Excessive link building

[Affillionaire]

Originally Posted by tigerwar

Don't know where you get that idea from Jonny,

Also quoting that video doesn't help matters, it is old in terms og google algorythm...since then there have been a few updates which apparently radically change the way google reacts to certain backlinking techniques.

I've written so many times in different threads regarding the changes thru the farmer and panda that I only half heartedly answered in this thread.
It was more of a warning than an explanation.

It is obvious that "viral" backlinking can't simply be stopped in its tracks and hence the number won't play a negative roll, but simulating a viral blast of backlinks (such as twitter/facebook) is not only hard to do, especially without the right tools but it's also not the strategy used by most newbies.

The majority just see the shiny promises of 1000s of backlinks, the how, where and who has the control don't normally come to mind

Backlink questions are rarely specific and the meaning of backlinks is very often misunderstood.
posting links only to PR3 and upwards in blasts of 1000s leaves a footprint
Posting to blogs with 2 to 3 links on a blog without any form of content in blasts of 1000s leaves a footprint.

posting to blogs using only "dofollow" by the 1000s (even 500) leaves an obvious footprint and are picked up as spamming the index.(so my statistics and those from others).

So as I've explained many times in various other threads(sorry), Variation is the key

now you can take me apart if thats the priority here

I'm sure something useful will come out of this

cheers
TW

I also agree with that also, thats why I continue to throw in pr1+ links everywhere and nofollow links because naturally that's the way its gonna be.

Now don't get me wrong I know the importance of High PR links but every authority site has links on N/A and PR0 sites too not all PR5 sites links are left ONLY on PR5+ sites.

Overall this is what I do and it's working for most of my sites, so I can only speak for myself, but I do have some sites that I don't know what the hell happened to their rankings and still trying to work on that.

[tigerwar]

Hey Affillionaire

Well that depends on what kind of backlinks got you degraded. E.G. the (B) type above are a killer because they there's obviously no content(hence spaming the index) and these are offered everywhere! Basically you have to simulate some form of interest which can be achieved fairly easily by means of B2B via RSS to those links and pinging them on a regular basis. If the links never get pinged, they will simply be ignored at some stage and your site dies with them.

There are many backlinking offers that include pinging these, the problem is, is that many ping them all at once. That's similar to turning a light on at night in the middle of the Sahara desert and sticking your head in the sand so that nobody finds you.

Spread out B2B simulates a viral effect rather than direct "spamming" inbound links.

Using B2B whilst at the top has an awsome effect of strengthening(per volume) your existing links but when you've been kicked as I was in the above case, it won't help too much.

The only thing that has really helped(on different test sites) was to create keyword related content and drive direct backlinks to those(using article submissions) + RSS B2B to those submissions. The important thing was then to backlink "INTERNALLY" from the new content to the older(harmed) content(not vice versa). This basically builds a net behind the older content and drives it back up without forcing direct preasure on the already "branded backlinks". Of course, you don't over do the internal linking and I found that a steady growth of B2B to the (B) links mentioned in the above post helped exceptionally well opposed to simply adding new "Direct" backlinks to the "harmed" content.

and btw...the majority of this can be automated once setup

cheers
TW

Originally Posted by Affillionaire

Hey I'm not dissagreeing with you there, but I had a site that was ranking pretty good on the 1st page and bring in some good sales and now is sitting at the same page range. I've tried to continuously build links to the site and I can't get it back to the 1st page, How did you get yours back?

[xnice]

Your website may have Google Dance. If your site is new and they are micro niches, you should not build too much links at beginning.

[Affillionaire]

Originally Posted by tigerwar

Hey Affillionaire

Well that depends on what kind of backlinks got you degraded. E.G. the (B) type above are a killer because they there's obviously no content(hence spaming the index) and these are offered everywhere! Basically you have to simulate some form of interest which can be achieved fairly easily by means of B2B via RSS to those links and pinging them on a regular basis. If the links never get pinged, they will simply be ignored at some stage and your site dies with them.

There are many backlinking offers that include pinging these, the problem is, is that many ping them all at once. That's similar to turning a light on at night in the middle of the Sahara desert and sticking your head in the sand so that nobody finds you.

Spread out B2B simulates a viral effect rather than direct "spamming" inbound links.

Using B2B whilst at the top has an awsome effect of strengthening(per volume) your existing links but when you've been kicked as I was in the above case, it won't help too much.

The only thing that has really helped(on different test sites) was to create keyword related content and drive direct backlinks to those(using article submissions) + RSS B2B to those submissions. The important thing was then to backlink "INTERNALLY" from the new content to the older(harmed) content(not vice versa). This basically builds a net behind the older content and drives it back up without forcing direct preasure on the already "branded backlinks". Of course, you don't over do the internal linking and I found that a steady growth of B2B to the (B) links mentioned in the above post helped exceptionally well opposed to simply adding new "Direct" backlinks to the "harmed" content.

and btw...the majority of this can be automated once setup

cheers
TW

Yeah I heard about a method close to that and was trying to get around to it by setting up TBS articles and inputting it into AMR and then using scrapebox to mass submit to those articles. Basically build a net of buffer sites and then build mass links to those articles or web 2.0 sites but have been focused on other getting other sites ranked well also, so I will give your method a try as soon as I get a chance and will let you know when I get some results. Thanks for the feedback.

BTW if you have an exact method you'd like to share feel free to PM me, I'm always ready to learn something new! (automation and all)

[mmickeals]

There is no such thing as excessive link building. There is only incorrect link building. I am not sure what you would consider excessive, but amongst my sites, I build about 10k links per minute, every minute of every day. When I see one of sites bounce down into the supposed "sandbox" I get excited. This is just a signal for me to ramp up linking activity to that site. Test this for yourself, but I am sure you will find that link velocity and link acceleration are far more important things to consider than what is mentioned in this thread.

It is true that sometimes a site will fall down in rankings when you begin to rapidly increase link velocity. All that this means is that your position is being recalculated. Every single time that this has happened to me, a continued increase in link velocity and acceleration has led to rapidly increasing rankings. I repeat that this has happened every single time. I always recommend that you take anything you hear with a grain of salt. The best knowledge is first hand knowledge, so test, test, and test. Warrior forum is a great site for alot of things, but to many people spout information that they have not tested, but just heard. And a great deal of what you hear is completly wrong.

Good luck.

[tigerwar]

Originally Posted by mmickeals

There is no such thing as excessive link building. There is only incorrect link building. I am not sure what you would consider excessive, but amongst my sites, I build about 10k links per minute, every minute of every day. When I see one of sites bounce down into the supposed "sandbox" I get excited. This is just a signal for me to ramp up linking activity to that site. Test this for yourself, but I am sure you will find that link velocity and link acceleration are far more important things to consider than what is mentioned in this thread.

It is true that sometimes a site will fall down in rankings when you begin to rapidly increase link velocity. All that this means is that your position is being recalculated. Every single time that this has happened to me, a continued increase in link velocity and acceleration has led to rapidly increasing rankings. I repeat that this has happened every single time. I always recommend that you take anything you hear with a grain of salt. The best knowledge is first hand knowledge, so test, test, and test. Warrior forum is a great site for alot of things, but to many people spout information that they have not tested, but just heard. And a great deal of what you hear is completly wrong.

Good luck.

Hi mmickeals,

Well the numbers are certainly very impressive and I do agree that not everything suggested, necessarily applies to every website.

I have already tried 10K, but not per min...jeeeesh! I tried 10K per day for about 6 months and as you claimed, the sites came back. Unfortunately they also disappeared for good in february this year...wiped from the surface and never to be seen again.

If anyone tries this, (and this is obviously only MHO) then I wouldn't suggest doing it on an authority site (a main income stream) rather on small niche sites designed for $20+ per month income, even better - autoblogs, unless of course you can carry the possible loss financially let alone all the personal time and effort involved to build an authority site.

Edit: also if your doing any testing, ensure to do this on a server with different IPs than your authority blog because if that get branded, you can start all over again.

[tutoringmethods]

Yes excessive link building consider as spamming..........

[tigerwar]

Originally Posted by Affillionaire

Yeah I heard about a method close to that and was trying to get around to it by setting up TBS articles and inputting it into AMR and then using scrapebox to mass submit to those articles. Basically build a net of buffer sites and then build mass links to those articles or web 2.0 sites but have been focused on other getting other sites ranked well also, so I will give your method a try as soon as I get a chance and will let you know when I get some results. Thanks for the feedback.

BTW if you have an exact method you'd like to share feel free to PM me, I'm always ready to learn something new! (automation and all)

using TBS and AMR fits pretty well with this Tool to convert, submit,organize and ping your B2B RSS feeds automatically.It's a one time set-up and then your ready. In AMR you have the "Live Links" browser for the submitted directories which you can then simply paste into the tool and with TBS you can create the RSS spins much easier.

cheers
TW

[jonnyhardbaked]

Originally Posted by tigerwar

Don't know where you get that idea from Jonny,

TW

Wooo...Did I say Anything offensive about your reply? I just reminded Jaysam about clearing things up..

But If I offended you, I humbly say sorry for that... And oh..Anyway, thanks for that information....When I get a hard time in my SEO, I would surely rely on that..

But for now, I will just stick to my techniques that I found very effective....

[tigerwar]

Originally Posted by jonnyhardbaked

Wooo...Did I say Anything offensive about your reply? I just reminded Jaysam about clearing things up..

But If I offended you, I humbly say sorry for that... And oh..Anyway, thanks for that information....When I get a hard time in my SEO, I would surely rely on that..

But for now, I will just stick to my techniques that I found very effective....

no Jonny,

I'm not offended at all and I'm not participating in this thread to discuss whether someone is talking BS or not, rather I'm (as a few others) trying to add value by entering experience and results so that others are able to make their own picture and possibly benefit from them.

I'm happy to hear that your techniques are working for you. Unfortunately you haven't made any contribution here in the thread regarding how or what. I'm sure people would be more than interested for you to share at least one of your effective ways rather than just hear what you have to say about others. Last but not least, that's why you came here, right?

cheers
TW

[shunks]

As long as you dont force the indexing and the backlinks are not low quality Xrumer/Scrapebox spam you will be fine.

[michelcarloss]

Yes I agree with you but maintain consistency of link building....

[jonnyhardbaked]

Originally Posted by tigerwar

no Jonny,

I'm not offended at all and I'm not participating in this thread to discuss whether someone is talking BS or not, rather I'm (as a few others) trying to add value by entering experience and results so that others are able to make their own picture and possibly benefit from them.

I'm happy to hear that your techniques are working for you. Unfortunately you haven't made any contribution here in the thread regarding how or what. I'm sure people would be more than interested for you to share at least one of your effective ways rather than just hear what you have to say about others. Last but not least, that's why you came here, right?

cheers
TW

Woops! I have to thank you for reminding me that. I am just enjoying my time reading everyone's opinion on this thread (and yours as well).

However, I care for everybody on this forum that's why I'm giving my best to help others. Regarding on this thread, when I look at the topic, I think someone has already given the right answer. I'm just being practical..

[tigerwar]

Originally Posted by jonnyhardbaked

But for now, I will just stick to my techniques that I found very effective....

what a shame for us all, I think we were all really looking forward to seeing your "effective techniques". Oh well....I suppose we'll just have to guess . Nevertheless, thanks a ton for your infomative contribution, it's always good to have such caring people

cheers
TW

[bigballin6161]

I have read times where people who have tested and yes too many backlinks will get you sandboxed or heavily penalized. Try doing a massive blast of scrapebox and xrummer to your homepage and seee what happens....

[mosthost]

10,000 links a minute Now there's some ambition!

[stephencammeron]

Originally Posted by mosthost

10,000 links a minute Now there's some ambition!

Well, if I do have 10,000 workers that gets 1 link per minute, then there's a 10,000 links per minute! LOL!

[stephencammeron]

Once you lose your ranking, they tell you that you did it the wrong way

Yeah, because they really didn't do it the right way.
However, I'm just wondering if those sellers does?

[tigerwar]

Originally Posted by Izaya

I hope your kidding. Do you actually even test anything, or do you just claim to have tested things? Whatever your doing tiger, your doing it horribly wrong.Why not search any competitive niches up and look at sites that are ranking and are under 1 year old, plenty have 100k+ links showing ( and that's just the links that are showing). Anyway if anything your completely ignorant, at least for competitive SEO.

Well first off Izaya,

I think the conversation is a little to harsh here at the moment and I'd like to try reduce it to a more pleasant level by appologizing for the word "ignorant" (sincerely).

I just get upset when people say things without showing any proof.

Anyways....I have already proved these facts on this forum and many know some of the tactics I use in order to reach #1 and even which sites. I don't preach anything that I don't practise and lot's of people here know that.

I have already made a post in this thread describing a site that was #1 and got attacked and degraded by simply blasting 24000 links from p0rn sites at it.

I proved this with 2 sites openly (by showing the rise and fall and domain names) here in the WF and I really don't want to have repost everything again having written 1000s of words in 100s of posts about it already. The topics were more related to how to get your site ranked rather than why a site can get degraded.

Below is an image of the competition that I was ranking for on #1 for 5 months, in fact I was on pages 1 to 3, if you count direct backlinks to this site using my articles 13 times and for a relatively high competition keywords.
As you can see in the image, they have millions of backlinks but I was able to kick them down with only about 1500 BLs which were spread out over approx. 7 months.



This wasn't a test site, but it is now and was earning good cash untill they blasted it using proxies with the p0rn backlinks.

Now, I do have many websites and 90% are doing exceptionally well using the same techniques but the equation is simple.....those that I have blasted and the one site mentioned above, have all been degraded and stayed at positions of between #150-#300.

I am not trying to BS anyone here, I've openly proved this already and I'm simply sharing my experience.

Why do the majority of my sites that are not blasted stay at the top and above those with millions of links and and those that are blasted fall rapidly and don't recover?

You know, I only see certain people trying to knock my opinions, but none of them are proving anything to back their statements.
Obviously no one is expecting or asking people to openly publish their site here, HECK..no way! but it would be great to hear a few possitive techniques opposed to simply saying..."you have to do it correctly" or whatever.

I can explain why my sites stay at the top and how I get there but I can't explain why they fall when blasted, I can only prove that they do fall when blasted, which leads me and many others to the conclusion...DON'T blast NEW sites.


cheers
TW

[nataliemussen]

Just as long as you maintain the quality of your backlinks, I think it's not possible.

[tigerwar]

Originally Posted by eurekapsycrille

Sorry to interrupt you tigerwar, I just want to ask if a 3 months site can be considered as young domain?

Well I hope someone jumps in to confirm, refute or add to this but IMHO anything under 2 years old is considered a new domain for the simple reason that too many spamm sites come and go which confirms the lack of intention of adding value to the internet. On the other hand there are also different levels of establishing a degree of trust = authority.

Point to note would be(regarding backlinks)

1. Attended opposed to neglected sites
2. Authoritive opposed to unauthoritive sites(possibly seen as spammers)
3. Socially Active opposed to inactive sites

A site that is getting publicity/backlinks from high authority sites and/or press releases will or should result in natural organic->viral backlinks (dependant upon interest) and could establish an authority within days, whereas a site that has little to do with this, will need much longer and hence retain the "new website" classification.

Sites with an obvious lack of continuity E.G. 3 months of posts and then left to go stale for 9 months but with a sudden interrest at the end of 12 months will be treated as a 1 day old domain because the "trust" or credibility" was simply never established.

Basically if your site is 3 months old and highly active, you should be able to backlink accordingly but if you over do this, it will still get degraded according to my and others experience.

A few people here are talking about blasting 5-10K per day or even minutes...sorry but if a 3 month old site is getting 100 visitors per day and I blast 5K of backlinks at it every day(not minutes), my 5 year old son could spot the difference(in terms of numbers on paper), what do you think the google algorithm can do?

So to answere your question, in terms of the "normal" site and regarding credible backlinks, I would say anywhere upto 2 years

cheers
TW

[dagaul101]

I think building the links in a natural progression would convince Google that the links are not strange and worthy of being penalised

[goldradio]

Building more and more links from relevant sites is always good, but if you try to spam and build irrelevant crappy links, there are chances that the value of those links taken down and the initial boost that we got through those links would be taken down..

[skele]

Allways take care about the relevant links to your site. It is the best that the topic is similar.

[GlenIris]

links should be relevant and must hv good matter !!!!!