Forbes Penalized For Selling Links. Will This Effect Us Too?

[AnniePot]

I read this morning that Google is sending out warnings to people both selling and buying links. See: Poll: Can You Pay For Links & Never Get Caught?

So, my question is, is this ruling going to effect us little guys as well? I ask because recently I've had two other web sites approach me of their own accord and ask if they can pay for a linkback from one of my high PR blogs.

In both cases I suggested a price that I thought was pretty high, but they agreed and paid up immediately, paying in advance for links lasting 12 months.

There are thousands of web sites that offer you a link for a price and say so on their sites. I was thinking of doing so too but now I'm not sure if this will be wise.

What do you guys think?

[cashcow]

It will affect you, but only if you get caught.

Google has said all along that they will penalize for buying/selling links but it is still done on a huge level.

My guess is that they don't spend a lot of time actively looking for this but if really depends on how much of a risk you want to take.

Lee

[AnniePot]

That's kind of what I thought. Well, I'm reluctant to just capitulate and reimburse my present 2 paid linkers, they have paid me a substantial amount (unless they get cold feet and ask to cancel of course), but I guess going that one step further and actually advertising paid links isn't going to happen.

[schwarzes]

Just curious,

How would google come to know that the link on my website is paid for or not ?

I might be placing links of my other websites in my pages, or maybe a local seller might be placing his links on mine and paying me in person.

How would google come to know that he is my neighbour and he paid me by buying a beer for me ? just curious..

[GazCooperOnline]

We all dabble in paid links one way or another and I think the key is to stay under the radar and not have anything on a site you value showing you offer paid links, that is just asking for trouble when you know its against Google TOS.

Stay under the radar and keep ya head down is my advice.

I never Ping a site or try to get google to index my latest efforts its like telling Google what you just did LOL I let them find them on there own.

Gaz Cooper

[GazCooperOnline]

I think she is reffering to you putting it in writing on your site that you accept paid Links which would be suicide.

Google will never know if you stay under the radar and are sensible

Gaz Cooper

[cashcow]

How would google come to know that the link on my website is paid for or not ?

That's a good question. I think for some sites it would be obvious but for the "little guy" that just has a couple of links on there then it seems like it would be hard to tell.

I mean they can hardly go around slapping everyone who has a link to another site on their site, right? So it seems it would have to be pretty obvious for them to take action. But that's just IMHO, I dont work for google so who knows?

Lee

P.S who is the biggest link seller on the planet?

[PatriciaJ]

If the links are no follow I think that it is paid advertising. Do follow and it affects Googles rankings and that's where the problem lies with them.

[AnniePot]

Originally Posted by schwarzes

Just curious,

How would google come to know that the link on my website is paid for or not ?

I might be placing links of my other websites in my pages, or maybe a local seller might be placing his links on mine and paying me in person.

How would google come to know that he is my neighbour and he paid me by buying a beer for me ? just curious..

That's what puzzled me too. It seems that the website is going to have to publish that they offer paid links. If I don't do this, I really think my two paying links should be safe

[Yadira Barbosa]

Originally Posted by schwarzes

Just curious,

How would google come to know that the link on my website is paid for or not ?

I might be placing links of my other websites in my pages, or maybe a local seller might be placing his links on mine and paying me in person.

How would google come to know that he is my neighbour and he paid me by buying a beer for me ? just curious..

On some cases the software used by link selling companies (as Text Link Ads) its detected by Google.

In other cases some websites includes a page for selling publicity on the website.

But theres some buying/selling process that goes under the radar for all, I don't know how Googles detect that.

[ShirleyS]

Originally Posted by cashcow

P.S who is the biggest link seller on the planet?

If adwords provide link value, then Google has to slaps itself

[cashcow]

Originally Posted by PatriciaJ

If the links are no follow I think that it is paid advertising. Do follow and it affects Googles rankings and that's where the problem lies with them.

Yes, that is correct, google has no problem with selling links if they are no follow. But most people buying them want them to be dofollow.

Lee

[bay37]

Originally Posted by cashcow

I think for some sites it would be obvious but for the "little guy" that just has a couple of links on there then it seems like it would be hard to tell.

Just wanted to add that even the "obvious" ones need to be examined on a case by case basis, which means a lot of manual labour. Doesn't really change anything for the "little guy".

[bay37]

Originally Posted by PatriciaJ

If the links are no follow I think that it is paid advertising. Do follow and it affects Googles rankings and that's where the problem lies with them.

Both "do follow" and "no follow" links affect Google rankings. The "no follow" ones carry less PR juice, but they are not 100% discounted.

[PatriciaJ]

Originally Posted by cashcow

Yes, that is correct, google has no problem with selling links if they are no follow. But most people buying them want them to be dofollow.

Lee

Fortunately I have had some advertisers that are happy with nofollow, but I'm still getting SEO companies who are trying to buy dofollow text links on behalf of big companies. I'm in negotiations at the moment with a company who are asking to pay for some relevant content with a text link on one of my home pages. In a sense like article marketing but they get to hog the limelight for a designated time. I think I prefer that way at the moment but I'm going to put some sort of notice or disclaimer on the site stating that some of the links are sponsered, some my own and some affiliate, hopefully that will help.

[PatriciaJ]

Originally Posted by bay37

Both "do follow" and "no follow" links affect Google rankings. The "no follow" ones carry less PR juice, but they are not 100% discounted.

It's a little while since I looked into it but I think that you have to state that the dofollow links are paid for advertising on your site and that there isn't a problem with nofollow because you are looking for clickthroughs and not trying to game the rankings.

[DeborahDera]

Purchasing "advertising" is one thing. Purchasing a "paid link" is another, and Google doesn't like it.

I think the blogs getting caught are the ones that list on their sites that they will list your link for a fee.

Originally Posted by AnniePot

I read this morning that Google is sending out warnings to people both selling and buying links. See: Poll: Can You Pay For Links & Never Get Caught?

So, my question is, is this ruling going to effect us little guys as well? I ask because recently I've had two other web sites approach me of their own accord and ask if they can pay for a linkback from one of my high PR blogs.

In both cases I suggested a price that I thought was pretty high, but they agreed and paid up immediately, paying in advance for links lasting 12 months.

There are thousands of web sites that offer you a link for a price and say so on their sites. I was thinking of doing so too but now I'm not sure if this will be wise.

What do you guys think?

[bay37]

Originally Posted by PatriciaJ

It's a little while since I looked into it but I think that you have to state that the dofollow links are paid for advertising on your site and that there isn't a problem with nofollow because you are looking for clickthroughs and not trying to game the rankings.

No idea about the terms and conditions, honestly... Just the fact that selling "no follow" links isn't considered "gaming the rankings" seems kind of strange to me, since no-follow links do help with rankings.

[iAmNameLess]

Google, where can I buy back links? They aren't penalizing everyone, and many people are still there who were there months and months ago.

[Apollo-Articles]

This is a bit lame, especially when Google sells links themselves!

So many sites sell advertising, surely this won't become a mainstream force?

Sam

[Converting Copy]

This discussion has made me a bit confused on the difference in punishment/acceptance between paid links for link juice and paid advertisements appearing on a site which are nofollow.

To me it seems the former should be punishable, at least from Google's perspective of wanting the most relevant content on top which gets polluted when a crappy site can shoot up there via some paid for powerful link juice, whereas the latter should be totally fine; but it seems like you all are saying there are some shades in between.

As far as how Google detects this practice, maybe they recognize when a small site takes a big leap in general and further investigate and rule depending on how it comes out.

I read in the past Google just nuked sites which it caught doing this big or small, but now they are a bit more sensible and "compassionate", just slapping you down to the late 70s.

Bigger companies aren't affected as much when something like this happens compared to smaller internet based companies which aren't in the public conscious, so it especially sucks for the little guys who get caught and rely exclusively on search engines for traffic.

[Kierkegaard]

If you own a website about cats and someone emails you offering to pay you for a link to their website, also something to do with cats, then Google will never know - how could they?

Compare it to owning a website about cats, finding a great resource for cat owners online and linking to it.

There is no way to tell the difference.

However, if you have a website about cats and have a load of links to sites about World of Warcraft, Online Casinos, Bodybuilding supplements, etc. then some dubious linking is going on.

[Alexa Smith]

Originally Posted by AnniePot

There are thousands of web sites that offer you a link for a price and say so on their sites. I was thinking of doing so too but now I'm not sure if this will be wise.

What do you guys think?

I wouldn't risk it, myself: Google's said too openly that they disapprove of of "paid links", for my taste, to be that open about it. I would imagine you'd probably be perfectly safe with what you've done so far, though?

[PatriciaJ]

Originally Posted by bay37

No idea about the terms and conditions, honestly... Just the fact that selling "no follow" links isn't considered "gaming the rankings" seems kind of strange to me, since no-follow links do help with rankings.

Without looking for and reading about it again I think that by using a nofollow link you are indicating to Google that it is paid for and you are not looking to pass on link juice. There is a blog from Matt Cutts about it somewhere if you do a search, sorry I'd find it myself but I'm in the middle of something.

[iAmNameLess]

Google against any manipulation of the search results. That being said, SEOs in general would be punished! lol.

I don't think there is much to worry about here. You just need to be smart about stuff. Don't go and spam irrelevant comments on an unrelated site. I make blog comments on sites out of my niche, and link back of course, but I make some sort of relevant comment.

Offer value.. YOU and YOUR SITE will be valued in return.

[donhx]

This act by Google is one of those issues where the industry giant is trying to smash the competition. In the name of "manipulating search results" they want to keep other people from making money in exactly the same way they do. I read the US Government is investigating Google for several unfair business practices, and maybe this ought to be another one.

There is nothing illegal about selling or bartering links, and the Federal Trade Commission covers this here: http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/w...cfr255_03.html

It could very well be that Google is using its power to reduce competition. I've seen the Forbes page, and they look like ads. That's what the Internet is all about, and I think Google is going to generate some problems for itself on this. It is a type of unfair restraint of trade.

[Alexa Smith]

Originally Posted by donhx

There is nothing illegal about selling or bartering links

No, of course not ... but there's nothing necessarily unfair (or at least not provably so) in Google ranking people's sites however they choose to, either.

Originally Posted by donhx

I think Google is going to generate some problems for itself on this.

Possibly so, eventually. But meanwhile one has one's rankings to consider, you know, and they affect one's income to some extent?

[GarrieWilson]

People you piss off, your competitors, Google fan boys, etc. will tell.

-g

[donhx]

Originally Posted by Alexa Smith

No, of course not ... but there's nothing necessarily unfair (or at least not provably so) in Google ranking people's sites however they choose to, either.

Possibly so, eventually. But meanwhile one has one's rankings to consider, you know, and they affect one's income to some extent?

Yes. In this case they need to make this smiley about 10 times bigger:

Google can do anything they want... right until they step on the toe of some gorilla, and that would be the government. The problem here is that selling links is virtually the same as selling ads. And Google is going to start twisting people's arms to make them all nofollow? Sounds evil to me. Google is trying to shape traffic to meet its own needs rather than providing true organic results.

[AnniePot]

Originally Posted by donhx

There is nothing illegal about selling or bartering links, and the Federal Trade Commission covers this here: 2003 CFR Title 16, Volume 1

It could very well be that Google is using its power to reduce competition. I've seen the Forbes page, and they look like ads. That's what the Internet is all about, and I think Google is going to generate some problems for itself on this. It is a type of unfair restraint of trade.

That's extremely interesting - thanks.

[wanna-succeed]

Just out of curiousity, is there a price level for link?
I know they say that a PR 5 is 100 time stronger than a PR 3 (multiples of 10).
Would you estimate the price being the same, 10 times more expensive for higher PR?

[Midnight Oil]

From Google:

"Not all paid links violate our guidelines. Buying and selling links is a normal part of the economy of the web when done for advertising purposes, and not for manipulation of search results. Links purchased for advertising should be designated as such."

Paid links - Webmaster Tools Help

[JWatson]

Originally Posted by donhx

Google can do anything they want... right until they step on the toe of some gorilla, and that would be the government. The problem here is that selling links is virtually the same as selling ads. And Google is going to start twisting people's arms to make them all nofollow? Sounds evil to me. Google is trying to shape traffic to meet its own needs rather than providing true organic results.

Yeah, that is something I think about. It first dawned on me when I saw a Google app (free naturally) that many fire departments in the States use on their way to a fire to get a guess as to whether the building is occupied or not.

I went from "omg how cool" to hmm..."how deep are some of these roots growing?"

I don't think of it as "evil" (sorry if I'm being too literal ) but as the almost inevitable consequence of corporate dominance.

I agree that the gorilla will be the government. (Thinking how they entangled IBM for a while.) But with the recent sentiment shift in Washington, I think it will be delayed for a while.

[AnniePot]

Further to my original post, opening this thread, this morning I read a new article by the same author whom I initially referenced: Yes, I Sell Links, Google Penalizing Me, Don't Judge Me VERY interesting reading again.

[ann1986]

Just make sure you dont leave any clue and footprints that you display paid links