How Many Hours? (honestly)

20 replies
Assuming you’re a full time copywriter.

On average how many hours a day do you work?

And how many days a week do you work?

It’s just out of interest –and to demolish the theory you can work 3 hours a day and make zillions.

Also I was talking to a client who was surprised to hear - when I'm writing I can genuinely lose all track of time.

I know you can use a “timer” like Schwartz suggested – but with me every time the bloody bell rang - I completely lost my concentration – and the sentence, phrase or headline just vaporised and it was hell to piece it back together.

So for you, is copywriting like it is for me, a lifestyle where the hours don't matter, or is it just a job?

Cheers,


Steve
#honestly #hours
  • Profile picture of the author Jason Kanigan
    Yes yes the time disappears. Three hours can go by in about thirty subjective seconds when I'm in the middle of it.

    I bid based on a portion of what I think the solution will bring in for revenue. That way I'm comfortable with the results and the pay no matter how long it takes (because it's higher than an hourly rate I'd be OK to work for). Once price is agreed upon and the down payment is in the account, I forget about money. The work is All, when I'm doing it.

    Projects come and go, and copywriting is one of the things that I do, so I can't give you a consistent figure. When I'm working, I'm working. When I'm on downtime, I'm on downtime.
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  • Profile picture of the author abugah
    I do 70 hours a week or more. Some days when I am in the moods, I put in 15 hours plus a day. On a standard day I wake up at 4am and by five I am on my Compaq laptop sited next to the window overseeing a park. Occasionally I get to see the lions, monkeys, or zebras as the sun rise.


    Here is by philosophy …


    1. This world is governed by immutable laws of sowing and reaping, cause and effect etc. And as such the more you put in the more you get out. Therefore, if you have the ambition to earn a million dollars a year, as I do, then you need to accelerate the dream by working more.

    2. Even if you were Stephen King, Gary Bencivenga, John Carlton, Clayton Makepeace, or any other brilliant writer/copywriter, the moment you stop writing, you deteriorate fast, very fast. So to be a better writer, write more and more.


    3. In copywriting, research is the key to the success of your copy. And research has no shortcut. You must dig and dig and dig. This takes time; meaning more work. However, in order to research less for every subsequent copy you write, it is better to stick with one industry or certain clients.

    4. Money is not evil contrarily to what most people believe. It is an excellent idea to accumulate the most in the shortest time possible when you still have the energy and opportunities. In your old age, give away as much as possible. Let your children and grand children work for theirs. After all , if you can manage to retire a multimillionaire why should they not become billionaires given the foundation you give them?


    5. It is not immoral to drop low paying energy supping clients to go for big payers. In fact, one should implement the 80/20 rule ruthlessly.

    6. If you can do with just 2 hours of sleep and remain healthy do it.


    7. Lastly, I have read a couple of biographies of copywriters and other distinguished citizens of this world. For instance…
    a) Bill Gates doesn't watch TV, he has no time for it-always busy working.
    b) David Ogilvy, the legendary copywriter, used to get to the office at dawn and leave after midnight while building his ad firm. So did Claude Hopkins ( often he could leave the office at 2 am and show up at 6 am)
    c) John D Rockefeller the first billionaire to grace the face of the earth, often broke his resolution of leaving the office before 10pm-having arrived at 6am. This man believed in only two things; work and family.

    What does this tell you?

    There is no such a thing as working 3 hours a day and earning zillions of dollars in a year.
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    • Profile picture of the author Treborrevo
      Originally Posted by abugah View Post

      John D Rockefeller the first billionaire to grace the face of the earth, often broke his resolution of leaving the office before 10pm-having arrived at 6am. This man believed in only two things; work and family.
      Ha. It strikes me that a man that doesn't get home till after 10 pm at night and leaves before 6 am actually doesn't believe in family so much...
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  • Profile picture of the author Mark Pescetti
    I spend way more time THINKING about a project than actually writing.

    Once I've developed the copy in my mind, the writing only takes me a 2-4 hours a day.

    I used to take on up to 5 clients a month.

    Now I keep it to one or two great paying gigs a month... on top of my more lucrative JV's and pimping out my own products.
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  • Profile picture of the author Caeristhiona
    As many as I can without completely ruining my family life.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jason Kanigan
    Current example! I just wrote homepage copy for a client. I *think* I started at 8:30.

    Some marketing guy emailed me about a presentation he's doing in a few minutes. It's almost 11:30!!!

    I swear I spent a half-hour on this little project--in subjective time. Flying!

    Oh, and I've been humming and hawing about the copy for days. Thinking time > Writing time. Every time.
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  • Profile picture of the author RHert
    I generally keep it between 2-4 hours a day. I like to work Smart, not hard. It's like being in a race. I bet I could beat the greatest runner in the world. How? I'll use my car. Like I said do things smart and you get more done in less time.
    Sometimes however (because I am a writer) I lose track of time and find that 8 or 10 hours have passed without me realizing it.
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    • Profile picture of the author CopywritingKing
      Originally Posted by RHert View Post

      I generally keep it between 2-4 hours a day. I like to work Smart, not hard. It's like being in a race. I bet I could beat the greatest runner in the world. How? I'll use my car. Like I said do things smart and you get more done in less time.
      Sometimes however (because I am a writer) I lose track of time and find that 8 or 10 hours have passed without me realizing it.
      I would trade with you in a second!

      I work probably 16-18 hours per day on weekdays, and may take a day off on the weekend to catch up on much needed sleep. My long hours are not because I 'have' to work; but because I love what I do and have a penchant for rewriting things over and over again.
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  • Profile picture of the author OO
    This is interesting and leads to what I've always known. Those that are successful and work what seems like crazy hours to the general masses, don't do this because it seems like work to them. They think it's fun in their minds. Great question OP.
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  • Profile picture of the author The Copy Warriors
    I don't really keep track of it but I would say that my workweek is significantly more than 40 hours. I would imagine somewhere in the 50-60 hour range is probably where it is. So let's say 12 hours a day, 5 days a week.
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    • Hi Pen,

      Yes it’s the toughest part in being a copywriter.

      Balancing the time you work with the time you want with your family and friends.

      When you’re in the flow that’s it – hours just fly by and the days blend into each other.

      Then add research, deadlines, and endless edits.

      If what I write is going to be good - I daren’t do less than 28 edits even then I can still miss a typo or two.

      The only times I don’t fanatically edit is here - so forgive me for any mistakes.

      Then the phone rings - a blast from the past - “remember the sales letter you did 7 years ago – the one that’s always been our “control” - well now we want to change it because we’ve got a new “gizmo”– and the piece has to be re-written in 2 days…”

      I could do “time management” but it wouldn't work for me.

      It takes too long (lol).

      I could “stay away" from the forum.

      But there are some ace writers here, and I want to read what they have to say. And I get brilliant answers to any questions I want to post.

      Or it might be suggested “get more organized”

      But I am meticulously organized - as writers we have to be.

      But still the time just zooms by.

      I can look at the clock it’s 9 am Monday.

      Next time I glance it’s 11pm on Saturday.


      Steve

      P.S. And I don't even remember eating, drinking gallons of coffee or showering...
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      • Profile picture of the author Hugh Thyer
        I'm usually 9am to 3pm (around kids and school) then another 3 hours at night.

        Of course it's not just writing. There's ongoing education plus client phone calls, proposals and paperwork too.
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  • Profile picture of the author LeeMark
    In a day i work for 8 hours and in a week around 48 hours.
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  • Profile picture of the author Bruce Wedding
    My work time varies wildly. The past 2 months, I've worked 12-16 hour days, not all on copy but still work. But, the goal is to get to those 4 hour days, and I will. You've got to put the systems in place to get there.

    Here are the facts...

    If you're going to write copy for others, for a fee, you will always work crazy hours. The goal should be passive income from multiple streams. I don't like a life where, when I stop writing, the money stops flowing.

    You know what makes me sad?

    Seeing newbies here wanting to be six-figure copywriters. I've been and have known a lot of those. They work their asses off. And what good does it do to earn $20k a letter if the next month you earn zero?

    They need a "wake up" slap and someone to scream...

    "You have magic fingers! You are capable of writing words that make people give you money. Why are you not taking advantage of this powerful information?"

    Here's a news flash...

    You're not always going to be young, healthy and carefree. And when you're not, you'll appreciate the fact that money is still flowing in from multiple directions.

    Adios
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    • Profile picture of the author abugah
      Originally Posted by Bruce Wedding View Post

      You know what makes me sad?

      Seeing newbies here wanting to be six-figure copywriters. I've been and have known a lot of those. They work their asses off. And what good does it do to earn $20k a letter if the next month you earn zero?



      Adios
      That's a great observation.

      Most people who start out in copywriting think they can retire in 18 months, but still make more money than most doctors and pilots. It can happened. A few people have done it, but you must WORK.
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      • Profile picture of the author Bruce Wedding
        Originally Posted by abugah View Post

        That's a great observation.

        Most people who start out in copywriting think they can retire in 18 months, but still make more money than most doctors and pilots. It can happened. A few people have done it, but you must WORK.
        Most people who start out in copywriting think that six-figures is a lot of money.

        As someone who has made no less than that for over 20 consecutive years, I can tell you without hesitation, it's not. Especially if you're having to write sales letters to get it.

        I realize if you're a fry cook at Mickey-Ds, you think it is a lot, but you'd be surprised what you can get used to, very quickly.

        We copywriters need to realize, if you'll do what most people won't, for just 5 years, you will be able to do what most people can't, for the rest of your life.
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        • Profile picture of the author Bruce Wedding
          Originally Posted by copyassassin View Post

          Hi Bruce,

          I gotta lotta respect for your skills and insights, and am grateful you share both on this forum.

          Just curious, what tasks/actions/things do you recommend we do for 5 years to put us in the 1% club?
          Thanks, Adam.

          Wow, there are a thousand ways to do it, on and offline.

          Actually, it shouldn't take 5 years but here's a few ideas. All depend on your ability to identify good niches, build a sales funnel, your SEO abilities, your marketing ability and the quality of products:

          Develop evergreen niche products & corresponding sales letters for Clickbank. Each should be a funnel leading to successively bigger products but NOT requiring your own time ie coaching

          Develop niche membership sites charging monthly fees.

          Direct mail offline for any number of products using postcards or letters.

          Sell tested marketing packages you write (display ads, direct mail pieces, instructions how to use them) to small businesses. You only write one for each niche. This is NOT a custom package for each business. 1000 @ $1,000 = 1,000,000. Read how Dan Kennedy says to do this with jewelry stores.

          Outsource where possible. Don't develop businesses which require much of your personal time after they are launched.
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  • Profile picture of the author Raiinzen
    Bruce, sounds to me like you really should be training a novice on how to be a copywriter. You really know your stuff.

    I am brand new; just wanting to get into the industry. I am willing to put in the hard work, but I'm not sure where to begin. How do I discover a good niche? What do I need on my site to make a good impression?

    Still trying to find the answers.
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  • Profile picture of the author AngieDixon
    My days vary. A short day might be four or five hours of actual WORK and a lot of thinking, reading and jotting notes here and there. A long day, 12 hours. I'd say 60-70 hours a week, but I'd rather be writing than doing anything but sleeping or spending time with my family.
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    • Profile picture of the author schttrj
      Making six figures with 2-3 hours a day is pretty much impossible, BUT making a few thousand bucks a month, working around 4-5 hours per day is pretty much possible. Building a business is hard, but once you have the networking done...you are on a roll, baby!!
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