Why do crappy MFA site out rank sites with quality content

[nest28]

I have made a great site with about 25 pages of content, each page has 400 to 600 words. I currently have about 90 backlinks and just out sourced 300 backlinks from a fellow warrior. From that 300 backlinks 60 goes to individual pages that I am trying to rank for which will soon bring my backlink total to almost 400. Now what I don't understand is how a crappy MFA site continues to out rank me, I currently sit at number 5 on the first page of google and the sit I speak of is currently at number 2. This site only has 5 backlinks and 1 of them is no-follow, the site is only a month older than mine so I just don't get why it continues to sit at number 2 while I have better content+more backlinks. My only other competition is other MFA sites, how long will it be before I can see my site rise above these other MFA sites.

Here are the stats for the keyword that I am trying to rank for as seen in micro niche finder.

exact phrase/local search count 5,400
competing sites-6,700
ad cost 8.14
mob 0
soc 20/green light

I know I shouldn't rush, my site is only 6 weeks old but so are the other sites I am competing against, maybe I just need to wait and see how things turn out. I would like to thank my fellow warriors in advance for any suggestions or help that may be provided though this discussion.

[David Bleidt]

well there are some things that you can't see.

1. your backlinks maybe aren't recognized by google so far
2. your competitor has high PR backlinks
3. does he has an exact match domain?
4. maybe he has backlinks which won't show up so far
5. what about your and his on page SEO?

These are just some examples that can impact yours and his ranking.

David

[Ehsan_am]

Originally Posted by David Bleidt

well there are some things that you can't see.

1. your backlinks maybe aren't recognized by google so far
2. your competitor has high PR backlinks
3. does he has an exact match domain?
4. maybe he has backlinks which won't show up so far
5. what about your and his on page SEO?

These are just some examples that can impact yours and his ranking.

David

I agree with all this.

another thing you might want to consider is that backlink checkers don't show you all the backlinks pointing to a site. Your competitor might have a couple of very high PR contextual backlink that your backlink checker doesn't show.

[nest28]

thank you david for your helpful comments but yes we both have exact match domains his is .org and mine's is .net I have been checking his backlinks for a month and just 4 always show up from sites with page rank of 3 or lower.

my site has roughly 12 backlinks from ezine articles with the keyword that I am trying to rank for as the anchor text.

I also have many backlinks from blog commenting in total i have 94 backlinks as of right now. his shows 4 to 6.
Also once the backlinks that I paid for gets indexed i will have 400, these backlinks are profile links from sites with page rank 4 or higher in addition to this i plan on building. backlinks to social bookmarking sites and article directories. I would like to build this site out for every possible long tail keyword that it can rank for, rather than build many micro niche sites.

[un]

That MFA site might also have been around for years and yours is relatively new I presume.

[nest28]

Ehsan_am, thanks for your comments also. He may a few backlinks that can't be seen but i doubt that it would be more than my site has, plus my backlinks are quality one way links from authority sites.

[nest28]

un, nope i already checked it is only a month older than my site.

[Tom Goodwin]

"Why do crappy MFA site out rank sties with quality content?"

...because Google does not rank sites based upon how a human visitor might view "quality". People hate to admit it, but that is a fact.

As long as the page is optimized for the keyword in question, then google can and will (depending on the competition) rank the page will in Google. It doesn't matter whether you think your content is "better." You might think it is crappy 300 words of content, but Google's algo thinks it matches the keyword search nicely.

It also doesn't matter if the MFA site only has a couple of pages. Google ranks pages not sites. I have plenty of few page sites with pages ranking at the top of Google because the pages are targeting specific keywords and usually (but not always) I have the backlinks to back it up.

Also, but chance, does the MFA site have the keyword as the domain name? If that's the case, than that is of course a huge boost.

Tom

[Joseph Then]

Give yourself another 1-2 months, carry on with your backlinking. You'll outrank that site.

Don't waste time finding out why, why, why...

[nest28]

tom I understand exactly what your talking about, and yes we both have exact match domains his is .org and mine's is .net i just have more pages and content.

[nest28]

Joseph i couldn't agree more i should just continue working hard and in time I know that I will now only beat that site but also all of the other competing sites as well

[nest28]

sorry meant to say not only will I beat that site, but the rest on my competitors as well.

[bigcat1967]

I believe you said that your site is only six weeks old? That's part of the problem right there. Keep adding unique pages and a few backlinks - it will eventually bypass it.

[paulgl]

Originally Posted by Tom Goodwin

"Why do crappy MFA site out rank sties with quality content?"

...because Google does not rank sites based upon how a human visitor might view "quality". People hate to admit it, but that is a fact.

As long as the page is optimized for the keyword in question, then google can and will (depending on the competition) rank the page will in Google. It doesn't matter whether you think your content is "better." You might think it is crappy 300 words of content, but Google's algo thinks it matches the keyword search nicely.

It also doesn't matter if the MFA site only has a couple of pages. Google ranks pages not sites. I have plenty of few page sites with pages ranking at the top of Google because the pages are targeting specific keywords and usually (but not always) I have the backlinks to back it up.

Also, but chance, does the MFA site have the keyword as the domain name? If that's the case, than that is of course a huge boost.

Tom

I think Tom is being polite.

This forum at the moment is filled with threads like this.
Your site does not exist in a vacuum. Your competitors do things
you don't know about. I wish people stop following some list that they
swear google should love more than Joe Shmo.

The only thing I would disagree on is the domain name thing. Not a huge boost.
In fact, it can put you in a box one cannot get out of. Keywords in your
url, yes, big factor. That's why Matt Cutts ranks for stuff other than Matt Cutts
with his mattcutts.com. Besides, you say you each have the keywords in a
domain....so.....who gets the best boost? Not a factor now, is it?

One of the biggest complaints I have about that domain thing, is too many people
do this first, then assume that's it. Done and done. Instead of getting past the list
and start doing some real SEO.

Small niches are iffy at best. There is no magic formula and I wish people would
stop berating the sites that outranks theirs. Get over it and get past it.

Paul

[jhonsean]

Take your time in quality link building and creating content with high quality standards it will be more helpful than questioning yourself and your capabilities. I think google has not yet revealing your backlinks due to updates of algorithm, be patience and more effort it will be matured as soon as it gets.

[nest28]

First and foremost paulgl it is just good manners to be polite while at the same time giving valuable advice, I don't believe you did either. Second I am not complaining about the site out ranking me. I was just curious to why it was number 2 and I am at 5. I do realize that others have much bigger problems like getting from page 10 to 1 while I started out at position 5 on page 1. As for my domain limiting for what I can rank for, I doubt that will happen as I have already checked for long tail keywords that also have the same keyword as my domain and trust me there are plenty of them, if I can rank well for just a third of those searches I would be happy.

paulgl I disagree with most of what you said and how you said it, but I would like to thank you for leaving your comment anyway.

[nest28]

thank you jhonsean I'm starting to see that my biggest mistake was not allowing enough time to pass, I am just in a rush to make money thats all I'm sure many of you can relate, but I do realize that making money online is a long process and not all everyone will be successful.

[Tom Goodwin]

Originally Posted by nest28

thank you jhonsean I'm starting to see that my biggest mistake was not allowing enough time to pass, I am just in a rush to make money thats all I'm sure many of you can relate, but I do realize that making money online is a long process and not all everyone will be successful.

I know its hard when starting out, but in my experience the more domains and the more sites you have going at once, the better your sanity will be. When you have many sites gong at once, you don't get pre-occupied with any particular site, and whey that site isn't moving as fast as you would like it, or why it is dancing around, etc.

Also, you are right, you just have to be patient. I typically give myself about a 3 month window now to start ranking well, at least for newer domains.

Tom

[Tom Goodwin]

Originally Posted by paulgl

The only thing I would disagree on is the domain name thing. Not a huge boost.
In fact, it can put you in a box one cannot get out of. Keywords in your
url, yes, big factor. That's why Matt Cutts ranks for stuff other than Matt Cutts
with his mattcutts.com. Besides, you say you each have the keywords in a
domain....so.....who gets the best boost? Not a factor now, is it?

We all know how you feel about keyword domains Not sure what you mean by "put you in a box one cannot get out of" means though. Perhaps forex.com snuck out of that hole to get to #1 for "forex" In my defense, there was no way of knowing from the OP's initial post that it was a keyword domain vs. a keyword domain though.

[Evan-M]

I would say it has the keyword in the domain.

I was ranked 11th after a pile of work, and couldn't budge, was lucky enough to win my key phrase on a go daddy auction for $9! lol and shot to # 1 after 3 days and a 301 redirect.

I couldn't believe my luck of getting the key phase domain, 550 search/day with a pbr of 60%.

traffic went from 30-40 a day on that site, to 3-400 per day. ( basically 1x for each rank the domain moved up lol ) bs luck , but ill take it.

edit nm, seen a post that came in while i was typing, keyword doman, vs keyword domain...thats a different story....

[nest28]

Thank you Tom for understanding what I am going through and giving me the appropriate advice to inspire me to keep working hard at my website building efforts. The only reason I am so worried about this one site is rather than having many micro niche blogs I was hoping to build one big site and rank most of my keywords in the top 3 spots of the serps.

Please let me know what you think about my efforts.

My site has 25 pages but only 6 are indexed.

In my webmaster tool it says that I am ranking for 14 Search queries most of which are on the front page of google.

Now my thinking has lead me to believe that once my other pages get indexed my site will rank for plenty more long tail keywords.

My question is this, is it a bad idea to build my site to rank for a bunch of long tail keywords that combined will bring thousands of searches a month, I mean if one keyword gets 200 searches a month and another gets 1,000 and so on wont it be great to rank for all of those.

Or am I wrong should I just build a bunch of micro niche sites.

[simpleonline1234]

Did you say your site is only 6 weeks? haha...yeah your site is going to do all sorts of crazy things in the infancy state.

In the eyes of Google your site is probably still in diapers so don't fret too much about anything right now.

I suggest just keep plugging away tossing high quality links to the site each day and not get too stressed over the little things that will happen during this time.

Your site will do everything from rank #1 to disappearing from the rankings all together for a few weeks to returning to the second page, etc.

Just keep doing what you’re doing everyday and maybe launch a few sites at once to keep you busy so you don't get discouraged when things don't change overnight.

No patience and SEO go together like oil & water.

Stick with it and don't fret to much over the competition beating you out so early....the name of the game is slow and steady....it's more of an endurance race than anything...the one left still building backlinks in the end will reap the rewards.

Just build them smart and obtain high quality, relevant backlinks with good PR and everything will fall into place soon enough.

[Evan-M]

Originally Posted by simpleonline1234

Did you say your site is only 6 weeks? haha...yeah your site is going to do all sorts of crazy things in the infancy state.

In the eyes of Google your site is probably still in diapers so don't fret too much about anything right now.

I suggest just keep plugging away tossing high quality links to the site each day and not get too stressed over the little things that will happen during this time.

Your site will do everything from rank #1 to disappearing from the rankings all together for a few weeks to returning to the second page, etc.

Just keep doing what you’re doing everyday and maybe launch a few sites at once to keep you busy so you don't get discouraged when things don't change overnight.

No patience and SEO go together like oil & water.

Stick with it and don't fret to much over the competition beating you out so early....the name of the game is slow and steady....it's more of an endurance race than anything...the one left still building backlinks in the end will reap the rewards.

Just build them smart and obtain high quality, relevant backlinks with good PR and everything will fall into place soon enough.

great post nail right on the head

[nest28]

Sorry for not stating that I was competing against another site with the same exact match domain.
But in this case shouldn't the domain with more content and backlinks win?

The site only has one page of content,a contact page, and a privacy policy page.

I also notice that by typing my keyword in different phrases a lot of other MFA sites were rank well in the serps. We all have the same keyword in our domains but just in different ways. So my goal is to beat all of them by building one big site with quality content and great backlinks. I feel that if I can to that I can make the same amount of money with my site than the rest of them combined.

[nest28]

simpleonline1234 I agree, THANK YOU ALL FOR YOUR COMMENTS AND SUGGESTIONS THEY WILL HELP ME TO STAY FOCUSED AND ACCOMPLISH MY GOALS. I wont worry about the little things anymore especially when my site is so young, just hard work and dedication ahead for me folks. I will let everyone know of my progress.

[sparckyz]

Interesting question with some good answers too. Must admit; i've often wondered about this myself :P

[paulgl]

Originally Posted by Tom Goodwin

We all know how you feel about keyword domains Not sure what you mean by "put you in a box one cannot get out of" means though. Perhaps forex.com snuck out of that hole to get to #1 for "forex" In my defense, there was no way of knowing from the OP's initial post that it was a keyword domain vs. a keyword domain though.

Hey Tom, I never say don't do it. It provides a good user vibe. But too many people
think it's magic.

The box is the niche. I don't exactly like the word niche when it comes to these things.
By niche one really means the whole genre of what they are doing. Not just one single,
narrow aspect. But if you rely on just the domain for tip off and direction, then you
are putting yourself in a box for just that. Not for the genre or even niche, but one
narrow item. Not conducive for building any long term authority.

My take on the domain is one keyword, carefully chosen and wrapped in a domain,
if possible, to allow branching. If your domain is red-buttons-for-shirts.com, then
what will people think if most people search for buttons? Better choice would be
for Button-orama.com or something like that. Too much is made about being a MFA
and taking it to the extreme. That is, one page on red buttons for shirts. Not the
way to go. The red-buttons-for-shirts.com is what people seem to bent on getting
or something similar, and debating what phrase to use. Button-Emporium.com IMHO,
would be what to get. (just an example....) Then have a url about shirt buttons, etc.

Besides, Tom. You drilled into enough people that domains don't get ranked.
Pages do

Paul

[Dellco]

Sometimes, no, actually most of the time, you just have to be patient and keep plodding.

I also see this in a lot of places, a so called crappy site or crappy page outranking a much bigger and better site. Apparently, it's normal and nobody can explain it much.

All you can do is build more pages and links, and have faith one day you'll outrank that site....

[nest28]

ok what if bought a exact match domain for Maybelline lipstick/Maybellinelipstick.com

wouldn't I be able to rank for plenty of terms with the word lipstick or Maybelline as long as there is med to low competition?

For example. these searches are real number from micro niche finder

Maybelline lipstick 9,900
moisturizing lipstick 590
mood lipstick 2,000
natural lipstick 1,900
plum lipstick1,900
poppy lipstick 390
sheer lipstick 1,300

Not to mention phrases like ''what is the best lipstick for thin lips'' or ''what is the best lipstick color for me'' extremely long tail keywords like this usually has low search volume but hey every little bit helps. I only selected a few there were many more phrases with the word lipstick in it so it would not be hard to build a large site around the one keyword but if thats not enough for you try to also add the other keyword which is maybelline.

maybelline lipstick swatches
maybelline lipstick review
maybelline lipstick ingredients
maybelline lipstick pearl
maybelline lip stain review

etc,etc

There are more than enough keywords with lipstick or maybelline in them so even if you bought a exact match domain you could easily build a site with at least a 100 pages with this one subject and if you backlink well enough most of those pages will rank well in the serps.

If each page of a website is considered a site unto it self why make 100 micro niche sites instead of making one site with a 100 pages. If you treat each page like it is a site unto it self and use meta description for each page along with backlink each page should make you money. combined the entire site should make the same as 100 micro sites right.

[David Bleidt]

Originally Posted by nest28

ok what if bought a exact match domain for Maybelline lipstick/Maybellinelipstick.com

wouldn't I be able to rank for plenty of terms with the word lipstick or Maybelline as long as there is med to low competition?

For example. these searches are real number from micro niche finder

Maybelline lipstick 9,900
moisturizing lipstick 590
mood lipstick 2,000
natural lipstick 1,900
plum lipstick1,900
poppy lipstick 390
sheer lipstick 1,300

Not to mention phrases like ''what is the best lipstick for thin lips'' or ''what is the best lipstick color for me'' extremely long tail keywords like this usually has low search volume but hey every little bit helps. I only selected a few there were many more phrases with the word lipstick in it so it would not be hard to build a large site around the one keyword but if thats not enough for you try to also add the other keyword which is maybelline.

maybelline lipstick swatches
maybelline lipstick review
maybelline lipstick ingredients
maybelline lipstick pearl
maybelline lip stain review

etc,etc

There are more than enough keywords with lipstick or maybelline in them so even if you bought a exact match domain you could easily build a site with at least a 100 pages with this one subject and if you backlink well enough most of those pages will rank well in the serps.

If each page of a website is considered a site unto it self why make 100 micro niche sites instead of making one site with a 100 pages. If you treat each page like it is a site unto it self and use meta description for each page along with backlink each page should make you money. combined the entire site should make the same as 100 micro sites right.

well this is what many people do. That is just one of the things you can discuss.
1. One big authority page
2. many micro pages

but both have pros and cons. if your authority page will be shut down for whatever reason you lose your complete money stream. the same goes with the micro pages because if they will be reviewed by google they could shut down your adsense acc. so ....

David