22 replies
I'm not new to copywriting, (I don't do it professionally though) but when it comes to my own products I start getting mental blocks being to close to the product. I'm wondering if any of the good people on this forum could help.

Headline: Making Algae Biodiesel at Home: Discover How To Make Money With Algae
Subhead: How To Make Algae Biodiesel...Make it Better, Make it Cheaper, Make it Yourself.

Demographic: engineers, DIY's, entrepreneurs, teachers, etc.

My own test have shown, if I get to "salesy" it doesn't work. If I put too many superlatives, (Amazing, Great, etc) it doesn't work. I tested using time frames (in 3 months) it didn't make much difference. I tested using the word "Guarantee" that didn't make any difference either.

Can anyone think of a stronger, more forceful, headline?

Thanks in advance.

David Sieg
#angst #headline
  • Profile picture of the author Daniel Scott
    Read "Breakthrough Advertising"... it's one of the best books I've ever read, and goes into a lot of detail regarding headlines and "hooks".

    IMHO in your headline you want to put in your hook... the piece of information that's going to stop people in their tracks and force them to read the first sentence.

    If you're not sure what your hook is, you need to find it, because it's integral to your marketing process... just like your USP.

    -Daniel

    P.S. Wondering why I didn't give any suggestions? Because when I do this for my clients it takes hours upon hours to come up with the kind of hook that sizzles and really sells. To do it I need to understand the product, marketplace, consumer, and much more in a very deep way - and that's something you're not going to get on a public forum from anyone.
    Signature

    Always looking for badass direct-response copywriters. PM me if we don't know each other and you're looking for work.

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5175263].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author The Copy Nazi
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Daniel Scott View Post

      Read "Breakthrough Advertising"... it's one of the best books I've ever read, and goes into a lot of detail regarding headlines and "hooks".

      IMHO in your headline you want to put in your hook... the piece of information that's going to stop people in their tracks and force them to read the first sentence.
      Daniel is absolutely on the money. Here's a snippet of the chapter on headlines in "Breakthrough Advertising Secrets " by Eugene Schwartz -

      You have ten seconds for your headline to stop that hand from throwing your piece away. So what is a headline? That's very important. And a headline is a very simple device that has a very easy job to do. Except that people make it extremely hard.

      The purpose of this headline: "Burn Disease Out of Your Body" - which is the first thing they see in those ten seconds - is to get them to read the next paragraph.

      That's all it is. Nothing else. It sells nothing. It confirms nothing. It argues nothing. It establishes nothing about the firm. If it stands by itself it would do nothing in the world, but all it's gotta do is, it's got to get them to read the next paragraph.

      Second, how long should a headline be? That's a classic question in copywriting. And, of course, the answer is, "No determined length." The headline depends strictly on how long it gets you to stop the person and get them going.

      And the third question is, how many headlines can there be in a mailing piece? And that, of course, is as many as you get on the page and make work.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5177086].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author travlinguy
    How To Make A Fortune With Slimy Green Stuff!
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5175752].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author jannatus
    David,

    What i'm feeling from this is that you're trying to come up with a good headline. And if that's the case, what is it you are trying to tell them??? Is it just 'how to make make Algea Biodiesel?' If it is, then that's not too hard to do!

    "How To Make Algae Biodiesel Like A Pro"
    "Who Else Wants To Learn How To Make Algae Biodiesel?"
    "Simple Tips On How To Make Algae Biodiesel At Home"
    "Now You Too Can Make Algae Biodiesel Without Any Previous Skills"

    But, and i do say a big MASSIVE "BUT". What i believe is missing here is the big IDEA. These headings above will do the trick if that's what your trying to communicate. But aren't they a little boring? Of coure! They don't really grab you do they?

    You need to find that big hook that jumps out and knocks em between the eyes, where they feel it.

    When you do, it needs to hum, buzz, make you move & whistle, and makes ur prospect say 'ahh yeah thats good, that's what I'm talking about'.

    A fictitious example would be:

    The Search Is Over!
    Young Local Unemployed Hobbyist Discovers
    "The Secret Formula To Algea Biodiesel",
    More Efficient, Economical, AND "Bio-degradable"
    Than The Latest Petroleum Super Giants"

    Of course David, you'd need to find what the market/industry/need etc actually IS, and shoot from there.

    Hope this helps.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5176177].message }}
    • Hi David,

      Of course the headline is vitally important.

      Get the “right” one and you’re on the road to fame and fortune.

      The types you used should have “worked” to a reasonable extent.

      Because it’s not just the headline that matters.

      The copy has to be great.

      You’ve got to sell your readers on reading what you have to say and make them want to continue reading.

      You’ve got to sell every benefit they get – every objection is eliminated. And every desire is fulfilled.

      You’ve got to have credibility – convincing your readers that your product really will deliver the results you’re promising.

      You need to promote the incredible value readers get – make it an irresistible offer.

      You’ve got to tell them - there is no downside or risk in accepting your brilliant offer.

      You need to sell your readers that ordering from you is simple and convenient.

      And you have to persuade them to “order now!” - because it’s absolutely, positively in their best interests and the most important they could do.


      And you’ve got to reach your target audience.

      You need lots and lots of traffic.

      That's usually the major problem - you're not reaching enough people.


      So make the headline as good as possible and if you can use a "hook"

      But also make the whole promotion as good as you possibly can.

      Do all this – and you have a great chance of success.

      Test it – and keep improving it.

      Hope this helps,


      Steve
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5176895].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author The Copy Nazi
    Banned
    Here's your head - buried in your (very interesting) body copy -

    In 1995 I was touring Vietnam and saw farmers pouring vegetable oil directly into their tractors for fuel.

    I couldn't believe it...


    Later doing research I found that the Allies and Germans during World War II used to do the same thing. I was hooked.

    Maybe you need to expand on that. Did the Germans and Allies just use biofuel for tractors? Or were they running cars, planes, tanks etc with it? And why did it not continue?

    Like my colleague above, I don't know the product so I can't help you more than that. But it does sound fascinating.

    P.S. I'd get rid of the header - or at least take the copy out - its getting in the way of the headline.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5177125].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author David Sieg
    Hi guys,

    Thanks for your input. The copy is converting...it just isn't converting as well as I'd like. Usually it is somewhere in the range of 0.85%-1.25%.

    jannatus: It not so much I want to tell them "How to make algae biodiesel" it's what they are interested in, and why they are there. I do agree, I need to find the "hook" that grabs them. I've tried so many headlines, tried video, or many different ways now (4-5 years), I know my demographic, I know my customers, but nothing ever seems to lift the conversation rate. I've been tracking it month by month for years. That is the reason I'm seeking help.

    Steve Copywriter: yes, the headlines worked as you said, "to a certain extent" (0.85%-1.25%) but I know it can be better. I think it can be 2%-3%. I have the eyeballs, I have the product. (It's a good one) What's proven to work as far as the copy goes is just straight accounting which is why the "sales copy" is a minimum and it basically consists of a table of contents. Most of the other elements are there.

    The Copy Nazi: Now were' getting somewhere. :+) That is all 100% true. Yes, the headline I think would hook them. It would appeal to my demographic. I have many comments on the home page bio. My cousin used it in his tractor in Vietnam. The Nazi's and Allies used it (Liberated it) for use in their tanks. As far as the history goes, (and it is pretty interesting) as I understand it, in those days they didn't really have the supply lines we have today. A unit was just let loose and they had to sink or swim on their own. They went around to farmers and took whatever they needed. Many times it was vegetable oil which they poured directly into the tanks, trucks, etc.

    My only concern about the headline is that is doesn't immediately state the benefit of why they are there. Once again, my own testing showed that my bounce rate increased when I didn't have an immediate, clarifying, benefit. Engineers, DIY'ers, are an immediate, hands-on, logical, group. However, this is a good topic. It would be interesting to know if I hooked it in another fashion (indirectly) and brought them in through the back door, so to speak, would work.

    So I studied headlines on Popular Mechanics. All of the headlines are immediate, and benefit focused. There are a lot of list headline (3 Ways To Make Your Crap Not Stink, etc.) and I've been playing around with those but haven't come up with one that "Talks" to me yet.

    BTW, to all of you...thanks for your responses. I hope to get more. It helps also to write out my reasoning as well.
    Signature

    Save Time, Save Money, Save the Planet
    www.making-biodiesel-books.com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5177834].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author The Copy Nazi
      Banned
      Originally Posted by David Sieg View Post


      My only concern about the headline is that is doesn't immediately state the benefit of why they are there. Once again, my own testing showed that my bounce rate increased when I didn't have an immediate, clarifying, benefit. Engineers, DIY'ers, are an immediate, hands-on, logical, group. However, this is a good topic. It would be interesting to know if I hooked it in another fashion (indirectly) and brought them in through the back door, so to speak, would work.
      Did you read the Schwartz quote i posted above?
      but all it's gotta do is, it's got to get them to read the next paragraph.
      Halbert said similar - "the headine is an ad for your ad".

      Here's $50 says it works.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5177889].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author David Sieg
        Originally Posted by The Copy Nazi View Post

        Did you read the Schwartz quote i posted above?
        Halbert said similar - "the headine is an ad for your ad".

        Here's $50 says it works.
        OK, you're on. ($50 bucks) Gotta work on the headline still, it's gotta sing some more. How about...


        Vietnam 1995: Suffering Under Crippling Fuel Shortages, Crafty Vietnamese Farmers Discover a Way To...?

        Maybe use the home page video after.

        One problem I see is that most of my traffic is organic search and affiliates. Main Keyword is "algae biodiesel" and secondary keyword is "Making algae biodiesel at home" so it has to be in the headline somewhere.
        Signature

        Save Time, Save Money, Save the Planet
        www.making-biodiesel-books.com

        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5178190].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author The Copy Nazi
          Banned
          Originally Posted by David Sieg View Post

          OK, you're on. ($50 bucks) Gotta work on the headline still, it's gotta sing some more. How about...


          Vietnam 1995: Suffering Under Crippling Fuel Shortages, Crafty Vietnamese Farmers Discover a Way To...?

          Maybe use the home page video after.

          One problem I see is that most of my traffic is organic search and affiliates. Main Keyword is "algae biodiesel" and secondary keyword is "Making algae biodiesel at home" so it has to be in the headline somewhere.
          Now why did you mess with it? It was perfect the way it was. Except for the "I was hooked". But you know - what would I know. Out.
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5178253].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author David Sieg
            Originally Posted by The Copy Nazi View Post

            Now why did you mess with it? It was perfect the way it was. Except for the "I was hooked". But you know - what would I know. Out.
            I haven't messed with ANYTHING yet. :+) I'm just brainstorming. But I agree, it is a nice hook. I'm not messing with you masterpiece...yet. :+)
            Signature

            Save Time, Save Money, Save the Planet
            www.making-biodiesel-books.com

            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5178363].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author RickDuris
    Hi David,

    What makes you think your headline is the culprit to your low conversion rates?

    In looking at your website, seems to me low conversions could be caused by almost anything.

    Good luck and much success,

    - Rick Duris
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5178312].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author David Sieg
      Originally Posted by RickDuris View Post

      Hi David,

      What makes you think your headline is the culprit to your low conversion rates?

      In looking at your website, seems to me low conversions could be caused by almost anything.

      Good luck and much success,

      - Rick Duris
      True. Mostly because of the 80-20 rule. I've got to start SOMEWHERE, and the headline is the obvious place. I've also tested a number of different elements of the copy itself. Of course, once I change the headline I may need to alter the body copy as well.
      Signature

      Save Time, Save Money, Save the Planet
      www.making-biodiesel-books.com

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5178379].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author RickDuris
        Originally Posted by David Sieg View Post

        True. Mostly because of the 80-20 rule. I've got to start SOMEWHERE, and the headline is the obvious place. I've also tested a number of different elements of the copy itself. Of course, once I change the headline I may need to alter the body copy as well.
        Hi David,

        Sounds good in theory, but I'd encourage you to discover where the visitors are abandoning the process in general and work backwards.

        You're kinda like a guy taking pain killers for a back problem. When the real problem is ill-fitting shoes.

        - Rick Duris
        Signature
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5178623].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author BrianMcLeod
          Originally Posted by RickDuris View Post

          You're kinda like a guy taking pain killers for a back problem. When the real problem is ill-fitting shoes.

          - Rick Duris
          Love that line, Rick.

          Consider it swiped and repeated without any credit whatsoever.

          LOL
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5178662].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author RickDuris
            Originally Posted by BrianMcLeod View Post

            Love that line, Rick.

            Consider it swiped and repeated without any credit whatsoever.

            LOL
            Sheesh. Well, at least you thanked me. Doesn't pay the bills but...
            Signature
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5178936].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author David Sieg
          Originally Posted by RickDuris View Post

          Hi David,

          Sounds good in theory, but I'd encourage you to discover where the visitors are abandoning the process in general and work backwards.

          You're kinda like a guy taking pain killers for a back problem. When the real problem is ill-fitting shoes.

          - Rick Duris
          It IS a good line. :+)

          Hummm...How would I discover where the "visitors are abandoning the process" Is there software? (hopefully free) Analytics will tell how long, but not where. Heatmap?
          Signature

          Save Time, Save Money, Save the Planet
          www.making-biodiesel-books.com

          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5178765].message }}
  • {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5178840].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author stevenalowe
      let the readers self-select, and focus on benefits, e.g.

      Engineers: How to save and make $$$ with diesel breakthrough

      or something like that - i don't know enough about the field to be more detailed
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5178919].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author David Sieg
      Originally Posted by BrianMcLeod View Post

      Ok, now this is cool. I got it installed.
      Signature

      Save Time, Save Money, Save the Planet
      www.making-biodiesel-books.com

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5179213].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author RickDuris
        Originally Posted by David Sieg View Post

        Ok, now this is cool. I got it installed.
        David,

        Over time, you'll start to notice patterns of behavior. It won't be clear cut. But you can see major trends of activity and then immediately see what happens after you make necessary changes.

        - Rick Duris
        Signature
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[5179930].message }}

Trending Topics