are you a copy-writer or an article writer?

15 years ago

"You don't necessarily need to be that much of a good writer to write good copy. But you need to really understand the human psychology and how our desires work."

HUH??? Writing great copy is very much like writing poetry. Every word must speak directly to the ideal prospects - and not get in the way of the message. Takes a great deal of work and many visits to the Thesaurus to get things right!

Copywriters must be able to use the prospect's wordings, the prospect's imagery. This takes considerable research, skill as well as a good understanding of "the human psychology and how our desires work".

The great copywriters make this seem easy. That's because they can find the precise word you'd use to say what they're communicating!

The best copywriting is where the words don't get in the way of the message.

Never underestimate the high degree of skill this requires!

Dot

Thanks
2 replies

Signature

"Sell the Magic of A Dream"
www.DP-Copywriting-Service.com

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[258312].message }}

Anita Ashland 15 years ago

You're right, Dot. Writing copy is like writing poetry; especially when writing email copy, where space is more limited.

A copywriter has to have good writing skills, there's no way around that, plus the understanding of persuasion and psychology. A copywriter is also like a chameleon and has to take on other people's personas while writing.
- [ 1 ] Thanks
Signature

At last...pre-written emails for Clickbank products that increase conversions.

Need smokin' hot email copy? www.AnitaAshland.com
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[258410].message }}

Li Weng

15 years ago

Originally Posted by dorothydot

"You don't necessarily need to be that much of a good writer to write good copy. But you need to really understand the human psychology and how our desires work."

HUH??? Writing great copy is very much like writing poetry. Every word must speak directly to the ideal prospects - and not get in the way of the message. Takes a great deal of work and many visits to the Thesaurus to get things right!

What I really meant was that you don't need to have the expressive skills of a book writer to do copywriter. You can use very simple words and grammar and still write effective copy.

Thanks

Signature

- Insert backlink here -

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[261310].message }}

Christie Love

15 years ago

You are right Anita. Although a copywriter needs to have good writing skills, an article writer doesn't.

I like to define myself as a ghostwriter because I provide an array of different writing services to my clients.

But, if i had to choose one, I would definitely choose...copywriter.

Thanks

Signature

***Protect Yourself from Internet ID Theft***
Get your Free Identity Theft Report
'A' rated company with the BBB.

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[258631].message }}

Cherilyn Woodhouse

15 years ago

I am a copywriter, as I don't write articles. If I were to write an article, it would be a marketing piece designed and optimized to drive traffic & entice your visitors - not an "article".

- Cherilyn

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Take your product from idea to profit in less than 90 days! Work with me to develop and implement a step-by-step plan for success!

Coaching & Consulting @ BCWebMedia.com

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[258638].message }}

DavidJohnson 15 years ago

I'm a writer, clear and simple. If I were to classify the type of writer I am I would say something along the lines of a copywriter because I enjoy persuasive writing. I have written fiction and non-fiction, articles and persuasive ads, blog posts and catalog copy.

Some of the best clients I have started out as writing articles because I can tell an opportunity when it comes across my desk. For instance I'm working with a Supplement manufacturer where I am doing online and offline copy for them but I also write blog posts for them as well because it ties in with the research I am doing and helps me to better digest what I'm learning. Clear and Simple, I'm a writer, nothing more and nothing less.

David
- Thanks
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[258668].message }}

Franck Silvestre

15 years ago

I'd say that I'm not an article writer, and definitively not a copywriter. I'm a story writer. Real life stories sell very well!

Franck

Thanks

Signature

Former Body Guard, Now REAL Traffic & List Building Coach
>> HOT WSO: Six Figure Solo Sellers <<

Winson Yeung said: "...Definitively A++ recommended WSO"
Kevin Riley said: "Franck, glad to see you bringing out MORE and MORE GREAT stuff"

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[258821].message }}

Jonathan Stapp

15 years ago

You know, I don't know if anyone has said this yet, but Clayton Makepeace is an excellent source for copywriting material.

He's got a great FREE newsletter he issues and they're pretty prolific if you've got the time to read through his material.

His last name should be MakeMoney or MakeLoveandnotWar. Anyway, this guy makes a killing a what he does. Happy Trails...

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[258962].message }}

dbarnum 15 years ago

So are you more of an article writer or a copy-writer?

Both

Many Warriors are both
- Thanks
Signature
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[259043].message }}

John_S

15 years ago

Well known copywriter Bob Bly writes white papers, and has written a book about white papers as a form of persuasive writing.

One of the criticisms I have of content as filler is the writer has no concept of persuasive writing. Specifically persuading readers the author is an expert worth hiring or buying from.

Putting up artificial barriers between copy and content writing merely insures you're going to fix your article writing price at a few cents per ton. There is no strategic significance to most articles.

Someone once heard search engines like new content. So an industry formed at filling the "article dump" with the sad word content. A word which shucks any claim of quality (that's information).

All content does is fill space. In a purported Information Age, content writing as most sites practice it should be a high crime. Better to study persuasive writing and news writing, and stop producing generic filler content where the only objective is avoiding the duplicate content penalty.

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[259100].message }}

Anita Ashland 15 years ago

Excellent post as always, John. Perhaps we harp too much about the distinctions between articles, white papers and copy; it can all be persuasive if we want it to be. I've certainly used copywriting techniques when writing articles promoting my own products.

And I agree that studying news writing is a good practice. Columnists have to be pithy and connect with readers in only 400-700 words. As a copywriter who specializes in email copy, I especially appreciate that and study that type of writing regularly.
- Thanks
- 1 reply
Signature

At last...pre-written emails for Clickbank products that increase conversions.

Need smokin' hot email copy? www.AnitaAshland.com
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[260419].message }}
- KenJ 15 years ago
  
  I am in the article writer camp. I find it very straightforward to write and inform through articles. Copywriting for a sales page is more of a dark art and I am not there yet
  
  Very interesting thread Li
  
  Thanks
  
  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[260479].message }}

Michael G Perry

15 years ago

Good question.. Li have written dozen of pieces of ad copy; both short and long formats.

Have studied Mark Joyner, , Mr Fire, Bob Bly, Willie Crawfords and others.

Writing ad copy has taught me much about how powerful it really can be.

When you write a good piece and it pulls "really good" you will be SHOCKED at what you can do with that same piece over and over again for the rest of your life and then pass it on to the next generation.

Know this: there is copy out there that was written over 80 years ago and it still in used to this day.

When you get it right, honestly, you can CRUSH the competition with lightening fast speed (especially when you have access to a big list).

Best of success to you.

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Las Vegas Job Search Looking for a job in las vegas? Best place to find one is here...
eBay Secrets Revealed Are you trying to figure out how to make money on eBay? Let the Elite show you how!
Need Publicity? Want it for Free? Let Willie Crawford and I show you how!
The Best Technology Integration site online is: SISNV.net

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[261391].message }}

LeeMasterson 15 years ago

I'm neither - and yet I'm both at the same time.

I'm a freelance writer and to me that means writing the assignment that lands in my inbox on that day. It makes no difference to me if I'm writing feature articles for magazines, simple content for websites, editorials for my own ezines, ebooks or writing sales copy for whatever product the client is wanting to sell.

Just write them and move on to the next assignment. It's my job.

Lee
- Thanks
- 1 reply
Signature
PLR Article Wizard
http://www.plr-article-wizard.com
Limited Edition PLR articles on highly profitable keywords.
Forex Trading | Credit Repair | Dog Training |
World of Warcraft | Weight Loss | Tattoos and more being added all the time.
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[261577].message }}
- cherylwright 15 years ago
  
  Yeah, what Lee said.
  
  I do all sorts of writing - sales pages, articles, brochures, ad copy, keyword articles, ebooks, magazine articles, rewriting -- basically I write what people pay me to write.
  
  I wouldn't want to pidgeon-hole myself into either of the categories listed.
  
  Cheryl
  
  Thanks
  
  Signature
  
  Learn to write effectively - for all areas of your business. Click here now!
  
  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[261624].message }}

Nick Doyle

15 years ago

I'd say copywriter. I'd argue that if you're a good copywriter and learn a bit of SEO ... you can also be a good article writer. But then again, I don't like writing articles so I'm sticking to writing actual sales-copy

Thanks

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[261931].message }}

cupbucket

Banned 15 years ago

I was told that to write good copy you just need to write as you would speak. I can do both quite well (I think)

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[262081].message }}

John_S

15 years ago

I was told that to write good copy you just need to write as you would speak.

They left out that's true only if you're a professional sales person.

Both for article or copy writing, you have to write for information value. That means research, being able to have empathy for and deeply understand who you're writing for.

That's takes one heck of a lot more than writing the way you speak.

For a medium like the web (where medium means neither rare nor well done) the devaluing of writing for technological gimmickry while blithely mouthing "content is king" is ludicrous.

At the end of the day, the thing that keeps the refunds in check is your writing. And a lot of copy is writing checks the reports and articles can't cash.

If the people writing for the web wrote the way they speak, let me just say I'll need a few drinks to handle any face-to-face conversation.

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[262234].message }}

MaskedMarketer

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Christie Love

You are right Anita. Although a copywriter needs to have good writing skills, an article writer doesn't.

An article writer doesn't need good skills? hmmmmm....

If you know how to write good copy for a salesletter then you should know any type of piece of communication with your prospects needs to be carefully crafted- no matter what the communication method is.

Article, audio, videos, reports, ebooks, all need to be carefully positioned and markted in a skill ful way. Sales letters are important, but marketing goes way beyond a sales letter.

Just beceause sales letters are an important piece of your business, do not mistake the rest of the business, like article marketing/writing as not needing skills.

If no skills are needed for article writing, then why are there 3$ per article writers and 100$+ article writers? All communication is part of your marketing and that takes some skills.

Originally Posted by John_S

g.

One of the criticisms I have of content as filler is the writer has no concept of persuasive writing. Specifically persuading readers the author is an expert worth hiring or buying from.

Putting up artificial barriers between copy and content writing merely insures you're going to fix your article writing price at a few cents per ton. There is no strategic significance to most articles.

Someone once heard search engines like new content. So an industry formed at filling the "article dump" with the sad word content. A word which shucks any claim of quality (that's information).

All content does is fill space. In a purported Information Age, content writing as most sites practice it should be a high crime. Better to study persuasive writing and news writing, and stop producing generic filler content where the only objective is avoiding the duplicate content penalty.

Hey John,

I agree most of the "content" out there is pure garbage. What that means is if you actually have skills and can write good information persuasively, you can dominate a market much easier. Even though there are differences between article writing, written salesletters, videos, audios, speaking, all communication should be filled with useful information and persuasiveness.

Probably the most powerful form of marketing is Education Based Marketing - so just being persuasive is only half the part, although extremely important.

Originally Posted by Li Weng

What I really meant was that you don't need to have the expressive skills of a book writer to do copywriter. You can use very simple words and grammar and still write effective copy.

Better copywriters have expressive skills of a book writer (some of them are both). The more tools you have in your aresenal the better. Simple words and grammar is only part of writing effective copy.

All marketing communication needs to do is have the prospects take a desired action that you want them to. You spend money on marketing to see an action- a result.

Effective marketing and communication takes skills, no matter what type of avenue you use to distribute your message. 1 article might not have a huge impact like 1 salesletter, but lets not say article writing/marketing takes no skills. All marketing and all communication methods takes skills- if you really want a wildly successful business.

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

"One Man's Ceiling is Another Man's Floor"

"I Pay Less Attention to What Men Say. I Just Watch What They Do."

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[262452].message }}

elsvirtual 15 years ago

I'm a copywriter, plain and simple.

Clients come to me because they want to increase their conversions and therefore, increase their profit.

I spend hundreds of hours every year researching and studying ways to push reader's mental triggers...how to compel them, through my writing, to open up their wallets.

I stay up late at night reading the latest studies regarding consumer behavior and what makes people buy.

I also research formatting strategies because I know it's not just what I write but how it's presented that'll increase conversion. And those strategies change drastically between the online and offline world.

I then research my client's target market until I think like them.

And only now can I start writing with a real chance of boosting conversion AND profit.

So you see, I believe everything I do that I've mentioned makes me one thing...a copywriter.

Evy
- Thanks
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[262637].message }}

AnarchyAds

Banned 15 years ago

[DELETED]

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[263847].message }}

MaskedMarketer 15 years ago

Originally Posted by AnarchyAds

I'm a sheep herder.

Why not get more meat and herd some cattle? lol
- Thanks
Signature

"One Man's Ceiling is Another Man's Floor"

"I Pay Less Attention to What Men Say. I Just Watch What They Do."
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[265602].message }}

Beaker

15 years ago

I do both. It is perfectly possible to be able to write articles and other types of copy (yes, articles are technically considered copy). I agree with Dot- both take specific skills. Copywriting takes a complex combination of skills that convey a number of different ideas at once.

Saying that an article writer doesn't need to be skilled is simply wrong. Article writing takes a great deal of skill and experience to do it well. Keeping an article interesting and informative and making it sound professional and trustworthy is no simple task. I find it a little strange that a person who says that article writers don't need writing skills is advertising article writing services in their signature...

I too hate the word "content." It positively makes my skin crawl. but that's often what clients ask for.

[ 1 ] Thanks

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[267800].message }}

are you a copy-writer or an article writer?

Trending Topics

Been a while! Any of you Old Timers here?

How much does the rebranding affect CR ?

Are billboards still effective in driving customers?

Boat and Jet Ski Rentals...... Door Hangers Effective?

A Very Strange Internet Problem