Who cares about post counts?

[Steven Wagenheim]

Originally Posted by John Taylor

Post count on it's own is not a useful
indicator, it's just a number.

However, when you see someone
with less than 30 posts contributing
nothing but one-liners in a short period
of time it alerts you to a potential
problem.

We can't eliminate post count, simply
because there are rules conditional
upon it.

John

John, you bring up a good point and I forgot about that.

So how about when a person reaches a certain number of posts, say,
1,000, their profile reads "Over 1,000 posts".

I don't know...just looking for answers to this post count ridiculousness
because on some level, it is absurd especially when you have some guy
who has absolutely no life and runs up his post count into the 10's of
thousands.

I mean what sane individual does that?

[ExRat]

Hi Eric,

Too many posts may also mean they have too much time on their hands...

Would you care to elaborate on what you mean by -

a) 'too many posts'

b) 'too much time on their hands'

RE - b) We all get 24 hours a day don't we? So presumably, anyone who spends a little more time than others on the forum, unless they have some sort of issue that causes it, is making a conscious decision to spend more time on the forum than others.

So what is the point of your statement?

The forum is nice, and a serious hobby for some, but reading and posting takes time.

I have to imagine many are too busy running their business to spend that much time here.

I see many posts about automation and auto-pilot business. I've even made some myself.

The point I made above (you didn't address me directly but I'm answering as if you did anyway, because I disagreed with the guy who's post you thanked) wasn't so much that it would be better that other people spent more time on the forum or made more posts, it was that the time they DO spend on it, it would be appreciated more if there was more useful/positive/helpful/educational substance to it.

Just do a search for the countless members who cut their time on the forum to focus on doing exactly what this forum is about... making money.

It's also a discussion forum about making money.

If you leave that part out (IE the discussion and the education that derives from it) it's so much easier to justify a selfish attitude towards contributing and giving back. Have you never seen posts from successful people here, suggesting that to be successful, you can't just focus on making money, there has to be something else to it - for example, providing value? Are they lying? Are they mistaken?

Or is your point a totally moot one?

As I explained above -

If everyone adopted aamccall's attitude, there would never have been anything here for him to learn from and achieve his goals with in the first place.

Perhaps you are suggesting that someone like me, with a high post count, should stop posting any posts that are purely to try and help others and focus totally on only posting to 'make money?' If you're not suggesting that, perhaps you could elaborate on what your point is? (If you can spare the time of course).

Hi aammcall,

I appreciate the apology and also the fact that this all started because you were moderating - which is one of the best ways to give back.

I realise I didn't hold back on my opinion above, and I realise that you may well have received the flak on behalf of many others who have expressed similar thoughts, but not got both barrels.

But in fairness to myself -

All I was doing was trying to get across that those with low post counts have many resons for not posting

...you actually ended up doing a bit more than that, and the main reason you ended up providing was 'selfishness' - because 'Eben Pagan said it's OK to be like that.'

I hope you understand why I responded the way I did. No hard feelings - it's just a discussion, and I am involved here to learn as much as anyone else.

Shockingly, (to some) my high post count does not actually signify that I enjoy and make a habit of wasting time. I find the time to come here.

[Steven Wagenheim]

To Paul, Roger and John Taylor:

If you know me, you know by now that I am not a suck up. I've had more
battles with you 3 than I care to admit to. I've acted like an ass and worse.

I can honestly say that I greatly look forward to most of your insightful
posts. John, you're not as long winded as Paul and Roger, but when you
say something it cuts right to the chase and has so much meaning, unlike
myself who, at times, has a habit of rambling on into the black night.

If I could collect every post that these gentlemen have made here related to
running a business and bound them in a book, I'd probably be one of the
most knowledgeable marketers on the planet just from their posts alone.

Post count does mean something when you actually have something to
say. Otherwise, it's kind of like that crappy music (I use that term loosely)
that you hear on those teeny bop stations that do nothing but fill up
the airwaves with useless noise.

I have been way too guilty of that myself.

I guess what I am trying to say, to the rest of you, is to look at the
quality of what one says. There are people here with fewer than 100
posts who have said some incredible things. I won't mention their names
here because I don't want to embarrass them.

Just because one likes to speak a lot doesn't mean he has anything to say.

There is an old Chinese proverb that everybody should take to heart.

It goes like this.

"Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because
they have to say something."

I have been guilty of the latter way too often.

Post count by itself doesn't tell the whole story.

[ragstworiches]

Perhaps if instead the post count was removed and your annual income was included, we would see who was successful and who was all talk.

This however would be far to crude, the best we can really on is to use the post count as an indicator of someone's knowledge in the field and see the content of what they write as the real value.

Phil

[ExRat]

Hi Steven,

Cheers. I would add that I'm not oblivious to the fact that many people don't like my bluntness, directness, sarcasm and at times, acid tongue.

But we all have our own communication styles and I happen to believe that mine is the best way forward for me to get my point across.

I would also add that there are quite a few other warriors, many of them who have been here a lot longer, who will tell me in the same direct manner that I use, if they think that I'm incorrect, unnecessarily harsh or rude, acting like an idiot - and many other things. Some of you will recall the many times that I have apologised.

But within this thread, you will see many comments that cast indirect aspersions and make insinuations - and the insinuations that they make aren't too pleasant. The people who do this are often careful to keep those comments indirect - they don't aim it at any one named individual, just a vague group.

It's quite clear that this is often done purely so that if someone rounds on them, they can try and wriggle out of any responsibility by resorting to wordplay, and then they often apply more insinuations and aspersions.

Above all else, this gets my back up because it's unhelpful and not conducive to discussion that has a positive and productive outcome.

And this is one of the reasons why I am even more direct, and I try to make sure that if I'm going to make an accusation, and make it firmly, that it's not done in a scattergun manner - therefore less people get caught in the crossfire, but it also gives me no wiggle room.

I rarely selectively quote people for the purpose of twisting their words, and I try very hard not to twist their words at all - which of course, means that if I am to discuss vague insinuations, I leave myself open to the possibility of being challenged that I AM twisting words.

I felt it prudent to add this here, so that readers can at least see some of the reasons why I take such a direct, blunt approach. It's not just because I enjoy being an argumentative troll - only partly

[Steven Wagenheim]

ExRat;960866]
Cheers. I would add that I'm not oblivious to the fact that many people don't like my bluntness, directness, sarcasm and at times, acid tongue.

I'm not so sure about the acid tongue but I do know that there are many
posts that you and Paul make that go right over my head. I'm a simple
thinker and I say my peace simply. So when you guys get all philosophical
and start using $20 college words, I am pretty much lost in the sauce.

The only way for me to get my point across is to say it simply, which means,
many times, that I have to use more words than you or Paul might use. As
a matter of fact, Paul once commented that, when I said that I wished I
could write like him (who wouldn't?) that my writing style was just different,
not better or worse. The only thing he said that was really different was
that I'd need to use more words to get my point across whereas he could
make the same point, sometimes in a sentence.

I have to admit, I love the way he can say one thing and it speaks
volumes. I don't have that gift. So I go with what I can do. The upside
to that is I've had very few people ever tell me that they didn't know
what I was talking about.

Anyway, sorry, I know this has nothing to do with what you just said,
just be yourself Roger.

My mother used to have a saying.

"To thine own self be true."

I didn't understand it when I was younger.

I do now.

[Paul Myers]

Steven,

The only thing he said that was really different was that I'd need to use more words to get my point across whereas he could make the same point, sometimes in a sentence.

If I'm thinking of the same comment, I believe I said something more like:

Not better or worse. Just different. Where I might take a while and write one long post, you'd make a number of posts in the same amount of time. We'd end up conveying the same amount of info but, despite my verbosity, I'd eventually say it in fewer words. On the flip side, people would have more opportunities to learn something from your multiple posts.

Separate from those comments, I try to look at results, and how they vary depending on learning styles. That's why I'm cautious about saying one thing is better or worse than another. Sometimes there's a clear difference, but often it comes down to the questions: For who, and under what circumstances?


Paul

[Steven Wagenheim]

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

Steven,If I'm thinking of the same comment, I believe I said something more like:

Not better or worse. Just different. Where I might take a while and write one long post, you'd make a number of posts in the same amount of time. We'd end up conveying the same amount of info but, despite my verbosity, I'd eventually say it in fewer words. On the flip side, people would have more opportunities to learn something from your multiple posts.

Separate from those comments, I try to look at results, and how they vary depending on learning styles. That's why I'm cautious about saying one thing is better or worse than another. Sometimes there's a clear difference, but often it comes down to the questions: For who, and under what circumstances?


Paul

Yeah, that's it. My memory is shot these days, but you hit the nail on
the head. I don't remember what thread it was as it was so long ago but
I vaguely remember the conversation.

At least when Alzheimer's hits I'll have an excuse to be so fog headed.

[Paul Buckley]

Post count alone means little. Join date carries more weight with me. Actually, I factor all the information contained in the four lines below a posters name and avatar when forming an estimation of the value of a post.

[Simmvee]

Well, right now for me post count means a lot. I can't so much as send a PM to anyone as of a little while ago.

[ERPConsultant]

Originally Posted by CDarklock

Forget the question of whether you do or don't contribute. Can anyone else here show me where, exactly, this forum requires me to contribute? As far as I know, I don't have to contribute squat, and neither does anyone else.

We are, however, required to meet certain standards of behaviour... and when we don't, we get infractions.

The forum does seem to require that you have at least 30 posts in order to post in most of the forums. Although well-intentioned, I am wondering how to make inquiries in the WSO forum regarding some offers.

Agree that certain standards of behaviour should be required to keep it civil.

[OnlineMasterMind]

Nothing wrong with being active on forums... BUT, most people netting 3K plus daily sure as hell don't have a 3K post count at any forum. Of course there are exceptions but that's a fact.

In other words... 90%+ of the people posting on forums with authority and high post counts still have a full time job and are probably posting from their job while their boss isn't looking.

Draw your own conclusions.

[Steven Wagenheim]

Originally Posted by OnlineMasterMind

Nothing wrong with being active on forums... BUT, most people netting 3K plus daily sure as hell don't have a 3K post count at any forum. Of course there are exceptions but that's a fact.

In other words... 90%+ of the people posting on forums with authority and high post counts still have a full time job and are probably posting from their job while their boss isn't looking.

Draw your own conclusions.

What facts do you have to back that statement up with?

I don't have a full time job. Haven't had one since 2000. No, I don't make
3K a day either, but I do earn 6 figures a year which I don't think is too
shabby for a guy who now spends a good part of his day either in the
recording studio or blasting away at enemy flying saucers.

You draw your own conclusions.

[Ewan Cormack]

This isn't really a normal forum.

On most forums, having a massive post count means that you don't really have a life, and you're obsessed with that particular forum.

This is a business forum. Why wouldn't successful businesspeople want to interact with other successful businesspeople?

In the short time that I've been a member here, I've got more information to help me make money than at any other time in my life. Of course I'm going to try to give back to other members whenever I can.

On top of all that, a forum like this is a great place to network and find others who can help you grow your business.

Having said all that, I wouldn't judge people by their post count. I judge people by their posts, and by the relationships that they have with others.

[Richard Tunnah]

Originally Posted by OnlineMasterMind

Nothing wrong with being active on forums... BUT, most people netting 3K plus daily sure as hell don't have a 3K post count at any forum. Of course there are exceptions but that's a fact.

In other words... 90%+ of the people posting on forums with authority and high post counts still have a full time job and are probably posting from their job while their boss isn't looking.

Draw your own conclusions.

I'm sorry but how can that be a fact? There's so many variables! There's a bunch of highly successful people that have a 3k+ post count on this forum! Maybe some don't post as much now but many do contribute.

Rich

[hugofortin]

Hi,

Everybody use the forum for their own goals and needs. Everybody are different. We have to respect those differences.

bye

Hugo

[sogeshirts]

This forum is basically loaded with great information no matter how high or small a persons post count is. I haven't seen too many threads that I haven't learned something from.

[Eric Lorence]

Hello Roger,

The title of the thread is "Who cares about post counts?" and my response was to that.

I don't care about post counts, and that is the reason why.

If someone... anyone... has the time and inclination to spend that much time on a forum... any forum... so be it.

If they have achieved that much success that they can... more power to them.

Though for someone who has achieved such "great success", why be bothered by whom someone else "thanked" or that they have an opinion different from yours. It is a discussion after all.

[Paul Myers]

All I know is I gotta have 20 posts to respond to certain things. Why?

Hmmm. Unless Allen changed things, it's 15 for one function and 30 for some others. I know that one of the recent "reports" that included the Warrior Forum as a place to "make fast cash" said 20. That dude has probably been responsible for a whole lot of people getting banned from here.

Those limits were put in place to slow down the onslaught of crap from people who come here to take advantage of certain benefits that were intended originally for established members. They work with rational people most of the time, even if they annoy them. They're usually ignored by idiots and spammers, which is why running up your post count quickly often results in getting banned.


Paul

PS: I just re-checked. The "report" I was referring to actually said 10, not 20. Who's saying 20?

[Rod Cortez]

Originally Posted by OnlineMasterMind

Nothing wrong with being active on forums... BUT, most people netting 3K plus daily sure as hell don't have a 3K post count at any forum. Of course there are exceptions but that's a fact.

In other words... 90%+ of the people posting on forums with authority and high post counts still have a full time job and are probably posting from their job while their boss isn't looking.

Draw your own conclusions.

And you obtained this proven, empirical evidence from where?

[Troy_Phillips]

I tend to listen to those with a higher post count a little more than someone with 4 post in which 2 is a one liner, one is a straight out ad and the other is a rant because they can't post a wso yet .

I came on here to learn as much as possible . I found that there was certain areas that I could give back in . Some things I don't know jack about .

Never did think about raising my post count just for the fact of raising it or for a wso ( haven't posted one yet )

Sometimes I reply with a few paragraphs . Other replies are admittedly one liners .

To those that seem to think that you can't be a serious Im and post a lot.. what type of business model have you set up for yourselves ?

The main reason I got into im was so I could have the time to do what I want and let the business run on autopilot as much as possible .

Would seem to me if your business is so time consuming that you can't spend a little time giving back, helping someone who is sincerely needing a little help , and even occasionally bull ****ting with someone , then you might be better off jumping back into the rat race .

[ExRat]

Hi Eric,

Nice wordplay (again).

You missed some questions - never mind.

If someone... anyone... has the time and inclination to spend that much time on a forum... any forum... so be it.

What does 'that much time' mean Eric? Some people have been coming to the forum for a really long time - much longer than me. (You see, I can do wordplay too. Pointless though, isn't it? More pointless than spending 'too much time' on a forum - if you're going to be on the forum at all, you might as well speak with clarity and say what you really think, eh?).

Though for someone who has achieved such "great success", why be bothered by whom someone else "thanked" or that they have an opinion different from yours. It is a discussion after all.

More wordplay. This is fun. Love the "great success" in quotes that you magically attributed to me.

I wasn't 'bothered' about who you thanked. I felt it prudent to point it out, because the intended target of your insinuations was so unclear.

Hi OnlineMasterMind,

BUT, most people netting 3K plus daily sure as hell don't have a 3K post count at any forum

Most people with about 350 posts are only earning crap money - like 3K a day or something.

90%+ of the people posting on forums with authority and high post counts still have a full time job and are probably posting from their job while their boss isn't looking.

100% of the people who hide behind anonymity on the forum work at McDonalds flipping burgers.

[Harvey Segal]

Originally Posted by ExRat

100% of the people who hide behind anonymity on the forum work at McDonalds flipping burgers.

or flipping websites


Harvey

[Paul Myers]

or flipping websites

It's not always easy to tell the difference...

"Sacred cash cows make the tastiest burgers."


Paul

[ExRat]

Hi Paul,

"Sacred cash cows make the tastiest burgers."

Not always. The last one I bought had some offline mold on it.

[Paul Myers]

Roger,

Not always. The last one I bought had some offline mold on it.

Yeah. That happens sometimes, when the bread is no good.


Paul

[kenboss]

You'll never catch ME posting a one-liner! Oops!

[marmo]

Post counts just basically mean to me nothing other then me getting to know something about you by what you posted here , the more posts you've made the more I could say learn about you , other then that post count means jack to me.

[Wrenny]

I just need 30 post so I can....


oops. nah. gl bro. ;D

[ERPConsultant]

How about putting posts of new members on hold so they don't appear until approved by a moderator in the forums where they now require to have min 30 posts to post? A newbie for example might want to post in the WSO forum to inquire about an offer. The rules can be set so that new threads in those forums cannot be started by a newbie.

[Tom Brite]

+1 post count for me w00t

Sorry had to post some newbie post count comment as it seems so fitting for this thread.

But what you say is true and that's why i left you a thanks.

Tom Brite

[gareth]

I think I'm a perfect example that post count does not reflect marketing success.

Probably when I hit paydirt I'll finally shutup.

[Gary Killops]

Post count doesn't mean a lot, however some of those who have posted a lot have some of the best quality post.

After you have been around here a while you come to recognize names so that when you see their post you know they will be good and worth reading. Some of these names have a few hundred post while others have thousands of post.

It's all about reputation rather than post counts in online forums.

Cheers!
Gary Killops

[Goatboy]

Originally Posted by nitinjain

Since i was new to this forum what does the posts count really mean to. Does it give any credit to our contribution. I don't think so..

Post count allows you to use the pm system and to offer WSOs, which apparently can make quite a bit of money. If you can raise a high post count, it will give your WSO offering a lot more authority.

As for myself, I still haven't come up with anything new to put in a WSO and I see no reason to rehash the same things that are openly available on the board and web. If I stumble across a brilliant idea of my own--which happens only once every 30 years--then I'll offer a WSO. I just really see no reason to follow the crowd and parrot the same things that everyone else is saying.

[Anthony Lex]

Just came back to this thread to see whats happening, turns out from the recent comments this thread isn't as useless as I was lead to believe. Thank you Warriors for your support.

[ChrisBa]

post count means jack.

[Ben_Curtis]

I look at post count myself, but I also look at Join Date, both of which I kind of calculate as to the probable value of the posts. I've noticed certain mugs appear time and again, and many of same have words of wisdom to impart. I skim a lot of threads/posts, but usually read the posts of the "old guard," and learn lots from them. So, I'd like to see both those stats remain.

[SolarFelineAU]

Originally Posted by Ben_Curtis

I look at post count myself, but I also look at Join Date, both of which I kind of calculate as to the probable value of the posts. I've noticed certain mugs appear time and again, and many of same have words of wisdom to impart. I skim a lot of threads/posts, but usually read the posts of the "old guard," and learn lots from them. So, I'd like to see both those stats remain.

I concur.

As a newbie to this forum, I look to the content of a post. I look to the post count of a poster, but that is not the only criteria that I use to ascertain the usefulness of a post to me.

I look to see the join date of the poster as well.

If someone has been on this forum for many years, and has a high post count, and has something instructive and enlightened to post, then my respect for them is high.

If someone, no matter how long they have been here, has something useful to say, that is something that matters to me as well.

SolarFelineAU

[DotComBum]

For me the post count is nothing, it's more important that you are really here to share your ideas and experiences.

[TheMole]

I have a suggestion. Penalize someones post count if the post is not contributing value. This is my one pet peeve on this forum. A person will ask (genuine example): "Are there any universities that presents a course in internet marketing?" And the answers are:
1. I don't know but will like to know.
2. Why do you need a university, you can learn all you need to know on this forum.
3. etc...etc...etc...
Geeezzz get with the program and answer the post for crying out load!!

[Kay King]

Posting that you sent a private message will often be deleted - the person who gets the message will have a popup so will know about it. It's useless "I pm'd you" posts that resulted in some of these restrictions. We've all had posts deleted - they are posts, not literature for the ages.

I have to say that recently I have been really frustrated with this forum...

Would be quite recent as you joined 13 days ago. Your posts seem to have been well received so why put yourself in the group who post only to complain?

kay

[gyar29]

Online communities are not much different than offline communities. Anytime someone new moves into the neighborhood those neighbors that are established in the community judge the newbie. And are also judged by the newbie.

The difference between the two is that the established member already has their own reputation within the community and therefore has the luxury of time. They do not need to quickly make judgments of the newbie. They can comfortably sit back and see how the new guy fits in.

The newbie must find someway to quickly categorize existing members. They must determine who they should interact with, those they should reserve judgment of, and those they should ignore. Unfortunately or fortunately -who's to judge- post counts, # of thanks, and join date are the tools that are supplied by the forum for someone just entering the community to make those determinations.

The newbie will eventually make adjustments to their initial determinations based on their experience with the words and actions of the members.

So do post counts matter? Sure they do, but the more experience we have with those things that really matter the less weight we give them when making judgments of our neighbors.

Eventually we find that we pay no attention whatsoever to those numbers. I rarely even think to look at them...

Except when someone posts something really dumb, then I look at them to see if the post was made by a newbie. If so, I understand a little latitude may be in order, after all they're just trying establish their own place in our community. Giving them the benefit of the doubt for a little while is just being a good neighbor. And I know that someone with many more posts than I will help guide them through the rough time when they are attempting to get established.

Gene

[hugofortin]

Originally Posted by gyar29

Online communities are not much different than offline communities. Anytime someone new moves into the neighborhood those neighbors that are established in the community judge the newbie. And are also judged by the newbie.

The difference between the two is that the established member already has their own reputation within the community and therefore has the luxury of time. They do not need to quickly make judgments of the newbie. They can comfortably sit back and see how the new guy fits in.

The newbie must find someway to quickly categorize existing members. They must determine who they should interact with, those they should reserve judgment of, and those they should ignore. Unfortunately or fortunately -who's to judge- post counts, # of thanks, and join date are the tools that are supplied by the forum for someone just entering the community to make those determinations.

The newbie will eventually make adjustments to their initial determinations based on their experience with the words and actions of the members.

So do post counts matter? Sure they do, but the more experience we have with those things that really matter the less weight we give them when making judgments of our neighbors.

Eventually we find that we pay no attention whatsoever to those numbers. I rarely even think to look at them...

Except when someone posts something really dumb, then I look at them to see if the post was made by a newbie. If so, I understand a little latitude may be in order, after all they're just trying establish their own place in our community. Giving them the benefit of the doubt for a little while is just being a good neighbor. And I know that someone with many more posts than I will help guide them through the rough time when they are attempting to get established.

Gene

Really interesting post! I enjoyed it! That comparaison is so true.

bye

Hugo

[Eric Stanley]

I agree with the above statements. I have seen GOLDEN information from people who have 10 posts and garbage posts from some Warrior's with 2,000+. I have also learned to not consider post count either when it comes to RESPECTING fellow warriors.

Some of my best customers and JV partners have come from people with extremely low post counts. They were just looking for the right information. If I were to blow off every PM from a person with a 4 post count, I don't know where I'd be today.

A word to the wise: Don't just shrug anyone off due to a low post count, and do not blindly trust somebody that has an extremely high post count either. Take all information with a grain of salt and consider your own findings and research!