The Angela Experiment: aka Let's gang up on Angela thread

[AlbertF]

If your really serious about Internet Marketing, either way, your going to need your own website or you will keep on starting from scratch with article sites.

Just take the time to dedicate on a site that you will be publishing articles from. It looks better as well as pay in the end.

[nobluff]

Ive got something to add:

Added a goarticle on the 28th of June.

Keyword without quotes - Results 1 - 10 of about 1,200,000 (numbers rounded)
Keyword in quotes - Results 1 - 10 of about 150,000 (numbers rounded)

I am currently at no 10 (1st page), the article is sitting at 60 requests right now, I think this is the amount of times someone reads article? Anyway, I will update this number to see if there is any movement.

I have done about 40 links in total, plus some other links (few blog comments and social links).

[FredJones]

Yeah, I am actually trying Angela's using a GoArticle as well as my own website - none of them are doing badly. Both keep within #5-#15 - need more backlniks to be consistently in top-10 and break top-3 I suppose - but fundamentally hte basic Google principle of backlinks is still working. This takes us back to ABC of PR.

[Upstate Cowboy]

Since we are adding stats here:

I have two Ezine articles ranked #1 and #2.

Competition NO quotes 1,750,000
Competition WITH quotes "354,000"

I have put over 200 backlinks on each of these with combination of Angela's and Pauls packets. They have been at the top for over two weeks now and I hope they stay there.

I have most every other keyword article in striking distance but for some reason only this keyword has responded really well to the backlinks. I haven't tested Goarticles yet. Only because Ezine always gives me 1st page presence organically for a week or so and decent traffic, so I am scared to switch until I see some testing from others haha.

I also backlink every article and web site in a rotation wheel. Working 2 hours a day just on backlinking I average 40 sites a day.

Thanks, Shane

[Saidar]

Ok people,

I used Paul's backlinks yesterday, and today I received an email from to owner of urbis.com,

Here is the email:

Dear Spammer,

You have just spammed my site, Urbis.com, by creating a profile with the purposes of creating backlinks to your site.

I am taking the following actions:
1. I am reporting you to the Federal Trade Commission. What you are doing is illegal. Read the law here: FTC GUIDES CONCERNING USE OF ENDORSEMENTS AND TESTIMONIALS IN ADVERTISING
2. I am reporting you to Google, which means you will be much lower in the search rankings. Google punishes link spammers.
3. If your profile spam continues, I will file a civil lawsuit against you.

-Steve



I know Google will ignore their report as I'm sure they get thousands every day, but is it really illegal? I don't understand that "law"

[traceye]

Originally Posted by Saidar

Ok people,

I used Paul's backlinks yesterday, and today I received an email from to owner of urbis.com,

Here is the email:

Dear Spammer,

You have just spammed my site, Urbis.com, by creating a profile with the purposes of creating backlinks to your site.

I am taking the following actions:
1. I am reporting you to the Federal Trade Commission. What you are doing is illegal. Read the law here: FTC GUIDES CONCERNING USE OF ENDORSEMENTS AND TESTIMONIALS IN ADVERTISING
2. I am reporting you to Google, which means you will be much lower in the search rankings. Google punishes link spammers.
3. If your profile spam continues, I will file a civil lawsuit against you.

-Steve

I know Google will ignore their report as I'm sure they get thousands every day, but is it really illegal? I don't understand that "law"

Hi Steve,

I got the same email, but I just laughed.

Report me for what? Leaving a link on my own profile page on their site? If that's the worst thing I did then Google will laugh in their face.

I wouldn't worry too much, I doubt they even really reported anyone - it's just a threat.

And as for the FTC law they quoted, that has to do with bloggers writing fake reviews and receiving payment in return. Hardly the same as leaving a link or two on a profile page.

Ignore the threat and move on. You'll be fine.

Tracey

[pj413]

Originally Posted by Saidar

Ok people,

I used Paul's backlinks yesterday, and today I received an email from to owner of urbis.com,

Here is the email:

Dear Spammer,

You have just spammed my site, Urbis.com, by creating a profile with the purposes of creating backlinks to your site.

I am taking the following actions:
1. I am reporting you to the Federal Trade Commission. What you are doing is illegal. Read the law here: FTC GUIDES CONCERNING USE OF ENDORSEMENTS AND TESTIMONIALS IN ADVERTISING
2. I am reporting you to Google, which means you will be much lower in the search rankings. Google punishes link spammers.
3. If your profile spam continues, I will file a civil lawsuit against you.

-Steve



I know Google will ignore their report as I'm sure they get thousands every day, but is it really illegal? I don't understand that "law"

First of all, that FTC rule about "endorsements" goes for HIM, not for you. If he doesn't want "advertisements" on his site, then he is free to remove them. You are not breaking the law by simply putting a link on a website. Not to mention that trying to tie a simple backlink as a violation of the FTC "endorsement" statute is REALLY pushing it. I don't think ANY court in the country would see a simple backlink as a violation of the FTC's "endorsement statute". The website itself would be the one in violation of this statute if it allowed illegal "endorsements", not a person leaving a backlink. And in order to violate the FTC's statute, you'd actually have to appear to be endorsing something that is not valid, not simply leaving a link to your website in your profile. You can read the FTC's definitions of such "endorsements" here.

This is just a scare tactic. How is putting a link on a site illegal? What law does it break? It doesn't; not even the FTC's "endorsement statute". They are just trying to scare you and are pointing to a law that has NOTHING to do with backlinks to "prove their point". Backlinks are the lifeblood of the Search Engines, and putting links on websites is not illegal, nor is it unethical. It's not like you are trying to disguise the links on the site or anything. What would they "report" you for, and what would the FBI do to you? Have you broken any laws? Of course not!

There are some sites who don't like links and have even created a "list" of people who have tried to leave a link on their system. A few other sites might pay attention to such a 'list'. However, it means absolutely nothing to Google or any other search engine. If it did, wouldn't you think that competitors would be getting the competition "blacklisted" all over the Internet? Of COURSE they would. If that sort of thing really mattered, all you'd have is mayhem instead of a search engine. Google knows that and they are NOT going to let something like this ruin their BILLION dollar business.

How do you think the "Big Name" companies get their sites to the top of Google? Anyone who thinks it's just because of their "Great Content" is seriously naive. They are all getting backlinks, too. They have SEO people who work FULL TIME, making sure their sites get and stay at the top and their job does not ONLY consist of fixing up the company's website for SEO purposes. Backlinks are the "name of the game" and just because a site doesn't like it doesn't mean that you have done ANYTHING illegal.

[mdzarate]

Originally Posted by Kurt

So all we have to do is submit our competitor's links to directories?

LOL! that is what I was thinking. Of course not! google may not count those links but will not penalize you for submitting to directories or as you stated all we would need is to submit our competitor's sites to directories and other link farm places....

[Doug D]

I emailed him back and told him, if you email me again...I'm coming to your house, I'm gonna knock your wife's teeth out, eat your dog, and make you my bitch!

What? should I not have done that? Seemed like a reasonable reply to me?

muuhaha........just kidding guys, woulda been funny though.

[mdzarate]

Angela,

I am a customer of your packets but do not remember getting this article technique, where do I get it from?

Thanks.

[Angela V. Edwards]

Sending you a PM, mdzarate.

[Pat Jackson]

Did anyone email him back letting him him know how ridiculous he sounds and stating all the facts that Pj just posted? haha

[Angela V. Edwards]

Originally Posted by Pat Jackson

Did anyone email him back letting him him know how ridiculous he sounds and stating all the facts that Pj just posted? haha

I don't know if anyone did that or not, but I was getting concerned emails from people about this site and the ramifications of backlinking as well. I put that note together so that Paul and I both had an answer for the folks who had actually been frightened by the email from this guy. He is simply trying to scare people. It's a bit "over the top", IMO.

[JDSalinger]

I think it would be better to let sleeping dogs lie or in this case a snarling dog. Firing off a nasty email to him might make you feel good initially, but it does little else. (If you really can't resist the urge, I at least suggest you use a throwaway email account)

The email will not change his mind even if all the above is true. Worse, you could tick him off and get him on a campaign to get back at you.

I view it like this. Its his house, his rules. If he does not want these extra profiles, it is his prerogative on how he wants to handle it.

Sure he should just turn off these features, but maybe he doesn't have the programming know how or want to spend the cost right now to be able to do that. From his point of view, he is just trying to protect his website. I just think he is going about it the wrong way. However, his email is rather chilling which I imagine may serve its purpose of keeping multiple spamming from occurring.

The real question would be even if he did report you to Google, would Google do anything about it or is this a small potatoes issue to them?

[Angela V. Edwards]

Can you imagine all the "tattling" that would happen if this sort of thing DID have an effect on Google? Marketers would be "reporting" their competitors every day.

[Saidar]

Originally Posted by Doug D

I emailed him back and told him, if you email me again...I'm coming to your house, I'm gonna knock your wife's teeth out, eat your dog, and make you my bitch!

What? should I not have done that? Seemed like a reasonable reply to me?

muuhaha........just kidding guys, woulda been funny though.

Haha, funny, I almost sent him something like that!

[Saidar]

Question...

I have been linking the crap out of my new site, at first the rankings improved, but from a week ago my rankings started to decrease bit by bit every day. 14th, next day 15th, next day 16th etc etc

I don't think this is the google dance, and I have never stopped my linking campaign. What is happening here? Maybe Google is devaluing my links?

Age of the domain and website must play a factor, why I'm saying this is because the number one two and three spot, 90% of their backlinks comes from directories and link pages (reciprocal links), but their domains is at least two years old.

[lharding]

Hello,

This is a very busy thread, but thought I would just let you know that I followed Angela's advise and this morning my article is on the first page of google at #6. So, thanks Angela, it works great!!!! I set this all up yesterday!

Lee.

[Terry Kyle]

Using Angela and PJ's backlinks, I've gotten several GoArticles to #1 for a range of specific phrases.

THE PROBLEM?

The problem is that these articles don't seem to convert into sales.

I've played around with different article styles: reviews, FAQ, problem/solution etc but conversions are elusive across a range of Clickbank products in very different niches.

Have any Warriors here hit on a good layout/style/approach on GoArticles that seems to work sales-wise?

Plus, Warriors using GA should use all available formatting and linking options in their articles: centering, bolding, bullet points, in-article links, vertical spacing for readability etc as GA is very flexible in this regard (unlike EZA).

Thanks for sharing your experience.

[AndyBlackSEO]

Originally Posted by Doug D

I emailed him back and told him, if you email me again...I'm coming to your house, I'm gonna knock your wife's teeth out, eat your dog, and make you my bitch!

What? should I not have done that? Seemed like a reasonable reply to me?

muuhaha........just kidding guys, woulda been funny though.

Ah... that old chestnut. Hahaha. You could save it as an email template in case you get any more site owners threatening legal action for placing a link within your profile.

Shop keepers will be taking legal action against us next if we pick up the fresh bread towards the back of their shelf instead of the older bread placed at the front. What is this world coming too? lol.

[AndyBlackSEO]

Originally Posted by Saidar

Question...

I have been linking the crap out of my new site, at first the rankings improved, but from a week ago my rankings started to decrease bit by bit every day. 14th, next day 15th, next day 16th etc etc

I don't think this is the google dance, and I have never stopped my linking campaign. What is happening here? Maybe Google is devaluing my links?

Age of the domain and website must play a factor, why I'm saying this is because the number one two and three spot, 90% of their backlinks comes from directories and link pages (reciprocal links), but their domains is at least two years old.

If it's a brand new site I would really only submit a few of these links per day as well as an odd article and maybe blog comment. Other people may disagree, but with a brand new site I think it's best to take the gradual approach. At least for say 3 months or something.

Why not try slowing your backlinking down but don't stop. See how that pans out for you.

[Saidar]

Originally Posted by AndyBlackSEO

If it's a brand new site I would really only submit a few of these links per day as well as an odd article and maybe blog comment. Other people may disagree, but with a brand new site I think it's best to take the gradual approach. At least for say 3 months or something.

Why not try slowing your backlinking down but don't stop. See how that pans out for you.

I agree, I didn't take that approach to test for myself because most warriors says you can go crazy with link building from the start. But looks like progress is difficult. Of course Google will not penalise you but maybe they give little value to the links for a brand new site.

I'll slow it down a bit and see what happens

[nobluff]

I am at no 7 this morning and +8 on my article requests (still not 100% sure what this is).

Originally Posted by nobluff

Ive got something to add:

Added a goarticle on the 28th of June.

Keyword without quotes - Results 1 - 10 of about 1,200,000 (numbers rounded)
Keyword in quotes - Results 1 - 10 of about 150,000 (numbers rounded)

I am currently at no 10 (1st page), the article is sitting at 60 requests right now, I think this is the amount of times someone reads article? Anyway, I will update this number to see if there is any movement.

I have done about 40 links in total, plus some other links (few blog comments and social links).

[Saidar]

Okay people,

All of my articles completely disappeared from Google. All of them were in the top 5 pages and now they are nowhere to be seen.

Lets hope this is the Google dance otherwise I'm going to cry until my eyes burst

[lharding]

Originally Posted by Saidar

Lets hope this is the Google dance otherwise I'm going to cry until my eyes burst

OUCH! I have my fingers crossed for you. Realistically, how long do the articles stay on the first page? I guess that depends on other activity around the keywords you've chosen. Just wondered how long I've got!!!

Cheers, Lee.

[daveshu]

LOL Saidar, I had the same worry a few days ago when my customers website vanished from page 4 - I was convincing myself I'd killed it off.

Fortunately it's now back - it arrived half way up page 3 & is now currently at the top of page 2 - COME ON BABY, COME ON!!!!

[jw007]

This kind of backlink building (Angela Edwards etc) works only with older trusted sites that have "some" traffic not with new websites which have a little traffic.

You can try it yourself: register a domain, obtain 200 backlinks by using specific keyword from high PR sites and wait a few days. You can get a good position in Google for a while but then Google drops your page out of first 500 SE results with that keyword. Google do not deindex that page but you can't find that page later with your keyword via Google. And this is not some "Google Dance". You can wait a year but your page will not appear again in top 100 results in Google with your keyword.

[lharding]

Originally Posted by jw007

This kind of backlink building (Angela Edwards etc) works only with older trusted sites that have "some" traffic not with new websites which have a little traffic.

You can try it yourself: register a domain...

I thought the experiment was with an Article, which ultimately pointed to your domain. So, it's the article that ranked in Google, not your domain. I guess it would work either way but the article site would have more "history" than your own newly registered site.

Cheers, Lee.

[Angela V. Edwards]

Originally Posted by jw007

This kind of backlink building (Angela Edwards etc) works only with older trusted sites that have "some" traffic not with new websites which have a little traffic.

You can try it yourself: register a domain, obtain 200 backlinks by using specific keyword from high PR sites and wait a few days. You can get a good position in Google for a while but then Google drops your page out of first 500 SE results with that keyword. Google do not deindex that page but you can't find that page later with your keyword via Google. And this is not some "Google Dance". You can wait a year but your page will not appear again in top 100 results in Google with your keyword.

I wouldn't recommend saying that sort of thing unless you KNOW it's true because some people will actually believe you. My friend just started a website in February called Take Him With You. By April, it was a Page Rank 3. In mid May, (not long after the new Star Trek Movie came out) I asked him to create a brand new page on his site based on the keyword phrase Star Trek Computer Sound, since he is a huge "Trekkie" and that particular search term gets over 1,000 searches a day.

He created the page and I went to work on it. Within a week, his site was number ONE for that keyword, where it remains today. (And just in case you ask, that keyword is converting BEAUTIFULLY for him; he couldn't be happier with the results.)

His website is now a Page Rank 4. All this with a "brand new" website.

[Angela V. Edwards]

Originally Posted by AndyBlackSEO

Shop keepers will be taking legal action against us next if we pick up the fresh bread towards the back of their shelf instead of the older bread placed at the front. What is this world coming too? lol.

Of course they will, as you've violated the United States Food Code and will be turned in to the FDA.

[Saidar]

Originally Posted by jw007

This kind of backlink building (Angela Edwards etc) works only with older trusted sites that have "some" traffic not with new websites which have a little traffic.

You can try it yourself: register a domain, obtain 200 backlinks by using specific keyword from high PR sites and wait a few days. You can get a good position in Google for a while but then Google drops your page out of first 500 SE results with that keyword. Google do not deindex that page but you can't find that page later with your keyword via Google. And this is not some "Google Dance". You can wait a year but your page will not appear again in top 100 results in Google with your keyword.

Is this the results that you got? Have you tried it before? I'm just curious because many senior warrior members says exactly the opposite.

If your results shows otherwise please share with us as this may be critical to our understanding of how Google works

[Saidar]

Originally Posted by daveshu

LOL Saidar, I had the same worry a few days ago when my customers website vanished from page 4 - I was convincing myself I'd killed it off.

Fortunately it's now back - it arrived half way up page 3 & is now currently at the top of page 2 - COME ON BABY, COME ON!!!!

That is good news, hope mine will come back as well.

But like I said, the age factor of a website must play a huge role in obtaining backlinks.

By the way, the day before it happened I installed Google analytics on my site. Maybe Google uses that data to determine the rank of your website because a website with 200 links and no traffic in analytics is off course a website who obtained the links himself. Maybe we should not use analytics until the site receives some good traffic

[4morereferrals]

So does this toolbag screen every poster and opinion that permeates his site? Does he endorse - screen every google adsense POS that pops up on their users screens from all his sites?

What a croc ...

Originally Posted by traceye

Hi Steve,

I got the same email, but I just laughed.

Report me for what? Leaving a link on my own profile page on their site? If that's the worst thing I did then Google will laugh in their face.

I wouldn't worry too much, I doubt they even really reported anyone - it's just a threat.

And as for the FTC law they quoted, that has to do with bloggers writing fake reviews and receiving payment in return. Hardly the same as leaving a link or two on a profile page.

Ignore the threat and move on. You'll be fine.

Tracey

[Gabby12]

I don't think so and if you read all of this and others threads many of us have had new sites rank and stay up on the first page with these links. I have finally reached #5 for a site I have been linking to for the past 2 mo. Thanks Angela!

Originally Posted by jw007

This kind of backlink building (Angela Edwards etc) works only with older trusted sites that have "some" traffic not with new websites which have a little traffic.

You can try it yourself: register a domain, obtain 200 backlinks by using specific keyword from high PR sites and wait a few days. You can get a good position in Google for a while but then Google drops your page out of first 500 SE results with that keyword. Google do not deindex that page but you can't find that page later with your keyword via Google. And this is not some "Google Dance". You can wait a year but your page will not appear again in top 100 results in Google with your keyword.

[Angela V. Edwards]

That's excellent, Gabby. Thank you for letting me know.

[Angela V. Edwards]

Originally Posted by 4morereferrals

So does this toolbag screen every poster and opinion that permeates his site? Does he endorse - screen every google adsense POS that pops up on their users screens from all his sites?

What a croc ...

Of course he does and if they happen to say or post the wrong thing, he contacts the FBI. Why does this remind me of the playground in gradeschool, where all the kids are going to "tell the teacher" on the other kids?

[4morereferrals]

Perhaps it had more to do with Porn ... other links from bad neighborhoods, or adsense spam/violations or something else - it certainly had NOTHING to do with a google penalty for too many HIGH PR backlinks to quickly.

.... 200 ... too many backlinks too quickly? ... totally absurd.

More likely you got spidered by the bots quickly cuz you used a high traffic high PR domain to obtain a backlink ... site got indexed quickly - ALL Good things ... you got a temporary QDF bump to the front of the line for fresh new content ... then your site settled into its rightful spot in the SERPS.

If you went and placed 200 backlinks on 200 different sites in a 48 hr period - very UNLIKELY theyd get hit by Yahoo slerp or Googlebot for weeks... So in effect your new domain would trickle in those 200 links over a 4 week period or longer. Certainly nothing to set off any red flags.

If all you did was put down 200 links and stop ... a good 25% of those likely never were found and another % were removed by mods or not approved and deleted - so when the bots went back on their rotation to that site - they were not found again, and deleted from gooogle and yahoo's systems. So your total link count likely dropped off big time.

Originally Posted by jw007

This kind of backlink building (Angela Edwards etc) works only with older trusted sites that have "some" traffic not with new websites which have a little traffic.

You can try it yourself: register a domain, obtain 200 backlinks by using specific keyword from high PR sites and wait a few days. You can get a good position in Google for a while but then Google drops your page out of first 500 SE results with that keyword. Google do not deindex that page but you can't find that page later with your keyword via Google. And this is not some "Google Dance". You can wait a year but your page will not appear again in top 100 results in Google with your keyword.

[jw007]

Originally Posted by Saidar

Is this the results that you got? Have you tried it before? I'm just curious because many senior warrior members says exactly the opposite.

If your results shows otherwise please share with us as this may be critical to our understanding of how Google works

Yes, it's based on my own experience but maybe I'm wrong, sorry Angela. Maybe I have used too competitive keyword terms. But (in my opinion) it's much easier to get better results with trusted high traffic website than with a new one. And some pages got (not very) good positions (maybe 3 months ago) but lost them, I don't know why.

"Star Trek Computer Sound" has not competition at all: only 200-300 results (when search term in title tag) in Google. So it's easy to get a page with this term on page 1 on SERPs...

[Angela V. Edwards]

Originally Posted by jw007

Yes, it's based on my own experience but maybe I'm wrong, sorry Angela. Maybe I have used too competitive keyword terms. But (in my opinion) it's much easier to get better results with trusted high traffic website than with a new one. And some pages got (not very) good positions (maybe 3 months ago) but lost them, I don't know why.

"Star Trek Computer Sound" has not competition at all: only 200-300 results (when search term in title tag) in Google. So it's easy to get a page with this term on page 1 on SERPs...

Of course it's easier to get better results with trusted high traffic websites. No one is disputing that; as a matter of fact, that's what the whole "Goarticles" experiment thing was all about. But you said the links DID NOT WORK for newer sites; that's completely different. And again, the sites that fall into the index for Star Trek Computer Sound are NOT only the sites that have that keyword in their title tag; we've discussed this at length on this thread. The MAJORITY of the sites in the TOP TEN (Front Page) for this keyword do NOT have that keyword in the title tag; if the "title tag" was the biggest thing pushing sites to the top, then why aren't 10 of those "200-300 results" not ALL on Page One? As a matter of fact, I had to bug my friend Rick to put a title tag on that very page; it was number one for a week before he even added the title tag to it.

But that whole issue doesn't matter. The only reason I brought it up is because it proves that the backlinks do, indeed, work for brand new websites, which you said they didn't. If you are trying to compete in a HUGELY competitive market, of COURSE it will take longer and more links. The links are powerful, but they are not going to get you to Page One out of millions and millions of results in a week or two.

Even *I* wouldn't recommend that a brand new site try to compete with millions of other sites right away if they actually want to see a good ranking in the near future. That's a "given", I would have thought. But it still doesn't mean the backlinks don't work for brand new sites.

[mwoeppel1]

Originally Posted by Saidar

Ok people,

I used Paul's backlinks yesterday, and today I received an email from to owner of urbis.com,

Here is the email:

Dear Spammer,

You have just spammed my site, Urbis.com, by creating a profile with the purposes of creating backlinks to your site.

I am taking the following actions:
1. I am reporting you to the Federal Trade Commission. What you are doing is illegal. Read the law here: FTC GUIDES CONCERNING USE OF ENDORSEMENTS AND TESTIMONIALS IN ADVERTISING
2. I am reporting you to Google, which means you will be much lower in the search rankings. Google punishes link spammers.
3. If your profile spam continues, I will file a civil lawsuit against you.

-Steve

I sent him an email and he told me he had 300 people sign up within two days. Kinda sent a red flag. So those of us that are using the packets may not want to post them on the same day!

[Angela V. Edwards]

Originally Posted by mwoeppel1

I sent him an email and he told me he had 300 people sign up within two days. Kinda sent a red flag. So those of us that are using the packets may not want to post them on the same day!

While that might be a red flag, his method of handling it (instead of simply cutting off new sign ups or making the links No Follow or disabling HTML) was a little "over the top", IMO. He even told Paul that he was going to report him to the FBI for "breaking the law". Here is the answer I put together for people who are worried about it (and quite a few people WERE frightened by this):

First of all, that FTC rule about "endorsements" goes for HIM, not for you. If he doesn't want "advertisements" on his site, then he is free to remove them. You are not breaking the law by simply putting a link on a website. Not to mention that trying to tie a simple backlink as a violation of the FTC "endorsement" statute is REALLY pushing it. I don't think ANY court in the country would see a simple backlink as a violation of the FTC's "endorsement statute". The website itself would be the one in violation of this statute if it allowed illegal "endorsements", not a person leaving a backlink. And in order to violate the FTC's statute, you'd actually have to appear to be endorsing something that is not valid, not simply leaving a link to your website in your profile. You can read the FTC's definitions of such "endorsements" here.

This is just a scare tactic. How is putting a link on a site illegal? What law does it break? It doesn't; not even the FTC's "endorsement statute". They are just trying to scare you and are pointing to a law that has NOTHING to do with backlinks to "prove their point". Backlinks are the lifeblood of the Search Engines, and putting links on websites is not illegal, nor is it unethical. It's not like you are trying to disguise the links on the site or anything. What would they "report" you for, and what would the FBI do to you? Have you broken any laws? Of course not!

There are some sites who don't like links and have even created a "list" of people who have tried to leave a link on their system. A few other sites might pay attention to such a 'list'. However, it means absolutely nothing to Google or any other search engine. If it did, wouldn't you think that competitors would be getting the competition "blacklisted" all over the Internet? Of COURSE they would. If that sort of thing really mattered, all you'd have is mayhem instead of a search engine. Google knows that and they are NOT going to let something like this ruin their BILLION dollar business.

How do you think the "Big Name" companies get their sites to the top of Google? Anyone who thinks it's just because of their "Great Content" is seriously naive. They are all getting backlinks, too. They have SEO people who work FULL TIME, making sure their sites get and stay at the top and their job does not ONLY consist of fixing up the company's website for SEO purposes. Backlinks are the "name of the game" and just because a site doesn't like it doesn't mean that you have done ANYTHING illegal.

I advocate being a "good neighbor" and if a site doesn't like links, don't put links there. But I also don't believe in "sabre rattling" either, and that is exactly what this webmaster is doing.

[Karen Newton]

Originally Posted by Angela V. Edwards

I think we're actually talking about similar things. The "visitors who spam" the sites much of the time were the folks who got the packets for free in the first place. I'm all for the webmasters taking away those links.

I always put my name, my photo, my location and often other stuff in my profiles and I've recommended that others do the same. People who are wise and use the sites like the gold they are most likely won't have any problems, even two years down the road.

Hi Angela,
Love your backlink packets, am a devoted member! I also belong to Brute Force, where we just got access today to the Linking Loophole software that incorporates a certain number of high PR backlinks. I'm curious, because you (and others have) stress that it's wise to fill out profiles etc, but then isn't that quite contrary to the purpose of BF - where automation is key? Are you suggesting that although we have this great Linking Loophole software to automate the backlinking, we *also* should visit these sites and fill out profiles etc? I'm concerned, because obviously that just undermines the whole purpose of having the software automate anything to do with backlinking.

My personal opinion - the backlinks through the automation of the software, without *any* other enhancements to the sites' profile pages etc, will still prove to be strong in the serps. I'm interested to hear what you have to say about it though.

Thanks!
Karen

[Angela V. Edwards]

Hi Karen,

Thank you very much for your kind words.

As far as the SERPS go, getting your backlinks that way will probably be no problem. For now. However, people are concerned about webmasters removing the links later on (although this really only happens in a TINY percentage of the sites) because all that is there is a link and no other information at all. I can see the point and if webmasters, sometime in the future, decide to really crack down on this sort of thing then backlinks that are automated in the way you are talking about will probably be the ones most at risk of removal.

At this point it's really up to you, but I do advocate being a "good neighbor" and good neighbors tend to give (ie, a little bit of information about you) as well as "take".

[djbory]

Ok guys, this is what you may call a little bit off topic (I don’t think it is) but I have to ask cause is very-very important….

Ok, I’ve been using Angela’s backlinks and I’m doing ok so far, so I built 2 more sites and I’m in the process of KEYWORD RESEARCH for the new articles… Keyword research, I believe is the base of Online Business…

Here is my dilemma: I did some research using WORDTRACKER and SEOBOOK (seobook is powered by wordtraker so it contains about the same data)…

Then I went to compare the results with GOOGLE KEYWORD EXTERNAL TOOL and I was astonished!… not only the results are totally different; far worse they are opposite…

Some keywords in GKET have hundreds, even thousands of daily searches (I divided the GLOOGLE numbers into 30 days to get a roughly daily estimate), and wordtraker shows only 2 or 3 daily searches…

Other times is the opposite; Wordtracker shows 800 or 900 daily searches, and Google shows very few and in some instances “NO ENOUGH DATA”

But it gets worse; if I do the research in MARKET SAMURAI, again I get extremely different results, and I’m getting frustrated over this…. I optimized a website before and after I got to GOOGLE ‘page 1’ I didn’t get the searches I was expecting…. So I like to get it right from now on…

Where do you guys do your Keyword research? Any advice will be really appreciated…

DJBory

How To Stop Foreclosure

[djbory]

Who should we trust for the results; the other guys or GOOGLE? After all, GOOGLE is showing its own numbers....Shouldn't they be accurate?

DJBory

[AnneE]

Here's my update -- I submitted my Goarticles article and over the course of a week submitted 30 backlinks (most of the PR 7). A little less than a week after the last link was posted the article was at number 5. A few days later it dropped to number 6. Then yesterday (about 1 week later), it dropped to number 16. I think I will add at least one new link to it and see if I can get it to come back up.

I know my Squidoo lens that I backlinked like crazy and had risen up to #16 has dropped to 40-something, even though I occasionally add additional links to it.

So I guess I'm a bit discouraged about what seems at least in some cases to be a temporary gain in ranking.

One thought about avoiding SPAM detection. I didn't really do this intentionally, but I created one profile and added a comment on their forum, then got called away.... haven't gotten back to it for 3 or 4 days and it occurred to me, maybe that is best. If new profiles are being reviewed, mine will be empty when checked. Tonight I'll go back and place my links on that profile page.

[djbory]

Originally Posted by AnneE

One thought about avoiding SPAM detection. I didn't really do this intentionally, but I created one profile and added a comment on their forum, then got called away.... haven't gotten back to it for 3 or 4 days and it occurred to me, maybe that is best. If new profiles are being reviewed, mine will be empty when checked. Tonight I'll go back and place my links on that profile page.

That sounds like a nice strategy... It would, however, be very time consuming, but it may be worth it at the end...

DJBory

[gmr324]

Angela and Paul,

I have a question about the need for "spinning" the profile content across the
different sites. In the interest of being a good neighbor and extending the
lifetime of the profiles, I believe in making the profiles as realistic as possible.
So, I created a 2-3 paragraph fictitious profile which includes my anchor text for
2-3 links which logically fit into the content. This way, the description of the person
makes sense and the anchor text fits seemlessly into it rather than just being
isolated obvious spam.

So, my question has to do with using this method but avoiding the Google
duplicate content filter by just cutting and pasting the same profile text
on every site. Do you believe its necessary to have the profiles be at least
50% different on each backlink site to avoid tripping this filter?

It would seem to be a good practice so Google doesn't see the same text
and just discounts it as something it has seen 100 times before thereby
possibly devaluing the backlinks.

Appreciate your thoughts

George

[Angela V. Edwards]

Originally Posted by AnneE

Here's my update -- I submitted my Goarticles article and over the course of a week submitted 30 backlinks (most of the PR 7). A little less than a week after the last link was posted the article was at number 5. A few days later it dropped to number 6. Then yesterday (about 1 week later), it dropped to number 16. I think I will add at least one new link to it and see if I can get it to come back up.

I know my Squidoo lens that I backlinked like crazy and had risen up to #16 has dropped to 40-something, even though I occasionally add additional links to it.

So I guess I'm a bit discouraged about what seems at least in some cases to be a temporary gain in ranking.

One thought about avoiding SPAM detection. I didn't really do this intentionally, but I created one profile and added a comment on their forum, then got called away.... haven't gotten back to it for 3 or 4 days and it occurred to me, maybe that is best. If new profiles are being reviewed, mine will be empty when checked. Tonight I'll go back and place my links on that profile page.

Anne, I honestly don't think it's been long enough. The first few days of adding links, the "Google Dance" is VERY evident, but it can also affect your rankings over the course of the next few weeks. I know the thread is very long, but if you were to read through it, you'd see that several folks faced this same thing. They were quite discouraged and didn't think the links were working for them. A few weeks later, just out of the blue, they thought about checking their rankings again. Most of them found their sites or articles or whatever in VERY high positions in Google.

Remember, the Google bot doesn't crawl all the sites at the same time, and it almost always "dances" when it sees brand new links; regardless of how they got there. Give it a bit more time and then let me know how it's doing.

[Angela V. Edwards]

Originally Posted by gmr324

Angela and Paul,

I have a question about the need for "spinning" the profile content across the
different sites. In the interest of being a good neighbor and extending the
lifetime of the profiles, I believe in making the profiles as realistic as possible.
So, I created a 2-3 paragraph fictitious profile which includes my anchor text for
2-3 links which logically fit into the content. This way, the description of the person
makes sense and the anchor text fits seemlessly into it rather than just being
isolated obvious spam.

So, my question has to do with using this method but avoiding the Google
duplicate content filter by just cutting and pasting the same profile text
on every site. Do you believe its necessary to have the profiles be at least
50% different on each backlink site to avoid tripping this filter?

It would seem to be a good practice so Google doesn't see the same text
and just discounts it as something it has seen 100 times before thereby
possibly devaluing the backlinks.

Appreciate your thoughts

George

Google doesn't count this sort of stuff as "duplicate content" and Google themselves even said so.

Duplicate content. There's just something about it. We keep writing about it, and people keep asking about it. In particular, I still hear a lot of webmasters worrying about whether they may have a "duplicate content penalty."


Let's put this to bed once and for all, folks: There's no such thing as a "duplicate content penalty." At least, not in the way most people mean when they say that.

So Duplicate Content is NOT an issue, but let me ask you: how would you go about making each profile "different" when so many of them ask you the same things? They ask your name, where you live, your age, etc. What would you do...create a slightly different "persona" for each profile? Of course not! You wouldn't be expected to by the websites, nor would Google want that. You are you and if you are filling out a profile, it would be best to put information about yourself, unless you are using a "pen name" and in that case, you would still create a "persona" of sorts for the pen name.