get massive quantity of backlinks without getting sandboxed.

[Christian Fox]

What is the best way to filter backlinks to a website to eliminate the chance of getting sandboxed?

I have heard of bookmarking a site and then hitting that hard with links. I need to nail this down. Does anyone have a good answer?

I know people are doing this, I am looking for the best way.

[Rob Whisonant]

It is NOT possible to get sandboxed by using linkback software like xrummer or any type of program or list.

If it was, everyone would be building as many backlinks to their competition using the spam software and lists.

Think about it. It IS NOT POSSIBLE to sandblox a site on google by building backlinks to it.

If it was, we all could just do xrummer blasts to all our competition above us on the serps and destroy them.

Re's
Rob Whisonant

[milan]

Rob is right. If it was simple, it would be simple to abuse it.
So, it's not simple, and hard to test for a definite answer. My educated guess is that Google is looking for unnatural patterns. Pattern recognition is a well known IT discipline, and it's not hard to imagine that Google gives such programming tasks to their PhD's.
For example, it does happen than a site gets popular over night (not common but happens), but in either case, it doesn't happen that it loses popularity over night, there has to be some curve. Also, a site naturally getting backlinks doesn't get them from only one source like blog comments etc.
I think the most common mistake sandboxed sites do is: a very new site gets a lot of (not so quality) backlinks and than stops getting links all of a sudden.

[Christian Fox]

It is NOT possible to get sandboxed by using linkback software like xrummer or any type of program or list.

If it was, everyone would be building as many backlinks to their competition using the spam software and lists.

Think about it. It IS NOT POSSIBLE to sandbox a site on google by building backlinks to it.

If it was, we all could just do xrummer blasts to all our competition above us on the serps and destroy them.

I used to say the same thing but...

I disagree. I just had a site sandboxed recently and I did nothing but the xrumer blast. Was ranked decently and had been for months until about 6 or 7 days after the blast I was watching my backlinks climb and then it fell off of the face of the earth.

If you need proof, send me 100$ and a url. Of course I would need to confirm it is you as I would never do something like that to anyone.

I have sandboxed my own sites using an automated wordpress spammer myself more than once by being too aggressive.

http://forums.digitalpoint.com/showt...1335791&page=5

Here is a tread from an Xrumer service who intentionally got his own site sandboxed and tells about it. I could get many more.

[jazbo]

I totally understand what you are saying about not being able to bet competitors banned through hitting their sites, but is that actually true? I have no idea so I ask that question.

I would also suggest that if Googles bunch of highly intelligent engineers talk about having a natural linking profile, then they have software to find you out if you go nuts.

Originally Posted by Rob Whisonant

It is NOT possible to get sandboxed by using linkback software like xrummer or any type of program or list.

If it was, everyone would be building as many backlinks to their competition using the spam software and lists.

Think about it. It IS NOT POSSIBLE to sandblox a site on google by building backlinks to it.

If it was, we all could just do xrummer blasts to all our competition above us on the serps and destroy them.

Re's
Rob Whisonant

[milan]

Rob, although I'd never use XRummer: it in either case it was not JUST about using XRummer, that would've been just one factor. It wouldn't be easy at all to sandbox an established site like that. Come on, sandbox digitalpoint.com

[Christian Fox]

I know I agree with the DP but...this service is on many sites, in this case it really has nothing to do with the forum. I could find the same info in BHW.

[kkchoon]

Just be careful when using XRumer, it greatly affect your link velocity, and you will lost links faster than gain, that's why Google filter your site (Not sandbox, else not index found).

Just keep building authority links, using profile, comment and articles, submit to only authority site with high PR, should get your ranking back very soon.

Kok Choon

[Preciseim]

This has been debated for a long while,

Check out this excellent video on why income links won't hurt you,

Incoming Links - Can They Hurt? | Free Traffic System

I also found a link to a video from a top google engineer reiterating this, i'll dig it and post it.

The fact is that you have no control over who links to you, so how can you get into trouble? There entire algorithm would be completely flawed if this was the case and they would not have a business...

Think about it, if i wanted to destroy competition all i'd need to do it head over to RAC hire a team of people to fire nasty links to my competitors and watch my site climb up the rankings one by one as they disappear...Not going to happen!!!!!

[TrafficMystic]

I find that for the first 4 weeks if you make your link building pretty constant then new sites don't seem top get sandboxed... I may just have been lucky in this area though...

[Davioli]

Using Xrumer on a new website WILL sandbox it! thats a fact.
Using Xrumer on your competitor WILL NOT sandbox it simply because there is a mixture of backlinks I.E your competitor will obviously have quite a few different types of backlinks before your xrumer blast.
You also say that you managed to deindex one of your own sites using a wordpress comment spammer. This is probably because wordpress spamming was your only source of backlinks.
If you mix up your backlinks there's a very low chance of getting sandboxed.

[Cristian Lungu]

Until your site doesn't get a thousand visitors per day, you should limit the number of links built per day to maximum 5.

Exceeding a decent ratio between visits and link portfolio raises red flags to Google.

[Preciseim]

Originally Posted by mark135

That's the worst piece of advice i've ever read on this forum, and there is a lot of bad advice flying around on here

I second that...

[M0n3yMan]

You can sandbox new sites very easily, I dont understand why everyone is in a rush, seo is a waiting game and hard work, there isnt any software that will at a click of a button get you ranked number one for any worthwhile term(if it was that easy everyone would do it).

Sandbox is temporary and I also dont think you will be penalised for gaining links but new sites definately get sandboxed if your too aggressive and have an un-natural link profile.

ways round this are to start of your new site with 20 or s links a day which would consist of blog comments directories articles maybe some blog posts so split the daily link building between these and just consistantly do this for 30 days,

This way in a months time you will have a diverse link profile and a good foundation to build on.

other things you can do is to write 30-50 articles and post one article on 30-50 different free blog hosts and then use comment spammers and xrumer to backlink the crap out of those blogs which will link to your main site.

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by M0n3yMan

You can sandbox new sites very easily, I dont understand why everyone is in a rush, seo is a waiting game and hard work, there isnt any software that will at a click of a button get you ranked number one for any worthwhile term.

You can use tools to assist but like you said SEO is or should be for the long term. Its actually better that way anyway. By the time you can rank high for a very competitive keyword you will have the content to keep visitors engaged and returning. People always think about Google results. thats not where the money is made.

The real money is made on the internet by people returning to your site because they found it useful. IF they are doing a search for the same keyword after finding your site its because you didn't convince them you had the answers they were looking for.

[Pixel]

everyone is saying that it's impossible, BUT have anyone actually tried to harm a website with spammy links? Logic is logic but proof is proof.

[Christian Fox]

You can sandbox new sites very easily,

Yes I know this, I did not do the blast. I expressed my concern about the box. He assured me he would not put my site in the box, he was wrong.

It is also dangerous to slam links to any keyword that does not merit that much attention, especially with a new site. I don't sandbox any of my sites anymore and I use a variety of auto backlink mechanisms. You would have a hard time getting brittanyspears.whatever sandboxed... But reddancingtreefrogsmatinghabbits*org would be easy to box.

Until your site doesn't get a thousand visitors per day, you should limit the number of links built per day to maximum 5.

It's not THAT bad of advice guys, you can't really put a number on it but I agree you have to tread lightly with a new site especially if the site does not merit that much attention to begin with. Google is really, really hard to outsmart.

I used to think I could outsmart Google, but I learned the hard way. It is kind of a fun game until you get caught and they take your chips away and you are forced to go home empty handed.....

[Christian Fox]

Originally Posted by Pixel

everyone is saying that it's impossible, BUT have anyone actually tried to harm a website with spammy links? Logic is logic but proof is proof.

\

Hell, I don't have Xrumer but I have tools that can do it, when I was new and ignorant I did it to more than one of my own sites unintentionally.

People can say what they want but anyone who has and knows how to use Xrumer will tell you it is possible. Not to de-index but to sandbox for sure.

People boast about doing this to competition all the time intentionally. Yes there are people like that out there....

The real money is made on the internet by people returning to your site because they found it useful. IF they are doing a search for the same keyword after finding your site its because you didn't convince them you had the answers they were looking for.

No argument there.

[Pixel]

Originally Posted by Christian Fox

Hell, I don't have Xrumer but I have tools that can do it, when I was new and ignorant I did it to more than one of my own sites unintentionally.

People can say what they want but anyone who has and knows how to use Xrumer will tell you it is possible. Not to de-index but to sandbox for sure.

People boast about doing this to competition all the time intentionally. Yes there are people like that out there....

I have xrumer and i used it to one of my sites and it didn't helped at all, so I don't use that software anymore. I think it's all about what links you got, if spammy links will be like 80% of all your link portfolio there is a high chance that google will slam the website. Please note that it's just my opinion.

[palobrian]

I would never use something like xrumer. I would focus on hand building some links regularly, ramp it up slowly. Even if you build 20 or more links in a day it takes the search engine a while to find them normally so it wont find them all at once.

Think slow and steady. it is like the turtle and the hair! The turtle wins in the end imho.

[Christian Fox]

Think slow and steady. it is like the turtle and the hair! The turtle wins in the end imho.

I agree, it is a dangerous game to try and cheat the system. In the end there is no free lunch. I still do it but quite conservatively.

[djbory]

Originally Posted by Pixel

I have xrumer and i used it to one of my sites and it didn't helped at all, so I don't use that software anymore. I think it's all about what links you got, if spammy links will be like 80% of all your link portfolio there is a high chance that Google will slam the website. Please note that it's just my opinion.

This is really funny Mr. 3 Posts; I don't think that you even know what a xumer is or what it does... If you would've known how much is cost and the maintenence cost of of running this outrageous EXPENSE piece of software you wouldn't have made such a trivial comment like "I have Xumer, but I don't use it anymore"... My God...

For everybody else; Xumer is one of the most effective SEO software ever developed for the IM Community... If used right is highly effective, unfortunately, 90% of users don't know how to use correctly, or they intentionally do...

Yes, it can get you site sanboxed, but in my experience, being sanboxed is not that bad, in fact in most cases when you get sanboxed your site comes back stronger that it was and ranking a lot much higher... it always happen to me...

In fact I know some highly successful IM's that do this to new sites intentionally, so go figure...

So if you get your site sanboxed just hold it for one month or two and sometimes just one or two weeks and you will be back in a better place.

DJBory

[Christian Fox]

Originally Posted by djbory

This is really funny Mr. 3 Posts; I don't think that you even know what a xumer is or what it does... If you would've known how much is cost and the maintenence cost of of running this outrageous EXPENSE piece of software you wouldn't have made such a trivial comment like "I have Xumer, but I don't use it anymore"... My God...

For everybody else; Xumer is one of the most effective SEO software ever developed for the IM Community... If used right is highly effective, unfortunately, 90% of users don't know how to use correctly, or they intentionally do...

Yes, it can get you site sanboxed, but in my experience, being sanboxed is not that bad, in fact in most cases when you get sanboxed your site comes back stronger that it was and ranking a lot much higher... it always happen to me...

In fact I know some highly successful IM's that do this to new sites intentionally, so go figure...

So if you get your site sanboxed just hold it for one month or two and sometimes just one or two weeks and you will be back in a better place.

DJBory

And there you have it, thanks.

[djbory]

Originally Posted by mark135

didn't you have a post a few months ago about being penalized or banned from google?

what is the situation today?

maybe it was spamming software like xumer that did it

I wasn't penalized or banned. At this point it looks like my sites were sanboxed even though they were almost a year old...

I believe Google can sandboxed you if you build an sudden highly and unusual number of backlinks to your sites even if your sites are not totally new...

It happened to my many times now, but in all cases they came back even a lot stronger than they were, and in many cases braking the #1 position on Google fist page...

Djbory

[M0n3yMan]

Originally Posted by djbory

This is really funny Mr. 3 Posts; I don't think that you even know what a xumer is or what it does... If you would've known how much is cost and the maintenence cost of of running this outrageous EXPENSE piece of software you wouldn't have made such a trivial comment like "I have Xumer, but I don't use it anymore"... My God...

For everybody else; Xumer is one of the most effective SEO software ever developed for the IM Community... If used right is highly effective, unfortunately, 90% of users don't know how to use correctly, or they intentionally do...

Yes, it can get you site sanboxed, but in my experience, being sanboxed is not that bad, in fact in most cases when you get sanboxed your site comes back stronger that it was and ranking a lot much higher... it always happen to me...

In fact I know some highly successful IM's that do this to new sites intentionally, so go figure...

So if you get your site sanboxed just hold it for one month or two and sometimes just one or two weeks and you will be back in a better place.

DJBory

completely agree xrumer is a powerful tool infact blackhat or whitehat its not down to just what links you build but how you build them and what purpose the links have, even smiley faces have there purpose :-)

[djbory]

Originally Posted by M0n3yMan

completely agree xrumer is a powerful tool infact BlueFart or whitehat its not down to just what links you build but how you build them and what purpose the links have, even smiley faces have there purpose :-)

Totally agree

[Jack Doug]

There is no such thing as SANDBOX...as Matt Cutts puts it. This is just a Google dance in the background where Google takes time to reconsider your backlinks.

[Christian Fox]

He can call it whatever he wants, Google has been 'reconsidering' my backlinks for 2 months now.

Yes I know the smiley trick, I have used it. Google will catch on to this eventually as well.

[sousen]

If you want to do off page link building these are good way Directory submission, blog comment, forum posting, article submission, press relies distribution

[bgmacaw]

Originally Posted by Christian Fox

What is the best way to filter backlinks to a website to eliminate the chance of getting sandboxed?

If you have several strong links from authority sites and a wide variety of IP addresses, it is very unlikely that you will get "sandboxed" no matter what other kinds of incoming links your site has. If all you have are obvious Xrumer links or other obvious automated links, your site isn't likely to get very far.

So, the objective isn't to 'filter' links but to get authority and near-authority incoming links along with whatever automated links you can get, within reason. This will give your site the best chance unless it's in a niche where spamming is common and subject to tighter scrutiny by the Google web spam team. Basically CNN.com isn't going to be "sandboxed" by someone using Xrumer but buycheapviagrafromme.biz easily could be.

Now, one thing that people mistake for the fabled sandbox are two Google algorithms, "Query Deserves Freshness" or QDF and "Query Deserves Diversity" or QDD. Both of these algorithms will allow sites meeting their secret criteria to rank higher, temporarily, than they would naturally based on their link profile. When the site drops, they assume that it's the "sandbox" rather than the page simply being returned to it's actual place based on it's backlinks.

There is more filtering that goes on, based on 100's of other ranking algorithms, but there is not a central "sandboxing" algorithm based on what has been stated by Google.

[Christian Fox]

Great informative post, thanks.

[searchnology]

I've noticed that the three year mark is the magic domain age for Google's trust. If your site is at least that old and has been steadily building backlinks over that three year period then a large influx in backlinks won't affect your site negatively. (I just had an Xrumer blast done with no problems)

It if were possible to get a site sandboxed with this method, people would be blasting their competitor sites all the time.

Originally Posted by djbory

I wasn't penalized or banned. At this point it looks like my sites were sanboxed even though they were almost a year old...

I believe Google can sandboxed you if you build an sudden highly and unusual number of backlinks to your sites even if your sites are not totally new...

It happened to my many times now, but in all cases they came back even a lot stronger than they were, and in many cases braking the #1 position on Google fist page...

Djbory

[Christian Fox]

It if were possible to get a site sandboxed with this method, people would be blasting their competitor sites all the time.

I agree I can point you to lots of threads at BHW where people talk of doing exactly that.

Give me a relatively url that is less than 3 years old and I'll show you how it works, if you can prove it's yours...