Forex Robots Questions

9 replies
I'm a programmer, so I understand that most of these forex robots are performing stochastic or Bayesian analysis on past patterns of currency pairs and extrapolating those into the future and generating buy/sell signals.

For me, that's the easy part. That's just neural nets, finite state machines and fuzzy logic ... I understand that part.

But what about the actual trades themselves? These systems seem to be charging subscription fees of up to $200 (or more) per month ...

* Do they actually authorize trades?
* Are they broker specific, or are they just emailing advice?
* If I buy Forex Robot XYZ for $X per month does that mean I have to ALSO have a specific brokerage account?

Thanks
#forex #questions #robots
  • Profile picture of the author Steve B
    No.

    No.

    No.

    You can't generalize about the workings of all robots - they're not all the same - they have different features and benefits.

    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author BDazzler
      Originally Posted by Steve B View Post

      No.

      No.

      No.

      You can't generalize about the workings of all robots - they're not all the same - they have different features and benefits.

      Steve
      That's why I'm asking the question, the core will be the same, the value will be on the differences. You can answer the question or tell me I'm wrong for asking it.

      I've written enough AI to know that there are multiple approaches and multiple solutions. Still modeling and projection is a discipline with core fundamentals.
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  • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
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    Originally Posted by BDazzler View Post

    Do they actually authorize trades?
    The ones sold as "expert advisors" for Metatrader have that capability. Most others don't.

    Originally Posted by BDazzler View Post

    Are they broker specific, or are they just emailing advice?
    They're usually not broker-specific. Even the "EA" type will work at any broker with Metatrader available/enabled as a trading method. Many other services are just emailing and/or texting advice. So the answer is "sometimes".

    Originally Posted by BDazzler View Post

    If I buy Forex Robot XYZ for per month does that mean I have to ALSO have a specific brokerage account?
    Not usually, no. (I think the answer might even be "never", but I'm not certain.)

    No sensible/serious/"high net worth" forex traders are interested in using automated robots (though plenty of losers are), because they understand that if it were possible for one to make consistent profits, its manufacturer would be leasing it to a hedge-fund for tens or hundreds of thousands per month, not trying to sell it on the internet to "high net worth individuals". That's why hedge-funds (and other "finance/investment houses") are employing highly skilled, experienced professionals on substantial salaries to examine, research and test products/services which make such claims.

    Sensible forex traders also tend to be people who are perfectly well aware that whereas as it's trivially easy, these days, to produce by backfitting/overfitting a robot which can be proved to have made consistent profits over recent months/years in the forex markets, unfortunately (but not at all surprisingly! ) that doesn't correlate at all to their chances of continuing to make the same (or any) profits over future months.

    It can be very instructive indeed, to look at/work out/discover the average number of months for which subscribers to such services continue to pay for them.

    Obviously enough, what it all boils down to is the inescapable fact that if anyone had one of those things which could really and reliably make future profits, selling its information/outputs for $100/$200 per month would very clearly not be a sensible or optimal way for them to monetize it! Doing a private, exclusive deal with Credit Suisse or Goldman Sachs (both of whom are openly in the market for such toys) for $100,000 per month would be a distinctly better monetization plan. Their appraisal techniques tend to be a little more rigorous than those of the average "forex product buyer" on ClickBank, though.


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  • Profile picture of the author ElectroFX
    Well said Alexa.

    Stay away from the robots, you will just end up paying to lose money sums it up

    After trading for 10 years, and with the help of my programmer, we have automated a large amount of the trading process but are still not quite there on full automation. If you trade for a living then you will have a complete trading plan and various elements of this are repetitive. The entry triggers I use are an example along with the reasons behind how and why I manage a trade the way I do, also my money management is repetitive. When it comes to where I look for trades to occur, and in some cases when, there are so many variables that is becomes tricky to automate and much easier to just see. The level of automation we have right now allows us to tell our robot 'where' we would like an entry trigger to form, if an entry trigger doesn't form there then no trade is taken, if an entry trigger does form there then the trade is executed and managed on auto pilot.. but.. the user still made the important decision This level of automation has proven to work perfectly but I remain sceptical of any consistently profitable robot claims until we do it ourselves.. and it won't be for sale if we do

    I don't think I answered your questions directly BDazzler but they have already been answered above. Just adding my thoughts as I stumbled across the thread
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    !! Don't bother attempting Forex until you have been though all this free material !!
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  • Profile picture of the author jasonwebb71
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    Now I remember why I left here many years ago!
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  • Profile picture of the author BDazzler
    Alexa gave me a good starting point and another member of this Forum sent me a PM and demoed his robot (which was QUITE cool).

    That gave me enough keywords to google some in-deapth questions, and see some starter code for MT4 and MT5.

    There seems to be three major factors:
    1. The "system" -- every robot automates some kind of system, similar to something ElectroFX has mentioned. These systems are all over the map from very simple (1,2,3 patterns) to HIGHLY complex ...neural network pattern analysis on something like 200 indicators.
    2. The logic ... i.e the quality of the code that implements the system.
    3. The "action" ... looks like you have every type of possibility from automatically authorizing orders to sending email messages and text messages.

    It was quite fascinating and quite educational.
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  • Alexa is right in everything she said except one point:

    No sensible/serious/"high net worth" forex traders are interested in using automated robots
    She probably meant to say "retail traders". Actual trading firms and investment banks run automated trading algorithms in the futures markets all day long.
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
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      Originally Posted by Anonymous Affiliate View Post

      Alexa is right in everything she said except one point:
      She probably meant to say "retail traders". Actual trading firms and investment banks run automated trading algorithms in the futures markets all day long.
      Thank you - yes: I did mean "retail traders", of course.

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  • Profile picture of the author fxstay
    some forex robots works on 1 or 2 currency pairs only so you must find those brokers provide you lower spreads on those currency pairs ..so your answers will be this:

    No
    yes
    yes
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