Are you good at analyzing Top 10 competition?

[outwest]

I am getting pretty good at it with Market samurai, I blast sometimes 100 to 200 words per day

Here is where I am stuck
People say, go ahead and target the kw if the competition is not targeting the term

Ok hmmmm

Many times you see N N N N in the onpage SEO columns in Market Samurai

but
sometimes these sites are showing only their main root domain in the top 10
not a subpage

and some of the sites are also showing 10,000 backinks and a PR5 or PR6

so than at that point you are thinking hmmmm ok now what?
High PR which is 5 and above is certainly not easy to outrank, and obviously these sites must have some pretty strong backlinks to get that PR,
but
yet
their onpage SEO is NOT targeting this kw

I have a friend who says, to heck with it, ONPAGE SEO TRUMPS BACKLINKS

How true have you found this to be
and where do you draw the line

[yukon]

It's not a matter of on-page vs off-page seo, you need both If your serious about ranking a page for the keyword.

[DarioMontesdeOca]

Originally Posted by outwest

ONPAGE SEO TRUMPS BACKLINKS

For Google ranking the exact opposite is true

[Clyde]

No lol, with Google backlinks is everything.

There are other factors of course, but backlinks is major.

[ruby2011]

Originally Posted by yukon

It's not a matter of on-page vs off-page seo, you need both If your serious about ranking a page for the keyword.

High quality and topic related backlinks is the king of Google ranking.
BTW, anyone can give some tips on how to analyze the ranking potential for certain keywords ? How to judge the competition according to the top 10 results?

[outwest]

Yes but that kind of does not make sense
how can backlinks be everything? Backlinks have to be relevant to the kws being targeted

If they are not targeting the kws in questions, then how can for example
www.othersite.com being listed in the top 10
how can this site be being pulled up for these kws if they are not even targeting those kws?

if google is just pulling them up because of their strong backinks and strong PR,
WHY did google choose to pull up THAT site, for this kw? if they are not targeting the kws in their onpage SEO, title, url, header and description?

the only thing left to make the site stand out would have to be the anchor text in their backlinks would be targeted towrds this kw phrase

So theoretically at least, that would be the reason they are ranking
So then if thats true, You would have to go look and analyze their backlinks for their anchor text

what do you think of this theory

[Marx Vergel Melencio]

Hi,

Onsite SEO geared towards contextual relevance is easier to do than offsite SEO geared towards contextual relevance, primarily because other people own the websites where your offsite content and backlinks should be placed, so they control if and when they'll publish your offsite content and backlinks. Google knows this. So, if you have a properly optimized site content page, I suggest SEOPressor to get good recommendations for properly optimizing your content pages for search engine robots, then you need enough contextually relevant offsite content pages with your backlinks on high authority domains in your niches with high PR, contextually relevant dofollow pages. These pages can be top ranking in Google for your target keywords, so you can funnel organic search traffic that goes to that page to your own pages, via your content and backlinks...

@ Ruby:

Originally Posted by ruby2011

...some tips on how to analyze the ranking potential for certain keywords ? How to judge the competition according to the top 10 results?

1. Google your target keywords, without quotes. Why? Your target audience does the same thing when they're looking on the Internet for relevant info and content about the solutions, products and services they need: They go to Google, type your target keywords without quotes, then click Search. This means the top ten page results = Your competitors, since you're competing with these pages for top ten Google rankings for your target keywords...

2. Take note of the URLs of these top ten page results for each of your target keywords. Also take note of the domain homepage/index page URLs where these top ten page results are found. Remember: A domain homepage/index page and an internal page of that website have different backlink portfolios/profiles, and Google PR juice of the domain homepage/index page is passed to internal pages and vice-versa.

3. Use SEO SpyGlass to gather details about the backlink portfolio/profile of each of those top ten competing pages and domain homepages for your target keywords. SEO SpyGlass provides the following:

•URLs of linking pages with backlinks;
•Number of backlinks;
•Google PR of linking pages;
•Alexa rank of domain homepage;
•Number of outbound links in the linking pages;
•Keyword anchors used for those backlinks; and
•IPs of domains where those linking pages are found...

4. Conduct human analysis of the data you gathered. Your main objective is to formulate and implement a doable content syndication and backlink building plan with your existing resources to outdo the backlink portfolios/profiles of the top ten competing pages for each of your target keywords...

5. Outdo the backlink portfolios/profiles of your competitors. You can include this in your content syndication and backlink building campaigns:

Find expired and deleted domains with high PR and niche/keyword-relevant domain names. Use SEO SpyGlass to determine the backlink portfolios/profiles of good expired and deleted domains. Do human analysis by asking: Are these sets of backlinks of these expired/deleted domains going to be taken down some time soon by the webmasters of those linking pages? Once you pinpoint a good list of expired/deleted domains with high PR and niche/keyword-relevant domain names that you can use to outdo the backlink portfolios/profiles of your competitors:

Register those expired/deleted domains, keeping in mind that Google can see domain registrant details even with whois guard, and Google won't like a webmaster who seems to be trying to manipulate Google search results. Assign one unique IP for each of those expired/deleted domains. Set up a website for each of those domains. Write homepage content with your backlinks for each of those websites. Slap up a 2-minute introductory video, as Google loves media-rich websites. Develop around three static pages and four posts/articles for each of those websites. Remember to balance the number of outbound links in each of those pages, and also remember to also link to contextually relevant pages of high authority websites for your niches, i.e. Wikipedia, BBC, CNN, etc...

To keep on improving the value of those new websites: Offer other webmasters backlinks in a dedicated post/page of a high PR website with content relevant to their target keywords, in exchange for unique content. This'll help you constantly upload updated content to your websites...

Hope this helps...

[Psykryph]

Originally Posted by outwest

so than at that point you are thinking hmmmm ok now what?
High PR which is 5 and above is certainly not easy to outrank..

For your information, PR has absolutely nothing to do with rankings or SERPs.

[outwest]

Originally Posted by Psykryph

For your information, PR has absolutely nothing to do with rankings or SERPs.

thats a myth
next time you outrank a PR6 with a new site let me know

If your theory were true, why did the diet website that is currently number one for its term that was a new site, go and buy and 301 redirect a 10 yr old PR6 to its diet page? if PR doesnt matter?

[razorhound]

I would still go for it as long as the top 10 aren't targeting it. I have one that is #1 with similar competition (between 25k to 2mil BLP to aged TLD) as you mentioned except that most of them are PR4 and one PR5, not PR5/6.

[outwest]

Originally Posted by Marx Vergel Melencio

Hi,





Find expired and deleted domains with high PR and niche/keyword-relevant domain names. Use SEO SpyGlass to determine the backlink portfolios/profiles of good expired and deleted domains. Do human analysis by asking: Are these sets of backlinks of these expired/deleted domains going to be taken down some time soon by the webmasters of those linking pages? Once you pinpoint a good list of expired/deleted domains with high PR and niche/keyword-relevant domain names that you can use to outdo the backlink portfolios/profiles of your competitors:

Register those expired/deleted domains, keeping in mind that Google can see domain registrant details even with whois guard, and Google won't like a webmaster who seems to be trying to manipulate Google search results. Assign one unique IP for each of those expired/deleted domains. Set up a website for each of those domains. Write homepage content with your backlinks for each of those websites. Slap up a 2-minute introductory video, as Google loves media-rich websites. Develop around three static pages and four posts/articles for each of those websites. Remember to balance the number of outbound links in each of those pages, and also remember to also link to contextually relevant pages of high authority websites for your niches, i.e. Wikipedia, BBC, CNN, etc...

To keep on improving the value of those new websites: Offer other webmasters backlinks in a dedicated post/page of a high PR website with content relevant to their target keywords, in exchange for unique content. This'll help you constantly upload updated content to your websites...

Hope this helps...

Have you actually done this? are there people out there who let PR5 or higher domains expire? I find this incredible that there are domains like that out there. Its easy to find the backlink portfolios, where is a list of expired domains to search

[Marx Vergel Melencio]

Hi Outwest,

Yes, we've been doing this since we officially registered our outsourcing firm here in Manila in 2006, initially for our North American and European corporate clients operating in the system security software development and affiliate marketing management industries. I formulated this strategy and implemented it for them. Read this page to learn about the achievements of our company in terms of the results we continue to provide our clients...

Here's one of the many tools you can use to:

•enter an exact keyword or a broad keyword to get a list of domains with niche/keyword-relevant domain names;
•find expired and deleted domains -- I particularly avoid dropped domains; and
•results from the tool above include PR of the domain homepage...

Only thing to do next is to use SEO SpyGlass to gather details about the backlink portfolios/profiles of those expired and deleted domains, then conduct human analysis to zone in on a good set of domains to register, set up websites with unique server IPs and develop content pages and posts with backlinks and other links pointing to high authority websites in your niches...

About your theory above: Yes, they most likely used your target keywords as anchors of their backlinks, and since their content pages are relevant to the keyword anchors of those backlinks: Google finds it relevant, thereby giving it high SERPs...

[theverysmartguy]

Originally Posted by Clyde

No lol, with Google backlinks is everything.

There are other factors of course, but backlinks is major.

I see you did a little bit a back pedaling after you said "everything".

I am sorry but backlinks are NOT EVERYTHING.

I constantly outrank people that have 1000s of backlinks to a single page TARGETING a specific keyword phrase. However, since their ONPAGE SEO is crap, and mine is optimized just right for the keyword, I out rank them for that term.

Yes, I do have backlinks. But the amount I have is a small fraction of what they have. This is where "On Page SEO TRUMPS Off Page SEO ( backlinks ) comes into effect.

Outwest wasn't saying that you can outrank people with JUST on page SEO. He was saying that if they aren't targeting the keyword but have tons of backlinks he should be able to outrank them with good on page seo and with FEWER backlinks.

He got that "phrase" from me, and what I just said is what was meant by it.

ON PAGE SEO coupled with some backlinking will out rank pages that have tons of backlinks but poor on page seo. I do it every day.

-- Jeff

[outwest]

Thanks Jeff For jumping in there

I recently bought a huge Adsense Tutorial about 100 page tut with vids etc
and they basically said they look at

1. PR of the sites in the Top 10 (look for Pr4 or less on position 5)
2. Backlinks to Page (lower the better obviously)

I emailed their support and said, what if you have pages with 10s of thousands of backlinks, ranking top 3 (and they have PR5 or 6)
Yet their onpage SEO is nowhere to be found its N N N N for title, url, desc and header. the guy answered back and basically agreed with Jeff he said if their onpage SEO is non existent, they many times can be easily outranked with perfect onpage SEO and decent backlinks


Like Jeff says, it makes way more sense to google if it wants to pull up the MOST RELEVANT sites to that kw search, to be giving a great amount of weight, to the onpage SEO, regardless of backlinks and PR of the sites


So actually if this is true what we are theorizing, it opens up a whole new world
kws that you would normally say, ops forget that one, all the top 10 have way too many backlinks and are too high PR
that makes it a new world where you can go in and say, yup that guy has no onpage SEO that one too, and that one and that one, i can outrank those sites with a little work

It really doubles triples or multiplies by a factor of 10 the number of "doable" keywords you have at your disposal

[yukon]

Originally Posted by Psykryph

For your information, PR has absolutely nothing to do with rankings or SERPs.

Originally Posted by outwest

thats a myth
next time you outrank a PR6 with a new site let me know

If your theory were true, why did the diet website that is currently number one for its term that was a new site, go and buy and 301 redirect a 10 yr old PR6 to its diet page? if PR doesnt matter?

No offense, you obviously haven't ranked many pages yet, in the SERPs.

What Psykryph said isn't some myth (lol) it's fact & a few simple Google search would show you that.

High PR is what you want on the external page (or internal) for your backlinks, it's not a deal breaker for backlinks, but If the PR is legit on the backlink page it's better than something like a PRn/a.

What your not getting is, Google has to populate the search results even If no web page on the net cares about the keyword your searching for.

When was the last time you searched for a real word on Google & the page was blank (not gonna happen).

Just because a high PR page ranks on the first page of Google for your keyword means nothing. If their on page seo sucks for the keyword, chances are very good they could care less about the keyword. That's when you wip out SeoSpyglass & check their backlink anchor-text to double check they are not targeting the keyword.

[outwest]

Originally Posted by yukon

No offense, you obviously haven't ranked many pages yet, in the SERPs.

What Psykryph said isn't some myth (lol) it's fact & a few simple Google search would show you that.

High PR is what you want on the external page (or internal) for your backlinks, it's not a deal breaker for backlinks, but If the PR is legit on the backlink page it's better than something like a PRn/a.

What your not getting is, Google has to populate the search results even If no web page on the net cares about the keyword your searching for.

When was the last time you searched for a real word on Google & the page was blank (not gonna happen).

Just because a high PR page ranks on the first page of Google for your keyword means nothing. If their on page seo sucks for the keyword, chances are very good they could care less about the keyword. That's when you wip out SeoSpyglass & check their backlink anchor-text to double check they are not targeting the keyword.

you still completely ignored my example
if PR doesnt matter

why go to the time and expense of 301'ing a PR 6 10 yr old site, for that loseweightfast site? if PR doesnt matter?

It certainly matters in weight of backlinks, and weight of backlinks certainly makes a huge difference in your SERPs

I am not saying PR is the only thing that matters, but it does have an effect on rankings, google trust in the site, etc etc

Jeff? Pipe in here, perhaps I am way off course

[yukon]

Originally Posted by outwest

you still completely ignored my example
if PR doesnt matter

why go to the time and expense of 301'ing a PR 6 10 yr old site, for that loseweightfast site? if PR doesnt matter?

It certainly matters in weight of backlinks, and weight of backlinks certainly makes a huge difference in your SERPs

I am not saying PR is the only thing that matters, but it does have an effect on rankings, google trust in the site, etc etc

Jeff? Pipe in here, perhaps I am way off course

Do you think that guy ranking #1 for buy car insurance cares about those two PR7 competition below him on page #1 in Google SERPs?

I doubt very much If he cares.

I haven't checked the #1 guys anchor-text on his backlinks, but I'm sure he is targeting the exact keyword (buy car insurance). At least his on-page seo says he is targeting this keyword (EMD, Page Title, in-text, etc...).

You just have to want to own the keyword more than the competition does...