What's your perfect link building service?

[areaK]

I love the Warrior forum, it's def the best IM place on the net. So I'd like to hear from my fellow warriors. Obviously I run a link building service and I've just put the new website up at Link Vines and I would like to know what you would like to see in a link building service...besides quality, that's a checkmark and has been my entire career, well before I expanded some of my services into a business.

And although I don't want to hear "super low prices" because the quality we provide can't be supported for $3/hr. pricing suggestions are certainly open for suggestion.

But, more specifically, what types of things would just totally win your heart. What would be the "They are my ONLY go to people and I go to them every time" factor? Is it the price, is it the quality, is it the customer service, is it English...& you can only pick 2 from that list (or whatever other ideas you have). Why? Because I'm trying to target the 2 most important factors because technically there could be many. Def would like to hear the other things but please share your TOP 2 as well.

Also would like to know if you prefer a service that uses automated tools to reduce the cost or hand implementation? We have had a couple of ?s about why we don't use automated tools (no complaints but questions) and I want to know which your preference is so that I can gauge popularity (and keep in mind that auto tools don't necessarily do what they are supposed to so if weigh all of the factors when sharing your opinion).

Do you prefer cheaper costs over quality? Do you prefer quality over cost? What's the deal-breaker for you?

I want to grow into THE service to go to, and business has been doing well since we started offering the services (before the site even went up) but I want to be literally the one on everyone's tongue, I so love this arena, so I really would appreciate your feedback, opinions and tips to help me better understand where people's primary interest and concerns lie. It's all about "listening to the people" so PLEASE share your thoughts. I need to know what people care about the most. Thanks SO MUCH for sharing =)

[areaK]

Originally Posted by Cecille20

In all my process I find participating in all do follow forums with a PR4 above is effective.. And I want to try yahoo answer and link in blogging. They said its also effective!

Thanks Cecille but that doesn't answer my questions. You are talking about link building in general when I am asking about the types of things people want to get from their link building providers, what things matter most to them, whether they prefer a service who runs automated tools or does everything by hand, etc. (please refer to original thread for more details on the opinions I'd like to hear).

...and BTW, I don't worry myself with dofollow as much as I do just getting links built. A link is a link is a link...a dofollow may carry more weight but it's a well-known fact that nofollows still get link juice.

[Andy Fletcher]

I don't think you're selling yourself very well on your site. You're leaving too much up to the customer.

If I come to you as a link building service provider I don't want to have to worry about how you do it, I just want you to get it done. It's up to you to drive costs down with outsourcing and automation to increase your profit margin and make it harder for other agencies to compete.

Further, one aspect I didn't see, although I didn't spend too long on the site was information about reporting. There are a lot of link building agencies and one clear area to get a competitive advantage is in your reporting format and tools. If you say you'll deliver 1,000 links that's very hard for me to check. So an easy report format would be good but a reporting tool that checks the existence of the links would be even better. You'll almost certainly want this for yourself anyway, so why not give it to your customers?

Another thought you on your website. The sign up box on the right is great to have but you could do with a better incentive to encourage people to sign up. At the moment you're basically saying, "Sign up so I can market to you". A much better message would be, "Sign up to receive a free OnSite SEO optimisation guide that will prepare your site for best link building effect" or similar.

Hope some of my pre-caffeinated waffle is of use to you,

Andy

[areaK]

Originally Posted by Andy Fletcher

I don't think you're selling yourself very well on your site. You're leaving too much up to the customer.

If I come to you as a link building service provider I don't want to have to worry about how you do it, I just want you to get it done. It's up to you to drive costs down with outsourcing and automation to increase your profit margin and make it harder for other agencies to compete.

Further, one aspect I didn't see, although I didn't spend too long on the site was information about reporting. There are a lot of link building agencies and one clear area to get a competitive advantage is in your reporting format and tools. If you say you'll deliver 1,000 links that's very hard for me to check. So an easy report format would be good but a reporting tool that checks the existence of the links would be even better. You'll almost certainly want this for yourself anyway, so why not give it to your customers?

Another thought you on your website. The sign up box on the right is great to have but you could do with a better incentive to encourage people to sign up. At the moment you're basically saying, "Sign up so I can market to you". A much better message would be, "Sign up to receive a free OnSite SEO optimisation guide that will prepare your site for best link building effect" or similar.

Hope some of my pre-caffeinated waffle is of use to you,

Andy

Thanks for your fantastic feedback Andy! Def agree, are working on fleshing out the site with info, more details, etc. And we do provide reports so I guess it would be nice if we mentioned that huh? Have other things to add to it but hadn't written that one down yet! Maybe the 30 hours of no sleep, 4 hours of sleep, then 30 more hours of no sleep working on projects and working on the site and backend stuff did it? LOL

I do outsource but not to drive down costs...my contractors are in the US and ppl in the US just don't work for a few bucks an hour...nor do I expect them to, I don't. I really could care less where contractors come from but they MUST speak/read/write excellent English which isn't as easy to find elsewhere so yanno.

We've been doing this behind the scenes for a while, landing projects from my existing clients, a note I had on my other site, freelance sites, referrals, etc. so now that we've decided to get bigger I need to know what people want to see on the site itself to peak their interest..and you def helped.

And I've used SO many automated tools over the years and they all half deliver if that, which is why I'm not so sure about using them on client accounts (and we have an explanation of this on the site...and will be putting it in more places around the site) but I may offer them as alternative packages that don't carry the guarantee what we guarantee as humans. So automation is a big concern for me (again having never really found anything that lives up to my expectations...yeah they deliver "some" of what they're supposed to but never all. Am developing a report for the signup box too, it's just not finished yet.

Your pre-caffeinated waffle is of GREAT use to me and I appreciate the feedback and suggestions!

[Andy Fletcher]

Originally Posted by areaK

And I've used SO many automated tools over the years and they all half deliver if that, which is why I'm not so sure about using them on client accounts (and we have an explanation of this on the site...and will be putting it in more places around the site) but I may offer them as alternative packages that don't carry the guarantee what we guarantee as humans. So automation is a big concern for me (again having never really found anything that lives up to my expectations...yeah they deliver "some" of what they're supposed to but never all. Am developing a report for the signup box too, it's just not finished yet.

My point is that your customer doesn't care if you use automation, people or train dogs to post backlinks. They want to get the service they pay for, however you implement it.

Make it as simple for them as saying "I want that one, here's the money" and you'll do a lot better than offering them a load of choice that they have to understand about human posting vs automation.

When you go to a restaurant that offers a selection of spicy dishes with varying degrees of heat. You don't expect them to ask you which spices you want you expect them to offer you a spice rating of 1-5 or something like that.

Hope that makes my point a bit clearer,

Andy

[areaK]

Originally Posted by Andy Fletcher

My point is that your customer doesn't care if you use automation, people or train dogs to post backlinks. They want to get the service they pay for, however you implement it.

Make it as simple for them as saying "I want that one, here's the money" and you'll do a lot better than offering them a load of choice that they have to understand about human posting vs automation.

When you go to a restaurant that offers a selection of spicy dishes with varying degrees of heat. You don't expect them to ask you which spices you want you expect them to offer you a spice rating of 1-5 or something like that.

Hope that makes my point a bit clearer,

Andy

Got'cha...does help clarify your point and give me something to think about =) I've always been so concerned about the quality of automation that I was a bit afraid to use the automated services as a way of giving clients a lower cost and increase profit because if the automated tool doesn't deliver everything it's supposed to then we still spend man hours, not figured in to cost, going back and doing whatever it didn't, fixing whatever it didn't do right, or creating/submitting the things it didn't that it should have that we would end up hurting ourselves cost-wise. But you've certainly got me thinking more into it =)

I've never really had to "sell" my services much except for way back in the beginning and I still didn't have to sell as much as you have to sell with a website. Maybe a proposal,that generally takes me about a half hour tops to perfect but these days, with referrals and repeat business I don't even do that much anymore...but with growing the business bigger and going live on a site, I now have to figure out how to sell via the website and convey everything we can do for someone so it's a learning process =) Much diff than, again a proposal, or maybe a convo about what we can do for someone, etc! I do some affiliate marketing but IDK, with a service over an affiliate product that often gives you materials to work with it's a bit diff.

So your tips and advice are EXTREMELY appreciated. Gives me a lot to think about and work on. Thanks a mill again for really being helpful!

[Andy Fletcher]

Do a quick search for white label SEO services. These guys have got it down. Their packages are so simple and easy to understand that other people can sell them for them. No mention of how they do it, just what the customer gets. Often reduced to a single word describing the level of the service. "Starter", "SME", "Corporate" etc.

Andy

[areaK]

Originally Posted by Andy Fletcher

Do a quick search for white label SEO services. These guys have got it down. Their packages are so simple and easy to understand that other people can sell them for them. No mention of how they do it, just what the customer gets. Often reduced to a single word describing the level of the service. "Starter", "SME", "Corporate" etc.

Andy

Thanks Andy...will do!!! You rock! A Warrior INDEED!

[jimkirk1943]

Dont know if this is any use to you but i like to have a quick turn around 3 days for 100 manual links, i like a full report on the sites ect ect, And i like the links all to be pinged and more if possible to help them get indexed. I like quick turn around because i like mini sites so i build them fairly quick and need new sites backlinking weekly, And if you can help your customer out with pinging sending a few RSS feeds out or something this would be another job done. My link builder does ping my sites for me and i love this about his service !!
Jim

[DogScout]

I use James from richjerks.net. I actually have no idea what he does.

I DO know he got a site to rank page 1 locally for 4 keywords with zero on site SEO where before the page didn't even show in the 1st 9800 results. Worth several new customers to the client every month and inexpensive as hell!

So the short answer is, like a client, I don't care about anything but results and he delivered. (Again)

[areaK]

Originally Posted by jimkirk1943

Dont know if this is any use to you but i like to have a quick turn around 3 days for 100 manual links, i like a full report on the sites ect ect, And i like the links all to be pinged and more if possible to help them get indexed. I like quick turn around because i like mini sites so i build them fairly quick and need new sites backlinking weekly, And if you can help your customer out with pinging sending a few RSS feeds out or something this would be another job done. My link builder does ping my sites for me and i love this about his service !!
Jim

YES it's of use =) We do ping our client's sites and submit their RSS feed (& depending on what all we're doing we create other RSS feeds or pull feeds from sites we created and submit those too) so I'm glad to know that's another plus that people appreciate! Def noting the quick turnaround for some "expedient" packages.

Thanks so much Jim =)

[areaK]

Originally Posted by DogScout

I use James from richjerks.net. I actually have no idea what he does.

I DO know he got a site to rank page 1 locally for 4 keywords with zero on site SEO where before the page didn't even show in the 1st 9800 results. Worth several new customers to the client every month and inexpensive as hell!

So the short answer is, like a client, I don't care about anything but results and he delivered. (Again)

Thanks so much =) Def helps to know what your selling point is, much appreciated!

[nobi]

But if he uses dubious black hat techniques that might get you banned one day with google you should care HOW results are delivered. Results are not everything!

[ruch1v]

I think with all these backlink packages and links getting removed, my number one concern would be that I am paying for links that are there for good, not get a report back like "u paid for 100 links, unfortunately 35 have been removed"


my second would be getting valuable link juice from high pr do follow sites, a couple .edu and .gov would be an awesome bonus!

[Mark Blaze]

Originally Posted by Andy Fletcher

Do a quick search for white label SEO services. These guys have got it down. Their packages are so simple and easy to understand that other people can sell them for them. No mention of how they do it, just what the customer gets. Often reduced to a single word describing the level of the service. "Starter", "SME", "Corporate" etc.

Andy

Thanks for this resource Andy,

Going to go and check it out now and make some edit's to my own right now!

In regard to the thread i would say it really depends on what you want to offer and who your target audience is, mine is newbies who don't know seo and the marketers who do know seo but don't have the time to do it anymore or just projects on the backburner that need completing!

In general you either offer individual services or a package deal!

Mark Blaze

[Mark Blaze]

Originally Posted by joakimtornhill

“The best piece of advice I can give you is to vary your linking strategy. It’s the only way to be sure you’ll achieve good rankings, and keep them. Remember that what works today might not work “tomorrow” – so it’s worth experimenting while all the time hunting for those “quality” links.”

I think you just won the award for not reading the post! Well done!

Edit: Oh and spamming your website too!

Mark Blaze

[euhlir]

The perfect link building service is done in bulk and is affordable.

[josephine.bookoffers]

Engaging on the following also helps:

squidoo lens
hub page
link wheel

[Billy Rey]

we are also offering a link building service but haven't started marketing it yet here or in any other forums but plan to very soon.

Like any business, link building services will also need continuous tweaking and improvements.

For me, the perfect link building service is one that offers continual improvements to their service, have a consistent system in place to deliver what they promise month in and month out and can easily be contacted so the customer has peace of mind throughout the project. And that is what we strive to be.

and of course they have to have an understanding of SEO and not just claim to know it. Having the experience is vital.

[areaK]

Originally Posted by Mark Blaze

I think you just won the award for not reading the post! Well done!

Edit: Oh and spamming your website too!

Mark Blaze

OMG yes he did! WTF kind of answer was that. I didn't ask HOW to link build, I know link building like the back of my hand! Geez, how unhelpful.

[areaK]

Originally Posted by Billy Rey

we are also offering a link building service but haven't started marketing it yet here or in any other forums but plan to very soon.

Like any business, link building services will also need continuous tweaking and improvements.

For me, the perfect link building service is one that offers continual improvements to their service, have a consistent system in place to deliver what they promise month in and month out and can easily be contacted so the customer has peace of mind throughout the project. And that is what we strive to be.

and of course they have to have an understanding of SEO and not just claim to know it. Having the experience is vital.

Thanks Billy, I'm not sure if that was really to answer my question or market your service but thanks for the reply.

[areaK]

Originally Posted by ruch1v

I think with all these backlink packages and links getting removed, my number one concern would be that I am paying for links that are there for good, not get a report back like "u paid for 100 links, unfortunately 35 have been removed"


my second would be getting valuable link juice from high pr do follow sites, a couple .edu and .gov would be an awesome bonus!

Thanks =) We are implementing some bonuses for higher link packages (thanks to Andy I got some great ideas for packages). I have the new packages drawn up but not on the site yet...but that's a good suggestion!

And yes, I agree about the links staying there. The way our links are built, they do stay there and they are from a variety of sites many being high PR and plenty being dofollow...unless it's commenting which we just can't guarantee but we have a great approval and stickiness for even those.

[areaK]

Originally Posted by Mark Blaze

Thanks for this resource Andy,

Going to go and check it out now and make some edit's to my own right now!

In regard to the thread i would say it really depends on what you want to offer and who your target audience is, mine is newbies who don't know seo and the marketers who do know seo but don't have the time to do it anymore or just projects on the backburner that need completing!

In general you either offer individual services or a package deal!

Mark Blaze

Our target is essentially the same. Whether you don't know it...or just don't have the time. And we do offer packages and individual deals but we operated from just referrals and word of mouth for so long that I never had to put a bunch of choice packages together for a site. We just recently decided to go bigger because we were generating a lot of biz without the site and people were so pleased with our services that we decided to go further. Now just working on all of the diff packages, etc. and pinpointing what's most important to people (there are the obviouses but all people vary which is why I wanted feedback from Warriors).

[jasonmorgan]

I skipped over most of the replies since you want to know what I think and want.

You didn't ask about this but I think your site sells you short. When I visit your site I want to know exactly what you offer and how much. I didn't get a clear answer and under normal circumstances I'd close your site and move on.

I don't mind reading for additional information and actually appreciate sites that have it but I would have liked to have seen a clear and bold we give you X for $Y

I did get that you don't offer a set number of backlinks for a price but work on an hourly basis. Having a ball-park idea of what can be done for the minimum $150 would have been nice. Are we talking 50 backlinks or 500?

I did eventually find your article submitting and blog commenting packages but it was from a link on a page and not located in the site navigation.

The idea of 'We can’t possibly guarantee approval of every comment' , I completely understand but also leaves me uncertain if I want to gamble $30 - $575 for the possibility of getting those backlinks.

I would also prefer a set package of backlinks instead of paying hourly.

Something I haven't seen offered are prebuilt profiles or web 2.0 properties without links added.

Sometimes due to the nature of my content or my paranoia of sharing my keyword research I'd prefer to do the actual link dropping myself. It would be a huge time saver if I could buy the profiles and web 2.0 properties already set-up and add in my links myself.

The strategy consultation is a good idea and I think a lot of new IMers need it.

What might help is having a checklist that people can use to make sure they have everything in place before they jump-in. This could also be the same strategy check-list you use so you're clients have a clear idea of exactly what you are going to cover and do for them... maybe you do this already.

well, that was my first impression at 2:30 am

[kalios]

The best link building service is the one that offers one package=one solution. Serious SEO could not be accomplished only by link directories or blog comments. We need to use any method in order to appear at Googles eyes natural...

[areaK]

Originally Posted by kalios

The best link building service is the one that offers one package=one solution. Serious SEO could not be accomplished only by link directories or blog comments. We need to use any method in order to appear at Googles eyes natural...

Thanks =) And absolutely agreed. We offer various packages from "Link Mix" packages to attain links from various sources to independent packages like article writing & submission, etc. to personalized solutions on an hourly basis for customized strategies because some people are doing various types of their own link building and only want help with a few areas or they really want to go all out with a strong, long-term, campaign. Everyone's needs vary so we're trying to meet the needs of each individual and I thank you for that comment =)

[John W.G.]

is "white label seo services" the name of a specific seo company?

There are a lot of results that come up for that term.

I'd be interested to see exactly what company you're talking about.

Originally Posted by Andy Fletcher

Do a quick search for white label SEO services. These guys have got it down. Their packages are so simple and easy to understand that other people can sell them for them. No mention of how they do it, just what the customer gets. Often reduced to a single word describing the level of the service. "Starter", "SME", "Corporate" etc.

Andy

[areaK]

Originally Posted by John W.G.

is "white label seo services" the name of a specific seo company?

There are a lot of results that come up for that term.

I'd be interested to see exactly what company you're talking about.

No it's not, he was just being a doll and giving me some ideas =)

[areaK]

Originally Posted by jasonmorgan

I skipped over most of the replies since you want to know what I think and want.

You didn't ask about this but I think your site sells you short. When I visit your site I want to know exactly what you offer and how much. I didn't get a clear answer and under normal circumstances I'd close your site and move on.

I don't mind reading for additional information and actually appreciate sites that have it but I would have liked to have seen a clear and bold we give you X for

I did get that you don't offer a set number of backlinks for a price but work on an hourly basis. Having a ball-park idea of what can be done for the minimum $150 would have been nice. Are we talking 50 backlinks or 500?

I did eventually find your article submitting and blog commenting packages but it was from a link on a page and not located in the site navigation.

The idea of 'We can’t possibly guarantee approval of every comment' , I completely understand but also leaves me uncertain if I want to gamble $30 - $575 for the possibility of getting those backlinks.

I would also prefer a set package of backlinks instead of paying hourly.

Something I haven't seen offered are prebuilt profiles or web 2.0 properties without links added.

Sometimes due to the nature of my content or my paranoia of sharing my keyword research I'd prefer to do the actual link dropping myself. It would be a huge time saver if I could buy the profiles and web 2.0 properties already set-up and add in my links myself.

The strategy consultation is a good idea and I think a lot of new IMers need it.

What might help is having a checklist that people can use to make sure they have everything in place before they jump-in. This could also be the same strategy check-list you use so you're clients have a clear idea of exactly what you are going to cover and do for them... maybe you do this already.

well, that was my first impression at 2:30 am

I don't know how I originally missed this =( But thanks so much for your reply =-) Agreed we were/still are (selling ourselves short) and we've been working on fleshing it out more and using great feedback like yours to make it better =)

Will def give some more thought to the ballpark figure on the retainer fees. It's a little hard and that's why it's a retainer vs. package because those are more personalized services that really vary from campaign to campaign. I've got people who need me to do some research first, then create a strategy, then implement so I may have to spend 2 hours researching (some people come to us without having 'researched' keywords) or just a half hour working out a strategy that we'll start with before my team can really dig into building.

So we've been working on developing more packages so, for those who know exactly what they need, they have a better idea of what might be achieved within a set fee; but yet still offer the more personalized options for those who don't or just have different needs than your average "I just need 500 links" person. The spectrum of needs really varies widely (much more than those who are fairly well versed might think).

Have thought about opening up the site navigation too, didn't want to clutter the site and went for the 'have all of the package links on one page' but I think that might be doing more harm than good.

As far as not guaranteeing comment approval - appreciate that you understand that but that's also why we offer bonus comments + bonus social bookmarking to help take care of any comments that don't get approved (and we actually have an unadvertised bonus link solution for those packages...that maybe we SHOULD advertise?) Our clients who do the blog commenting also get submitted to our Traffic Bug account so that more links will be dripped out for them over time not only to make up for any unapproved comments but also to hopefully give them even more than they bargained for, but again that's an unadvertised bonus so maybe we should make it advertised?

We have an EXCELLENT approval rate but never want to make promises we may not be able to keep...but try to over-deliver by the quality + 5 bonus comments + 15 social bookmarks + unadvertised bonus of Traffic Bug submission for additional links dripped out. I don't think we've had a commenting client that hasn't continued to use us (yes the site is new but I've had my team working on campaigns before the site was even a thought)...not that we never will, but maybe we do need to sell ourselves better on that.

Hmmm, now THAT'S an interesting thought...profiles without the links. I wonder how much of a business it would be though? I've been doing this for a while now (just decided to go bigger with the company) and I've never heard a request like that so, again, while I wonder if there would be much of a demand for it I LOVE THE IDEA!

We don't have a checklist but it's something to consider. We don't on the backend, again because everyone needs/wants vary so much. Some people want to just cut us loose to do our thing and some people want "write and submit articles for me and do comments for me" and that's it. Some people are experts who know exactly what they want, some people are intermediate and pretty sure of what they want but open to suggestions and allowing you to do a few new things for them to see if it helps them, and some people are very green and need you to really walk them through it all/answer their questions/and implement 'whatever' works (them saying 'just do whatever will help me'). Def going to give that some thought though.

But this is exactly what I'm trying to fill here..a bit of a gap on personalized services. I don't want to be a cut and dry service, a way overpriced service, an 'average quality' service...I want to REALLY give whoever whatever they need in a personalized, affordable, top quality manner.

So I'm feeling my way around how to best convey this to everyone from the expert who knows what he/she needs to the newbie who has no idea what they need.

I figure if I go to a site and all they offer are packages...what if I need something more personalized? Or what if I need a mix of things but don't want to buy ALL those packages to get it? Or what if my competition isn't really using xxx technique so I need more of that but still a little of xxx and xxx but my options are limited with these packages? Then what?

Or what if I go to a site and they say for $150. we can build you xxx links but then when they get into everything they realize I've never really researched my keywords, I had no idea what my competition was and how easy it might be to slide into certain spots while working on other more competitive ones in the meantime....or what-have-you personal situation and then I say 'well you'd be best served if you let us look at your keywords and competition first and that's going to take some time off that $150 so now we can't really deliver you that many links with that much money because we need to do this' ...so I don't want to lock us into xxx amount of links for $150 when there really can be a lot of variables when you get into 'personalization'.

Which is, again, the reason I'm trying to flesh out more with more packages like articles, etc. along with link mix packages, and still offer a personalized service but that just doesn't come with a guarantee of links because it's almost impossible to guarantee xxx links when it's "personalized" according to your specific needs. You might want us to build content for your site AND build off-site links which would change the game...and we want to be 'that' personalized.

Hoping that offering those options 1) cut & dry packages (article submissions/blog commenting/etc) 2) link mix packages (to give you a variety of types of links and 3) personalized, custom, services will give just about anyone the solution they need, whatever their need.

Nowwww if I can just get all of that clearly laid out, sell ourselves better on it, and all that good stuff =) ...back to the drawing board ;-) Which is why YOU GUYS ROCK! I have gotten some EXCELLENT tips, feedback and advice here...love the Warrior forum and SO APPRECIATE everyone taking the time to look around the site and take the time to give really valuable feedback.

......and those are my thoughts after being up about 24 hours LOL so I hope that all made sense!!! Thanks again =)