The LSI theory, Which Side Are you On?

[ildarius]

People that are addictied to SEO theories will enjoy this one

LSI Siloing, Co-Occurrence Proven: Debunking Stompernet’s Ploy - Rex Freiberger

2 SEO pros going head to head on the LSI and Silo theory, it's a fun read hope you enjoy it.

Rex used to be a regular here on the forum btw

What are your thoughts on LSI?

[bgmacaw]

I agree with what Rex said, primarily that LSI is one of many factors that Google uses to rank sites and his thoughts on Stompernet's intentions with the videos.

[Mickm]

Stompernet are saying LSI doesn't exist? Uhh.. lol LSI changed how we SEO sites..

[askloz]

Google doesn't use it to rank pages. It uses it to find out what the page is about and allocate it to a search term category of relevancy.

Matt Cutts on the recent brand bias algo update - Search and Internet Marketing rants, news and views - the Fire Horse Trail

LSI-Latent Semantic Indexing: ServicesAreUs.com


It's also used to determine the type of article it is, ie, does it use power words, words that many of us don't use on a daily basis. ie, you could talk about particular diet pills, while others may go into fuller detail about those pills and mention other related ingredients, names of, and such, where many of us would not go that far or even know anything about it. It separates the big buys who know from those small boys who just write crap stuff that most ppl who use diet pills already know about.


I heard somewhere on a video matt did, ran a search, but can't find it.

[askloz]

LMAO what? You kidding? Blimey, someone must be smoking some real good stuff at the Stompernet Desk.

Originally Posted by Mickm

Stompernet are saying LSI doesn't exist? Uhh.. lol LSI changed how we SEO sites..

[Mickm]

Originally Posted by askloz

LMAO what? You kidding? Blimey, someone must be smoking some real good stuff at the Stompernet Desk.

Totally, that Google LSI patent must have just been a bad trip.. man.

[Rex_Flay]

hahaha nice reference to bad trips. i gotta get back on this forum. ildar you are the man.

@askloz they do use it to rank pages. they want to give return relevant results to their users, so if you have expert verbiage on your site, ie you use language only someone with a mastery of the content would know, then google will rank your site higher.

they also patented the co occurrence theory so when the crawlers see phrases in relation to another they can tell if its good content and something that a reader will find relevant.

you should check out my twitter page, Rex Freiberger (rexfreiberger) on Twitter i compared andy jenkins simplification of lsi to george bush's 'axis of evil' dumbing down of geo politics and he actually responded, with exclamation points and happy faces

[askloz]

Originally Posted by Rex_Flay

@askloz they do use it to rank pages. they want to give return relevant results to their users, so if you have expert verbiage on your site, ie you use language only someone with a mastery of the content would know, then google will rank your site higher.

No it does NOT! Matt Cutts has already stated that they don't use LSI to rank pages in Google, but more to find out what a page is about, and used as a Filter and determine the professional nature of that article. that's all.

Ranking is based mainly on authority score, which sites links are coming from, how easy a site is accessible (user experience - and there's many levels of that to be considered), how easily accessible the content is for the search bot. How long the site has been around,how many related site links point to that article that points to yours, whether or not it creates a semantically related theme, how regular the content is, how long a person stays on the page, and crap loads more stuff. they are the main things that rank pages, but to say it uses LSI to rank pages is NOT true, it's used as a Filter ONLY! Go and ask Matt Cutts if you're so hung up about it, he mentioned Google doens't use LSI about a year ago on video

Listen I know Stompernet people are clueless, some of their so called SEO Experts are idiots and I've already myth busted a lot of their claims already, and a few other so called experts. And yeah, I think their products are crap too!

I know how to do SEO, to a point that I have software now that creates all my websites, scraps content based on the keywords I want, rewrites the content in the manner that I know is best, spits out a page and gets links from all over the place. I have over 700 domains, over 700 normal websites, most with forums, and 12,000+ blogs combined on those domains that also has content auto published on the sites, and I receive over 10,000,000 hits a month combined.

[Mickm]

Originally Posted by askloz

Listen I know Stompernet people are clueless, some of their so called SEO Experts are idiots and I've already myth busted a lot of their claims already, and a few other so called experts. And yeah, I think their products are crap too!

I think they've only been in the game since 2004? Can't blame them for trying, even if they have zero credibility in the wider SEO community. Amazing what paying frank kern 25k can achieve innit.

[Black Hat Cat]

Originally Posted by Mickm

Totally, that Google LSI patent must have just been a bad trip.. man.

It must have been.

Originally Posted by Mickm
Stompernet are saying LSI doesn't exist? Uhh.. lol LSI changed how we SEO sites.

LSI changed how YOU seo sites. Some of us aren't as easily distracted by meaningless noise.

Frankly, the Rex character discredits himself in the very first paragraph, and it continues throughout the piece with several unsubstantiated claims. It doesn't sound like he even watched the videos at all. If you ask me, it seems like he has a bad case of Stomper envy, lol.

[Mickm]

Originally Posted by BlueFartcat

LSI changed how YOU seo sites. Some of us aren't as easily distracted by meaningless noise.

Instead how about explaining your position and how you came to reach that conclusion.

And if you're not constantly changing how you engineer a site, then you're simply not doing your job properly... algorithms change, which means we have to change, my friend.

[Wakunahum]

When I use LSI words or theme words, I tend to get more traffic since that page gets found for more terms.

So whether it ranks your main keyword phrase higher or not doesn't matter to me. I just want the extra traffic that I can get if I use themed phrases on the page.

[ildarius]

I they are not using it now, then I think it's really possible that they will start using it pretty soon. Google bought out the company that specialized in LSI relevance searches... why do that if you're not going to use the technology?

[theGypsy]

Thanks for the link drop/mention... but I'm not altogether sure what the 'Vince' update had to do with the whole LSI thing? I had an older post on - the LSI Bandwagon - worth the read.

Essentially the purchase of Applied Semantics in 2003 was exactly as stated in this thread - for understanding the page content - It was for matching Google AdWords to the page content... not for the reg index SERPs. To be honest things such as PLSI, HTMM and LDA are more likely used for such purposes... LSA/I isn't the most effective approach.

I posted a lengthy comment on the Stomper Blog and on LinkedIn where they were also pimping it; see here - LinkedIn: Sign In

What is kind of funny, is that they cited patents which were actually Phrase Based IR and had nothing to do with the LSI purchase... those were from Anna Patterson whom came on board in 2003 also... and far more likely the route of the semantic word approaches in the reg index... more here on Phrase Based Optimization

There is no LSI patent... per se... Applied Semantics put out some research papers... but that's about it... they misstated many facts in that Stomper post(s)

Anyway, I hope that helps clear some of it up... they certainly have made a mess of it...

ciao (and thanks for the luv Loz!! always appreciated)