Will Google Grow Wise To Web 2.0 Link Wheels?

JasonParker · 08-22-2009, 11:05 PM

What do you think? Will Google start catching on to what's happening with these web 2.0 link wheels and give a nice big slap?

4morereferrals · 08-22-2009, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JasonParker

What do you think? Will Google start catching on to what's happening with these web 2.0 link wheels and give a nice big slap?

Yes ... surely. You all should stop it right now ;-)

JasonParker · 08-22-2009, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4morereferrals

Yes ... surely. You all should stop it right now ;-)

You mean that the web 2.0 properties themselves aren't going to transfer the same link juice?

OR, the structure of creating the wheel isn't going to be effective anymore?

OR, is linking web 2.0 properties to web 2.0 properties going to hurt us in the long run?

Joe118 · 08-23-2009, 12:57 AM

I guess it needs to be said explicitly: he was being sarcastic.

Expanding further: why worry about what might not work tomorrow, do today what works today and worry tomorrow about tomorrow

cashcow · 08-23-2009, 08:43 AM

What if Google catches on to us writing articles for links and gives article directories a slap?

What if they catch on to writing press releases and slaps those?

What if they catch on to using videos for links? .........

Quote:

Expanding further: why worry about what might not work tomorrow, do today what works today and worry tomorrow about tomorrow

Exactly!

You never know what google is going to do - it is out of your control so your best strategy is to have a diverse linking program that gets links from many places, link wheels included.

BTW - there is no "rule" that link wheels have to be web2.0 properties. What if you simply searched for high PR communites in your nice that allowed blogs and created link wheels with those?

Michael Nguyen · 08-23-2009, 08:46 AM

cover yourself by not closing the link wheel

JasonParker · 08-23-2009, 09:15 AM

I'm in it for the long term, so I care about predicting what SEs may or may not do.

I think it's dumb and wreckless to just try every blackhat technique out there without thinking of the long term effects... especially when you're spending thousands of dollars per month on outsourcing SEO.

kkchoon · 08-23-2009, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4morereferrals

Yes ... surely. You all should stop it right now ;-)

Are you serious?

I don't think Google will implement the filter anytime soon...

If Google do that, I believe many legitimate sites will be affected, just like killing an ant with a bomb!

Quote:

Originally Posted by JasonParker

You mean that the web 2.0 properties themselves aren't going to transfer the same link juice?

OR, the structure of creating the wheel isn't going to be effective anymore?

OR, is linking web 2.0 properties to web 2.0 properties going to hurt us in the long run?

Just mix your strategy, build some link wheels with closed loop and some with open, or just don't bother to link them up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael_nguyen

cover yourself by not closing the link wheel

Agreed. Even closing the loop shouldn't be anyway harmful, especially you have other links out...

Quote:

Originally Posted by JasonParker

I'm in it for the long term, so I care about predicting what SEs may or may not do.

I think it's dumb and wreckless to just try every BlueFart technique out there without thinking of the long term effects... especially when you're spending thousands of dollars per month on outsourcing SEO.

Black Hat method is extremely powerful, they are at least 2 years ahead Google...! Up until today, Google still don't have the resources to filter and remove Vigra spam - totally!

For me, any kind of link building is black hat, and do it manually may set it back to gray hat, but in nature you are still trying to affect Google result. I don't think Google would really mind that, as long as your site is providing value to their searchers...

I must agree with you about doing business in long term, it all falls into how you cover your tracks, and not about white, gray, blue or black!

- Kok Choon

JasonParker · 08-23-2009, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kkchoon

Are you serious?

I don't think Google will implement the filter anytime soon...

If Google do that, I believe many legitimate sites will be affected, just like killing an ant with a bomb!

Just mix your strategy, build some link wheels with closed loop and some with open, or just don't bother to link them up.

Agreed. Even closing the loop shouldn't be anyway harmful, especially you have other links out...

Black Hat method is extremely powerful, they are at least 2 years ahead Google...! Up until today, Google still don't have the resources to filter and remove Vigra spam - totally!

For me, any kind of link building is black hat, and do it manually may set it back to gray hat, but in nature you are still trying to affect Google result. I don't think Google would really mind that, as long as your site is providing value to their searchers...

I must agree with you about doing business in long term, it all falls into how you cover your tracks, and not about white, gray, blue or black!

- Kok Choon

I think like that about black hat too... in my mind, any way you try to manipulate the search engines and build backlinks...

anyway...

I'm not going to stop creating web 2.0 properties and linking to them. The only thing that concerns me is that it's got to be easy to track a wheel of links in between, say, 8 web 2.0 properties.

I'm wondering if it's safer in the long run to just create a web 2.0 property and not link it to another 2.0 property, ping it, bookmark it, link to it with an iSnare submission...

cashcow · 08-23-2009, 11:16 AM

Quote:

I'm wondering if it's safer in the long run to just create a web 2.0 property and not link it to another 2.0 property, ping it, bookmark it, link to it with an iSnare submission...

That would probably be the safest, but the question is that if google did devalue these links, would they devalue links from all web 2.0 properties no matter if they were in a wheel or not?

Would it be worth their while to develop the code that detects a link wheel and the overhead of running that or would they just slap all web2.0 links?

Is the added benefit of linking them all together that much more than not linking them? (this would actually be a good test....)

Technically all link building practices (or any efforts by you to try to manipulate your position in the SER's) is frowned upon by Google (or as some people say "black hat") so if you really wanted to be within the letter of the "law" then you wouldn't do any link building at all.

However, I think that google probably "allows" some of this to some point. Like article submissions. Maybe because article submissions take work ... so do link wheels so maybe they don't mind them?

Kael41 · 08-23-2009, 11:59 AM

The real question is whether they'll figure out the linking going on between web 3.0 properties...shhhhh....

kkchoon · 08-23-2009, 12:32 PM

I think just keep your content site remain "white" is good enough, how to get backlinks isn't a big issues, as long as all links are mixed... meaning you don't get backlink from pure directory, profile, bookmark or... anything.

dburk · 08-23-2009, 07:38 PM

Hi Jason,

I don't believe they need to "grow wise to" or ever need to detect link wheels. Their current algorithm already handles the issue effectively.

If you create a bunch of crappy pages they are not going to help you much, however if you put some useful and sought after information on your blogs they will carry much more weight. Google is on record in support of merit based link building. If your Web 2.0 posts have merit then Google is happy to reward your backlinking efforts.

bigcat1967 · 08-23-2009, 07:47 PM

Quote:

Black Hat method is extremely powerful, they are at least 2 years ahead Google...! Up until today, Google still don't have the resources to filter and remove Vigra spam - totally!

I can't believe what I'm reading.

LIndaB · 08-24-2009, 12:20 AM

In reality, link wheels are nothing new. They've been around a long time. Michael Campbell wrote "Revenge of the Mininet" - which included several mini-net linking strategies, including what are now known as "link wheels" - years ago, and many people have been using the ideas for years. I would imagine that if Google really hated them, they would have found a way to filter them out a long time ago. When you think about it, a group of sites that all have content on a niche and that link to each other are useful for searchers. Why would Google object to good content linked together? This is quite unlike automated viagra links spammed all over the internet by various blackhat tools that don't contribute any kind of good content whatsoever.

08-22-2009, 11:05 PM	#1
JasonParker Senior Warrior Member War Room Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: USA Posts: 4,145 Thanks: 891 Thanked 1,048 Times in 432 Posts	Will Google Grow Wise To Web 2.0 Link Wheels? What do you think? Will Google start catching on to what's happening with these web 2.0 link wheels and give a nice big slap?

08-23-2009, 12:57 AM	#4
Joe118 Gold Nuggets Producer War Room Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 2,341 Blog Entries: 2 Thanks: 738 Thanked 2,234 Times in 421 Posts Contact Info	Re: Will Google Grow Wise To Web 2.0 Link Wheels? I guess it needs to be said explicitly: he was being sarcastic. Expanding further: why worry about what might not work tomorrow, do today what works today and worry tomorrow about tomorrow
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08-23-2009, 08:46 AM	#6
Michael Nguyen Senior Warrior Member War Room Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: London Posts: 1,055 Thanks: 63 Thanked 151 Times in 106 Posts	Re: Will Google Grow Wise To Web 2.0 Link Wheels? cover yourself by not closing the link wheel
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08-23-2009, 09:15 AM	#7
JasonParker Senior Warrior Member War Room Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: USA Posts: 4,145 Thanks: 891 Thanked 1,048 Times in 432 Posts	Re: Will Google Grow Wise To Web 2.0 Link Wheels? I'm in it for the long term, so I care about predicting what SEs may or may not do. I think it's dumb and wreckless to just try every blackhat technique out there without thinking of the long term effects... especially when you're spending thousands of dollars per month on outsourcing SEO.

08-23-2009, 11:59 AM	#11
Kael41 Passive Income Specialist War Room Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Spring, TX Posts: 1,182 Thanks: 9 Thanked 160 Times in 97 Posts	Re: Will Google Grow Wise To Web 2.0 Link Wheels? The real question is whether they'll figure out the linking going on between web 3.0 properties...shhhhh....
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08-23-2009, 12:32 PM	#12
kkchoon Advanced Warrior War Room Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Online World... Posts: 2,922 Thanks: 96 Thanked 530 Times in 269 Posts	Re: Will Google Grow Wise To Web 2.0 Link Wheels? I think just keep your content site remain "white" is good enough, how to get backlinks isn't a big issues, as long as all links are mixed... meaning you don't get backlink from pure directory, profile, bookmark or... anything.
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08-23-2009, 07:38 PM	#13
dburk Senior Warrior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Tampa, Florida Posts: 4,643 Thanks: 162 Thanked 671 Times in 581 Posts Contact Info	Re: Will Google Grow Wise To Web 2.0 Link Wheels? Hi Jason, I don't believe they need to "grow wise to" or ever need to detect link wheels. Their current algorithm already handles the issue effectively. If you create a bunch of crappy pages they are not going to help you much, however if you put some useful and sought after information on your blogs they will carry much more weight. Google is on record in support of merit based link building. If your Web 2.0 posts have merit then Google is happy to reward your backlinking efforts.
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08-24-2009, 12:20 AM	#15
LIndaB Advanced Warrior War Room Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Oregon, USA. Posts: 896 Thanks: 184 Thanked 50 Times in 37 Posts	Re: Will Google Grow Wise To Web 2.0 Link Wheels? In reality, link wheels are nothing new. They've been around a long time. Michael Campbell wrote "Revenge of the Mininet" - which included several mini-net linking strategies, including what are now known as "link wheels" - years ago, and many people have been using the ideas for years. I would imagine that if Google really hated them, they would have found a way to filter them out a long time ago. When you think about it, a group of sites that all have content on a niche and that link to each other are useful for searchers. Why would Google object to good content linked together? This is quite unlike automated viagra links spammed all over the internet by various blackhat tools that don't contribute any kind of good content whatsoever.