EVERY Copywriting Formula In The History of Mankind and Womankind

35 replies
From Jo at Copyhackers.

She says it took 200 hours to write this.

And you'll see why it was worth it...

https://copyhackers.com/2015/10/copy...eid=63a1168679



Steve
#copy #hackers
  • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
    As Dan Kennedy said at Titans Of Direct Response,
    it's the mechanics and every good copywriter has them.

    What's missing is delving deep into the mind of your prospects.

    It's no use having any formula when your prospect has seen, heard
    similar to what she gets from you.

    How do you break down the research phase into a formula?

    What...research..that isn't sexy, how can you sell that?

    Probably not.

    Yesterday I dug up from a client that when he gets a prospect
    to a certain point it's near to 100% are sold.

    The path to getting prospects to that point is very clear.

    How do you become a sales detective?

    Mmm, that sounds like work...forget it.

    Let's get back to a sexy formula.

    Best,
    Doctor E. Vile
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    • Profile picture of the author RickDuris
      Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

      As Dan Kennedy said at Titans Of Direct Response,
      it's the mechanics and every good copywriter has them.

      What's missing is delving deep into the mind of your prospects.

      It's no use having any formula when your prospect has seen, heard
      similar to what she gets from you.

      How do you break down the research phase into a formula?

      What...research..that isn't sexy, how can you sell that?

      Probably not.

      Yesterday I dug up from a client that when he gets a prospect
      to a certain point it's near to 100% are sold.

      The path to getting prospects to that point is very clear.

      How do you become a sales detective?

      Mmm, that sounds like work...forget it.

      Let's get back to a sexy formula.

      Best,
      Doctor E. Vile
      If you knew Joanna, or had taken one of her courses (and I have), there is no way you would say that.

      - Rick Duris

      PS: That post is gold.
      Signature
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      • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
        Originally Posted by RickDuris View Post

        If you knew Joanna, or had taken one of her courses (and I have), there is no way you would say that.
        Would you like to expand on that Rick?

        Thank you,
        Doctor E. Vile
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      • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
        Originally Posted by RickDuris View Post

        If you knew Joanna, or had taken one of her courses (and I have), there is no way you would say that.

        - Rick Duris

        PS: That post is gold.
        Rick, here's 2 well respected people in the direct response
        marketing field talking about formulas and how most get them wrong...

        https://rlallc.clickfunnels.com/secr...-survey-funnel

        Best,
        Doctor E. Vile
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  • Dr Vile,

    For goodness sake lighten up!

    It's just about formula's - nothing more.

    If you prefer not to avail yourself of a formula that is absolutely fine.

    (special note - whenever anyone writes copy - you can work out the "formula" - even if the writer didn't consciously use one)

    A formula if you like, gives you a "track" you still have to build the performance cars to race on it.

    It's good to have both - because it's best to stay on the track (rather than crashing into the barriers of endless rambling).

    You talked about an apparently formula less Dan Kennedy * "delving deep onto the mindset of your prospects" - well his preferred copywriting formula which he has being banging on about for decades is mentioned by Jo.


    Steve

    * And I quote - "Dan Kennedy called PAS (Problem, Agitate, Solution) - the most reliable sales formula ever invented."
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    • Profile picture of the author RickDuris
      Originally Posted by Steve The Copywriter View Post

      * And I quote - "Dan Kennedy called PAS (Problem, Agitate, Solution) - the most reliable sales formula ever invented."
      Full disclosure: A few people have privately pointed out to me Joanna does the right thing and links back to my site for extensions of PAS as well as one of my VSL formulas.
      Signature
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  • Yes Rick she does.

    Here's the sequence for the PAS...

    The Dan Kennedy quote - links to Henneke Duistermaat's "Enchanting Marketing" site - and she very kindly offers "27 more copywriting formulas"

    Press that link and you'll never guess where you arrive…

    Oh you have guessed?

    Yes, it's the CopyRanger site.


    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author pewpewpewmonkeys
    Where’s the D?
    It takes patience and confidence to spend a little time building up the D. Apple has more than enough confidence to work on the D.
    It got a bit inappropriate, though.
    Signature
    Some cause-oriented hackers recently hacked one of my websites. So I researched what they're about and then donated a large sum of money to the entity they hate the most.

    The next time they hack one of my websites I'm going to donate DOUBLE.
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    • Thx Steve,

      Plenty formula here to feed the blind spot in any alchemical retina.

      I had today free to fix up stuff for halloween and hit on moldy admin, but I guess now I gotta make like a fat gal to the honey spoon.

      This ain't intel - it's abuse.
      Signature

      Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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  • Princess,

    And I was hoping you would disclose your very own formula. Actually formula's.

    I asked 7 senior algorithm experts each of them used a terabyte of unique data but they were still foxed.

    So it's time to cough...

    Your main copywriting F.

    And then…your preferred creative writing F.

    We may not immediately understand but to try and gain the knowledge we should be told.


    Steve
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    • Originally Posted by Steve The Copywriter View Post

      I asked 7 senior algorithm experts each of them used a terabyte of unique data but they were still foxed.

      So it's time to cough...

      Your main copywriting F.

      And then...your preferred creative writing F.

      We may not immediately understand but to try and gain the knowledge we should be told.


      Steve
      Hey

      Now it's my turn to be confused.

      Don't quite catcha.
      Signature

      Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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  • Never thought that would happen.

    (note - cough…if used colloquially in the UK means "confess", "tell' or "spill the beans")

    Anyway, let me make a formal request.

    Dear Princess,

    I would find it very illuminating if you would be kind enough to tell me if you have your very own preferred copywriting formula (as far as I can tell - it's never been "officially" discovered, transcribed and collated).

    Also if you use a use a formula for your how can I say, left field creative writing (a bit like a Coen brothers movie script spiked with vodka - they haven't written it yet, but if they could, they would).

    It may well be you don't use any formulas or structures - but if you do, would you cough, I mean disclose them?


    Sincerely,

    Steve The Copywriter
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  • Profile picture of the author Raydal
    Interestingly, one of the first lessons I have in my coaching program has
    to do with formulas, many mentioned in this article. (Great article.)

    Now I also have my own formula that I've never shared outside of
    my 8-yr old program. It was the shock of my life when listening to a
    Jon Benson webinar that he shared the EXACT formula as his 3X VSL
    formula. Today everybody calls it by that name.

    Maybe great minds think alike?

    But formulas do work and they serve like the structure
    of a building. You still need the windows, walls, doors etc.
    to make the building complete.

    -Ray Edwards
    Signature
    The most powerful and concentrated copywriting training online today bar none! Autoresponder Writing Email SECRETS
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    • Hey, Steve, I am so stoopid.

      Evry time I see F I think of F right now. Thought you were alludin' to sumthin' kinko but it was only me.

      So, yeah, I guess both CW F's hang on imagry. Filtered through narrative an' story, course, but image is all. Whoever controls the imagry runs the show. Whoever defines the narrative frames the argument.

      Copy. Movies. Politics. Heart to heart with your best pal.

      Back in the day, the church ran all the imagry, then we got Tarot, novels, movies, ads. Oral storytellin' morphed, but the essentials remain:

      What is the picture I wanna slip into someone's head?
      What vision do I want in there gonna seem so real that they feel on it, act on it?

      Structure you deploy feeds that, an' it's always gonna need a tweak to ensure it has currency du jour, especially now info is speedin' up.

      Originally Posted by Raydal View Post

      But formulas do work and they serve like the structure
      of a building. You still need the windows, walls, doors etc.
      to make the building complete.
      Ray Edwards
      See? Momentum moves on already.

      An' this is a timely point, Ray.

      Buildings are where people hang out, and their structure shapes how the hoomans inside might interact an' play out their emoto-narratives.

      Diffrent things happen in a high rise to a bungalow, but all the happenstuff is the work of people. Without 'em, you just got an empty building (which I could do with right now cos some fkr is shoutin' real loud outside).

      I guess you have to see how it all rolls when you're on the receiving end, hooverin' on the world's perpetual infogasm.

      Surrounded by ads, so you suck 'em up, notice repetitions, omissions.

      Watch a movie, read a poem, mix it up.

      Then alla the stuff in your periphery feeds in.

      Gray day now. Rain. A bird. My stoopid cape for tomorrow flung over the back of a chair. Blisso loud guy vacuum. Taste of muffin glowin' round my chops. I can't blot it out an' I can't stop it mixin' around, an' it's all image, all story, all (if I think of how I might end this reply in a few minnows) fiction. A selective/selected clutch of shards from the available promptpool that my brain cannot help but run into meaning.

      Lemme look again.

      Still gray (slow burner). Still rain (but now I question the relative weight of its fall), bird is gone, jus' looked for a substitute animal but there ain't one, a car, cape (which i am now wearin' jus' to mess this all up), a quieter loud guy vacuum, less muffin -- hey that was a powerful promptpool 'cos I just spun on it again. Even so, it's diffrent from the first run, and I muse on this.

      Take away the gray, the rain, the cape, the guy -- the stuff -- and what have I got?

      Nuthin'.

      I can't even punch the loud guy I never saw in the chops, which is annoying 'cos he had a beard an' I coulda smacked him harder than a regular rowdy *******.

      How stuff is in time an' space right now is kinda accidental (apart from the cape, and regular fixtures like keyboard, monitor, lamp) yet it breathes the story of the moment. It IS that.

      But it's only me sittin' here in a building, and though it's mostly accidental, all the pictures are workin' me right now, same as you.

      Run copy, write a poem, shoot a movie, you load up with the imagry you want seen, then fix it up into an order.

      The accident of that missin' bird, gone, but flappin' in my head still, becomes a deliberately beheld vulture, pickin' on flesh if I wanna.

      Now, where might that play?

      "Ripped off by your insurance company?"

      Ha!

      But that's runnin' stuff backwards.

      Brief comes first, an' before yr through para 1, lions roar, airplanes fly, hunks flash meat, all kindsa stuff wings in on a prompt.

      So you drop 'em in a pit an' watch 'em fight it out.

      Some broad idea always wins out, some image to hang the story on.

      That usually happens when I'm tidying stuff or shopping for pizza, an' I jot down phrases, an' build it up till it makes sense an' hangs together, an' tweaks on whatever CW Fs illuminate or dim the point needs makin'.

      Then the client says, "hey this is a pile of crap" an' I go kick a dog.

      Experiment: go find a bird right now.

      Outta the window, Google, book.

      Whatever project you're workin' on, throw it up big in your mind's eye, then hit on the bird.

      Some of 'em sing real lousy but none stay truly silent.

      Tucked away under the squawk gonna be a flicker of an image, the visual writhing of sumthin' plus sumthin', same as if you saw the bird anyhoo, without me askin' ya.

      But now I told you to go see the bird, dropped her onya after alla this alla this writin' (finished in a minnow, an' mebbe what I oughta be doin' is sum' genuwhine hooverin insteada honeyspoonin' the fat gal of my procrastination/diligence) I figure it might sing somethin' different to the anyhoo bird, an' mebbe you'll see more of the image flicker now I've suggested ur gonna see sumthin'.

      It's an accidental image drop, but also kinda deliberate.

      If it sparks your project on some, I wld truly love that.
      Signature

      Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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      • Profile picture of the author dmaster555
        Originally Posted by Princess Balestra View Post

        Hey, Steve, I am so stoopid.

        Evry time I see F I think of F right now. Thought you were alludin' to sumthin' kinko but it was only me.

        So, yeah, I guess both CW F's hang on imagry. Filtered through narrative an' story, course, but image is all. Whoever controls the imagry runs the show. Whoever defines the narrative frames the argument.

        Copy. Movies. Politics. Heart to heart with your best pal.

        Back in the day, the church ran all the imagry, then we got Tarot, novels, movies, ads. Oral storytellin' morphed, but the essentials remain:

        What is the picture I wanna slip into someone's head?
        What vision do I want in there gonna seem so real that they feel on it, act on it?

        Structure you deploy feeds that, an' it's always gonna need a tweak to ensure it has currency du jour, especially now info is speedin' up.



        See? Momentum moves on already.

        An' this is a timely point, Ray.

        Buildings are where people hang out, and their structure shapes how the hoomans inside might interact an' play out their emoto-narratives.

        Diffrent things happen in a high rise to a bungalow, but all the happenstuff is the work of people. Without 'em, you just got an empty building (which I could do with right now cos some fkr is shoutin' real loud outside).

        I guess you have to see how it all rolls when you're on the receiving end, hooverin' on the world's perpetual infogasm.

        Surrounded by ads, so you suck 'em up, notice repetitions, omissions.

        Watch a movie, read a poem, mix it up.

        Then alla the stuff in your periphery feeds in.

        Gray day now. Rain. A bird. My stoopid cape for tomorrow flung over the back of a chair. Blisso loud guy vacuum. Taste of muffin glowin' round my chops. I can't blot it out an' I can't stop it mixin' around, an' it's all image, all story, all (if I think of how I might end this reply in a few minnows) fiction. A selective/selected clutch of shards from the available promptpool that my brain cannot help but run into meaning.

        Lemme look again.

        Still gray (slow burner). Still rain (but now I question the relative weight of its fall), bird is gone, jus' looked for a substitute animal but there ain't one, a car, cape (which i am now wearin' jus' to mess this all up), a quieter loud guy vacuum, less muffin -- hey that was a powerful promptpool 'cos I just spun on it again. Even so, it's diffrent from the first run, and I muse on this.

        Take away the gray, the rain, the cape, the guy -- the stuff -- and what have I got?

        Nuthin'.

        I can't even punch the loud guy I never saw in the chops, which is annoying 'cos he had a beard an' I coulda smacked him harder than a regular rowdy *******.

        How stuff is in time an' space right now is kinda accidental (apart from the cape, and regular fixtures like keyboard, monitor, lamp) yet it breathes the story of the moment. It IS that.

        But it's only me sittin' here in a building, and though it's mostly accidental, all the pictures are workin' me right now, same as you.

        Run copy, write a poem, shoot a movie, you load up with the imagry you want seen, then fix it up into an order.

        The accident of that missin' bird, gone, but flappin' in my head still, becomes a deliberately beheld vulture, pickin' on flesh if I wanna.

        Now, where might that play?

        "Ripped off by your insurance company?"

        Ha!

        But that's runnin' stuff backwards.

        Brief comes first, an' before yr through para 1, lions roar, airplanes fly, hunks flash meat, all kindsa stuff wings in on a prompt.

        So you drop 'em in a pit an' watch 'em fight it out.

        Some broad idea always wins out, some image to hang the story on.

        That usually happens when I'm tidying stuff or shopping for pizza, an' I jot down phrases, an' build it up till it makes sense an' hangs together, an' tweaks on whatever CW Fs illuminate or dim the point needs makin'.

        Then the client says, "hey this is a pile of crap" an' I go kick a dog.

        Experiment: go find a bird right now.

        Outta the window, Google, book.

        Whatever project you're workin' on, throw it up big in your mind's eye, then hit on the bird.

        Some of 'em sing real lousy but none stay truly silent.

        Tucked away under the squawk gonna be a flicker of an image, the visual writhing of sumthin' plus sumthin', same as if you saw the bird anyhoo, without me askin' ya.

        But now I told you to go see the bird, dropped her onya after alla this alla this writin' (finished in a minnow, an' mebbe what I oughta be doin' is sum' genuwhine hooverin insteada honeyspoonin' the fat gal of my procrastination/diligence) I figure it might sing somethin' different to the anyhoo bird, an' mebbe you'll see more of the image flicker now I've suggested ur gonna see sumthin'.

        It's an accidental image drop, but also kinda deliberate.

        If it sparks your project on some, I wld truly love that.
        I don't know if I need some sleep or something, but my brain hurts from reading this......
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  • You know what, (given time to let it settle and blend) I'm glad I asked.

    Thanks PB.


    Steve
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    • Originally Posted by Steve The Copywriter View Post

      Thanks PB.
      Hey, you asked real nice & I am a sucker.
      Signature

      Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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  • Before these threads conk out with a natural euthanasia (unless Princess B gives them the occasional adrenaline shot).

    Here's another reason why Formula's are good.

    You're suffering from blank screenitis and the normal remedy is to type like a fiend and then edit like a mad axeman/woman.

    But if you pick a formula that "fits" your assignment - the rabbiting of words does become a dash more coherent and meaningful.

    In a nutshell? - Formula's give you a turbo charged directional jump start.


    Steve
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    • Originally Posted by Steve The Copywriter View Post

      In a nutshell? - Formula's give you a turbo charged jump start.
      Steve
      Gotta figure Sylvia Plath mighta become a great life insurance saleswoman if she hadn't fallen foul of the villanelle.

      Not sure about the adrenaline -- dispenser in the kitchen broke last week an' the guy can't come fix it till next Thursday.
      Signature

      Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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  • Might not make it to thread 20 then (sobs)


    Steve
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  • Yeah, that's a total bummer.

    What we gonna do to fix it?
    Signature

    Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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  • No idea, I'm still in despair…

    But look it's a done deal.

    Close the thread - my work is complete.


    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author splitTest
    Thanks Steve.

    Bob Bly also has an e-book of copy formulas. (See www.copyformulas.com.) Anyone tried it?

    I was thinking of getting it, until this thread. Saved me a few bucks.
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  • Split,

    Technically the threads have ended (lol).

    However, Bob stuff is usually worth a read - chances are a lot of the formulas in his book are mentioned.

    But he may have unearthed a few more good ones. For $29.00 it might be worth it.


    Steve
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  • Nicetiga,

    I'm sure you know, by choosing an appropriate formula you can light up, what might have been a rather formal somewhat black and white technical report into a vivid technicolor masterpiece.

    Bringing real life (maybe with a little singing and dancing) into the information and specs creating all the emotional and logical impact you want.

    Some readers might be a little stunned while most are truly enthralled.


    Steve
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  • You are in big trouble if you use any "formula" and splatter it with poor, inadequate and lacklustre words.

    A formula is only a "guide" - pick the right one and then add ALL the correct copy, persuasion and selling techniques.

    It's a bit like a satnav, you can't blindly follow the directions, you need to be in full control of the car.


    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author Oziboomer
    For those that didn't tune into Joanna live back in March here's the link....

    http://www.warriorforum.com/war-room...snap-copy.html

    I enjoyed the personality that Jo brought to the conversation.

    Formulas are one thing but success is another and there is no denying there is some success that is going on.
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  • Quote - You are back to mechanics and word play - End Quote


    With a push and a shove that could be the definition of a copywriter.


    Steve
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    • Shapeshiftin' angels milkin' paradise to order has a cool ring to it also.
      Signature

      Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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  • It is quite catchy…

    If it was a lyric which band would you choose to play it?
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    • I figure Eat Skull have the appropriate lyrical edge, not to mention the "mass appeal" factor.

      srsly, mood music is as sneaky a fit as words or images.

      Wrong song = wrong message.

      Blurred Lines never gonna sell a bank in a TV ad (yet).

      Figurin' the right music to sell a bank is more pulsey than formulaic, an' mebbe words have the same power to hit on heart.

      This don't mean formulums are bad, but like you said earlier, they gotta enable rather than restrict, like the squirt of icin' spellin' LUVYA on a birthday cake vs the the equally hoopy lasso throttlin' ur brain of oxygen.

      Sounds obvious when u smack out the scale all big, but down dirty on the page the lines get kinda blurred sometimes an' the mechanics can show thru too easy.

      The oscillatorials between formulum an' pulse can mebbe prise those tricko lines apart -- for me, at least.

      (Dunno whether I've resurrected a post here or merely slid a flippant katana along the stomach of a beached whale, but yeh, that angel line should mebbe go in a song.)
      Signature

      Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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  • Profile picture of the author daveshu
    I think the problem that 99.9% of people here have, is that they are all into looking for magic formulas instead of looking at the client, or even better, the end user - the person who actually spends their money.

    Try to jam an idea into a formula and you'll miss the very person who might buy your product.

    Focus on the end user with money to spend, and what they want, need, and desire, and the "formula" will sort itself out - if you know what you're doing.

    In other words, don't try to put the cart before the horse.
    Signature

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  • You are so right there is no absolute, always a winner, never fails "magic formula"

    The exception? - when a promo hits the stratosphere with sales you could say that "formula" with everything in it was magic.

    Anyway...

    Yes, the customer always come first.

    No great harm in using the best formula to help achieve this.

    Again disaster beckons if anyone feels that a "formula" is the road to untold riches and copywriting nirvana.

    Because it depends on 1079 - give or take - other vital factors.

    I prefer to say that any Ad must have a "structure" (to keep it on track).

    Which is exactly the same as a "formula"

    "Structure" tends to avoid any misconceptions, misunderstandings and endless - use one - don't use one - debates.

    And you can analyse any Ad - and good or bad you will always find a structure.

    And a formula.


    Steve
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