Is this what's wrong with some Im'ers?

14 years ago

Hi,

I like your post and nice comparaison! lol

It's really important to give value in every possible. You must have in mind to help peoples, not only get their money.

Hugo

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Nathan Alexander

14 years ago

Zig Ziglar said, and I'm messing this up but it's close (maybe someone can quote it right) you can have anything you want as long as you help others get what they want.

It's not just about delivering value, it's about overdelivering. At the same time, you are in business to make a living, and you should never run from that. You should never hide what it is you stand to make from a transaction in the sense that if it's too altruistic all the time, people just won't believe you.

Sometimes you have to show and explain what you're getting out of it as well. When you're giving an unbelievable deal to your customers and they're thinking "no way..." - Don't be afraid of the fact that you gain too, and don't run from it in your sales message.

If you're providing something worth more to the person than the price they're paying, you're in business.

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kevinfar

14 years ago

You must give value in whatever you do online, however the real measure of how successful you are is how much money you are making.

At the end of the day that is the only thing that matters in my opinion. There are various things to consider in the long run, such as ethics and other stuff, however how much you make is still the best way to gauge how successful one is.

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TheRichJerksNet

14 years ago

I have said it many times over and over ... It's not all about money. Yes many will argue with that but to each his own.

I was recently asked how I monotize my forum and the answer I gave this person way, I don't. This person was shocked and asked me how on this green earth do I make sales and I have a 100% ad free forum, 100% ad free facebook apps, 100% ad free article directory, and etc..

I explained to him in simple terms that many should be able to understand..

Communication --> Socialization --> Relationships

It's really a simple process that does boil down to providing value with expecting nothing in return. You communicate with your fellow prospects and start socializing with them and build relationships.

What this does is build trust and build followers, once you have achieved that the sales will and always do follow.

Money does not = success as some claim but then again many have a different opinion on what success really is.

James

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M Thompson

14 years ago

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

I have said it many times over and over ... It's not all about money. Yes many will argue with that but to each his own.

I was recently asked how I monotize my forum and the answer I gave this person way, I don't. This person was shocked and asked me how on this green earth do I make sales and I have a 100% ad free forum, 100% ad free facebook apps, 100% ad free article directory, and etc..

I explained to him in simple terms that many should be able to understand..

Communication --> Socialization --> Relationships

It's really a simple process that does boil down to providing value with expecting nothing in return. You communicate with your fellow prospects and start socializing with them and build relationships.

What this does is build trust and build followers, once you have achieved that the sales will and always do follow.

Money does not = success as some claim but then again many have a different opinion on what success really is.

James

James i don't often agree with your sentiments but this time i am 100% in agreement...

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TheRichJerksNet 14 years ago

Originally Posted by M Thompson

James i don't often agree with your sentiments but this time i am 100% in agreement...

Thanks .. I think ....

James
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Adam Carn 14 years ago

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

What this does is build trust and build followers, once you have achieved that the sales will and always do follow.

How do they trust Rich Jerks? Hehe.

Adam
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Daniel Scott

14 years ago

It's a nice, warm, fuzzy feeling to think that the more value we give the more money we make... but it ain't entirely true.

Sure, better offers help make more sales... but anyone who thinks you have to offer value to make money... I have two words....

"Arbitrage Conspiracy".

Having a "build it and they will come mentality is down-right dangerous.

As the saying goes... "Fail to plan, plan to fail".

Adding value to people's lives is important. Let's just not forget we're in business while we do it.

-Dan

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JMPruitt

14 years ago

@Daniel Scott
James was not talking about this forum. He owns his own forum
And he has no adds, His sig has no adds, he has two special offer threads but the members promote it more than he does.

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Daniel Scott

14 years ago

Originally Posted by JMPruitt

@Daniel Scott
James was not talking about this forum. He owns his own forum
And he has no adds, His sig has no adds, he has two special offer threads but the members promote it more than he does.

Thanks for the heads up... I have edited my post to reflect this.

However, on THIS forum, James does indeed promote himself with ads... something I'm sure he'd agree with.

-Dan

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JMPruitt

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Daniel Scott

Thanks for the heads up... I have edited my post to reflect this.

However, on THIS forum, James does indeed promote himself with ads... something I'm sure he'd agree with.

-Dan

True true, he does promote here. he also runs a few WSOs He is a Marketer, and when it comes to his products, he lets us know they are available. but he does not put a bunch of adds all over the forum. He does not have any adds in his sig at his own forum, yet he still makes money.

I agree you can make money without providing value. However, My integrity is not for sale. If I don't think something is valuable, I will not sell or promote it. NO matter how much money I leave on the table.

I help a lot of people in forums, on my blog, in my emails. I am not into consulting, so I am not shorting myself to provide them with everything I know. and I sell more products because of the trust I build with those people.

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TheRichJerksNet

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Daniel Scott

Thanks for the heads up... I have edited my post to reflect this.

However, on THIS forum, James does indeed promote himself with ads... something I'm sure he'd agree with.

-Dan

Daniel,
We all "promote" ourselfs but my point was not about promoting yourself. My point was about giving to the community without asking for anything in return.

I personally myself love 100% ad free sites and as such all my sites are 100% ad free. I think I have one blog that actually has adsense on it but that is because I have been too lazy to remove them ..lol

Other than the one above, all my blogs are 100% ad free.. Now they do contain one block of text that leads to one of "MY" products but that is about it. There are no affiliate ads, no adsense ads, no CPA ads, and ect.

I much prefer to build relationships with people "without" expecting anything in return. That may mean helping them pay for a product they want, donating to a cause they beleive in, or in many cases giving away my product for free. This also could mean just taking the time to answer questions they may have when they send me a PM.

Sometimes you never hear from some of these people again and other times you actually build a following of people that trust your judgement.

While we are all in business this does not mean that all of us are after that next $$$ that we can squeeze out of someone. Sure we all got bills to pay and a life to live but that does not mean everything you do has to be about money.

But then again this is me and it may not be for everybody or work for everybody.... The best you can do is be who you are.

James

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MissTerraK

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Daniel Scott

It's a nice, warm, fuzzy feeling to think that the more value we give the more money we make... but it ain't entirely true.

Sure, better offers help make more sales... but anyone who thinks you have to offer value to make money... I have two words....

"Arbitrage Conspiracy".

Having a "build it and they will come mentality is down-right dangerous.

As the saying goes... "Fail to plan, plan to fail".

Adding value to people's lives is important. Let's just not forget we're in business while we do it.

-Dan

Are you assuming people do not plan what they are building when they say build it and they will come then?:confused:

Trying to understand the thought process behind the statement is all

MissTerraK

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TheRichJerksNet

14 years ago

Good question Adam ... I have no idea, maybe we could ask some of my members or customers ....lol

James

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Adam Carn 14 years ago

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

Good question Adam ... I have no idea, maybe we could ask some of my members or customers ....lol

James

Hehe just kidding man, it's not all in the name is it?

Adam
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- TheRichJerksNet 14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Adam Carn
  
  Hehe just kidding man, it's not all in the name is it?
  
  Adam
  
  Oh I know you was ....lol Not everything is as it seems ...
  
  James
  
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MissTerraK 14 years ago

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

Good question Adam ... I have no idea, maybe we could ask some of my members or customers ....lol

James

By getting to know the real person through socializing and relationships and discovering the person behind the persona!

Very simple!

MissTerraK
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forous

14 years ago

It is indeed hard to market online. Some may believe you some may not. I would like to agree to James comment above. It is good to build trust first. Everything else will just follow.

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ALuth

14 years ago

Let's take a look at basic marketing principles real quick. The most important of all of these principles is building a relationship strategy.

The relationship strategy has 3 prescriptions that you must follow to sustain a long-term successful relationship.

The customer comes first
Adopt a win-win attitude
Add value whenever possible

If you follow these 3 guidelines, you will build trust, establish credibility, and make money. Sell for the customers needs and give them what they want.

If you try and push, it's just going to end up being your downfall.

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Shannon Herod

14 years ago

You have truly hit the nail on the head. That is wrong with not only most IM'rs but practically all of them. All the "gurus" included. I have fallen into that trap as well. Going around chasing money. When you chase money you end up broke.

When you give value, somehow the value keeps coming to you.

Talk soon,

Shannon

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zachary0611

14 years ago

It's kind of like the guy who wants that girl he likes to want him back, but he only repels her by acting needy and desperate in his approach, instead of qualifying her.

This comment makes me think you are in the Pick Up Artist Community

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bgmacaw

14 years ago

Originally Posted by traderfx

Many even myself at one time looked at Internet marketing as being about the money.

Business, not just IM, is about making money.

Delivering value, building relationships, etc. is a means to an end, nothing more and that 'end' is making money. And these touchie-feelie means aren't the only way to reach that end. After all, some of the wealthiest corporations around really suck at delivering value and building relationships with customers.

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Zanti

14 years ago

Originally Posted by bgmacaw

Business, not just IM, is about making money.

Delivering value, building relationships, etc. is a means to an end, nothing more and that 'end' is making money. And these touchie-feelie means aren't the only way to reach that end. After all, some of the wealthiest corporations around really suck at delivering value and building relationships with customers.

Do you mean companies like GM, Chrysler, Goldman Sacks, Citibank, Leaman Brothers etc... Hmmm.

While the touchie-feelie means aren't the only way to making money but for me it is the way to be wealthy. Wealth is not (again for me) only associated with money but with the integrity of the person making money.

I prefer to be a leaver and not a taker in this world and I do that by giving to my customers and not focus all my efforts on taking money and "leaving nothing on the table" as I've read so many in the forum talk about.

But to each his own, what works for me and others will not work for everyone.

Z

Brian "Zanti" Alexzander

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bgmacaw

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Zanti

Do you mean companies like GM, Chrysler, Goldman Sacks, Citibank, Leaman Brothers etc... Hmmm.

Good examples, but I was mostly thinking about "Wal-Mart".

I'm also thinking about companies like one I'm doing some work for that make money hand over fist by basically being mean and nasty to people who're in desperate financial straits. Not much adding value or positive relationship building there.

And, on the touchie-feelie dimension, I don't have a high trust level for a businessperson who wants to be my pal. After all, people thought Bernie Madoff was a nice guy until the truth came out.

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Zanti

14 years ago

Originally Posted by bgmacaw

Good examples, but I was mostly thinking about "Wal-Mart".

I'm also thinking about companies like one I'm doing some work for that make money hand over fist by basically being mean and nasty to people who're in desperate financial straits. Not much adding value or positive relationship building there.

And, on the touchie-feelie dimension, I don't have a high trust level for a businessperson who wants to be my pal. After all, people thought Bernie Madoff was a nice guy until the truth came out.

Wal-Mart, isn't that the company that has been sued for unfair labor practices around the world and violation of workers rights?

Like I said, we each operate to the beat of different drummers.

I personally couldn't work for a company that's mean and nasty and takes advantage of people in desperate financial straits. But that's me. No judgment on those who do.

I can only be responsible for what I do and how I treat people. This works for me and not for everyone else.

It's really not wanting or trying to be a customer's pal, it's about treating the customer with respect and giving more in value than what I receive in return.

Like what Frank Kern said above in the video. But that's more of that touchie-feelie stuff, what the heck does Kern know anyway, he's probably a Bernie Madoff in disguise.

Hey.

I wish you the best in success.

Z

Brian "Zanti" Alexzander

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Hesaidblissfully 14 years ago

One of the first quotes I heard when I first started learning about marketing was "Everybody's favorite radio station is WII-FM: 'What's In It For Me?'" With that in mind, it's the PERCEPTION of value that motivates people to buy, not necessarily the actual value of the item for sale (if there even is such a thing as "actual value" in the first place).

That's why you have people who say you should just give away all your best stuff for free, and other people who counter that by saying, "Well, yeah, but what about all those crappy products that promise the world and underdeliver...and yet they still sell like hotcakes?" In both examples, it's the perception of value that influences the prospect to buy.

That perception of value could take the form of you giving away a bunch of free content. It could take the form of you giving away no free content at all, but having a really convincing sales letter. It could take the form of exclusivity, scarcity, convenience, bargain prices...it could be something fear based, etc.

The light side of marketing, the dark side of marketing and every shade in between can work, if your offer convinces the prospect that what they want will be supplied by your product.

Having said that, I agree with the OP. It's not even necessarily about newbies "giving value" in the sense of giving away a bunch of cool free stuff. It's that most newbies don't understand how to make their offers and their overall marketing process appeal to the prospect's self-interest.
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DogScout

14 years ago

My favorite 1½minute video...again. Lol

YouTube- Broadcast Yourself.

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Daniel Scott

14 years ago

Integrity etc is great.

I'm not denying that... and speaking for myself... the day I give up my honor is the day I give up living.

But the OP was purely about money and profit.

That's it.

The whole discussion about ethics/morals really doesn't enter into it.

As for "big companies"...

Microsoft... the company who made the richest man in the world... have been accused many times of shady business practices.

Nintendo are also a good example. They released the DS... then the DS Lite... no the DSi.

Those guys knew *exactly* what they were doing when they left features out of each preceding console... getting people to buy stuff soon.

It hasn't hurt *their* sales.

Car companies do it too... they're always a fair way ahead of their current releases.

Not the way I choose to run my biz... but I'm definitely leaving cash on the table.

-Dan

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TheRichJerksNet

14 years ago

By getting to know the real person through socializing and relationships and discovering the person behind the persona!

Very simple!

MissTerraK

My point exactly ....

James

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Shannon Herod

14 years ago

The great Jim Rohn said... "We get paid for bringing value to the marketplace." Not... you get paid for creating WSO products for people looking for a magic pill.

Shannon

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CDarklock

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Shannon Herod

The great Jim Rohn said... "We get paid for bringing value to the marketplace." Not... you get paid for creating WSO products for people looking for a magic pill.

But the closer you get to that magic pill, the more you're paid.

Deliver the promise of a magic pill, and you get paid a certain amount, because that promise has a certain value.

Deliver the reality of a magic pill, and you get paid a lot more, because it's worth a lot more.

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Erik Ortega

14 years ago

The problem with internet marketers is that so many of the newbies i've talked to have quit their job, lost their job, are in debt, or have no money what so ever so they don't want to hear about providing value until they are making money.

If you want to be successful you've got to look at this like an investment, come strong on the front end and you'll get great rewards on the back end. It's funny how many of even the most self pro-claimed "successful guru's" will stuff their sites with affiliate links without providing truly groundbreaking information.

If a warrior on here decided to mentor me for free for a few weeks or w/e and developed a bond with me and then said "listen, I've put together this system that has worked for me, I'm selling it if you'd like." I'd be more apt to buy the product because I know its coming from a trusted source.

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dsmpublishing

14 years ago

Hi guys

i find that there are a lot of sellers out there that come across as desperate and only want the big bucks and this is why they fail so much.

They will want an income stream that takes them six months to set up in the hope of $5000 a week from it. But what if this one income stream fails?

I would rather have 100 that bring me in $50 a week any day then im not acting desperate and can have several of them and if two or three flop it wont make me bankrupt.

kind regards

sam
X

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Todd-O

14 years ago

Great post about getting back to the basics of business like some once said "find a need and fill it" then the money comes rolling in after. I sometimes find myself thinking too much about how much cash I need to make each week when I could be thinking about how to creat value in my products!

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Is this what's wrong with some Im'ers?

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