Micro Niche Finder - Conspiracy? or just plain rubbish?

[latinoman231982]

Ive started this thread prior to a bit of research I have been carrying out on 3 sites I have put up.

-(Example site 1 - SOC:22 -Search count: 6600 -Competing sites: 15,000

I am in top 3 results for this keyword, yet only recieve 2 visits daily. I then used the free wordtracker tool and my suspicions were right - estimated daily search 5!!!!!!

I can only put this down to micro niche finder being completely wrong.

Second site, similar stats, with search count of 2900 according to MNF, yet i get NO visits daily....wordtracker reports 2 daily searches. Im number 2 by the way.

Third site soc 11, search count of 12,000, monthly, my daily visitor rate??? 7, and im in top spot. BUT yet again wordtracker was right, 4 visits daily.

Now im not saying micro niche finder is rubbish or anything, as please someone correct me if im wrong...But doesnt MNF get it's information from google keyword tool? Does this also include the Strenght of competition??

I then decided to go after keywords with an SOC of 100 or more, following MNF results, and ive done this with another 3 sites....

First site search count of 4,000 , i rank number 4, i recieve 20 daily visitors...yet according to wordtracker results i should recieve only 2...HUH!?

second site, 5,000 search volume, SOC of 140, rank number 3 in google, and recieve 30 -40 visits per day.

Now take into consideration all these sites i just purchased keyword in domain, submitted 10 articles each.

Please someone contribute with an explanation, the results are so inaccurate.

[kingside]

MNF pulls it's data from the free Google keyword tool, which is very often inaccurate. Before you invest heavily in a particular keyword, you'll want to cross check the results from MNF with your other keyword tools (keyworddiscovery is my favorite.. and the free version does just fine).

So no, not a conspiracy. Just Google being wrong.

[wolfmmiii]

I agree with kingside. The sites a produce for lease obviously have to target quality keywords since I'm charging people. I always compare my Market Samurai results with other tools before targeting a keyword and building a site around it.

[latinoman231982]

So am i right in saying, that the rest of the information is safe to go by, such as SOC and so forth? Or as it pulls all information from google keyword tool all that could be worng. Cause it that the case, then why use the tool in the first place right?

[internetmarketer99]

Originally Posted by latinoman231982

So am i right in saying, that the rest of the information is safe to go by, such as SOC and so forth? Or as it pulls all information from google keyword tool all that could be worng. Cause it that the case, then why use the tool in the first place right?

Latinoman,

First, thanks for posting your findings.

MNF uses the "inanchor:" "intitle:" and "inurl:" search operands to calculate 'SOC'. I don't think they mention the specific formula they're using, but from my experience the best I can tell is it's a ratio.

You can see those searches by clicking on the number you get when you click "SOC".

Mark

[jjjones]

Are you looking at broad, phrase or exact match search count numbers? Micro Niche Finder defaults to exact but you can also see phrase or broad. (all pulled directly from Google External Tool) Exact will give you less searches but we feel it is more accurate. The Google External Tool defaults to Broad, by the way.

That is one possible explanation but if you will PM me with one or two of your keyword phrases and your website I will be happy to take a look. Its impossible to troubleshoot if we don't have all the information.

Also, In the future you'll get quicker customer support if you use our help desk at:
James J Jones, LLC - Powered by Kayako SupportSuite Helpdesk Software

James Jones

P.S. We switched from using Wordtracker over a year ago because so many people complained that the search counts weren't accurate.

Originally Posted by latinoman231982

Ive started this thread prior to a bit of research I have been carrying out on 3 sites I have put up.

-(Example site 1 - SOC:22 -Search count: 6600 -Competing sites: 15,000

I am in top 3 results for this keyword, yet only recieve 2 visits daily. I then used the free wordtracker tool and my suspicions were right - estimated daily search 5!!!!!!

I can only put this down to micro niche finder being completely wrong.

Second site, similar stats, with search count of 2900 according to MNF, yet i get NO visits daily....wordtracker reports 2 daily searches. Im number 2 by the way.

Third site soc 11, search count of 12,000, monthly, my daily visitor rate??? 7, and im in top spot. BUT yet again wordtracker was right, 4 visits daily.

Now im not saying micro niche finder is rubbish or anything, as please someone correct me if im wrong...But doesnt MNF get it's information from google keyword tool? Does this also include the Strenght of competition??

I then decided to go after keywords with an SOC of 100 or more, following MNF results, and ive done this with another 3 sites....

First site search count of 4,000 , i rank number 4, i recieve 20 daily visitors...yet according to wordtracker results i should recieve only 2...HUH!?

second site, 5,000 search volume, SOC of 140, rank number 3 in google, and recieve 30 -40 visits per day.

Now take into consideration all these sites i just purchased keyword in domain, submitted 10 articles each.

Please someone contribute with an explanation, the results are so inaccurate.

[kingside]

Originally Posted by jjjones

P.S. We switched from using Wordtracker over a year ago because so many people complained that the search counts weren't accurate.

None of them are 100% reliable, which is why it's import to cross-check. I think you made a good move by going with the Google tool though. If you're itching to add new features, an option to automatically cross-check w/ keyword discovery would be useful.

Great tool, BTW.

[Radix]

I always start with MNF, verify with exacts through google search first and then the keyword tool. I then run everything through Market Samurai.

In almost every instance, the data matches.


Couple of things you might want to check. How are you ranking in Yahoo and Bing? I discovered not too long ago that some niches have much higher traffic through those two engines than they do with G. Another variable could be that the niche is seasonal? That alone throws monthly averages out the window.

Don't give up on MNF. Sometimes you really have to punk a term or phrase to make sure of your results. For example, digging down you find a term with good traffic and low SOC for both the singular and plural forms. In new searches, try variations of those terms for both singular and plural and see what it returns. If you're getting the same numbers everytime, you're good. If they're not, go the G keyword tool and run them for a closer matching list of possible variations. Be sure to use exact, not broad.

Hope that helps

[latinoman231982]

james, thanks for the response. I didn't create this thread as into slate your program, when i said rubbish, i meant as in the results are rubbish, not the program. Alot of my websites are doing fine, but usually the ones that seem to good to be true, usually are.

It seems wordtracker for me, gives me the most reliable results. And yes, I am using exact results, not broad or phrase. Its no big deal, but you would expect with lareg numbers like that it should come close...right?

Of 35 websites I have created wordtracker seems to be providing more accurate details for me personally, and google seems to overestimate.

James I also have another query:

Regarding SOC where is this data coming from? Im managing to rank higher on alot of keywords that technically I shouldnt. I just dont know whether im coming or going.

[dddougal]

iv found micro niche finder to be great. very accurate if not a little slower than some other tools.

[JMartin]

SOC in MNF is just "guesstimation" really.

What it doesn't do (I think) is actually analyze the top listings for the actual strength, which tells you the real chance you have to getting traffic for the KWP.

All tools that use SOC type things basically just follow a simple rule:

The less pages with this or that on them, the less likely you are to find solid pages that are tough to rank.

For instance, if a KWP has 10,000 "competing" pages and another one has 150,000 "competing" pages, it's assumed that the lower number should have a lower % of optimized entry points.

However, if you don't actually analyze the top results, you're doing yourself a disservice.

There could be a KWP with 500,000 "competing" pages, but pretty much all of them are doing things wrong. So, there you are doing things right and enjoying a page one listing.

Really, you should get in the habit of checking out at least the first page of every KWP you might be interested in and don't just dismiss something because of result counts.

MNF and Market Samurai (and others) are awesome tools for saving time, organization, etc. Just make sure to do the extra couple of steps so you don't miss out on any gold out there.

[Colin Palfrey]

Don't worry about slating his software.

When you complain about it, he knows what to fix or explain better.
I for one am far more likely to look for, and buy it, after seeing that if there are issues he's willing to deal with them.

After all even Microsoft with there budget, have problems but what you want to see is people identifying problems in tech or help and looking to fix them.

Feed back always helps. An this isn't the forum for false praise.

Just my opinion though...

[jjjones]

Here is a knowledgebase article that explains SOC:

What is SOC? - Powered by Kayako SupportSuite Helpdesk Software

James

Originally Posted by latinoman231982

james, thanks for the response. I didn't create this thread as into slate your program, when i said rubbish, i meant as in the results are rubbish, not the program. Alot of my websites are doing fine, but usually the ones that seem to good to be true, usually are.

It seems wordtracker for me, gives me the most reliable results. And yes, I am using exact results, not broad or phrase. Its no big deal, but you would expect with lareg numbers like that it should come close...right?

Of 35 websites I have created wordtracker seems to be providing more accurate details for me personally, and google seems to overestimate.

James I also have another query:

Regarding SOC where is this data coming from? Im managing to rank higher on alot of keywords that technically I shouldnt. I just dont know whether im coming or going.

[tdpubs]

Great posts everyone. I'm using MNF, MS, Google and KD. I'm naturally paranoid. They all do a slightly different job and fulfill their stated purpose.
Dennis