Are We Getting Cheap?

29 replies
Hey,

Here's something that really gets me mad. Let me know what your take on this whole issue is, ok?

So... a few months back, I read on John Reeses blog a post called "Why You Should Listen To Your Customers" and it talks about how he was releasing this new class at $497 but then people freaked out a little and they wanted something cheaper, so he took parts of the original course out, reformatted it and changed the price to $97.

and the people are like... OH! Thanks for lowering the price! You're so cool.

I am sitting here like... WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH THESE PEOPLE?

I mean, Filsame's last product that he did with Anik was like $67 or $97. I don't remember now.

CHEAP!

I mean, Fortin lowered the price of The Copy Doctor to like $300 or so, Traffic Secrets 2 is much cheaper than the original.

The ONLY person that I am aware of that is not lowering his prices is KERN.

What's going on with us?

I mean, I look at this forum and I see a bunch of $7 or $17 WSOs that promise WHO KNOWS WHAT. I mean, take a look at this:

http://www.warriorforum.com/warrior-...1000-days.html

This warrior is promising 1000 dollar days for $12!

Now, I assume the WSO delivers because he's an honest guy. I don't know him, I don't have the WSO, but assuming it delivers on the promise, should he not charge more for it?

I mean... 12 bucks! Come on...

or this:

http://www.warriorforum.com/warrior-...ave-today.html

OVER $1000 a day for $17. From a great Warrior too...

By the way, none of the above links are affilate links. Just straight copy and paste.

On top of that still, I keep noticing MORE and MORE offered for a simple email signup.

So, what's happening to us as an industry?

are we getting cheap?

What's your guys' opinion?

MorganRichman


ps. I accidently posted this as a WSO. My apologies to the moderators.
#cheap
  • Profile picture of the author Louise Green
    I'm not sure why the big guns are selling at low prices, but I know why I am:

    IM isn't my main niche, my money is made in other niches and it's so ridiculously easy that it's not right to charge a huge sum of money for something that anybody can do.

    Selling at this price it's easy to test the market to find out if there's a demand for the product and to judge the response of it, before taking things further.
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  • Profile picture of the author Gene Pimentel
    When you purchase from a WSO that claims it will show you how to make $1000 for $12, you are not buying a $1000 bill. You are buying an idea, and a plan on what you need to accomplish that. The cost is not the $12. The cost is the time and effort you need to put into earning the $1000.

    Likewise, you can buy a blueprint for $12 to build a $300,000.00 house.
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    • Profile picture of the author KarlWarren
      Originally Posted by Gene Pimentel View Post

      Likewise, you can buy a blueprint for $12 to build a $300,000.00 house.
      I love that!!!

      "We" are only getting cheap, because "We" allow ourselves to be. People will pay what they believe to be the right value for a service/product. If you position yourself correctly, and illustrate the value of your offer effectively - people will pay MORE than they pay your competition for a similar product.

      "We" are just getting lazy, and want to make sales without putting in the effort to do so.

      Kindest regards,
      Karl.

      Please note... my use of quotation marks is not argumentative, only illustrative - this point, I feel I must clarify as I used them in a reply to another thread and was accused of having a 'superiority complex'

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    • Profile picture of the author Morgan Richman
      Originally Posted by Gene Pimentel View Post

      When you purchase from a WSO that claims it will show you how to make $1000 for $12, you are not buying a $1000 bill. You are buying an idea, and a plan on what you need to accomplish that. The cost is not the $12. The cost is the time and effort you need to put into earning the $1000.

      Likewise, you can buy a blueprint for $12 to build a $300,000.00 house.
      exactly. I just think that if we have something good, we really should not sell it cheap. I mean, as someone else stated, we should position ourselves and still try to keep the prices high.

      That's why it bugs me when I see cheap products. It really does.

      MorganRichman
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  • Profile picture of the author dave147
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    • Profile picture of the author Morgan Richman
      Yes, I understand that. What I tried to convey is that overtime the price tags on WSOs get lower and lower and in my opinion, too low.

      MorganRichman

      Originally Posted by dave147 View Post

      You can't compare WSO prices to the big guns dropping their prices. WSO prices are supposed to be so much cheaper than the price the general public have to pay. That is what makes the WSO area so great.
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    • Profile picture of the author Tina Golden
      Morgan, I'm not sure what your point is with this post. No one is telling you that YOU have to lower YOUR prices so are you saying the lower prices are affecting your business in some way?

      I don't see this situation as any different than the retail markets. When sales are slow, they often lower prices to get people in the door. They are hoping that those people will buy other stuff once their in the store.

      Perhaps IMers are doing the same thing. Get people into your sales funnel at a low price point, feed them value and gain their trust...next thing you know, they're much more willing to buy your higher priced goods.

      Tina
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      • Profile picture of the author John Hixson
        Originally Posted by TMG Enterprises View Post

        Perhaps IMers are doing the same thing. Get people into your sales funnel at a low price point, feed them value and gain their trust...next thing you know, they're much more willing to buy your higher priced goods.

        Tina
        I think that is the point. For me it is simple, I need to build a reputation and a list - so what do I do? I offer my work cheaper than I might otherwise in order to develop those things.

        Prices will likely increase as I make a reputation and have a list of buyers I know are hungry for my product.

        As for the top level marketers - let us assume they know what they are doing. As a couple of posters have rightly pointed out what is happening is that there is a huge amount of free information available - so it could be that people are spending less for info products in the IM niche, they can get the info anyway.

        So, as Tina rightly says, taking these people who would be reluctant to pay $500 and asking them to pay $50 - but with a tremendous sales funnel, upsells etc could well be making the same amount.

        Breaking a $500 info product down into 10 x $50 ones that get sold as modules, upsells etc is likely to have a large effect on the numbers you can target. It opens up new markets (though also does decrease the 'exclsuive' feel to it). Does it work? I have never tried releasing a $500 product to answer that but I would suggest the experts know what they are doing.

        To answer the OP - yes we possibly are getting cheao - but it is more to do with information overload on already free sources making us reluctant to pay out for yet more information that many know already they won't act on. Perhaps the IM crowd is jaded by information? Just look at what you can get on the WF for free!
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      • Profile picture of the author Morgan Richman
        Tina,

        I guess my point here is that I feel part of the community and it kind of personally hurts me inside that we become a little "cheap" as I call it. I am not directing this at everyone. I am just talking about us as a group.

        MorganRichman

        Originally Posted by TMG Enterprises View Post

        Morgan, I'm not sure what your point is with this post. No one is telling you that YOU have to lower YOUR prices so are you saying the lower prices are affecting your business in some way?

        I don't see this situation as any different than the retail markets. When sales are slow, they often lower prices to get people in the door. They are hoping that those people will buy other stuff once their in the store.

        Perhaps IMers are doing the same thing. Get people into your sales funnel at a low price point, feed them value and gain their trust...next thing you know, they're much more willing to buy your higher priced goods.

        Tina
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  • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
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    I've never seen an IM course that was worth what the gurus were charging, but for me, the old saying "it's the economy, stupid" is applicable.

    Many people without jobs, financial hardship everywhere. I sell my products cheap, so people can afford them without cutting into bill and food budgets. Simple as that. I sell a lot more products by selling at a reasonable price than I would if I were to attempt to position them as exclusive.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Hixson
      Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

      I've never seen an IM course that was worth what the gurus were charging, but for me, the old saying "it's the economy, stupid" is applicable.

      Many people without jobs, financial hardship everywhere. I sell my products cheap, so people can afford them without cutting into bill and food budgets. Simple as that. I sell a lot more products by selling at a reasonable price than I would if I were to attempt to position them as exclusive.
      Another valid point (not sure how I skipped over this post)> I should imagine (I have no stats on it though) that IM is more popular than ever right now as more people desperate for cash turn to IM to try make money online. That means huge swarms of potential customers - but because they are desperate to be earning they haven't as much cash available to spend on info products. So instead of an increase in value for the products an increase in the number sold is the way forward (market vs supermarket business plans perhaps a decent analogy)
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  • Profile picture of the author J Bold
    Is who getting cheap? So you are one of those who wants to sell products for $1000 and more? For what reason? It better be damn good to be complaining about cheap products.

    In my opinion those $3000 products are often way overpriced. It's because many who sell to the IM crowd are realizing in this day and age their information is not that valuable, as many fantastic WSOs are out there that can give you great info for less than dinner for two, and that's the way it should be. Go to the book store, look at best selling business books, how much do they cost? I understand they sell products under the guise of it being education and a course and thus that's why someone like Kern sells his products for a few thousand dollars (never bought his stuff, but he could be one of those few who actually is worth it, but I don't know), but education is over-priced because of all the overhead of buildings and campuses and staff on college campuses. I don't see the reason to complain about cheap products. A lot of people are getting smarter when it comes to expensive products because there are often high complaints on big number products, as some of them are truly all hype and fluff and little meat. IMers want the meat, as the fluff is getting to be overkill.

    So, some of these guys are not worth it, not at all, but while there may be a few who really have such great information that it is worth the high dollar pricing, I think some of them are realizing their stuff is just not that great and they may get more sales overall if they lower the price. Either that or they realize a lot of newbies are not going to be willing to part with $1000 for their course, and that's who they're marketing towards.
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  • Profile picture of the author Arun Kumar
    Excellent topic. I see that most of the people would like to purchase cheaper price products or services more. Coming to me, when i offer my services for cheap price, i use to get more orders and when i offer the reasonable price to the work which i do then i won't get much orders. Also some of my clients use to ask me discounts as they won't look at, how hard we work. Change should come on themselves.
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  • Profile picture of the author steve-wilkins
    WSO- stands for Warrior Special Offer which means it must be a lot cheaper than the original price it sells for and offer a significant discount to Warriors.

    Some marketers are simply lowering their prices just because the market is so competitive right now, one big marketer lowers their prices and the rest follow. It's only good news for those who are just getting started and can pick up some bargain price products that can help them succeed.
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  • Profile picture of the author Taylor French
    I've heard that a lot of the "gurus" are having to drop prices because people aren't as willing to pay the higher prices anymore. I've also heard that some of them are looking to get out of IM entirely. (For real, not just for show.)

    Maybe there are finally just too many products that rehash the same stuff that people are learning not to keep buying and buying, especially the higher priced stuff.

    Maybe the economy just won't support those kinds of prices right now.

    Maybe people are just fed up with being charged so much for information.

    Who knows? But I think it's about time people wised up and stopped paying so much for the rehashed crap. Every once in a while a product is truly worth a higher price, but most of the time the same thing can be had for $17 somewhere else.
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  • Profile picture of the author ZhaoAnXin
    I don't think it's about the market getting cheaper.

    All of these guys have high ticket products. Mass Control, PLF, etc. are all like 2k or so. Traffic Secrets 2.0 was about $500 as I remember.

    These dudes are all smart business men and I would guess it comes down to them testing and realizing one of three things:

    A. The market was was tired of 4 figure offers
    B. They were losing a huge part of the market segment who couldn't afford the 4 figure offers and wanted to get them into their buying funnel at a price point they could afford or justify to themselves
    C. A combination of A and B.

    My personal guess is B.

    By selling such cost restrictive, high ticket items those guys were losing out on MOST of the low/mid range market share.

    By offering $xx products that "over-delivered" (assuming they do), they condition and train the mid and lower range of the market to feel like buying from them is a safer bet, and then they can escalate them up the funnel to higher ticket items, or will have at least gotten $97 before they lose interest in IM.

    But I don't think it's necessarily these guys being pushed by the market. I think it's them being smart and pushing the market in their own way.
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  • Profile picture of the author ZhaoAnXin
    I don't think it's about the market getting cheaper.

    All of these guys have high ticket products. Mass Control, PLF, etc. are all like 2k or so. Traffic Secrets 2.0 was about $500 as I remember.

    These dudes are all smart business men and I would guess it comes down to them testing and realizing one of three things:

    A. The market was was tired of 4 figure offers
    B. They were losing a huge part of the market segment who couldn't afford the 4 figure offers and wanted to get them into their buying funnel at a price point they could afford or justify to themselves
    C. A combination of A and B.

    My personal guess is B.

    By selling such cost restrictive, high ticket items those guys were losing out on MOST of the low/mid range market share.

    By offering $xx products that "over-delivered" (assuming they do), they condition and train the mid and lower range of the market to feel like buying from them is a safer bet, and then they can escalate them up the funnel to higher ticket items, or will have at least gotten $97 before they lose interest in IM.

    But I don't think it's necessarily these guys being pushed by the market. I think it's them being smart and pushing the market in their own way.
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  • Profile picture of the author SeanSupplee
    Many times big guys give out their best content for a low price because they want to get people in the door and on their list.

    Yes you might be buying a killing product for only $67 bucks but on the back end are those $5,000 tickets to training and the likes. It gets peoples feet in the door and delivers a honest product and this is a new customer you can sell to over and over again. There is a reason people do it and its because it works. Don't go trying to reinvent the wheel your going to end up flat broke when you do. Go with the flow and you will be rewarded.
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  • Profile picture of the author Nemanja
    This is happening because more and more people want to make money from home and they buy IM related stuff which tell them to make some information product and put it on the sale and they do it and their info products are also about making money and there you go in few months we have 1000 upon 1000 so called IM guru people selling the same old stuff wrapped in different packing but more cheaper, because they are selling only the fraction of the knowledge.

    So, all are now forced to lower their prices if they want to be in the game, because there are thousands of them selling all kind of products and people with low budget will first go for cheaper thing rather than big packages produced by great IM names.

    The knowledge has leaked and now it's vale is lowered, so this is it.

    When somone produce something new it will be expensive again.

    Nemanja
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  • Profile picture of the author Mark Blaze
    In my honest opinion it's a good thing!

    Now that means all these guru's etc that make all if not most of their money from their products that they sell to others will actually now have to use the methods they teach to make money too.

    Soon enough it will become very transparent who actually only makes money from their products and not the methods themselves.

    Mark Blaze
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  • Profile picture of the author BIG Mike
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    • Profile picture of the author Morgan Richman
      Good point. Thanks.

      MorganRichman

      Originally Posted by BIG Mike View Post

      Folks just don't have the amount of "Play Money" they had a year and a half ago.

      It's not about being cheap - it's about simply not having the resources they once had.
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      • Profile picture of the author Loren Woirhaye
        The major product launches that have told IMers they should
        "charge more for your products" also carried steep prices -
        this is an inoculation ploy which only works when you're selling
        the idea that the customer will be able to turn around and
        easily get his money back when he learns the secret of
        increasing his prices many times over.

        What these teachings ignore is the axiom of direct mail described
        in Eugene Schwartz's book "Mail Order" - basically when you raise
        the price you should expect to see conversions go down. This
        does not mean raising your price is unprofitable because sometimes
        lower conversions at a higher price mean more profits. However,
        when prices are raised too high there's a clear point of diminished
        returns.

        In real world direct response we do not launch or sell new products
        and ideas in a vacuum. When a concept works, it gets knocked-off
        within a matter of months or even weeks. When there is too much
        of the same sort of thing on the market, the profit margins collapse
        because the originator of the product will inevitably experience
        reduced conversions due to knock-off (or just similar) competiton.
        Sometimes competition is just a matter of the originator creating
        a new product category but not having the ability to prevent
        entry by other players with more resources. In fact, knocking-off
        a good (or great) idea is one of the secrets of the most
        successful entrepreneurs (Felix Dennis) - because an emerging
        market can support quite a lot of growth and competition.

        A mature market however is a different story. Are we reaching
        a point of maturity in the market for "how to make money online"?

        Suggested book reading for legitimately increasing prices:

        "How To Sell At Prices Higher Than Your Competitors" - Steinmetz
        "No B.S.Marketing To The Affluent" - Dan Kennedy
        "Uncensored Sales Strategies" Sydney Biddle Barrows
        "How To Get Rich" Felix Dennis
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  • Profile picture of the author Marketstriker
    My product pricing policy usually depends on a segment which I'd like to concentrate. Product with a high quality, unique options, customer support may be positioned as an exclusive and of cause I will sell it for high price, because segment is not big. For low price product I use opposite policy. There is nothing new here. Just marketing. Just different pricing.
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  • Profile picture of the author Matt Gannon
    Its simple look at the economy at the moment, I think you have your answer!
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  • Profile picture of the author AnneE
    Are WE getting cheap? Well I can't speak for you, but I'm pretty cheap if your definition of cheap is thinking twice before spending over $100 for something.

    Another theory on why 'gurus' might offer products more cheaply is they can still make a profit and if they can really over-deliver and you fall madly in love with the value of what they offer versus the cost. If you buy a $100 product and it's an awesome deal, then you are more likely to continue to buy and maybe over a lifetime of rolling out products they will earn more from you, than if you bought a $300 product and thought, "well that wasn't worth it."

    I do think it's harder and harder to just roll out any old product 'write an ebook in 24 hours' and sucker people into buying it. Frankly I'm not interested in doing that, so that's okay by me.

    I sense that you are angry that people are 'getting cheap' as you call it. Are people starting to be more careful about the money they spend on internet marketing products? Yes, probably. About time. I think if a product delivers $1000 of value people will still buy it. But most of the big bucks products didn't really deliver on the promise in my experience. I wonder how many Stompernet members are still shelling out $800 a month.
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  • Profile picture of the author duncanb
    Warrior forum attracts so many potential purchasers of the wso product, these internet marketers still make a significant return on their product despite its paltry price.

    This thinking means everyone can profit from learning and advancing their IM skills.
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  • Profile picture of the author silvervixen
    The economy is in the tank...and not just in the United States. The world economy is down as well. This means people have less money to spend and even if they're doing ok, they're going to be more cautious about spending that money. Lower prices mean more people will be willing to buy.
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  • Profile picture of the author Dexx
    I dont think WSOs are meant to be "ball breakers" for price...basically I use the forum to test if it WILL sell...if it does well in a small community like the WF, then it can be assumed it will sell well with affiliates promoting it to the whole internet =)
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  • Profile picture of the author robrudd
    Dont forget, when you sell your products at an affordable price to the masses, you also have an opportunity to prove yourself, build trust, and build a targeted list of happy customers.
    Hopefully you can convert many of them into your next product or into a continunity system that will pay you over and over again.

    Many products have an upgrade or a backend or OTO of some sort.
    But ya the times they are a changing.
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