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What copywriting coaching program(s) would you recommend?

by RogozRazvan
5 replies
Hello,

I would love some recommendation of a few top notch copywriting coaching courses. I am not a new copywriter but I want to take it to the next level, as I've reached a point where studying from passive sources (like books and video courses) brings me only marginal returns. While I have read many books (around 30 so far, on copywriting), I can testify that 80% of my skill came from being mentored by a top copywriter. However, that was a long, long time ago.

This means learning from someone who is way better than me. Ryan Healy used to have a very good course and one of my friends attended it with good results. Last time I've contacted him, this course was put on hold. I'm looking now at the course from Paul Hancox. I've also heard a lot of good things about Vin Montello.

As far as price is concerned, I don't know exactly how much I want to invest, most likely in the $1000 to $5000 range. A friend invested $1000 per month for coaching a few years ago and now he is earning a monthly five figure sum thanks to it (and ofc, thanks to his own hard work). Right now I'm stuck in the realm of "good but not good enough". I don't think that it comes down to learning more as it is about unlearning some bad habits about writing copy.

The course can be online or even in person. I'm willing to relocate in most parts of the world as long as the experience is worth it (plus, a change of environment would be welcomed) The most obvious choice would be AWAI but I'd like to hear other recommendations too.

The ideal case would be to pay around $1000/month then enter an apprenticeship for a few months or even years. In this manner, I can continue my education while improving my skills.

As a last note, I've been keeping a "R&D" budget for a while, for books, seminars and such but it is time to step it up. I would have to be a real moron not to get at least $2 for every $1 invested in improving my skills. It is a shame that it took me so long to realize exactly where I should invest my money to get the highest ROI.

Thank you,
Razvan
#coaching #copywriting #program #recommend
  • Profile picture of the author Oziboomer
    Hi Razvan,

    I've got nothing against mentors or coaches and I've been mentored and coached in a variety of skills that are outside of copywriting.

    You say 80% of your results have come through some mentoring a long time ago.

    Now...you could get some good mentor.

    But if you have got $1K - 5K plus to invest why not invest in marketing to get some more clients.

    Nothing like some additional grindstone burn to help with skill improvement.

    Working in any field towards a goal does tend to help produce improvements.

    As for advanced mentoring what specifically do you expect to achieve?

    Where do you see your weaknesses that could be improved?

    Are your needs more for technical aspects or psychological improvement?

    Best regards,

    Ozi
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    • Profile picture of the author MikeHumphreys
      (Full Disclosure: I do copywriting mentor on a very selective basis)

      Razvan,

      At the end of the day, you need to decide which route is the best one for you to take.

      If you're looking for a copywriting course (self-study), then the best one I've seen to date is Clayton Makepeace's QuickStart Copywriting System. You can get it through Clayton's website or the AWAI one.

      If you're looking for a mentor, then there's a few threads on this forum which discuss some of the different copywriting mentors that other copywriters have used or would recommend. You can find them in this awesome sticky: http://www.warriorforum.com/copywrit...pywriters.html

      I'd highly recommend interviewing each copywriting mentor you're considering, even if it's by email. Find out how they mentor... Find out what areas they feel they can help elevate your skills.

      Hope that helps,

      Mike
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      Kickstart Your Copywriting Business: How To Get Loads of New Clients FAST!

      Kick-A$$ Eight-Figure Producing Copywriting Gun For Hire | Marketing & Copywriting Blog
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      • Profile picture of the author RogozRazvan
        @Oziboomer - I don’t need more clients. I need better results for my clients. It is a difference. My focus is on maximizing lifetime value per person and not in volume.

        Yes, I do need a mentor but a mentor is not something you find on ClickBank.com. My mentor in the past was someone that I actually met, spent time with, drank a beer or ten with, discussed and generally, spent countless hours both as a trainee and as a friend. That’s something rather hard to find online.

        A coach is simply a person who is better than me and he’ll give me his time and I’ll give him money for his time. If a friendship is possible, all the better, but I do have very different definitions between a coach and a mentor.

        I have formed some really bad habits when writing copy. The fact that English is not my first language doesn’t bother me nor does it bother anyone else. I tend to overcomplicate things, talk down to my prospect sometimes, make the copy a bit too complex and generally, the general advice I get from clients is “simplify the damn thing”.

        From a technical point of view, my copywriting is solid. Not top notch but solid. I have achieved this by systematically studying the masters and developing SOP (standard operating procedures) for most things. However, too often I write copy that is appealing to me and not to the target market. It still achieves results but it wouldn’t hurt to get back to the basics for a while.

        I’ve noticed that sometimes, copywriters that sell their copy for $200 actually write some parts better than I do. They do fail on making an appealing case but they do keep it simple. Knowing too much copywriting theory can actually be a disadvantage.

        Thank you for your thoughts, they are very useful and your last question made me wonder what exactly I want in a coach.

        @Mike - I do have the program from Makepeace, bought it off eBay. I’ve actually studied it, from the first page up to the last one (1084 I think). It is full of notes on the side and pencil marks. I don’t know why but writing copy in a step-by-step manner simply doesn’t work for me. I’ve tried it. I’ve actually tried it several times.

        In the end, each section sounds great but it feels disconnected from the others. The last time I’ve wrote copy under this format, I ended up using it as a general outline and actually started rewriting the copy in a more organic fashion.

        To both of you - it feels like sometimes I’m missing the most obvious and simplest part of the copy. Like I know how to write 10 different guarantees but I do miss a basic thing, one that you learn in day one of copywriting, like keeping your lead short, to the point, appealing and with the purpose of building momentum.

        I'm trying a bit too much to be fancy, to have style over function that I forget the basic rule in copywriting. Sell the damn thing.

        Mike, if I may ask - is the program in your signature your only one?

        Best regards,
        Razvan
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        • Profile picture of the author gjabiz
          Originally Posted by RogozRazvan View Post

          However, too often I write copy that is appealing to me and not to the target market.

          To both of you - it feels like sometimes I’m missing the most obvious and simplest part of the copy.

          Razvan
          Are you missing the REASON why you are writing that piece of copy to that particular person?

          I've been told my coaching is the hardest thing out there because I won't read a single word of copy until I know exactly who the target market is and the reason why this person has been chosen. It apparently is a difficult thing to do,
          for many average and/or beginning copywriters to do.

          Just as the map is not the territory, the LIST or name is NOT the person.

          If you get this, then you could have an Ah Ha moment.

          Sitting at Union Square in San Francisco and looking at a map, and planning a walk to Sutro Hts Pk. looks like a short distance as the crow flies. Then start walking up and down, and it is a harder task than it looked.

          Before you invest in any coaching, review your materials and on a separate piece of paper create a PictoGrigm of

          UNDERSTANDING

          the PERSON

          you are writing copy for.

          Maybe this will help, or not.

          PictoGrigm of Remote Persuasion

          Writing to a person you KNOW is one key and is different than writing to a person in a group.

          gjabiz
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  • Profile picture of the author Raydal
    I have a one on one program that may fit your need. You can review
    and let me know if this works for you.

    -Ray Edwards
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    The most powerful and concentrated copywriting training online today bar none! Autoresponder Writing Email SECRETS
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