Read some books. Want to learn more.

by mosd
43 replies
So I've read a couple of books and some of them 2 times.

I still feel that I can't provide value for my clients regarding copywriting.

Does anyone know a good source where you can get lessons each day? Like today do this, tomorrow this and so on.

Grateful for all tips
#books #learn #read
  • Profile picture of the author TjarkHartmann
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    • Profile picture of the author mosd
      Originally Posted by TjarkHartmann View Post

      thanks! Is it really necessary to read over 1000 back covers?

      Or do you mean writing the ads by hand?
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      • Profile picture of the author sethczerepak
        Originally Posted by mosd View Post

        thanks! Is it really necessary to read over 1000 back covers?
        Of course not. But it's also not necessary to make six or seven figures a year. You can survive just fine on $20k.

        What you want shouldn't be bigger than what you're willing to do for it.
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        • Profile picture of the author Raydal
          Originally Posted by sethczerepak View Post

          Of course not. But it's also not necessary to make six or seven figures a year. You can survive just fine on $20k.

          What you want shouldn't be bigger than what you're willing to do for it.
          Somehow, some people have the impression that if you are reading books
          you are not writing copy. It is either you are learning or doing, but you
          can't do both. I bought and read two books last week and I'm reading my third
          this week that came in the mail last Friday.

          -Ray Edwards
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          The most powerful and concentrated copywriting training online today bar none! Autoresponder Writing Email SECRETS
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          • Readin' is cool, but it is not the only source of info.

            Plus you gotta figure how there are plenty of people who read loadsa stuff without it appearin' to have any practical impact on 'em.

            So I figure you gotta hoover up all available info an' be prepared to get down dirty an' transformational even if all you find are scraps.
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          • Profile picture of the author angiecolee
            Originally Posted by Raydal View Post

            Somehow, some people have the impression that if you are reading books
            you are not writing copy. It is either you are learning or doing, but you
            can't do both. I bought and read two books last week and I'm reading my third
            this week that came in the mail last Friday.

            -Ray Edwards
            Eh, I only make that assumption when it's spelled out, as in this thread when the OP asked how to start writing several times.

            Now he (she?) has indicated the writing has commenced. Next stop: figuring out how to sell the ever-loving shit out of it.
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  • Profile picture of the author angiecolee
    1) Learn every day. Be a voracious learner. Picking and choosing what to learn based on convenience of structure can be a detriment. Set your own lessons, or find a mentor/course that matches what you feel you need.

    2) Apply every day. Write something. That's what writers do. Let it sit and analyze it a few days later, perhaps compare to a control piece or other strong sales collateral. What's different? What's similar? What can you change to do better next time?

    There's more than one way to learn. And if you want to be truly successful, you won't dismiss things that are more difficult.
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    • Profile picture of the author mosd
      Originally Posted by angiecolee View Post

      1) Learn every day. Be a voracious learner. Picking and choosing what to learn based on convenience of structure can be a detriment. Set your own lessons, or find a mentor/course that matches what you feel you need.

      2) Apply every day. Write something. That's what writers do. Let it sit and analyze it a few days later, perhaps compare to a control piece or other strong sales collateral. What's different? What's similar? What can you change to do better next time?

      There's more than one way to learn. And if you want to be truly successful, you won't dismiss things that are more difficult.
      Thanks so much! When you say learn every day, how do I learn every day? Reading?

      And about applying do you mean apply to jobs?

      Sometimes i feel lost and had enough of reading and want to start writing.
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      • Profile picture of the author angiecolee
        Originally Posted by mosd View Post

        Thanks so much! When you say learn every day, how do I learn every day? Reading?

        And about applying do you mean apply to jobs?

        Sometimes i feel lost and had enough of reading and want to start writing.
        Read, learn, seek knowledge every day. It doesn't matter HOW you learn. There are videos, podcasts, books, magazines, documentaries, websites, and SO much more in terms of information. Find something recommended by someone you admire/aspire to be like and start there. Then find another thing and keep going.

        I do not mean apply to jobs. I mean apply your knowledge to WRITING SOMETHING. If you want to be a copywriter, you need to WRITE. You need to force those thoughts swirling around in your head to come out through your pen/fingertips. You'll never get anything out of all the learning if you don't make yourself apply the learnings to the work.
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    • Profile picture of the author gjabiz
      Originally Posted by angiecolee View Post

      1)
      There's more than one way to learn. And if you want to be truly successful you won't dismiss things that are more difficult. (In fact, you embrace them-gja)
      I'm very picky with my selection of "students", maybe some of these tactics will help you (or not).

      I give an assignment first thing, write copy for one of my existing products. Should be for sale in no longer than a week. I'll drive traffic to it, the student keeps all the money.

      But, they have to embrace the immersion, hit the ball, DO it method.
      They need a web site.
      An auto-responder.

      I give them the first couple of products, a low end, and a higher priced one.

      They learn by doing. I only take on students who want to develop their own products, and follow a tested and proven method.

      Product for sale.
      PROSPECTS and a way to get them to their promotion.
      They accept the money, fulfill, and we build things out from there.

      As has been written a gazillion times, you could simply find a product at Clickbank and get permission to use your own copy to drive traffic to your offer and they fufill.

      Just MY opinion, people learn faster, get better feedback, and become better quicker while DOING and actually SELLING something, along with their studies of the masters, old and new. Serious students want to study, they can't get enough.

      Those who just want to get the golden egg, while not doing much, I refer them to AWAI or some place else.

      SELL something.

      And if you lack sales experience, a few hours a week of outside selling, anything anywhere, will give you a boost of confidence too.

      WRITE daily, but write to sell.

      gjabiz
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      • Profile picture of the author mosd
        Originally Posted by gjabiz View Post

        I'm very picky with my selection of "students", maybe some of these tactics will help you (or not).

        I give an assignment first thing, write copy for one of my existing products. Should be for sale in no longer than a week. I'll drive traffic to it, the student keeps all the money.

        But, they have to embrace the immersion, hit the ball, DO it method.
        They need a web site.
        An auto-responder.

        I give them the first couple of products, a low end, and a higher priced one.

        They learn by doing. I only take on students who want to develop their own products and follow a tested and proven method.

        Product for sale.
        PROSPECTS and a way to get them to their promotion.
        They accept the money, fulfill, and we build things out from there.

        As has been written a gazillion times, you could simply find a product at Clickbank and get permission to use your own copy to drive traffic to your offer and them fulfill.

        Just MY opinion, people learn faster, get better feedback, and become better quicker while DOING and actually SELLING something, along with their studies of the masters, old and new. Serious students want to study, they can't get enough.

        Those who just want to get the golden egg, while not doing much, I refer them to AWAI or some place else.

        SELL something.

        And if you lack sales experience, a few hours a week of outside selling, anything anywhere, will give you a boost of confidence too.

        WRITE daily, but write to sell.

        gjabiz
        I think this is the way to go for me.

        Will pick one or more products and start a blog for each product. Will try to sell this product and use my copy to do this.

        But, I don't know how to drive traffic?

        Let's say I write amazing copy to good products, how will my blog be found by customers?
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        • Profile picture of the author angiecolee
          Originally Posted by mosd View Post

          I think this is the way to go for me.

          Will pick one or more products and start a blog for each product. Will try to sell this product and use my copy to do this.

          But, I don't know how to drive traffic?

          Let's say I write amazing copy to good products, how will my blog be found by customers?
          One step at a time. If you haven't started writing yet and you're already worrying about traffic, this is never going to work.

          Put your butt in the chair and write. Otherwise you're not a writer, copy or otherwise. It's really that simple.
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          • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
            To add to Angie, more money is exchanged offline than online,
            therefore you don't need to worry about traffic.

            You know who you want to get your message in front of and send it
            in the mail.

            Like this quick ugly, but effective, one I whipped up for my friend...



            My friend comes up with digital agencies listed in Google Local
            and grabs their postal address and send the black ink on white 4 x 6 postcard.

            Soo much simpler than online marketing
            and in most cases more effective because the customer gained offline
            spends more than those gotten online.

            Best,
            Doctor E. Vile
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            • Profile picture of the author mosd
              Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

              To add to Angie, more money is exchanged offline than online,
              therefore you don't need to worry about traffic.

              You know who you want to get your message in front of and send it
              in the mail.

              Like this quick ugly but effective one I whipped up for my friend...



              My friend comes up with digital agencies listed in Google Local
              and grabs their postal address and send the black ink on white 4 x 6 postcard.

              Soo much simpler than online marketing
              and in most cases more effective because the customer gained offline
              spends more than those gotten online.

              Best,
              Doctor E. Vile
              Maybe I'm little slow but i didn't understand this. What exactly are you doing?
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              • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
                Originally Posted by mosd View Post

                Maybe I'm little slow but i didn't understand this. What exactly are you doing?
                And I don't understand your question.

                Best,
                Doctor E. Vile
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              • Profile picture of the author 1Bryan
                Originally Posted by mosd View Post

                Maybe I'm little slow but i didn't understand this. What exactly are you doing?
                He's showing you where MOST of the opportunity really is.
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                • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
                  Originally Posted by 1Bryan View Post

                  He's showing you where MOST of the opportunity really is.
                  His actions show he has an employee mentality
                  which requires instruction every step of the way.

                  A highly motivated entrepreneur would
                  find the way.

                  Best,
                  Doctor E. Vile
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      • Profile picture of the author 1Bryan
        Originally Posted by gjabiz View Post


        SELL something.

        And if you lack sales experience, a few hours a week of outside selling, anything anywhere, will give you a boost of confidence too.

        WRITE daily, but write to sell.
        I had to quote this.
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  • Profile picture of the author Julie McCogan
    i would like to read new books also
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  • 3 Books for you.

    But you must read them in order -

    How To Write A Good Advertisement - Victor Schwab (all the basics - fully covered - and then some - including 100 of the greatest headlines ever written - under $20.00)

    Tested Advertising Methods - John Caples (a legendary copywriter clearly explaining his unique and proven techniques with copies of his Ads - they always say get the 4th edition - don't fret too much if you can't - under $10.00 for the 5th edition)

    Breakthrough Advertising - Eugene Schwartz (super advanced and utterly indispensable material - you'll know astonishing stuff that most others don't - but despite being written by a truly amazing copywriter - it is a tough read - when you've read it 3 times award yourself a "Masters Degree in Copywriting & Marketing" - costs around $100 but worth at least $50,000 plus)


    Plough through these and you WILL discover if copywriting is your destiny.


    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author mosd
      Originally Posted by Steve The Copywriter View Post

      3 Books for you.

      But you must read them in order -

      How To Write A Good Advertisement - Victor Schwab (all the basics - fully covered - and then some - including 100 of the greatest headlines ever written - under $20.00)

      Tested Advertising Methods - John Caples (a legendary copywriter clearly explaining his unique and proven techniques with copies of his Ads - they always say get the 4th edition - don't fret too much if you can't - under $10.00 for the 5th edition)

      Breakthrough Advertising - Eugene Schwartz (super advanced and utterly indispensable material - you'll know astonishing stuff that most others don't - but despite being written by a truly amazing copywriter - it is a tough read - when you've read it 3 times award yourself a "Masters Degree in Copywriting & Marketing" - costs around $100 but worth at least $50,000 plus)


      Plough through these and you WILL discover if copywriting is your destiny.


      Steve

      Actually I've read these 3 books, but also Robert Collier letter book and cashvertising. I feel that I know the techniques but don't know how to apply them.

      I need to start writing!
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  • Well, I once read a book on car mechanics.

    Or I thought I did.

    I opened up the hood looked at the engine and had no idea what I was supposed to do.

    The answer?

    I had to read the book again and again.


    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author mosd
      Originally Posted by Steve The Copywriter View Post

      Well, I once read a book on car mechanics.

      Or I thought I did.

      I opened up the hood looked at the engine and had no idea what I was supposed to do.

      The answer?

      I had to read the book again and again.


      Steve
      at that time you opened the hood, thats what i need to do. To start writing! How i dont know.

      Should i buy the stopwatch course?
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      • Profile picture of the author angiecolee
        Originally Posted by mosd View Post

        at that time you opened the hood, thats what i need to do. To start writing! How i dont know.

        Should i buy the stopwatch course?
        Open up a word document on the computer or grab a piece of paper and a pen.

        You do not need another course to teach you how to write. You need to write.
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      • Profile picture of the author gjabiz
        Originally Posted by mosd View Post

        at that time you opened the hood, thats what i need to do. To start writing! How i dont know.

        Should i buy the stopwatch course?
        You don't have what it takes to be a copywriter.

        How does that make you feel? Did you bristle or have a knee jerk reaction?

        Or, does it hit close to home? You've been given several ideas over a few days now, and, still you haven't written anything.

        Writer's Write.

        If you aren't writing, then you need to call yourself a Copythinker. Think all you want. Unless you are a one man Think Tank (and they do exist)...you seldom get paid for your thoughts on copy writing, experienced writers are the exception.

        The stall, the "don't know what to do next" whine is all BS. Start writing today.

        Here is a WF project for you to write on...

        Write about the WF and if it has value, and why someone should come here and visit.

        Create a Headline, sub heads if needed and just the body opening.

        The Secret to Getting the Most from Your Warrior Forum Visits
        Noob Discovers Hidden Treasure at Warrior Forum

        Are you new to the WF? It can be confusing and overwhelming. I know, it happened to me.

        But once I discovered the secret method used by the very best marketers at the WF, my IM went through the roof.

        Quit whining and start writing, prove me wrong and I'll eat crow, but, I don't think you have what it takes.

        gjabiz
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  • Profile picture of the author kimanierick
    dont waste your time reading hundreds of books on how to do it. Remember they are also in business and will tell you anything. You understand yourself better. Just decide to do it, have confidence and deliver. You learn best while you are doing it practically. You might find out that whatever you just needed was confidence/ Thanks and all the best
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  • Could this be the pain barrier problem?

    Oh noooo, it's just so agonising opening a word document and trying to start typing.

    And yes the first to tenth draft is f****** painful to look at.

    Then you improve and edit it 28 times and suddenly you realise you may have written something...

    …that might be worth reading.

    Welcome to the wonderful world of copywriting.


    Steve
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  • Here's somethin' you can do right now.

    Take gjb's 227 words from thread #17, an' reduce 'em down to 150.

    He's got some punch in there, but with more time I betcha you could crisp it up some.

    This will force you to make choices.

    The raw material is here, an' you don't have to think about what to say right out.

    All you gotta do is revise it.

    When you're done, cut to 100.

    Then 50.

    What's the message here? What's the essence?

    When you're down to one word (an' I figure it's write!), then record your thoughts about what you jus' did.

    What words you chose to keep, what words you cut out, an' anythin' else struck you.

    Cell phones take dictation, so jus' ramble on all you like.

    Gonna be a frickin' mess, but if ur a writer, then you'll have sumthin' to say.

    Play it back, write it down, word for word.

    Gonna be gibberish spruced with the occasional lucid moment, all served up in a pot of chaos.

    But if you edit down to 3/4, you'll find the essence, clarify your points.

    Reduce again, an' you plumb the depths of your own wisdom.

    That's when the fun starts.

    Pick a mid-range edit an' throw in an emotion.

    Prolly what you'll have is a kinda neutral account of what you did, so mebbe you could angry it up.

    Or try bliss, sadness, euphoria.

    Be as ham acto as you like, jus' to see what you gotta do to make the original words sing through this kinda feely filter.

    Mebbe when you go back to your originals, you'll see a bias you never saw the first time.

    Read some other stuff an' you'll get a feel for the undercurrents.

    Chew on ad copy an' keep a check on your pulse.

    Ask why so little of it is neutral.

    Are there tricks in there you jus' figured for yourself by experiment?

    You gotta be fearless in alla this.

    Commit sumthin' to paper, whatever.

    Good or bad, it's information, brain food, an' the more you have, the better choices you can make.

    (This is 350 btw, an' it is so ultra rambly I am ashamed. But I am kinda dictatin' to fingers here.)
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  • Profile picture of the author angiecolee
    GJA, Steve, and Balestra have phenomenal points.

    I tell you just to write because that's how you find out if writing is for you. Studying will never tell you how to be a better writer. Writing will.

    You'll never know if you can swim if you don't get in the water. You can rattle off all the latest and greatest swim strokes/techniques, and all the relevant facts about buoyancy and body mass/composition. But CAN YOU SWIM? It's time to get in the water, man. You're not going to know until you try.

    And rather than failing (which appears to be what is making you hesitant), you might surprise the hell out of yourself. Reading is not writing. Studying is not writing. Writing is writing - get on it, son.
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    • Profile picture of the author onehalf
      Originally Posted by angiecolee View Post

      GJA, Steve, and Balestra have phenomenal points.

      I tell you just to write because that's how you find out if writing is for you. Studying will never tell you how to be a better writer. Writing will.

      You'll never know if you can swim if you don't get in the water. You can rattle off all the latest and greatest swim strokes/techniques, and all the relevant facts about buoyancy and body mass/composition. But CAN YOU SWIM? It's time to get in the water, man. You're not going to know until you try.

      And rather than failing (which appears to be what is making you hesitant), you might surprise the hell out of yourself. Reading is not writing. Studying is not writing. Writing is writing - get on it, son.
      I completely agree with angiecolee. Studying and learning concepts and basic principles in copywriting are useless if you will not put them into practice. Experience is the best teacher.
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  • Profile picture of the author mosd
    posted something but seems it didn't get registered. But thanks for your answers, i will start writing.

    will write on existing products. By hand write down some good sales letters and try to identify why and what technique is used. Also try to get some jobs on Fiverr to start writing.
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  • Profile picture of the author dcfitz
    There are some very good suggestions by these Warriors, Start reading, learning everything you can find about something you like. Begin writing about what you like, find out what people are asking, find answers and write. Write in detail, give your writing, substance, no fluff. You will find writing will become easier, because you will begin to understand the subject. Than just rinse and repeat, find another subject and product.
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  • Profile picture of the author mosd
    Thank you very much for your answers. I've been writing almost every day. Even if just some sentences, I try to write every day. But sometimes I feel like: How do I know I'm writing something good?

    That's why I thought it was a good idea to listen to Gjabiz tips to start a blog and start selling.
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  • Profile picture of the author joncoates89
    Originally Posted by mosd View Post

    So I've read a couple of books and some of them 2 times.

    I still feel that I can't provide value for my clients regarding copywriting.

    Does anyone know a good source where you can get lessons each day? Like today do this, tomorrow this and so on.

    Grateful for all tips
    I would most definitely try applying what you have learned from those books into a daily routine my find first over a period of time. The fast you temper that knowledge into the fires of experience the better
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  • Profile picture of the author Tomas Lodén
    Check out the The Gary Halbert Letters and 10 top tips for being a successful copywriter. You can find links to these resources in my sig below..
    Signature
    6-fig affiliate marketer since 2003
    Free coaching to your first $100 dollars. DM me now..
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  • Profile picture of the author Minds Eye
    Fact is most of us who are copywriters started out not knowing a lot about the HOW. But, through a lot of effort - and more failure than success, we BECAME better. Not by reading, but by doing. Was my first promo a huge success? Nope. But my second one was better than the first. Because after I actually WROTE SOMETHING, I learned things I hadn't from READING.
    I learned about cadence. I learned about the proper use of repetition, I learned about voice. All those things a book couldn't really teach me came to me from the writing process.
    We all want to have written something, but the process of writing requires real work. Thinking. Stringing words together. Scratching out some of those words and finding better ones. Thinking some more.

    “There's nothing to writing. All you do is sit down at a typewriter and open a vein.”
    - Ernest Hemingway
    Signature

    A powerful perspective on persuasion

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    • Originally Posted by Minds Eye View Post

      "There's nothing to writing. All you do is sit down at a typewriter and open a vein."
      - Ernest Hemingway
      With a view to squirt a direct hit on the uvula of a beguiled vampire.

      Also: frickin' artery, dimwit.

      (I do not wish to diminish Hemingway's talent here - jus' singlin' him out for an errant metaphor.)
      Signature

      Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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  • Profile picture of the author Exsolution
    Copywriting is not an inherent skill, it is slowly gained through sustained effort. In this case, the effort is to digest lots of books; not only books but everything that has any literary value...even a twitter comment.
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  • Profile picture of the author zobairi
    ok. thanks everybody
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  • Profile picture of the author DougBarger
    Mosd's Assigment (Due 11:59pm CST Dec 29, 2015)

    This is a self-directed course so you are free to complete each question at your own pace,
    however the Dec 29 due date is a hard deadline and your assignment will not be credited if
    you are even one minute late, so make life easier for yourself and get started early. Life
    happens to all of us so unexpected delays will happen. It is your responsibility to prepare
    for these and to complete your assignment before the deadline on the due date.

    Mosd, The warriors you've read from so far are right on the money with their advice answering your question.

    Obviously you can't depend on others to spoon feed you the ability to produce a high conversion rate without at least coming to the dinner table with your hands washed and ready to eat.

    With that said, I'll help you get started.


    Mosd's Daily Assignment

    Today: Identify your target market.

    Who will read your copy?

    What do they want?

    What is their biggest problem?

    How can your product or service help them solve their problem and give them what they want?

    How can you find out what they'd be willing to spend to solve this problem?

    Where exactly is this information located and how can you find a way to access it?

    Is there an existing market demand?

    Are people spending money on products or services to solve this problem already?

    How do you know?

    Who else sells a solution to their problem?

    How exactly will you solve their problem better?

    Create your offer.

    What exactly are you offering?

    What exactly does your customer get?

    What exactly do they have to pay to get it?

    What else must they do to claim your offer?

    How can you make what they get more valuable?

    How can you make what they must do to claim it seem much less than the value they get?

    Why should they buy from you instead of someone else?

    Why should they buy from you right now instead of later?

    Now that you have written the answers to these last two questions above,
    how should you reword your offer to make the importance of buying from
    you right now instead of anyone else (or later) clear?

    When you have completed your first daily assignment by the deadline,
    meaning each question is answered completely to the best of your ability,
    make a post here in this thread and you will get instructions for your
    next assignment.
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    • Profile picture of the author redmelon
      Originally Posted by DougBarger View Post

      Mosd's Assigment (Due 11:59pm CST Dec 29, 2015)


      Mosd's Daily Assignment

      Today: Identify your target market.

      Who will read your copy?

      What do they want?

      What is their biggest problem?

      How can your product or service help them solve their problem and give them what they want?

      How can you find out what they'd be willing to spend to solve this problem?

      Where exactly is this information located and how can you find a way to access it?

      Is there an existing market demand?

      Are people spending money on products or services to solve this problem already?

      How do you know?

      Who else sells a solution to their problem?

      How exactly will you solve their problem better?

      Create your offer.

      What exactly are you offering?

      What exactly does your customer get?

      What exactly do they have to pay to get it?

      What else must they do to claim your offer?

      How can you make what they get more valuable?

      How can you make what they must do to claim it seem much less than the value they get?

      Why should they buy from you instead of someone else?

      Why should they buy from you right now instead of later?

      Now that you have written the answers to these last two questions above,
      how should you reword your offer to make the importance of buying from
      you right now instead of anyone else (or later) clear?

      When you have completed your first daily assignment by the deadline,
      meaning each question is answered completely to the best of your ability,
      make a post here in this thread and you will get instructions for your
      next assignment.
      Good post! These are very helpful and neccessary for newbies
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  • Profile picture of the author SL1
    I suggest you check out: https://copyhour.com/ (no affiliate link)... great resource for step by step copywriting training.
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