Double Opt-in - Don't Waste Your Money

20 replies
I recently did a test ad run for a squeeze page and ended up losing 62% of my leads and wasting a bunch of money. I just want to share what I did wrong so that others reading this don't make the same mistake.

The process I set up was to collect the lead using Aweber and then redirect through my affiliate link to a related product sales page.

It's a good thing that I tested this with a small budget because I forgot that this particular autoresponder list was set to confirmed (double) opt-in. DOUBLE DUH!

The big mistake I made was that I didn't give people a good incentive to confirm. The other mistake I made was redirecting directly to a sales page using double opt-in.

As a result, only 38% of the leads actually confirmed their email.

I should have had a page in between that instructed them to confirm their email and gave them a reason for them to do so (i.e. "you must confirm to get your free report...")

If you're thinking about using a similar strategy to build your list, either adjust your process for this or don't use double opt-in.

Hope this helps someone.
#double #money #optin #waste
  • Profile picture of the author Andyhenry
    Thanks for sharing Ron.
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    nothing to see here.

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  • Profile picture of the author Scott Ames
    Always useful stuff. Thanks.
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    Success consists of going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm. -Winston Churchill

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  • Profile picture of the author WillR
    Well said Ron. The page in between is vital if you are going to use double-optin. As you said, you need to give them clear instructions on HOW they need to confirm but more importantly WHY they need to confirm.

    Make it clear that they will not receive the free stuff unless they confirm their email, and the reason they need to confirm is to help protect their own privacy.
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  • Profile picture of the author Janice Sperry
    Some really good points except I don't agree with the part "or don't use double opt-in." Personally I would keep adjusting but I would NEVER abandon the double opt-in.
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  • Profile picture of the author Lilach
    There are pro's and con's to double optins. Not everyone will take the time to double optin therefore you are potentially loosing sign ups.

    However there is one good point to mention when using double optins. If someone does take the time to click and double optin in the chances are your emails will definately go into their inbox, rather than their junk.

    The amount of emails I receive that go direct to my junk rather than my inbox are huge, mainly because they haven't set up a double optin.

    Not quite sure of the technicalities as to why this works but for some reason it appears to, for me anyway!

    Lilach
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  • Profile picture of the author AndyBeard
    What amazed me recently when I went to test iContact as so many people seem to be recommending them recently is that whilst you can redirect to a page after data entry to give confirmation instructions, there is no way to redirect to a thank you page after someone has clicked a confirmation link.

    I can find similar though different holes in every autoresponder offered on the market, so before anyone chimes in that Aweber or Getresponse are better, they have their achilles heel as well.
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    • Profile picture of the author Dan C. Rinnert
      You reveal a bias when you refer to it as "double opt-in" as opposed to "confirmed opt-in" which is the more apt description.

      When you have a sign-in form, you really have no idea who is entering addresses in there. It could be someone using someone else's eMail address (or a fictitious address) thinking they will get a freebie without giving their own address or perhaps thinking they'll just annoy one of their buddies by signing them up for a bunch of lists.

      Essentially, ANYONE can enter an eMail address into a form field. Combine that, unconfirmed opt-in and a competitor or someone who really doesn't like you, and you're asking for trouble.

      I know this is one of those things where people will argue endlessly over, and this thread will likely go on for a few pages, but confirmed opt-in just makes sense. You don't want to be sending stuff to people who really didn't want it. (http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...irmed-opt.html)
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  • Profile picture of the author AndyBeard
    Dan I don't think that is what Ron was saying - this wasn't against a confirmed/double opt-in process at all.

    The point was to concentrate on one thing, the opt-in first and then worry about the secondary offer because otherwise you only get one bite at the cherry.
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    • Profile picture of the author Dan C. Rinnert
      Originally Posted by AndyBeard View Post

      Dan I don't think that is what Ron was saying - this wasn't against a confirmed/double opt-in process at all.
      If that's true, then, sorry Ron, my bad.

      But a title of "Double Opt-In - Don't Waste Your Money" suggests otherwise.
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      • Profile picture of the author Ron Douglas
        Originally Posted by Dan C. Rinnert View Post

        If that's true, then, sorry Ron, my bad.

        But a title of "Double Opt-In - Don't Waste Your Money" suggests otherwise.
        Don't judge a post by it's title
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        • Profile picture of the author Dan C. Rinnert
          Originally Posted by Ron Douglas View Post

          Don't judge a post by it's title
          It's probably too early in the morning for me to be posting on WF.
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      • Profile picture of the author theemperor
        I have to say I err on the side of safety i.e. the confirmed opt in.

        Your job is to get your website copy right - Make the visitor so hungry and desperate to get your stuff that they'll wait by their PC all day until that confirmation email comes and click it immediately

        Also there is flexibility about what you write on the confirmation email - so use those words wisely.

        I don't have much of a problem with people not confirming, a small active niche list I have (just 50 subscribers has 49 confirmed opt-ins and 1 who forgot). I find this ration fairly typical.

        That said I use Aweber and I think they have a nice animated picture showing the visitor what to do, so perhaps that helps.

        There is only one list I have that isn't confirmed opt-in and that is for customers and is linked to DLGuard, I make it clear on the first email that they are free to unsubscribe but to stay subscribed for updates to the software.
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        • Profile picture of the author Aussie_Al
          I had someone opt into my free newsletter the other day and yesterday they unsubscribed with the message "Stop sending me spam"!

          I was this close >< to writing back - You chose to subscribe to my newsletter but saved my energy and moved on
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  • Profile picture of the author Janice Sperry
    Originally Posted by Dan C. Rinnert View Post

    You reveal a bias when you refer to it as "double opt-in" as opposed to "confirmed opt-in" which is the more apt description.

    When you have a sign-in form, you really have no idea who is entering addresses in there. It could be someone using someone else's eMail address (or a fictitious address) thinking they will get a freebie without giving their own address or perhaps thinking they'll just annoy one of their buddies by signing them up for a bunch of lists.

    Essentially, ANYONE can enter an eMail address into a form field. Combine that, unconfirmed opt-in and a competitor or someone who really doesn't like you, and you're asking for trouble.

    I know this is one of those things where people will argue endlessly over, and this thread will likely go on for a few pages, but confirmed opt-in just makes sense. You don't want to be sending stuff to people who really didn't want it. (http://www.warriorforum.com/main-internet-marketing-discussion-forum/214979-why-i-prefer-confirmed-opt.html)
    I missed the past post you linked to "Why I Prefer Confirmed Opt-in." I like the switch to "confirmed". A good post and I agree with everything you wrote. Aweber and some others REQUIRE confirmed opt-in.
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    • Profile picture of the author Dan C. Rinnert
      Originally Posted by JMS View Post

      I missed the past post you linked to "Why I Prefer Confirmed Opt-in." I like the switch to "confirmed". A good post and I agree with everything you wrote. Aweber and some others REQUIRE confirmed opt-in.
      Actually, from what I think Paul told me many moons ago, I think it was IMers who started referring to confirmed opt-in as "double opt-in".
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  • Profile picture of the author ChrisBa
    Originally Posted by Ron Douglas View Post


    The big mistake I made was that I didn't give people a good incentive to confirm.
    This is the best advice I've read today
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  • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
    To me the post made the context of the subject heading very clear. The two main take aways I got from Ron's original post was:

    1. Make sure you add a page reminding them to check their e-mail before sending them to a sales page (Aweber can do this automatically for you if you like).

    2. Make sure you give people an incentive so it increases the likelihood of checking their e-mail to confirm their opt-in.

    RoD
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  • Profile picture of the author netmomof2
    Thanks for the post.

    I like to direct them wherever I intended to direct them when they opt in the first time. The only time they confirm is when they receive the initial email.

    I like to make it easy for people to get the info instead of having them jump through many hoops. People are naturally lazy and procrastinate so I like to have them opt in to receive the info and then confirm their emails once and then they get the information they requested.

    Thanks for sharing that experience, I agree with you.
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  • Profile picture of the author Colin Theriot
    I want to add also, that I think the actual exercise of compliance inherent in having confirmation bait is a VERY powerful conditioning mechanism to use right at the beginning of the relationship.

    I will send you emails with good stuff in them. But to get the stuff, you have to go to your inbox, look for emails from me, open them, read them, and click. It sets the tone perfectly for what should follow. And it should follow many many many times.

    This is the same reason I tell people they need to have a CTA to leave a blog comment or some other click action for every email, even just content. You must condition the behavior you want over and over again - I want them to be compelled to follow through the process, because each time they do, they are conditioned to go with it a little easier the next time, and the next, and the next...

    Anyways, good post Ron.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Rogers
    Even if you aren't using a third party service for your autoresponder, you should check your webhost's terms and policies before electing not to require double opt-in. For example, one might assume that leasing a dedicated server would permit them to run their list building and email campaigns as they wish, as long as they weren't spamming. Many hosts require double opt-in, even on dedicated servers. HostGator for example.

    HostGator Dedicated Mail Policy

    John
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