Postcard Test Question

35 replies
Let's say I can either test a 6"x11" postcards and drop 3000 postcards, or drop 4000 to 5000 4"x6" postcards, but I can only do one or the other test.

What would you rather trial and why?
#postcard #question
  • Profile picture of the author OutOfThisWord
    Do the 4x6 coz you save 13 cents per piece on postage, assuming you are mailing first class, which is always a good idea considering 30% of bulk mail never gets delivered.

    First class also gets the dead mail returned, so you can eliminate from your list, whereas if you mail bulk, you'll have to pay for returns.

    You can do a lot of selling in 4x6 if you have a clear offer and compelling reasons to take you up on your offer.
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  • Profile picture of the author RickDuris
    Show us the post cards.

    - Rick Duris
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  • Many will say it depends on the copy.

    But 99% of the time I always go with the larger Postcard (even if the copy is short).

    My tests show the bigger the card the better the response.

    And you want them to stand out from the crowd so it's good not to be a "standard" size.


    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author Rearden
    Rick -- haven't gotten that far yet.

    Enter a 3rd option -- what about trialing 2 different postcards -- 1 a 4x6 and the other the 6x11 -- maybe about 2000 pieces each?

    And is that true about bulk mail being 30% undelivered?
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    David Duford -- Providing On-Going, Personalized Mentorship And Training From A Real Final Expense Producer To Agents New To The Final Expense Life Insurance Business.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mr. Subtle
      Originally Posted by Rearden View Post

      And is that true about bulk mail being 30% undelivered?
      No, it's not true.
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  • Profile picture of the author bob ross
    I'd go 4.25x6 (make sure you at least get that extra quarter inch).

    I agree with Steve about bigger postcards getting better response, but in my opinion, getting 33% - 66% more postcards mailed is the clear choice.

    For solo mailings, I like using big postcards as part of a sequence where each time they get bigger, or I'll use them if I we really need to fight for mailbox attention in certain niches.

    With such a small mailing, you'll need all the quantity you can get. 4.25x6's will get your undeliverables returned (as the above poster stated) so there's a big benefit there. Bulk mail postage will never get returned, they will simply dispose of undeliverables.
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  • Harping back to the size of the Postcards.

    I still say the bigger the card the better the response regardless of the volume sent.

    (Steve's theory and proven in practise - make your "media" so much better, extra special, more interesting and more readable than anyone else's).

    However,

    If you are making an absolutely, sensational, barnstormingly*, irresistible offer (which you should be doing to get the highest possible number of sales) then do what Mr Ross said.

    Start by sending out as many Postcards as you possibly can to capitalise on the results.

    When that works, keep doing it but with a bigger Postcard - cost won't be an issue because you'll have made a tasty profit.

    And you'll inevitably get an even higher response with a bigger and better card.

    And always use a glossy card and again as Mr Ross said go for the thickest card.

    You want to ooze quality which boosts your credibility - making your enlightening, engaging and enthralling message - so worth reading.

    Great thing about Postcards is - it's difficult not to read them.


    Steve


    P.S * I'm not sure how "barnstormingly" translates - shall we just say - spectacularly good.
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      • Profile picture of the author Biz Max
        Originally Posted by Mr. Subtle View Post


        The problem is most do not know how to fill 3x more selling area. I suppose they could make a giant WE'RE #1 on the front side of the card

        For me, go big. To send out more of a bad ad serves no purpose (sorry Bob). Since all flat mail is 33% bigger now than 15 years ago I would not revert.

        Mail less, put a lot of effort into the piece and make it as big as you can.
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  • Profile picture of the author bob ross
    But is the heightened response from a 6x11 going to be worth 66% more postcards being sent?

    Even if a 6x11 card produced 66% more response than a 4.25x6 card, making the test hypothetically breaking even, I'd rather break even with more people reached than fewer reached at a higher response.

    This is the same theory I have with saturation mail. If I can saturate say 20,000 addresses and get a .5% response or target 5,000 with a 2% response... I'd take the 20k volume.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mr. Subtle
      Originally Posted by bob ross View Post

      This is the same theory I have with saturation mail. If I can saturate say 20,000 addresses and get a .5% response or target 5,000 with a 2% response... I'd take the 20k volume.
      Thanks for the straw man argument. LOL

      The reality is that if you test 5,000 and get a 2% response rate, you'll more than likely get the same response rate when you "roll out" to 20,000 (and will stop sending those cards where you only got a .5% response).

      Rearden is testing and he doesn't know whether to test 3,000 large postcards vs. 5,000 small postcards. The total cost for either is about the same.

      Since the costs are the same, I'd test the larger postcard so I can get the best response possible (large postcards pull better than smaller ones and the more you tell, the more you sell).
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      • Profile picture of the author bob ross
        Originally Posted by Mr. Subtle View Post

        Thanks for the straw man argument. LOL

        The reality is that if you test 5,000 and get a 2% response rate, you'll more than likely get the same response rate when you "roll out" to 20,000 (and will stop sending those cards where you only got a .5% response).

        Rearden is testing and he doesn't know whether to test 3,000 large postcards vs. 5,000 small postcards. The total cost for either is about the same.

        Since the costs are the same, I'd test the larger postcard so I can get the best response possible (large postcards pull better than smaller ones and the more you tell, the more you sell).
        If rearden sends an even larger postcard, like a 9x12, how many pieces would do you think be sufficient to mail instead of 3,000 6x11's
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  • Bob,

    We may have to agree to disagree.

    Yes a 66% increase in circulation is good - but bad and expensive if the response is poor.


    It's always the copy that drives the response.

    My absolute priority is - get the copy bang on.

    Then I guess you can use any size of card.

    But...

    I use the biggest card possible (there isn't that much difference in price between a 4.25 x6 or a 6 x 11).

    It's just been proven to me time and time again - when the copy is great - bigger cards pull better results than smaller cards.


    Steve


    P.S.Usually to get the copy blazingly good - you actually need more space.I never want to jam it into a smaller space. Never make the good prospects do any hard work. If it's easy to read - it's easy to respond.


    Let me say it again like this -

    Usually to get the copy blazingly good - you actually need more space.

    I never want to jam it into a smaller space.

    Never make the good prospects do any hard work.

    If it's easy to read - it's easy to respond.
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  • Profile picture of the author bob ross
    Steve, I'm glad we're having this discussion, it's good for everyone.

    I do think that the added benefit of 4.25x6's being sent first class mail (fast and predictable delivery & undeliverables returned) is an advantage as well.

    Like you said, if the copy is bang on, it shouldn't matter too much. Dollar for Dollar, the 5k option really has advantages that I don't believe should be sacrificed in exchange for a more noticeable card.

    If the selling space of a 6x11 in this case is incredibly important, a one shot mailing is going to be really tough. If the OP is simply trying to get the recipient to take a 'next step', I'm really struggling to see the advantage a 6x11 will have versus the other options strong advantages.
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  • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
    Originally Posted by Rearden View Post

    Let's say I can either test a 6"x11" postcards and drop 3000 postcards, or drop 4000 to 5000 4"x6" postcards, but I can only do one or the other test.

    What would you rather trial and why?
    Is this going to homes or businesses?

    Might help the Postcard gurus in the lounge.

    Best,
    Ewen
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  • Profile picture of the author bob ross
    If we subscribe to the 'bigger is better' theory without really looking at the details we have...

    a 9x12 sent to 1800 addresses would be an even better option.
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  • Bob,

    Lets say the client just wants to drive prospects to his or her website.

    You might well think - in that case it can easily fit onto a 4.25 x 6.

    But why not with great empathy - sell, sell and sell the unique, wonderful and extraordinary benefits of the website.

    And skyrocket the response.

    You need at least a 6 x 11 to do it.


    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author bob ross
    Steve, I totally agree man. Completely agree on what you're saying about the benefits of comparing 4x6 vs 6x11, it's just the volume and postage class difference that's the issue for me.
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  • Bob,

    If the copy is top notch - and the offer is truly irresistible. Use a big Postcard.

    Don't cram it into a small card to bump up the circulation - because the response that should be brilliant often plummets (far too many people won't bother squinting, struggling and squirming to read it).

    And don't worry about the price of a bigger card or the postage costs.

    They pale into insignificance thanks to the increased volumes of orders, revenues and profits.


    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author bob ross
      Originally Posted by Steve The Copywriter View Post

      Bob,

      If the copy is top notch - and the offer is truly irresistible.

      Don't cram it into a small card - the response that could have been brilliant can plummet.

      And don't worry about the price difference in the size of the cards or the postage costs.

      They pale into insignificance thanks to the volumes of orders, revenues and profits.


      Steve
      Agree wholeheartedly with you.

      I'm not worried about postage cost though, it's the advantage that first class postage has, which is faster & predictable delivery along with undeliverables returned.
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  • Yes, whatever we send - it has to go first class.

    For all the reasons you mentioned.

    Plus when a prospect sees "the greatest offer in the world and must respond now to get all the incredible benefits..."

    They're not thrilled to see that the promo was sent by bulk mail.

    Takes the shine off everything.


    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author Rearden
    Thanks for all the input, fellas.

    This would be a lead generating piece, mailed to 55-75 year olds, designed to pull those interested into dialing and listening to a free recorded message about my product.

    It will be an all-text piece -- no pictures. Probably on goldenrod, with a huge head and plenty of curiosity-provoking copy.
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    David Duford -- Providing On-Going, Personalized Mentorship And Training From A Real Final Expense Producer To Agents New To The Final Expense Life Insurance Business.
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    • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
      Originally Posted by Rearden View Post

      Thanks for all the input, fellas.

      This would be a lead generating piece, mailed to 55-75 year olds, designed to pull those interested into dialing and listening to a free recorded message about my product.

      It will be an all-text piece -- no pictures. Probably on goldenrod, with a huge head and plenty of curiosity-provoking copy.
      Slightly off topic, but relevant to your overall success.

      It's about your list.

      Having a list of those that have a history of buying similar products and services at a similar price point through the mail is greatly going to put the odds of success in your favor.

      You may know this, but re-hearing the proven basics can do no harm.

      Best,
      Ewen
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    • Originally Posted by Rearden View Post

      Thanks for all the input, fellas.

      This would be a lead generating piece, mailed to 55-75 year olds, designed to pull those interested into dialing and listening to a free recorded message about my product.

      It will be an all-text piece -- no pictures. Probably on goldenrod, with a huge head and plenty of curiosity-provoking copy.


      Yes, sent to a good targeted list - a Postcard is an excellent media to use for this type of promo.

      Going back to the bigger card debate - your audience is more likely to have poorer eyesight.

      So use a larger card making it easy to read.

      Don't make them squint at the copy.

      Because they won't bother - it's so much easier just to fling the card in the trash.


      Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author OutOfThisWord
      Originally Posted by Rearden View Post

      Thanks for all the input, fellas.

      This would be a lead generating piece, mailed to 55-75 year olds, designed to pull those interested into dialing and listening to a free recorded message about my product.

      It will be an all-text piece -- no pictures. Probably on goldenrod, with a huge head and plenty of curiosity-provoking copy.
      For your test I would suggest printing 2 color, of the small postcard so you qualify for 33c postage...

      ...and print them 4 to a page on legal size card stock, min. weight for mailing.

      Then run thru laser printer and personalize the address side, with your teaser copy just above their address and use their name in the teaser copy.

      Then you take the post cards and have them cut down and stacked and run through a postage meter.

      I used to do just that in the '90's and sent as much as 10,000 a week.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rearden
    About the list...

    If I could get a list of policy holders from a few select companies, I'd be stinking rich.

    But all I have access to is a generic demographic list, unless somebody has another way to get a more targeted list.

    More of a liability question: can I make specific reference to the companies and their product in my postcard copy in a way to alert unsuspecting consumers about reviewing their coverage due to the potentially unwanted terms inherent in their policy?
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    David Duford -- Providing On-Going, Personalized Mentorship And Training From A Real Final Expense Producer To Agents New To The Final Expense Life Insurance Business.
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    • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
      Originally Posted by Rearden View Post

      About the list...

      If I could get a list of policy holders from a few select companies, I'd be stinking rich.

      But all I have access to is a generic demographic list, unless somebody has another way to get a more targeted list.

      More of a liability question: can I make specific reference to the companies and their product in my postcard copy in a way to alert unsuspecting consumers about reviewing their coverage due to the potentially unwanted terms inherent in their policy?
      First question.

      Yes you can rent lists of more targeted groups.

      For example there are those that are known diabetics.
      You can go after those that are known to have health issues.

      You can go to geo targeted.
      For example Santa Barbara where the average home valuation is just under a million bucks. Or the top 10 wealthiest suburbs in the States. Google the top 100 wealthiest suburbs and then you can feed those locations into your list filter.

      There's a whole library of mailing lists publicly available for viewing at http://lists.nextmark.com/ http://www.impulse-media.net/ Don't use the ones where they have been compiled or come from tv. They are the worst.

      Is your offer to review existing policies in case they are paying to much?

      Best,
      Ewen
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  • Profile picture of the author Rearden
    Right.

    My targets are:

    -The person who knows they need more life insurance.
    -The person who has insurance but may not have the optimal type of policy for their goals -- and may not realize it.
    -The person who has zero life insurance.

    Most of the people I deal with have had some health issues in the past -- very few are in perfect health (probably just 25% of the people I see that I write up).

    Ideally, I want my piece to target all of those I mentioned above and drive them to listen to my prerecorded message.
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    David Duford -- Providing On-Going, Personalized Mentorship And Training From A Real Final Expense Producer To Agents New To The Final Expense Life Insurance Business.
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    • Profile picture of the author MikeHumphreys
      If you're not using a strong list, strong sales copy, and making a strong offer then the size of the card isn't going to matter.

      Many years ago, I did postcard marketing for my massage therapy center... some of them were complete bare-bones campaigns where I had used MS Publisher to create 4 postcards on a page, took it to the local Staples and copied them onto card stock which we cut and mailed out ourselves.

      Definitely NOT a polished looking mailing piece but it was pretty common to pull 3-5% from a campaign because the offer was strong and the copy was fairly good (this was before I even knew what copywriting was and started studying it).

      So my advice is hire a copywriter who will help you nail down the offer and the copy... then get the best quality mailing list you can.

      You can always start with a small mail drop (to use a bigger mailer), test, and then mail out to a bigger segment of the list if it turns out to be a responsive list.
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    • Profile picture of the author OutOfThisWord
      Originally Posted by Rearden View Post

      Thanks for all the input, fellas.

      This would be a lead generating piece, mailed to 55-75 year olds, designed to pull those interested into dialing and listening to a free recorded message about my product.

      It will be an all-text piece -- no pictures. Probably on goldenrod, with a huge head and plenty of curiosity-provoking copy.
      Originally Posted by Rearden View Post

      Right.

      My targets are:

      -The person who knows they need more life insurance.
      -The person who has insurance but may not have the optimal type of policy for their goals -- and may not realize it.
      -The person who has zero life insurance.

      Most of the people I deal with have had some health issues in the past -- very few are in perfect health (probably just 25% of the people I see that I write up).

      Ideally, I want my piece to target all of those I mentioned above and drive them to listen to my prerecorded message.
      For prospecting purposes, you certainly want to test the in-home mail you see arrive in your mailbox every Wed./Thur. where you get all the grocer flyers, probably something from Dish TV, a dentist, oil change, etc.

      But, what this service offers (operates as Valassis) is, you can do a full 8-1/2 x 11 inch flyer, full color on both sides and sell the hell out of your offer.

      And you can target just the households that meet your demographics, meaning not everyone on the block or even in the zip code will get your offer, just the ones who are older, etc.

      Often you can get 20,000 pieces printed and delivered for around $1,800, whereas just the postage on 4,000 min. size post cards will run you $1,320.
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    • Profile picture of the author misterme
      Originally Posted by Rearden View Post

      Enter a 3rd option -- what about trialing 2 different postcards -- 1 a 4x6 and the other the 6x11 -- maybe about 2000 pieces each
      That's what I'd do. Test them both. Key them so you know where responses come from. If you test them one at a time, it's taking you longer to find out what works best.

      Just seems to me (and yes I've done postcard mailings) that the advantage of the larger size is in getting more noticed because it sticks out from the rest of the mail. So all other things being equal the larger size might bump the results up a a bit.

      If it does then the next thing you'd want to test is more copy on the bigger size. Because otherwise you're only sending a larger size version of the smaller card. So if more copy can be written to increase response, test that and use that additional space wisely.

      Also, a thought... since I believe you sell final expense insurance. Haven't the companies in that field, like Securus, developed and tested mailers over the years where it's pretty much the best you're likely to get by way of response? Why don't you just copy what the big boys have figured out?

      Originally Posted by Mr. Subtle View Post

      Also remember the post office is going to print or stick a bar code somewhere around near the bottom, to the immediate left of the 4x2 space. So don't print your contact info or anything down there.

      Originally Posted by Rearden View Post

      My targets are:

      -The person who knows they need more life insurance.
      -The person who has insurance but may not have the optimal type of policy for their goals -- and may not realize it.
      -The person who has zero life insurance.
      Ideally, I want my piece to target all of those I mentioned above and drive them to listen to my prerecorded message.
      So those are people who don't generally have wealth for the most part and/or they probably don't have life insurance already covering their burial expenses. So if people in those circumstances are found in certain areas, such as lower income areas, you may want to see if the list broker can geographically select zip codes of those areas when you order a list. Should be only a few dollars more per thousand.
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  • Profile picture of the author ASCW
    I'd lean towards the larger postcards (assuming the copy is on target).

    If you test the smaller ones and the results aren't quite there (Maybe break even, or fall a little short), you'll keep yourself up at night wondering if things had been different if you had chosen large postcards.
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    • Profile picture of the author bob ross
      Originally Posted by ASCW View Post

      I'd lean towards the larger postcards (assuming the copy is on target).

      If you test the smaller ones and the results aren't quite there (Maybe break even, or fall a little short), you'll keep yourself up at night wondering if things had been different if you had chosen large postcards.
      And if you don't get a great response from the large postcards you'd wonder if sending 66% more of the smaller ones would have been different.

      5,000 is a good test number considering these type of targets. 3,000 isn't so good, when we consider statistical variance. It's just not a huge sample size to get an accurate picture of response on a one-shot mailing.

      It's not worth the bulk class postage either. If bigger postcards were responsible for that much more response, then 8.5x11 or 9x12 would be a better choice since there's 54% more selling space available.

      3,000 to 5,000 piece volume is really critical here because of the small sample size, even more than a 30,000 to 50,000 comparison (same %) where variance isn't as swingy.



      note: I probably sound like I'm really against big postcards. I'm not. Steve's point about poor eyesight is spot on.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mr. Subtle
        Originally Posted by Rearden View Post

        About the list...

        If I could get a list of policy holders from a few select companies, I'd be stinking rich.

        But all I have access to is a generic demographic list, unless somebody has another way to get a more targeted list.
        Yeah, you need find a library in your area that subscribes to the SRDS Direct Marketing List Source and look at the consumer lists under the category "insurance buyers."

        Originally Posted by bob ross View Post

        5,000 is a good test number considering these type of targets. 3,000 isn't so good, when we consider statistical variance. It's just not a huge sample size to get an accurate picture of response on a one-shot mailing.
        A 3,000 mailing is plenty big to get the information as to whether the piece will fly or not.

        The last time I received a 6x4.25 postcard soliciting something was a year ago. It was a plastic postcard (restaurant offer). Before that I can't tell you when I received one. The only 6x4.25 postcards I get are from the dentist reminding me to set an appointment for my bi-annual teeth cleaning and jiffy lube sending me a reminder that one of my vehicles is due for an oil change.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rearden
    You all know of any mail shops that can do business reply mail preferably in snap pack mailers?
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    David Duford -- Providing On-Going, Personalized Mentorship And Training From A Real Final Expense Producer To Agents New To The Final Expense Life Insurance Business.
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