Where did YOU learn copywriting?

Li Weng · 12-04-2008, 10:12 PM

I read stuff from people like Joe Vitale, Jay Abraham. A lot of the times I read the sales letters of hot selling products and see what they're using to trigger psychological response in readers.

what about you?

imaddict · 12-04-2008, 10:19 PM

Isn't self-taught and bought courses essentially one and the same?

Li Weng · 12-04-2008, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by imaddict

Isn't self-taught and bought courses essentially one and the same?

Oh yeah I should clarify, by self-taught I mean researching free information and learning it yourself that way. As in you didn't learn systematically from a course. You figured it out from whatever free information is available online.

Vin_J · 12-05-2008, 03:19 PM

multiple methods.

aboutalhah · 12-07-2008, 03:34 AM

I read many sales letter, and read and bought stuff from Yanik Silver, Gary Halbert, Michel Fortin, Stepehen Dean and other copywriters.

Franck

Bruce NewMedia · 12-11-2008, 12:05 AM

Started out with a single Dan Kennedy book many years ago.

Then read Bob Bly, and started looking for clients and practicing copy all the time.

Then got audio tapes by Joe Sugarman and his first book. Then read Ted Nicholas, Jay Abraham, and invested in John Carleton course, Scott Haines material, ADMAGIC by Brian Keith Voiles, Jeffrey Lants books, Maximum Money By Halbert and many, many more. (did I say LOTS more?)

Then started going to seminars by Gary Halbert and Dan Kennedy. ...and so it goes. I read top ads practically everyday and write every day.

BTW, The last year or so, I've found another great copywriting resource to be Clayton Makepeace.
______
Bruce

Cherilyn Woodhouse · 12-11-2008, 12:34 AM

I learned how to write copy by doing what few other copywriters ever have... I started my career in retail sales, then moved to B2B sales. Face to face... Cold calling... Generating leads and closing sales... Doorknocking, pounding the pavement, learning what works in the real world.

Personally, I don't believe you can get a better education.

- Cherilyn

seowordsmith · 12-11-2008, 03:56 PM

By writing - thousands of pages of content Started off with keyword-stuffed content, back when that was OK, pre Web 2.0, when dinosaurs walked the earth. Now, thankfully, writing can be more information-based, but I think I learned a lot about keyword writing from that initial experience.

Stephen Dean · 12-11-2008, 04:25 PM

Reading a ton of ads in biz opp magazines when I was a teen. At the time I was looking to get rich quick, but I think the ads sunk in and effected my writing style.

Started writing copy for myself using what I had absorbed by reading all thsoe ads.

Then started writing for others after people noticed my work. Started real cheap, $97-$197 per letter which was unheard of at the time. Then slowly raised my rates as I continued to learn.

During this time I read all the greats... How to Write A Good Advertisement, Tested Advertising Methods, The Robert Collier Letter Book, Breakthrough Advertising, etc. (How to write a good advertisement is my favorite for beginners, Breakthrough advertising is my favorite for experienced).

After I was established and making a few thousand per letter, I hired Michel Fortin to be my coach for close to 2 years I think. That helped a lot as you can imagine.

Through Michel's blog and coaching, he's probably taught me more about copy than anyone dead or alive.

Another great online resource is The Total Package

Stephen

MontelloMarketing · 12-12-2008, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seowordsmith

By writing - thousands of pages of content Started off with keyword-stuffed content, back when that was OK, pre Web 2.0, when dinosaurs walked the earth. Now, thankfully, writing can be more information-based, but I think I learned a lot about keyword writing from that initial experience.

Sorry none of what you're talking about is copywriting. It's SEO writing and article writing.

ndcole78 · 12-12-2008, 05:25 PM

I've always been a writer one way or another. But for copywriting, I had to develop a salesman or marketing mindset, so I watched a lot of infomercials, read the direct mail that companies send, and read sales letters on the Web---that's basically all I did and still do now.

aleisterone · 12-12-2008, 11:28 PM

You guys may laugh but the first guide on copywriting I read was actually from a book called Speed Seduction by Ross Jeffries. He teaches dating skills by the use of nlp.

Dean Dhuli · 12-13-2008, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vin_J

multiple methods.

Same here.

Terry Newman · 12-13-2008, 01:54 PM

I hate to sound old, but my first experience with copywriting was back in the 1980s. I was ghost writing natural health books for a client. He wanted to know if I could write a few letters as well.

The next thing I know I'm on his staff, learning the secrets of copywriting. After several months, he hires a nationally known copywriter, Shell Alpert (he's dead now), and I'm on the telephone with him for hours at a time as he tells me about the anatomy of a sales letter.

As it turned out, the campaign he developed -- and I'm still proud to say I wrote -- worked out very well.

Ilya Feynberg · 12-13-2008, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MontelloMarketing

Sorry none of what you're talking about is copywriting. It's SEO writing and article writing.

Vin....one of these day's I'm going to have to take you up on your mentoring services.... seriously

MontelloMarketing · 12-13-2008, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdunn123

Vin....one of these day's I'm going to have to take you up on your mentoring services.... seriously

My students are all making more money!

Ilya Feynberg · 12-13-2008, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MontelloMarketing

My students are all making more money!

I can only imagine Vin. I've been steadily getting better at writing my own copy, increasing conversions, opt ins, email series etc. We've spoken in the past and I think it's getting close to that time were I have to start taking things to the next level. We'll talk soon...trust me...I can't wait!

Colorado Deb · 12-13-2008, 05:43 PM

I started back in the early 1990's for my direct mail (snail mail) business with Jay Abraham and then purchased the AWAI course (Accelerated Program for Six-Figure Copywriting). I bought some Direct Mail books that talked about testing (isn't everything about testing?)

Then I learned more about headline writing from Bill Myers and Richard Dennis. Lately I've learned from Tellman, the Stomper crew, and Clayton Makepeace, as well as many others. (It does become a bit of an addiction...)

As many responses to this poll stated, I also have learned a lot from reading great copy written by others. One thing I have worked on since the early 1990's is to create a targeted swipe file - I have my big boxes of hard copy and a large digital folder on my computer. Swipe files are nothing new, as you know, and nearly every good copywriting course talks about the value of having one. I am constantly referring to them. I even have a 'headline' swipe file, a 'power words' swipe file, etc.

lklein · 12-14-2008, 01:28 PM

Self taught/reports

Alex Malave · 12-17-2008, 11:17 PM

Buying a ton of courses. Cramming them at 2x speed while taking notes.

I also heard Dan Kennedy one time that the way he learned to write copy was by getting 100 of the best salesletters of all time and rewriting them by hand.

I'm currently on number 37.

He got that from Halbert.

moneycometh · 12-18-2008, 07:11 AM

I read a lot of Dan Kennedy, Joe Vitale, Jay Abraham, Zig Ziegler, etc. Although, Zig is more living the golden rule principals. His famous line is "if you'll just help enough other people get what they want, then you'll get what you want". I also like the Earl Nightingale series. One of my favorites is "Lead The Field". Again not so much about copywriting per se, but, still food for thought!

moneycometh · 12-18-2008, 07:13 AM

Now that is a great tip! I'll use this for myself! Thanks.

ados67 · 12-19-2008, 05:39 AM

Self-taught + Articles & books, for the most part

That's how I'd recommend most people start. Then, you should go freelancing a bit, for cheap rates - and work your way up!

Adi Friedman
Two Believers.

MisterEThoughts · 12-31-2008, 12:25 AM

Ebooks, Reports, Articles, Blogs, Books

Christie Love · 12-31-2008, 02:34 AM

I had a mentor too.

myob · 01-01-2009, 08:31 PM

Despite having a degree in Marketing, I never did learn copywriting. I just found a couple of the best copywriters in the world and hired them for my staff.

MontelloMarketing · 01-01-2009, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by myob

Despite having a degree in Marketing, I never did learn copywriting. I just found a couple of the best copywriters in the world and hired them for my staff.

When you come onto a copywriting forum and say you hired 2 of the best copywriters in the world, you get my attention. So... I clicked a couple of your links, Paul... and...

No offense...

But your letters need a ton of work. Please tell me your "2 of the best" copywriters were hired recently and haven't gotten to reworking those pages yet.

Please tell me that.

Or tell me it's opposite day or something.

UnityinAustralia · 01-06-2009, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen Dean

Reading a ton of ads in biz opp magazines when I was a teen. At the time I was looking to get rich quick, but I think the ads sunk in and effected my writing style.

Started writing copy for myself using what I had absorbed by reading all thsoe ads.

Then started writing for others after people noticed my work. Started real cheap, $97-$197 per letter which was unheard of at the time. Then slowly raised my rates as I continued to learn.

Stephen

I did something similar. I found the best rule of thumb was to read as many sales letters as I could, and find the ones that worked on me (made me desperately want to buy their stuff), and then use content from their letters.

Tested out some ideas in the real world, and evolved from there.

Jacqueline Watson · 01-06-2009, 10:33 PM

I'm hooked on Clayton Makepeace's
stuff. He's pretty good...pricey,
but I learn a lot from the free
stuff he has on his site.

His newsletters are phenomenal!

Peace and Love

Jacqueline

Sarah Johnson · 01-07-2009, 04:15 PM

Above all, it would have to be through a coach. (Thank you Stephen!) With his guidance I am reading and learning more than I thought possible on the subject of copywriting. I am also a follower of some big-timers, like Michel Fortin, and continually read their blogs for very useful and pertinent information.

~Mrs. Johnson

rahulmagi · 01-08-2009, 11:44 PM

I learn from newspapaers, magazines and online media, these things helped me lots...

Mr. Thiago · 01-09-2009, 05:32 AM

If you want to know how to copywrite go to amazon and buy some copywriting books, hypnosis in writing books and call to action books.

You should spend at least $200.

In the end this small investment will make you so much money.

This is the best advice I can give anybody out there.

Study and don't be lazy!

View Poll Results: Where did you learn copywriting?
Self-Taught	15	35.71%
Bought Courses	13	30.95%
Had a Mentor	7	16.67%
Other	7	16.67%
Voters: 42. You may not vote on this poll

12-04-2008, 10:12 PM	#1
Li Weng Advanced Warrior War Room Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 588 Thanks: 19 Thanked 56 Times in 40 Posts Social Networking	Where did YOU learn copywriting? I read stuff from people like Joe Vitale, Jay Abraham. A lot of the times I read the sales letters of hot selling products and see what they're using to trigger psychological response in readers. what about you?
	- Insert backlink here -

12-04-2008, 10:19 PM	#2
imaddict HyperActive Warrior Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: , , . Posts: 129 Thanks: 8 Thanked 17 Times in 12 Posts	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? Isn't self-taught and bought courses essentially one and the same?

12-05-2008, 03:19 PM	#4
Vin_J Warrior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 28 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? multiple methods.

12-07-2008, 03:34 AM	#5
aboutalhah Senior Warrior Member War Room Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Guadeloupe (Caribbean Sea) Posts: 3,376 Blog Entries: 50 Thanks: 42 Thanked 165 Times in 92 Posts Social Networking	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? I read many sales letter, and read and bought stuff from Yanik Silver, Gary Halbert, Michel Fortin, Stepehen Dean and other copywriters. Franck
	>> Click to start with My Underground Online Marketing Blueprint << Warriors love My Simple $2000+/ Month IM Plan (2 Years To Figure it out, but it was worth it)! Kevin Riley said: "Franck, glad to see you bringing out MORE and MORE GREAT stuff"

12-11-2008, 12:05 AM	#6
Bruce NewMedia www.OfflineAdvance.com War Room Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Chicago Posts: 2,005 Thanks: 1,272 Thanked 573 Times in 314 Posts	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? Started out with a single Dan Kennedy book many years ago. Then read Bob Bly, and started looking for clients and practicing copy all the time. Then got audio tapes by Joe Sugarman and his first book. Then read Ted Nicholas, Jay Abraham, and invested in John Carleton course, Scott Haines material, ADMAGIC by Brian Keith Voiles, Jeffrey Lants books, Maximum Money By Halbert and many, many more. (did I say LOTS more?) Then started going to seminars by Gary Halbert and Dan Kennedy. ...and so it goes. I read top ads practically everyday and write every day. BTW, The last year or so, I've found another great copywriting resource to be Clayton Makepeace. ______ Bruce

12-11-2008, 12:34 AM	#7
Cherilyn Woodhouse Formerly Cherilyn Lester War Room Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Chilliwack, BC, Canada Posts: 2,215 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 78 Thanked 257 Times in 67 Posts Social Networking Contact Info	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? I learned how to write copy by doing what few other copywriters ever have... I started my career in retail sales, then moved to B2B sales. Face to face... Cold calling... Generating leads and closing sales... Doorknocking, pounding the pavement, learning what works in the real world. Personally, I don't believe you can get a better education. - Cherilyn
	Take your product from idea to profit in less than 90 days! Work with me to develop and implement a step-by-step plan for success! Coaching & Consulting @ BCWebMedia.com

12-11-2008, 03:56 PM	#8
seowordsmith Warrior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 2 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? By writing - thousands of pages of content Started off with keyword-stuffed content, back when that was OK, pre Web 2.0, when dinosaurs walked the earth. Now, thankfully, writing can be more information-based, but I think I learned a lot about keyword writing from that initial experience.
	SEO Wordsmith \| SEO Marketplace

12-11-2008, 04:25 PM	#9
Stephen Dean Master Copywriter War Room Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: WA , USA. Posts: 1,052 Thanks: 133 Thanked 192 Times in 99 Posts Social Networking	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? Reading a ton of ads in biz opp magazines when I was a teen. At the time I was looking to get rich quick, but I think the ads sunk in and effected my writing style. Started writing copy for myself using what I had absorbed by reading all thsoe ads. Then started writing for others after people noticed my work. Started real cheap, $97-$197 per letter which was unheard of at the time. Then slowly raised my rates as I continued to learn. During this time I read all the greats... How to Write A Good Advertisement, Tested Advertising Methods, The Robert Collier Letter Book, Breakthrough Advertising, etc. (How to write a good advertisement is my favorite for beginners, Breakthrough advertising is my favorite for experienced). After I was established and making a few thousand per letter, I hired Michel Fortin to be my coach for close to 2 years I think. That helped a lot as you can imagine. Through Michel's blog and coaching, he's probably taught me more about copy than anyone dead or alive. Another great online resource is The Total Package Stephen
	Occupation: Best Copywriter Ever. Clients: Matt Bacak, Jim Edwards, Ryan Deiss and more. I write sales copy that demands champagne celebrations: Hire A “Champagne Celebration” Copywriter.

12-12-2008, 05:25 PM	#11
ndcole78 Advanced Warrior War Room Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: , , USA. Posts: 608 Thanks: 1 Thanked 72 Times in 14 Posts	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? I've always been a writer one way or another. But for copywriting, I had to develop a salesman or marketing mindset, so I watched a lot of infomercials, read the direct mail that companies send, and read sales letters on the Web---that's basically all I did and still do now.

12-12-2008, 11:28 PM	#12
aleisterone Warrior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 29 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? You guys may laugh but the first guide on copywriting I read was actually from a book called Speed Seduction by Ross Jeffries. He teaches dating skills by the use of nlp.

12-13-2008, 01:54 PM	#14
Terry Newman Warrior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Currently, Ohio. About to spend a month in NYC! Posts: 3 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? I hate to sound old, but my first experience with copywriting was back in the 1980s. I was ghost writing natural health books for a client. He wanted to know if I could write a few letters as well. The next thing I know I'm on his staff, learning the secrets of copywriting. After several months, he hires a nationally known copywriter, Shell Alpert (he's dead now), and I'm on the telephone with him for hours at a time as he tells me about the anatomy of a sales letter. As it turned out, the campaign he developed -- and I'm still proud to say I wrote -- worked out very well.

12-13-2008, 05:43 PM	#18
Colorado Deb Warrior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Durango, CO, USA Posts: 26 Thanks: 4 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts Social Networking	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? I started back in the early 1990's for my direct mail (snail mail) business with Jay Abraham and then purchased the AWAI course (Accelerated Program for Six-Figure Copywriting). I bought some Direct Mail books that talked about testing (isn't everything about testing?) Then I learned more about headline writing from Bill Myers and Richard Dennis. Lately I've learned from Tellman, the Stomper crew, and Clayton Makepeace, as well as many others. (It does become a bit of an addiction...) As many responses to this poll stated, I also have learned a lot from reading great copy written by others. One thing I have worked on since the early 1990's is to create a targeted swipe file - I have my big boxes of hard copy and a large digital folder on my computer. Swipe files are nothing new, as you know, and nearly every good copywriting course talks about the value of having one. I am constantly referring to them. I even have a 'headline' swipe file, a 'power words' swipe file, etc.
	Are you using audio and video on your website? Chances are you should be! Make it simple to create your audio & video players for your site, and protect your content. http://EasyWebsiteAudioVideo.com http://BBSTutorials.com

12-14-2008, 01:28 PM	#19
lklein Kindle Book Author War Room Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Marion TWP,MI , USA. Posts: 545 Blog Entries: 2 Thanks: 15 Thanked 49 Times in 28 Posts Social Networking	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? Self taught/reports
	WordPress Power Guide http://www.lambertklein.com/wordpress.html - WordPress Power Guide

12-17-2008, 11:17 PM	#20
Alex Malave Active Warrior War Room Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Vegas Baby Posts: 72 Thanks: 0 Thanked 23 Times in 4 Posts Social Networking Contact Info	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? Buying a ton of courses. Cramming them at 2x speed while taking notes. I also heard Dan Kennedy one time that the way he learned to write copy was by getting 100 of the best salesletters of all time and rewriting them by hand. I'm currently on number 37. He got that from Halbert.

12-18-2008, 07:11 AM	#21
moneycometh Jackie K. Anderson Join Date: May 2007 Location: Bolingbrook, Il Posts: 145 Thanks: 18 Thanked 9 Times in 7 Posts Social Networking Contact Info	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? I read a lot of Dan Kennedy, Joe Vitale, Jay Abraham, Zig Ziegler, etc. Although, Zig is more living the golden rule principals. His famous line is "if you'll just help enough other people get what they want, then you'll get what you want". I also like the Earl Nightingale series. One of my favorites is "Lead The Field". Again not so much about copywriting per se, but, still food for thought!
	Learn how the ticket scalpers and brokers get all the good tickets!

12-18-2008, 07:13 AM	#22
moneycometh Jackie K. Anderson Join Date: May 2007 Location: Bolingbrook, Il Posts: 145 Thanks: 18 Thanked 9 Times in 7 Posts Social Networking Contact Info	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? Now that is a great tip! I'll use this for myself! Thanks.
	Learn how the ticket scalpers and brokers get all the good tickets!

12-19-2008, 05:39 AM	#23
ados67 Active Warrior War Room Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Israel Posts: 63 Thanks: 14 Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? Self-taught + Articles & books, for the most part That's how I'd recommend most people start. Then, you should go freelancing a bit, for cheap rates - and work your way up! Adi Friedman Two Believers.

12-31-2008, 12:25 AM	#24
MisterEThoughts Freelance Writer Join Date: May 2007 Location: Bayarea, CA , USA. Posts: 30 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Social Networking Contact Info	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? Ebooks, Reports, Articles, Blogs, Books
	www.911FreelanceWriting.com - Writing Portfolio

12-31-2008, 02:34 AM	#25
Christie Love The Fabulous One War Room Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 930 Thanks: 11 Thanked 79 Times in 68 Posts Social Networking Contact Info	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? I had a mentor too.
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01-01-2009, 08:31 PM	#26
myob Mind Your Own Business War Room Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 3,499 Thanks: 538 Thanked 2,118 Times in 1,303 Posts	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? Despite having a degree in Marketing, I never did learn copywriting. I just found a couple of the best copywriters in the world and hired them for my staff.

01-06-2009, 10:33 PM	#29
Jacqueline Watson Writing For A Living Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Wrightsville Beach, NC Posts: 83 Thanks: 34 Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts Social Networking Contact Info	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? I'm hooked on Clayton Makepeace's stuff. He's pretty good...pricey, but I learn a lot from the free stuff he has on his site. His newsletters are phenomenal! Peace and Love Jacqueline
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01-07-2009, 04:15 PM	#30
Sarah Johnson Active Warrior Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 94 Thanks: 5 Thanked 14 Times in 8 Posts Social Networking	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? Above all, it would have to be through a coach. (Thank you Stephen!) With his guidance I am reading and learning more than I thought possible on the subject of copywriting. I am also a follower of some big-timers, like Michel Fortin, and continually read their blogs for very useful and pertinent information. ~Mrs. Johnson

01-08-2009, 11:44 PM	#31
rahulmagi Warrior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: delhi Posts: 24 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? I learn from newspapaers, magazines and online media, these things helped me lots...
	Blog tips

01-09-2009, 05:32 AM	#32
Mr. Thiago Mr. Thiago War Room Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 56 Thanks: 4 Thanked 40 Times in 10 Posts Social Networking	Re: Where did YOU learn copywriting? If you want to know how to copywrite go to amazon and buy some copywriting books, hypnosis in writing books and call to action books. You should spend at least $200. In the end this small investment will make you so much money. This is the best advice I can give anybody out there. Study and don't be lazy!