Question for Clickbank Affiliates

[Alexa Smith]

I'm not (yet) a CB affiliate but am just looking through the stock to see which items I might be well placed to promote via a pre-selling blog page or whatever.

My question is: with all these CB sales pages that open with a pop-up offering a "free report" of some kind, for the prospect to give their email address, how do you know that the sale isn't going to be made separately, once the vendor has the prospect's email address in his autoresponder? How do you know that you'll get paid, in other words?

And does the same apply to all the ones with an exit pop-up, too?

In other words, where's your incentive to promote these products as an affiliate?

I've perhaps misunderstood something fundamental, because clearly large numbers of people are affiliates for these things. Can someone explain this to me, please?

[Jared Alberghini]

When you direct a prospect to a CB affiliate, a cookie is set within your visitors computer, that tracks and has your CB affiliate username, and is stored for future visits back to that site.

Even if there is an 'optin-email capture page', this is usually followed by a call to action to buy their product, with your affiliate username.

Sure, there are ways that can mess up your sale, like if your referred visitor deletes their cookies, or (much less likely) if you don't cloak your affiliate link, another affiliate can replace yours with theirs if they are a CB affiliate.

Overall, the chance of you not getting your commission is very slim if you refer visitors to the sales pages.

Let me know if that helps, or if you need more details on any specifics.

- Jared

[alexshelton]

Yeah, according to a few guys I've spoken to, that cookie lasts around 3 years, I don't know if its the same for all

Have fun

[KarlWarren]

In addition to what Jared said, some vendors capture your aff ID as a custom field in their optin form (hidden) and append this to all links to buy in their follow-ups.

Rare, but it does happen.

I would suggest testing, using your own affiliate link and signing up to their list... then double checking the vendor's methods.

Most are pretty sound.

Kindest regards,
Karl.

[Brian Edmondson]

In most cases the affiliate link is not collected or passed through during opt-in.

So when follow-up is done, it's done with a "naked" link.

If the user deletes their cookies / clears their history, then you won't get credited on future sales; if they do, then you will.

In most cases, when I'm doing any type of metrics I don't really count on sales that aren't made directly (as an affiliate).

There are pluses and minues to everything. The minus to affiliates marketing (in this specific case you mention) is that you are building someone else's list and only making profit on initial sales.

The pluses: most of the work is done for you, you just have to generate the traffic.

Brian

[jan roos]

If clickbank installs cookies then how can we benefit from a research review site? Let's say I look at the sales page for a health clickbank product. Then I go to google to find reviews and get to your review page and decide to buy from you wouldn't the cookies then credit the previous site owner resulting in you losing a sale?

[JHamilton]

Clickbank cookies overwrite any previous cookies. Alexa S, definately check out the salespage to be sure there aren't alternate methods of payment (such as pay-pal separate from the clickbank order form.) Also, if there is an optin list then subscribe and check subsequent mailings for awhile to be sure people aren't being directed to seperate order forms- there are alot of legitimate businesses out there but every marketplace has its bad apples

[Clare Moser]

Originally Posted by jan roos

If clickbank installs cookies then how can we benefit from a research review site? Let's say I look at the sales page for a health clickbank product. Then I go to google to find reviews and get to your review page and decide to buy from you wouldn't the cookies then credit the previous site owner resulting in you losing a sale?

Nope, The cookie is always over written by the last referrer so the review site would get credit for the sale.

[liban]

I know there are some marketers that deliberately try to cheat you out of a cookie, but there are many more who cause you to lose commission out of sheer ignorance. Sometimes, alerting a vendor will help them gain and keep affiliates like you.

And I know this, because once, I was one of those ignorant vendors...I have since seen the light. : )

[pjs]

Clickbank uses the "Last Clicked" cookie philosophy afaik. Meaning the last affiliate link clicked is the affiliate to get the credit.

So if you send someone to a CB page who then opts-in to their list. That list sends them a new link (with their affiliate link) in the email, you will NOT get credit if the user clicks that link and makes the purchase.

Sort of a big issue as to who gets credit. Original affiliate or latest clicked. I see the benefits of both but it's sort of a toss up.

[Harvey Segal]

Originally Posted by pjs

So if you send someone to a CB page who then opts-in to their list. That list sends them a new link (with their affiliate link) in the email, you will NOT get credit if the user clicks that link and makes the purchase.

Do you mean to say ...

So if you send someone to a CB page who then opts-in to their list AND That list sends them a new link (with the PUBLISHER'S affiliate link) in the email, you will NOT get credit if the user clicks that link and makes the purchase.


Harvey

[NewbiesDiary]

I've been asking myself the same question. I'm in the middle of creating a review site & I did a bit of research on some of these products.

I created my link, I cloaked my link at offto.net, I checked my link - now to check it I tried buying through every link on their page to make sure my affiliate id was on the page. Then I subscribed to their emails, downloaded their trial packages etc etc etc & each time I got a new link I checked to make sure it'd show my clickbank affiliate id on the page on the clickbank order page. It worked everytime, if it didn't I wasn't going to use their product.

Check & double check - it'll take you a bit longer, but can be worth it in the long run.

[Alexa Smith]

Originally Posted by Harvey.Segal

Do you mean to say ...

So if you send someone to a CB page who then opts-in to their list AND That list sends them a new link (with the PUBLISHER'S affiliate link) in the email, you will NOT get credit if the user clicks that link and makes the purchase.


Harvey

Thanks - this is what I took pjs as meaning, Harvey. This is the exact point that was worrying me.

It seems to me, as a potential traffic-provider (i.e. affiliate) there, that if that can happen because of the "most recent cookie gets the commission" policy, then clearly I ought, as an affiliate, to be promoting in preference publishers who don't have the facility to do that.

Regardless of what publishers do or don't do, why put your time and effort into being an affiliate of a product whose publisher has the facility to deprive you of your commissions when there are so many others who apparently don't?

This seems to me to be such a complete no-brainer that I'm evidently having difficulty understanding why those publishers who depend primarily on affiliates as traffic-generators are doing this at all and why affiliates tolerate it rather than simply voting with their feet and promoting others' products instead.

Many thanks to everyone above for their kind replies.

[NewbiesDiary]

Originally Posted by alexa_s

Thanks - this is what I took pjs as meaning, Harvey. This is the exact point that was worrying me.

It seems to me, as a potential traffic-provider (i.e. affiliate) there, that if that can happen because of the "most recent cookie gets the commission" policy, then clearly I ought, as an affiliate, to be promoting in preference publishers who don't have the facility to do that.

Regardless of what publishers do or don't do, why put your time and effort into being an affiliate of a product whose publisher has the facility to deprive you of your commissions when there are so many others who apparently don't?

This seems to me to be such a complete no-brainer that I'm evidently having difficulty understanding why those publishers who depend primarily on affiliates as traffic-generators are doing this at all and why affiliates tolerate it rather than simply voting with their feet and promoting others' products instead.

Many thanks to everyone above for their kind replies.

Possibly a great number of affiliates don't think about it this deeply, or maybe they figure if they cut out all the ones where this is a possibility then it greatly narrows the field and you'd therefore be making less money anyway - it's kinda like complaining about all the tax you have to pay - if you didn't earn as much you wouldn't have to pay as much - yes but you wouldn't have as much!!

[raamanand]

It's all a numbers game. There are some "pests" who will learn about the product from you and then use their own affiliate link to get a discount. It's easy with ClickBank.

[Harvey Segal]

Originally Posted by raamanand

It's all a numbers game. There are some "pests" who will learn about the product from you and then use their own affiliate link to get a discount. It's easy with ClickBank.

You are now talking about a different situation - customers buying through their own link
as opposed to publishers stopping an affiliate getting credit.

You cannot entirely eliminate this but the following tips may help

How To Stop ClickBank Link Theft


Harvey

[earlyretirement]

Originally Posted by Harvey.Segal

Do you mean to say ...

So if you send someone to a CB page who then opts-in to their list AND That list sends them a new link (with the PUBLISHER'S affiliate link) in the email, you will NOT get credit if the user clicks that link and makes the purchase.


Harvey

Hi Harvey/alexa_s

In the scenario you outiline you are correct - you WILL NOT
get credit for any sale that follows...HOWEVER .... and this
is a very important HOWEVER...

Most publishers (and I'm one of them) are honest and although
they will place a link in follow-up emails, that link is a DIRECT LINK
to their website and DOES NOT contain the ClickBank hoplink.

So instead of http://theircbid.theirproduct.hop.clickbank.net ,
the link in their autoresonders would be http://www.theirproductwebsite.com

This actually helps affiliates get sales because the publisher is
actually doing the follow on their behalf.

It all depends whether you trust the publisher of the product
you're promoting. If you're not sure, here are two things you
can do to try to find out.
1) Email them and ask the question. "Do you use direct links
or ClickBank hoplinks in your autoresponders?"
It's then still a matter of trust because they could lie to you.
Unfortunately you can't really cover that one. If they're
dishonest, they're dishonesrt and nothing you can say or
do will change that.

2) Sign up for the series and see for yourself what links are in
the autoresponders. If the link(s) is/are cloaked, click on them
and see what appears in the address bar when the site loads.
If it come up with http://www.theirproductwebsite.com it should
be ok. If you see http://www.theirproductwebsite.com?hop=theircbid
in the address bar then I would say they're trying to cheat
you. I say that because they couldn't really put the ClickBank
hoplink in the autoresponders by accident.

As a side issue, if you're looking for a publisher you plan to
have a lasting business relationship with, signing up for the
series will also give you a good feel for how your prospects
will be handled by the merchant.

I hope this helps.

Best Regards

Eddie

[JayXtreme]

Alexa..

Personally I avoid CB products with an opt-in whenever I can..

But if you find a product that is a good fit for your niche with an opt-in, then try to speak the the product creator and discuss things a little, if they are open and responsive you can gauge things about them and how they operate etc..

Just my .02

Peace

Jay

[traceye]

Originally Posted by earlyretirement

Most publishers (and I'm one of them) are honest and although
they will place a link in follow-up emails, that link is a DIRECT LINK
to their website and DOES NOT contain the ClickBank hoplink.

So instead of http://theircbid.theirproduct.hop.clickbank.net ,
the link in their autoresonders would be http://www.theirproductwebsite.com

Why would any publisher put their own hoplink in their autoresponder emails? It doesn't make sense to me. (Unless as you mention, they were out to steal commission off their affiliates).

That's just crazy! I work hard to find affiliates, there is no way I'd take commissions away from them if they referred someone to my site - nobody would ever promote my product again.

I do have an autoresponder series but all links go back directly to the sales page therefore whoever sent them there in the first place gets credited with the cookie even if they finally decide to buy after the 15th email ...

I would say that is the case with the majority of publishers too - I really doubt many would try and steal commissions off their affiliates.

Cookies don't get over-written if the vendor sends someone back to the site with just the domain name and that's what most people do.

Tracey

[JayXtreme]

Originally Posted by traceye

Cookies don't get over-written if the vendor sends someone back to the site with just the domain name and that's what most people do.

Tracey

VERY true... and someone like yourself Tracey I would gladly promote an opt-in site for...

But in most cases I would need to speak to the creator to get things clear and open avenues of communication etc.

Peace

Jay

[earlyretirement]

Hi Tracey

Well put - that's exactly my point. Most CB publishers are honest
and want affiliates to prosper as it makes their life much easier.

I just gave a couple of pointers as to how you may be able to
identify the few 'rotten apples' - for those in this thread showing
some concern or maybe asking for guidance.

Best Regards

Eddie

[mrozlat]

If someone deletes their cookies on their computer and then makes a purchase... you lose the sale... but that's the case with any affiliate program that uses cookies... and from what I know they ALL do... correct me if I'm wrong.

Otherwise you are sweet... since your cookie is still on their computer when they make a purchase... you can easily test this by using your affiliate link to signup for a free report... and then click on the email link and go through the checkout process to hopefully find your affiliate link at the bottom off the screen.

[Alexa Smith]

Originally Posted by mrozlat

correct me if I'm wrong.

Not wrong ... just a little slow-moving: the thread was a year old until you kindly replied.

[mrozlat]

lol... i'm all for the tortoise ;P

[Harvey Segal]

Originally Posted by mrozlat

lol... i'm all for the tortoise ;P

Were you trying to check if a cookie lasts a year ?

Harvey

[scrofford]

Originally Posted by Alexa Smith

I'm not (yet) a CB affiliate but am just looking through the stock to see which items I might be well placed to promote via a pre-selling blog page or whatever.

My question is: with all these CB sales pages that open with a pop-up offering a "free report" of some kind, for the prospect to give their email address, how do you know that the sale isn't going to be made separately, once the vendor has the prospect's email address in his autoresponder? How do you know that you'll get paid, in other words?

And does the same apply to all the ones with an exit pop-up, too?

In other words, where's your incentive to promote these products as an affiliate?

I've perhaps misunderstood something fundamental, because clearly large numbers of people are affiliates for these things. Can someone explain this to me, please?

I just talked to a rep at Clickbank and he explained it like this: When the customer clicks on your link(whether it is a ppc ad or whatnot) the "cookie" is already set by the time the customer would opt in. The downside is yes you are helping the merchant build their list.

The cookie lasts for 60 days. After that it is deleted. So it really isn't like you are going to lose your affiliate commission. I just don't think I would like helping to build someone else's list.

[mrozlat]

Originally Posted by Harvey.Segal

Were you trying to check if a cookie lasts a year ?

Harvey

it seems the cookie isn't stale lol
re-ignition yeeeaah

[vicone]

Also of concern would be those merchants who don't provide a sales page as the original landing page. The hoplink takes the visitor to a squeeze page and the visitor doesn't get to see the sales page until the optin form has been completed. In some instances, visitors are able to cancel the optin form and click through to the sales page.

However, every additional step required by the visitor to reach the sales page and the "Buy" button causes leakage of traffic. Visitors get frustrated and leave.

If there is no intruding opt-in, the affiliate is not left wondering whether the merchant will pass on the affiliate-id to the lead who has opted in. Yes, I know that with some extra work it's possible to test whether the affiliate will receive credit for a subsequent sale.

In the absence of prior knowledge about the trustworthiness of the merchant, I personally prefer merchants whose hoplink goes to a sales page and lets it get on with the job of producing a sale.

Ivan

[Chris Worner]

Why not be the vendor instead and run your own affiliate program, then this wont be an issue.

[NY1]

Personally, I won't promote a CB product that collects an e-mail.

Before I will promote a product, I go through the entire process to see what my list customers are going to be put through.

With the few that I did test out,

Here's what I saw:

1. Using links that don't give ME credit for the sale

Obviously no incentive there.

2. A LOT, in the 5 or 7 part course, start to pitch OTHER clickbank products

(ie they are taking your traffic and doing their own affiliate marketing, one guy started sending me make money online offers when the product was in a totally unrelated niche)

Also, you have just handed one of your own subscribers or potential subscribers to someone else. Now, your e-mails have to compete with the other persons for your prospect or buyers attention.

Personally, I am protective of my lists, so I don't want to do that to them.

If you are in a niche where your prospects are not used to getting hit with a lot of e-mails, you just became a spammer in their mind.

(Most non im people do not get the legal definition of SPAM, they just think any e-mail they don't care for is spam)

[talfighel]

Alexa,

I have promoted a few programs through ClickBank that capture people's email addresses and found out that ALL of them have sent out other promotions for other programs and this got me to the point where I don't really promote any programs like that anymore.

Yes, for the first few emails, they are selling their own and if a sale is being made, you earn a percentage of that sale. But some of them, at the 6th email and beyond could be selling other people's products which means that you will not earn a penny from that.

That has been my experience with some of these programs that capture people's emails.

Tal

[vicone]

Why not be the vendor instead and run your own affiliate program, then this wont be an issue.

That's true and in many cases I do offer my own products. However, in one large niche, in particular, I pre-sell 60-70 different products (and growing). I don't have time in the short-term to replace them with my own products.

Also, by selling other people's merchandise, it frees me to choose those markets and create those products which especially interest me and I enjoy writing about (or editing).

Ivan

[Alexa Smith]

Thanks for the further replies, guys ... the thread is over a year old, you know?

Originally Posted by NY1

Personally, I won't promote a CB product that collects an e-mail.

No indeed. Neither will I. Neither will many of us here. For me, in the 15-months' experience I've gained since starting this thread, making that decision was the biggest single factor that made the difference between making a living and not making a living.

Originally Posted by talfighel

Yes, for the first few emails, they are selling their own and if a sale is being made, you earn a percentage of that sale.

Not necessarily.

Some of them, even in the first few emails, promote only that same product but with an affiliate-link cookie that overwrites your own, because in the case of Clickbank, it's the "most recent cookie" to which the affiliate commission is accredited. And that can be the vendor's wife's. That's not breaching any of Clickbank's rules, either: they allow it. Once a person's opted in to the vendor's list, they don't really "belong" to you any more. Many people (most of them vendors with an opt-in on their sales pages!) allege that "That very rarely happens" but the truth is that they don't really know that, they just guess/assume it, and obviously they can't prove it.

[minted1]

if a visitor goes to the vendors site and either buys or sign's up for the newsletter through your affiliate link then you WILL get credited for that sale.