Anyone heard of Henry Gold or Pat Murray?

[JMichaelZ]

What are you doing in Ohio when the original emails are supposed to have come from Malden, Massachusetts?

[Floyd Fisher]

Originally Posted by mmurtha

I have a quick question ...

If there isn't any unsubscribe link in the emails, can he be reported to the FTC?

Seems to me it will be worth shutting him down this way.

Or would that be more suicidal or detrimental for my business in the long run?


Mary

Henry lives in Singapore, so I doubt very much the FTC can do anything.

If he's violating Singapore law, then you might be able to bust him.

[Floyd Fisher]

Originally Posted by John Taylor

By the way..

I have now set up a filter so that all email from Henry and "Pat" the spammers is forwarded to the address mentioned here: FTC - SPAM - Home Page

John

John, you have got to show me how to do that. I've been dying for such an application for years.

[Blase]

I wasn't going to say anything because I though bashing
even the bad guys was forbidden.

But, Pat, who's email I also got and I would say is a spammer
said "Henry Gold guards his reputation"

That is not true, I paid $30 for express shipping and got my
package 18 days after I ordered it!

The product was crap and he got it back.

The whole experience was a nightmare.

Paul Myers said, "Henry is a schmuck, in my opinion"
VERY TRUE.

[mmurtha]

Originally Posted by Patim

In an attempt to clear the air, I uploaded my picture and added details to my profile.

As you can see by my picture, I am Not Henry Gold. I would like to ask Jason
James to look at my picture. Do I look like Henry?

As I said before, the mailing being discussed here was totally my fault.

I have been accused of finding information in an underhanded manner. I worked my
tail off for nearly 3+ weeks in July searching the internet for the contact information.

All of the information I carefully gathered is readily available to anyone. I worked
very hard and diligently to find it. I did not buy a list. I did not do anything dishonest.

I again humbly ask everyone to realize I made a mistake.

Thanks,

Pat

Pat,

We can't help it if you wasted your time doing the wrong things in gathering everyone's information. You spent the time on your own accord. How is this our problem?

What you did with everyone's info is harvest names and email addresses. If you gather people's info from their sites, then email them as you would a list without them opting in, this is unethical and possibly against the FTC law if you live in the US, especially since there was no unsubscribe link in the emails.

No one in their right mind would except this as a good practice in this business ... most certainly not the email recipriants!

The truth is, once people figured out what you did do, you lied about it. To us, that is being dishonest.

It made the original problem much worse than it should have been to rectify. Now you are dealing with a group of angry people who DO NOT trust you.


Btw, I'd drop the sainthood act, and man up to what was done.

Then I'd empty that list out of those autoresponders and put up a legitimate optin form, then market your product or service like real marketers do.


Mary

[JMichaelZ]

But boy, oh boy, if you were a buzz marketer, what better publicity could you possibly get than a hot debate in the world's most popular internet marketing forum.

[Paul Myers]

"Pat,"

It's not just one email. It's the lies and the repetition.

And, according to some folks in this thread, they got emails at addresses specifically created for Henry's 117 Christmas Gifts promotion, and that were never used anywhere else.

Who's lying, "Pat?" Them or you?

And how about the shifty way you/Henry got people to promote the thing? You know those people aren't going to get anything like the numbers you implied.

All in all, this is what we in the trade call a cluster____.


Paul

[Takuya Hikichi]

I JUST received the following email.

Greetings Takuya Hikichi,

Big BS Alert - not Murray's secret but Murray Con?
In a mailing that we received this morning from credible Tom the Toolman,
it seems he has debunked and pointed out what seems to be Murray's Con
featuring Henry Gold in a review titled:

The Murray Secret System Squeeze Page "Review" by Tom
"theToolman"

In Tom's analysis points out many CONtradictions and in some cases all
out lies that are permeated in the Murray Secret sales letter.

While we were reading through the sales letter originally - we did not fall
for all the BS hype and BS lies and we did not take the time to review it
ourselves. We seen right through the garbage and we got prepared by putting
our fishing boots after the first paragraph of the sales letter ..... Tom
has done a great job in accessing the Murray's Secret sales page and
in our opinion "Great Job Tom"!

To possibly save yourself some big bucks check out Tom's review and
see what you think for yourself:
http://link.aecnu.org/member/link.php?tid=114

[Paul Myers]

Tak,

I JUST received the following email.

It's good that people are pointing out the problems with Henry's offer, but this one is so intellectually sloppy that I wouldn't recommend it as a good analysis.

As a minor example, he quotes Henry's comment that it's not ONLY about building a "big list," and talks as though Henry said listbuilding isn't important at all.

In context, that's not even close to what he said. This is so off the point that he could easily make people sympathetic to Henry, which would suck.

Go after the scam, yes. But do it on the facts, not bad interpretations of them.


Paul

[ExRat]

Hi,

I have been accused of finding information in an underhanded manner. I worked my tail off for nearly 3+ weeks in July searching the internet for the contact information.

All of the information I carefully gathered is readily available to anyone. I worked very hard and diligently to find it. I did not buy a list. I did not do anything dishonest.

To Pat -

I don't know if you're just playing the fool here - bank robbers work very hard and diligently to break into banks - that doesn't make it right. Buying a list (where the people on the list have given consent to having their names sold) is OK (although they usually only gave consent because they didn't read the small print).

Just because you worked hard means nothing.

All of the information I carefully gathered is readily available to anyone.

Do you mean that you (or anyone) is able to extract their email addresses via whois? Or do you mean that you have made the list of emails that you (painstakingly) gathered available to everyone?

If it's the former, then just because the phone book is full of numbers doesn't mean I can ring them 50 times a day and harass people. Just because you have a doorbell doesn't mean I can ring it continually. Likewise, email addresses.

If it's the latter, then you need to clarify - have you allowed anyone else to email this list apart from yourself?

[Daniel McGonagle]

I agree with Paul's assessment of H Gold. From "personal" experience, unfortunately...

[Melkor]

Originally Posted by Patim

I I worked my
tail off for nearly 3+ weeks in July searching the internet for the contact information.

All of the information I carefully gathered is readily available to anyone. I worked
very hard and diligently to find it. I did not buy a list. I did not do anything dishonest.

Pat

Hard work on your part does not constitute a meaningful argument for the legality or honesty of your actions. That you did manually what is normally performed by a scraper bot does not constitute a material difference from the practices of spammers.

Of course that's assuming that you actually did that and didn't just mail the 117gifts mailing list. In either case, it's not even remotely related to Best Practice for permission marketing. If you aren't Henry Gold in disguise I recommend taking some time out to subscribe to the MarketingSherpa and TalkBiz newsletters and study how it's done by people who actually know what they're doing.

Sad, really. I remember Henry from back when he started his Christmas event and though he was obviously inspired by Mark Hendricks it wasn't badly done. Not that I had any personal contact beyond signing up but at the time I didn't feel like the was any list abuse going on. I wonder what happened to the man?

There is an abundance of personal tragedies around, the Lord knows. But it might be an idea to not have yours happen quite so publicly.

[David_Thompson]

My mailbox got bloody hammered and it's been
going on for more than a couple days now.

I know we all make mistakes but Pat you came here
and saw everyone complaining about getting those email
and you still think sending out you **** JV offer will get
you anywhere, you and Henry are wankers, your emails
are clogging my inbox...

--David

[dylanloh]

"Henry lives in Singapore, so I doubt very much the FTC can do anything.

If he's violating Singapore law, then you might be able to bust him."

He lives in Singapore? I didn't know that! Maybe I should pay him a vist...

[Jason James]

Originally Posted by Patim

In an attempt to clear the air, I uploaded my picture and added details to my profile.

As you can see by my picture, I am Not Henry Gold. I would like to ask Jason
James to look at my picture. Do I look like Henry?

As I said before, the mailing being discussed here was totally my fault.

I have been accused of finding information in an underhanded manner. I worked my
tail off for nearly 3+ weeks in July searching the internet for the contact information.

All of the information I carefully gathered is readily available to anyone. I worked
very hard and diligently to find it. I did not buy a list. I did not do anything dishonest.

I again humbly ask everyone to realize I made a mistake.

Thanks,

Pat

Hi Pat,
Youre right... in your picture you arent Henry Gold... I think what most people here have a problem with is that you came on here, said sorry and that you screwed up... but yet those same emails kept coming over and over several days later. All of my email address got multiple copies.

So you basically said sorry and continued to spam people anyway over and over again several days later after your remarks. I think all the people here deserve some kind of explanation as to why this is happening.

[jasondinner]

Here we go again with the "Tell a Friend" script they got running on
the site.

Now I'm getting emails from this guy:

2008-09-23_1259

That's a Jing Project link to a screenshot mods []

Jason

[John Hillage]

Just checked back on this old post - my goodness it caused a bit of debate! Glad I asked for advice before "jumping in" to any affiliate promotion!

[socrates]

Hello Everyone,

Socrates here..

I just found this thread and my name came up a couple of times so I wanted
to come in and clear any confusions.

On july 22 (my birthday) I took over henry's newlsetter. I am sure that you know, I CANT
just manually add members in bulk to any Aweber list without double confirming. So if you
are getting emails from me it means that you legitimately opted in for either mine or
henry's newsletter in the past,
There is only ONE legitimate copy of those lists with proof of optin in and that
is in MY aweber account.

If you wish to unsubscribe, please do so by using the link on the bottom of
my emails (these are aweber lists. there are no tricks here)

If you are getting emails from henry, or pat or whomever else, I have
nothing to do with it.

As part of the the agreement of taking over the newsletter,
was to use henry golds name in the from address for a while for a smooth
transition. his name will be gone within the next week or so.

Other than that I have NOTHING TO DO WITH henry or his business.

If you need to contact me privately please use the PM feature, or you can contact me
through my blog at: Marketing Secrets by Socrates Socratous or our support desk at:
Cerberus Helpdesk :: Support Center

so just to recap: Any email you receive from me will be sent to you through
an AWEBER list. you can confirm that by checking the unsubscribe link
that is sent with ALL my emails. (if you want me to manually remove your
email address from ALL my lists, please PM me)

Oh, and yes, I do send promo emails as well as content rich emails.

Best
Socrates Socratous

[socrates]

Originally Posted by Bev Clement

I've just had one to an email address I don't sign up for newsletters for. This isn't from Pat but Socrates Socratous & Henry Gold

Seems he has taken over Henry's list and he has just bought for me an brand new PLR but I have to pay him for it, and the brand new PLR I gave away on the old forum over 1 year ago

Hello Bev,
If you check that email it's from an aweber list.

In addition, EVERYTHING in my email about the PLR in question was true. That was a NEW product at least to ME. In fact I bought it the Day I said I did, right here through a WSO. This is the nature of PLR. You buy a package, then you resell it. You giving it away for free in the past is not a reason that this package isnt of true value to the some people. In fact since you created or at least promoted this package in the past (for free or a fee), you must agree that it was of value to the right people.

Best regards
-Socrates Socratous

[johnedgley]

Thus highlighting another problem - one which surely deserves its own thread - is it really ethically correct to use wso's for re-hashed plr offers? Shouldn't the source product be declared so that we at least don't con each other?

I must stress I do realise that different marketing can put a product in front of different audiences, but for my 2p I don't think plr re-hash should be allowed in wso's unless the source/lineage is made clear.

[John Taylor]

Originally Posted by johnedgley

I don't think plr re-hash should be allowed in wso's unless the source/lineage is made clear.

The rules clearly state that any product sold as a wso should be
original. Products that are based upon "Rehashed PLR" should not
be offered in the WSO section period.

John

[Harry_UK]

Hi,

I wish I had seen this thread earlier, I accepted Pat Murrays initial mailing on the basis of his association with Henry Gold.

This thread should be required reading for all newbies (like myself).

I've learned:-

- that if you dont do things right you can destroy your rep and the cost is probably greater than any short term benefit.

- that subscriber lists do get sold on and thus users may end up getting mail from people they have not requested it from (albeit they might be offered and an opt out link), so using unique address (thru aliases might be a good idea).

- that ebooks etc sold / given away without proper credits to identify their origin may well be 'recycled old dross' or worse a duplication of what you already have.

- some new names whose blogs / Warrior posts may be worth paying attention to in future.

Harry

[RichardLegg]

I'm getting MORE of these messages again - to multiple email addresses this time.

There's no unsubscribe link in any of them and I never signed up to anything from "Henry" ... at least not with all of these email addresses.

Here's where it's coming from this time:

"from Henry Gold <vip@777selfhelp.com>"

Give it a rest!

Anyone else getting these again? I don't know if it's from Henry, this Pat Murray guy, or someone completely different.

[R Hagel]

Originally Posted by RichardLegg

Anyone else getting these again? I don't know if it's from Henry, this Pat Murray guy, or someone completely different.

Yep, I got one yesterday. Subject line: "Rebecca, it's Henry Gold (Personal)."

Doesn't seem all that personal, eh?

Cheers,
Becky

[Paul Myers]

"from Henry Gold <vip@777selfhelp.com>"

That's interesting. That domain - 777selfhelp.com - is registered to Dr Joe Rubino.

Headers, please?


Paul

[R Hagel]

Paul, I just forwarded the email to you using paul [AT] talkbiz. I was just going off memory for an email address, so let me know if you have a different preference.

Cheers,
Becky

[Paul Myers]

Becky,

Thanks. That address is fine. And yes, that's Henry. Same format, and the same IP as last time. Different partners this time, but the same nonsense.

I wonder if Dr Rubino has any idea who and what he's gotten mixed up with?

That email was sent from a Hostgator server. The folks who got it might want to send copies, with full headers, to abuse [at] hostgator.com

If that doesn't work, try abuse [at] theplanet.com - that's Hostgator's upstream.

At this point, I'm convinced that the only thing that will motivate Henry to behave in an ethical fashion as far as his handling of email lists is to lose the ability to mail to them.

He's pretty much guaranteed that I'll never speak well of him in any way that could lead people to get involved with him.


Paul

[Paul Myers]

I've sent Dr. Rubino a note, pointing him to this thread.


Paul