Internet Sales Tax Bill

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Anyone see this?

Could mean bad news for ecommerce merchants in the U.S.

Review & Outlook: The Internet Sales Tax Rush - WSJ.com
#bill #internet #sales #tax
  • Profile picture of the author mraffiliate
    Yea, I think it has already passed the House. If it passes and become law then it will be impossible for the typical internet business to conduct business. It exempts brick and mortar businesses
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    • Profile picture of the author OnlineStoreHelp
      I have been telling people for the last year and a half this is a huge giveaway to Walmart, Best Buy and Amazon. I have written my senators about it but of course never got anything back.

      Amazon wants to control the ecommerce market so they are pushing it to make people go on their platform. "Don't worry, we will transmit the taxes directly for you"

      Walmart and Best Buy finally have competition which is hurting them so of course they are going to lobby for a tax that doesn't hurt them.

      I told my senator, I would be willing to consider the sales tax requirement if you make it illegal to give property and sales tax exemptions to the very businesses that are lobbying for this bill.
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      • Profile picture of the author mraffiliate
        I'm not sure how this will work if you are an affiliate. I wonder who will be collecting the sales tax on the sales of WSO's on this forum?




        Originally Posted by OnlineStoreHelp View Post

        I have been telling people for the last year and a half this is a huge giveaway to Walmart, Best Buy and Amazon. I have written my senators about it but of course never got anything back.

        Amazon wants to control the ecommerce market so they are pushing it to make people go on their platform. "Don't worry, we will transmit the taxes directly for you"

        Walmart and Best Buy finally have competition which is hurting them so of course they are going to lobby for a tax that doesn't hurt them.

        I told my senator, I would be willing to consider the sales tax requirement if you make it illegal to give property and sales tax exemptions to the very businesses that are lobbying for this bill.
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        • Profile picture of the author OnlineStoreHelp
          It depends. If your state charges sales tax on digital goods, you are supposed to be remitting that tax. Mind you, no law says you have to CHARGE sales tax, just that you need to remit it to the state. Here in Hawaii we have an excise tax (closer to a VAT) and many places never charge it but they still have to remit it.
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          • Profile picture of the author TerrySilver
            Here's another decent article explaining it:

            Everything you need to know about the Senate’s online sales-tax bill

            Sounds like as of now it will only effect retailers with sales 1mm+/annually. I don't totally disagree that clearer tax policies need to be looked at for internet commerce, but not in this manner or at this speed.

            Amazon doesn't care because they already have a physical presence in several states, so they are already required to file.
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            • Profile picture of the author upmatthews
              I heard it was businesses that does more than $1,000,000 in sales a year and it was in the 1st article;

              "So big business and big government are uniting to pursue their mutual interest in sticking it to the little guy. Any Internet seller with more than $1 million in annual sales would be forced to serve all of the nation's tax collectors."
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              • Profile picture of the author dburk
                Yep, the Bill in it's current state, will effect virtually all small U.S. businesses that sell anything online. Only the smallest one-man type of businesses will be exempt initially, but that will probably not last long.

                The stinker of this bill is that the biggest cost to all US based eCommerce businesses will be in submitting to an army of auditors from about 9600 separate taxing authorities. The cost of complying, even for smaller exempt stores, will probably exceed all of your current profit margins.

                And it gets even worse for small US based companies. If you think you will be able to pass this cost on to consumers, think again. :confused:

                Since foreign based companies will not be subject to the same regulation and taxation, any attempt to pass this higher cost on to consumers will simply result in the transfer of your market share to foreign operators. This is all part of the current leftist globalist movement to forcibly redistribute your wealth. If you are a US citizen, you the target of economic warfare being waged against you by your own government.

                If you have a successful eCommerce business you may want to start planning your expatriation to a business friendly country, since you are now in the cross-hair of an anti-free-enterprise government with a looming 3 trillion dollar deficit on the horizon.
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    • Profile picture of the author Craig B
      Originally Posted by mraffiliate View Post

      Yea, I think it has already passed the House. If it passes and become law then it will be impossible for the typical internet business to conduct business. It exempts brick and mortar businesses
      At least skim over the article before commenting. It hasn't even reached the House yet. The Senate still has to vote.

      As others have already stated, even if the bill is passed it will only affect those that make more than $1,000,000 in sales per year.

      It only applies to brick and mortar business if they also sell online. Otherwise, they already pay sales taxes for the state they are located in.
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      • Profile picture of the author mraffiliate
        Maybe you need to "at least skim over the article". Cispa did pass the House and now it is on it's way to the senate, where it is in limbo.


        CISPA passes House vote, faces Senate and possible veto - Technology on NBCNews.com

        Originally Posted by Craig B View Post

        At least skim over the article before commenting. It hasn't even reached the House yet. The Senate still has to vote.

        As others have already stated, even if the bill is passed it will only affect those that make more than $1,000,000 in sales per year.

        It only applies to brick and mortar business if they also sell online. Otherwise, they already pay sales taxes for the state they are located in.
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        • Profile picture of the author Craig B
          Originally Posted by mraffiliate View Post

          Maybe you need to "at least skim over the article". Cispa did pass the House and now it is on it's way to the senate, where it is in limbo.


          CISPA passes House vote, faces Senate and possible veto - Technology on NBCNews.com
          What does the Cyber Intelligence Sharing and Protection Act have to do with internet sales tax? :confused:
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          • Profile picture of the author mraffiliate
            The two aren't related.
            As you know, most congressman/women don't read the bills they sign onto, so they are being told that the Cispa bill is about sharing information between internet companies in case of national emergency or terrorist threats. So if enough congressman/women don't read the bill and go by what they are told, they won't see the internet tax that is tied to the backend of the Cispa bill.


            Originally Posted by Craig B View Post

            What does the Cyber Intelligence Sharing and Protection Act have to do with internet sales tax? :confused:
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            • Profile picture of the author Craig B
              Originally Posted by Auctiondebteliminator View Post

              What I think is stupid is that their 'fairness' doctrine and rhetoric is to 'level the playing field' for brick and mortar stores.

              Here's the problem with that.

              It's already level.


              Brick and mortar stores have an advantage with proximity. So to be 'fair' online stores get to have the advantage on price.

              Done and fair.
              Great point. In addition, individually shipping items from the warehouse is more expensive than bulk shipping to a brick and mortar store.


              Originally Posted by mraffiliate View Post

              The two aren't related.
              As you know, most congressman/women don't read the bills they sign onto, so they are being told that the Cispa bill is about sharing information between internet companies in case of national emergency or terrorist threats. So if enough congressman/women don't read the bill and go by what they are told, they won't see the internet tax that is tied to the backend of the Cispa bill.
              Like you said, they aren't related. The internet sales tax bill has nothing to do with CISPA. It is not tied to the backend.
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  • What I think is stupid is that their 'fairness' doctrine and rhetoric is to 'level the playing field' for brick and mortar stores.

    Here's the problem with that.

    It's already level.


    Brick and mortar stores have an advantage with proximity. So to be 'fair' online stores get to have the advantage on price.

    Done and fair.
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    • Profile picture of the author OnlineStoreHelp
      Originally Posted by Auctiondebteliminator View Post

      What I think is stupid is that their 'fairness' doctrine and rhetoric is to 'level the playing field' for brick and mortar stores.

      Here's the problem with that.

      It's already level.


      Brick and mortar stores have an advantage with proximity. So to be 'fair' online stores get to have the advantage on price.

      Done and fair.
      In addition, no one says they have to charge sales tax. They just have to remit it. Given that most retail stores I deal with have at least 50% gross margins if not higher (since they get better wholesale pricing then drop shippers many times), they could easily compete but choose not to.

      There is a local feed and pet food store near bye. Limited selection and they operate out of a 400 square foot area. Pricing is litterally done in whole dollars. 5LB bag of dog food? 23 bucks on the dot. No worries about taxes, change, just flat dollars. Not only that, tell them what you want and they load it right int your trunk at the curb.

      They have been around 50 years and have a line that backs up to the intersection. And this is with Petco down the street.
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  • Profile picture of the author redstanford
    so how will this affect amazon affiliates?
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  • Profile picture of the author mamamiacy
    They are going to have an exemption for less than one million sells.
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  • Profile picture of the author TravisO
    If this would become law, then let them do the job on collecting taxes to internet people who owns business.
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  • Profile picture of the author mamamiacy
    If pass, what is the date going to be effective?
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  • Profile picture of the author Paul Alden
    ..scares the hell outta me.
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  • I'm actually going to turn this into an opportunity.

    The way I see it, I'm going to do one of two things:

    Keep my same prices (my margins are high enough) and use it as a pitch to attract more customers into my copywriting, like - 'I'll pay your sales tax!' (You know, with more funneled language, though)

    Or, I'll watch the market after it passes (if it does) and if the fair market value of my items increases, then I'll increase my item's prices to the market value as well - something vigilant sellers do anyway - and STILL tell my buyers 'I'll pay your sales tax!'

    And I will - I won't add 'tax' into my cart. I'll sell my items for the fair market value, as researched from actual market values, and then take the deductions from there (tax being one of them).

    State and Federal governments don't care if you 'collect' taxes - they only care if you 'pay' them. So, it'll just be something that I take out of the margin.

    I never charge shipping and NO I don't 'add it to the price of the product' either. No matter what argument people want to make on that.

    Shipping is COVERED by the market worth - not added to it!

    You take what people are WILLING to pay, and take deductions from there.

    You don't take what people are willing to pay, and then add shipping, tax, handling, etc. Because then the price comes to a point where they are no longer 'willing to pay'.
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    • Profile picture of the author dburk
      Originally Posted by Auctiondebteliminator View Post

      I'm actually going to turn this into an opportunity.

      The way I see it, I'm going to do one of two things:

      Keep my same prices (my margins are high enough) and use it as a pitch to attract more customers into my copywriting, like - 'I'll pay your sales tax!' (You know, with more funneled language, though)

      Or, I'll watch the market after it passes (if it does) and if the fair market value of my items increases, then I'll increase my item's prices to the market value as well - something vigilant sellers do anyway - and STILL tell my buyers 'I'll pay your sales tax!'

      And I will - I won't add 'tax' into my cart. I'll sell my items for the fair market value, as researched from actual market values, and then take the deductions from there (tax being one of them).

      State and Federal governments don't care if you 'collect' taxes - they only care if you 'pay' them. So, it'll just be something that I take out of the margin.

      I never charge shipping and NO I don't 'add it to the price of the product' either. No matter what argument people want to make on that.

      Shipping is COVERED by the market worth - not added to it!

      You take what people are WILLING to pay, and take deductions from there.

      You don't take what people are willing to pay, and then add shipping, tax, handling, etc. Because then the price comes to a point where they are no longer 'willing to pay'.
      Hi Auctiondebteliminator,

      That would be a viable strategy if only...

      If only eCommerce over the Internet wasn't a world market...

      If only the tax applied equally to everyone...

      Sadly it doesn't.

      You will be stuck paying the tax, paying for accounting software to calculate the tax, paying for the accounting and filing to more than 40 separate agencies and paying for the cost to defend your accounting practices from an army of auditors from more than 9600 separate taxing authorities that are all going to want to take a look at your books.

      This is a huge expense for large companies that currently have stores in many states and US cities. As a small business, you too will now have this gigantic expense to weight you down. I hope you have a small army of accountants and tax attorneys, else you will get crushed by 9600+ separate taxing authorities that have you in their target sites.

      Exactly how much will these new accounting expenses cost you? it's hard to predict exactly, but on average it is expected to be in the high 6 figures for small businesses and over 7 figures for medium to large businesses.

      And, while you are taking on this huge new set of expenses, competitors outside the USA will have none of it. If this bill passes, it will result in a transfer of wealth from the US to foreign businesses. That is the purpose of the bill, and that is exactly what will happen.

      Perhaps a more practical strategy will be to expatriate yourself and save a half a million or more in accounting expenses, while simultaneously saving on a huge tax bill?

      While I admire you optimism... you need to wake up and smell the coffee.

      If this bill passes it will have major ramifications for your online sales. None of them positive, because the intent of the bill is to take lots of money out of your pocket. And it is aimed precisely at you, not your biggest competitors, but you in particular.
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      • Profile picture of the author jan roos
        Originally Posted by dburk View Post

        Hi Auctiondebteliminator,

        That would be a viable strategy if only...

        If only eCommerce over the Internet wasn't a world market...

        If only the tax applied equally to everyone...

        Sadly it doesn't.

        You will be stuck paying the tax, paying for accounting software to calculate the tax, paying for the accounting and filing to more than 40 separate agencies and paying for the cost to defend your accounting practices from an army of auditors from more than 9600 separate taxing authorities that are all going to want to take a look at your books.

        This is a huge expense for large companies that currently have stores in many states and US cities. As a small business, you too will now have this gigantic expense to weight you down. I hope you have a small army of accountants and tax attorneys, else you will get crushed by 9600+ separate taxing authorities that have you in their target sites.

        Exactly how much will these new accounting expenses cost you? it's hard to predict exactly, but on average it is expected to be in the high 6 figures for small businesses and over 7 figures for medium to large businesses.

        And, while you are taking on this huge new set of expenses, competitors outside the USA will have none of it. If this bill passes, it will result in a transfer of wealth from the US to foreign businesses. That is the purpose of the bill, and that is exactly what will happen.

        Perhaps a more practical strategy will be to expatriate yourself and save a half a million or more in accounting expenses, while simultaneously saving on a huge tax bill?

        While I admire you optimism... you need to wake up and smell the coffee.

        If this bill passes it will have major ramifications for your online sales. None of them positive, because the intent of the bill is to take lots of money out of your pocket. And it is aimed precisely at you, not your biggest competitors, but you in particular.
        It looks more and more like they are trying to collapse the economy on purpose! wtf
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      • Profile picture of the author BKenn01
        Don't think this will effect Affiliates. Amazon and others collect the tax on the sales. You are essentially being paid a commission for driving the buyer to the site and making the purchase.
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      • Originally Posted by dburk View Post

        While I admire you optimism... you need to wake up and smell the coffee.
        Don't get me wrong. I think the bill is a bad move, and I don't think it levels the playing field at all. I think it destroys any form of fairness and I cross my fingers everyday.

        Both as a merchant and as a consumer. But, I do have a great accountant and we've been in talks about how to handle this and have made game plans preliminarily across my platforms.

        But the general consensus is that yes, it will be a mess.

        But as far as being a merchant, there are ways I can attract my customers to still want to buy from me at a fair market value - which is what I'll stick to - and hopefully increase my sales while my competition tries to mark up items to compensate. I'll increase my volume where the market does value the items, while my competition increases their price - where the market doesn't value the item.

        It's a strategy I'll pursue based on market data and hopefully win in that market.
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        Famous for my '$1000 dollar challenge,' I've been teaching people how to DOMINATE on eBay for YEARS. Sell 100% of your items FOR A PROFIT. Rank higher, sell faster, sell more, and DESTROY your competition with a data-based approach. Quit listening to Guru's-in-training! Click now below!
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  • Profile picture of the author Danceparty
    isnt this for those who have sales over 1m per jurisdiction per year? so this will actually benefit lots of small businesses. If u take in over 1m, just diversify into different llcs and problem solved. Another option is to incorporate offshore.
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