Is it just me or is everyone losing money with CB & ADwords

Alexa Smith

Banned 14 years ago

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thebitbotdotcom

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Alexa Smith

If it were easy to promote Clickbank products using AdWords and direct linking, why would vendors need affiliates at all - they could just do that themselves easily enough, don't you think, and pocket 100% of the sale price instead of 30%/40% or whatever?!

What produces sales is the value you can add to the process and the relationships you and/or your sites can build with the prospective customers. But you can't do that by direct-linking from AdWords. Nor can you pre-sell in any other way, build a list, or develop your own business.

But 100 clicks is actually far too small a number to be able to judge anything. You'd be doing terribly well to have a 1% conversion-rate this way (I think you'd actually be doing well to have 0.5% conversion-rate, and that's if you've selected a really good product with an appropriate sales page for that kind of traffic), so with allowance for variability you need to monitor at least many hundreds of clicks before trying to draw any conclusions.

Well that explains why tweeting the *(&#^(&*^@ out of CB products didn't work. All of the visits were cold.

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Black Hat Cat

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Alexa Smith

If it were easy to promote Clickbank products using AdWords and direct linking, why would vendors need affiliates at all ?

Because they like making money? You do know Adwords doesn't reach everyone who is interested in a product, don't you?

What produces sales is the value you can add to the process and the relationships you and/or your sites can build with the prospective customers. But you can't do that by direct-linking from AdWords. Nor can you pre-sell in any other way, build a list, or develop your own business.

And yet, plenty of vendors produce sales for their own products doing just that....they don't presell, or build a list. Basically, they're direct-linking from Adwords to their sales page. If it can work for them, it can work for affiliates. Direct linking is direct linking. The visitor has no clue that they were sent there by an affiliate or the vendor himself.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not arguing which way is better, I'm arguing what is possible. Yes, it makes more sense, imo, to build a list and presell. But that doesn't mean it's necessary. If vendors can make sales by direct linking to their sales page, there's no reason why affiliates can't make sales by direct linking to sales pages.

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Alexa Smith

Banned 14 years ago

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tryinhere

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Alexa Smith

If the affiliate's heard of the FTC and its regulations, that tends not to be the case, actually. Affiliates have to declare that they're earning a commission, these days, I believe?
Ok.

this a question i asked when the new/revised ? FTC rulings were being implemented and how that affected those who advertised using adwords and or banner ad placements / etc.

the answer was that as such the text and or the banner ads were seen as and deemed to be advertisements and as such it was reasonable for a consumer to then understand that with the advent of an ad it was in fact a paid and or a business venture.

because of this it was not necessary that an ad carry the affiliate disclosure and how it works.

I am no legal, legal, but that was my understanding of the reply, and each must do as they do.

as for the thread and the topic,

some do , some don't, same ol story really.

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Anonymous Affiliate

14 years ago

Is it just me or is everyone losing money with CB & ADwords

Hehehe welcome to the reality. Adwords is just too expensive to make the standard 60% commission on the standard $47 Clickbank product worth it, even on apparently less competitive niche markets. Run some maths and you'll realize that Adwords is just not catered anymore for that type of affiliate marketing... It was a few years ago, but not anymore... regardless of what some "gurus" (selling PPC courses, of course) want you to believe...

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clicktrack 14 years ago

I agree with you just can't direct link. If you did an adwords campaign prior to launch and built a list of potential customers. Then leading up to the launch talk about the product and features and on launch try to sell them. If they are aware you will make money from the deal off them some sort of bonus if they buy through you.

When I do clickbank I try to find products with recurring commissions. I also try to find products that I think have some real value to its customers. 99% of the stuff is junk on clickbank but 1% I feel has some true value and if you find one of those and start to get recurring monthly on it you will be in business.
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mlord10

14 years ago

I don't use PPC, but I would not use direct linking regardless of the strategy to build a long term business. At least have a product review page where you discuss both the advantages and disadvantages that your product has to offer.

Even better is building a list in your niche market, and then marketing them related products. This is how many affiliates reach the "super affiliate" status.

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regska

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Stede Troisi

Can I ask a silly question. Who uses AdWords now and why?

Thanks,

- Stede

LOL! I know I'm not.

Really, adwords is not a good idea if you sell an ebook at Clickbank. focus on other things, try not to spend that much money when selling ebooks. You can just exert all your efforts recruiting affiliates and offer them generous commissions. Adwords is very risky compare to affiliate marketing.

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WealthWithin

14 years ago

It's not profitable to use PPC to promote a product with $25 margin.

1. Use PPC to build your list.
and/or
2. Use low end products with high-priced backend offers.

Your main goal with PPC should be to get a customer while breaking-even.

If you're just using PPC with affiliate marketing, you MUST have a killer bonus to make a profit.

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WealthWithin

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Stede Troisi

Can I ask a silly question. Who uses AdWords now and why?

Thanks,

- Stede

LOL.

Google's $23 billion annual revenue indicates that some people are still using it.

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abednego 14 years ago

Originally Posted by WealthWithin

LOL.

Google's $23 billion annual revenue indicates that some people are still using it.

That doesn't exactly explain the why though
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tylerdrun

14 years ago

Google cash is pretty much dead for clickbank products. They do work for other physical products but you may encounter trademark restrictions.

Why direct link a cb product? Start building a list or at least create a presell page. WIth a list, you can promote other products and make money from their launches too. And with a presell page that is targetted to the product, your ppc bids will lower and you will get more traffic and sales for less pay.

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alrab

14 years ago

if your using broad match yu will get lot of clicks but little or no conversion.
pause the broad match keyword then re-run the campaign ..with exact and phrase mtach only.

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Talltom1

14 years ago

I gave up on Google Adwords a long time ago. If you look at your profit margins, and your CTR, and conversion rates, the costs rarely justify a PPC campaign.

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John Durham 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Talltom1

I gave up on Google Adwords a long time ago. If you look at your profit margins, and your CTR, and conversion rates, the costs rarely justify a PPC campaign.

Im convinced that you have to be able to lose 10k in order to make 3-5 profit...

It seems like the guys you hear succeeding are spending thousands per day on Adwords to make hundreds or a few thousand.

My risk tolerance is not that high.
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Rob Barbour

14 years ago

I use Adwords for many campaigns (CB included) currently and do VERY well. In fact some of my best converting keywords only cost me $.08-.30 per click - and that's search - not content network.

You have to actually WORK at finding the best keywords and be willing to spend money to find them. If you can't afford to spend at least $50/day for testing, I'd stay away from Adwords.

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jan roos

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Rob Barbour

I use Adwords for many campaigns (CB included) currently and do VERY well. In fact some of my best converting keywords only cost me $.08-.30 per click - and that's search - not content network.

You have to actually WORK at finding the best keywords and be willing to spend money to find them. If you can't afford to spend at least $50/day for testing, I'd stay away from Adwords.

Exactly right. Adwords is not for the faint of hearted. You definitely need to be able to hande losing a few hundred before you can start seeing a positive ROI. Sometimes you can get lucky and be profitable right away but for the most part you wont

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mesya

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Rob Barbour

I use Adwords for many campaigns (CB included) currently and do VERY well. In fact some of my best converting keywords only cost me $.08-.30 per click - and that's search - not content network.

You have to actually WORK at finding the best keywords and be willing to spend money to find them. If you can't afford to spend at least $50/day for testing, I'd stay away from Adwords.

Yeah, it's right..maybe I have to stay away for that..

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ape263

14 years ago

I always question some of the advice given on Warrior Forum. A lot of times, it all seems like smoke and mirrors. If I may ask, why would a person not use direct linking? The company could do it themselves? Maybe, but what if a person is finding keywords the company is not looking for and things of that nature? To me, it just makes more sense to direct link, depending on how good their sales page is, because you don't have to worry about creating a site of your own. You can let them do the selling for you. Furthermore, I have always wondered about the process of having an affiliate click this link to go to this page, and then click this link to go to the official site. Wouldn't I loose a great deal of my customers on my landing page? I know I know, blah blah blah about how good the landing page has to be. But come on, be serious. They are still having to go to a completely different site, forcing them to make a decision all over again.

If there were a way to tie in the payment page of the merchant's website with my landing page, I wouldn't feel this way, but I just don't see how people are so against direct linking.

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Troy_Phillips

14 years ago

Direct linking will not build your business whatsoever. Of course if you do not want to build a site and actually have any part of the selling process, you don't want a business.. you want a hobby that might pay you a buck or two occasionally .

Yes .. there is ways of taking code from a buy now button and placing it on your review page .

Originally Posted by ape263

I always question some of the advice given on Warrior Forum. A lot of times, it all seems like smoke and mirrors. If I may ask, why would a person not use direct linking? The company could do it themselves? Maybe, but what if a person is finding keywords the company is not looking for and things of that nature? To me, it just makes more sense to direct link, depending on how good their sales page is, because you don't have to worry about creating a site of your own. You can let them do the selling for you. Furthermore, I have always wondered about the process of having an affiliate click this link to go to this page, and then click this link to go to the official site. Wouldn't I loose a great deal of my customers on my landing page? I know I know, blah blah blah about how good the landing page has to be. But come on, be serious. They are still having to go to a completely different site, forcing them to make a decision all over again.

If there were a way to tie in the payment page of the merchant's website with my landing page, I wouldn't feel this way, but I just don't see how people are so against direct linking.

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BobJutsu

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Troy_Phillips

Direct linking will not build your business whatsoever. Of course if you do not want to build a site and actually have any part of the selling process, you don't want a business.. you want a hobby that might pay you a buck or two occasionally .

Yes .. there is ways of taking code from a buy now button and placing it on your review page .

Thats not true whatsoever. That implies that your business model is the one, and only model that qualifies as a business, and that just isn't the case. There is an infinate number of ways to make money, lots of money.

I have direct linked many an adwords campaign, and made plenty of coin doing so. Although, I have to say that I don't do much volume in CB 'cause I prefer CPA's, I have direct linked many CPA offers for a pretty little profit. I don't mind throwing a few hundred bucks at an offer just to test the water and see if it's warm, and maybe then I'll bother with building a landing page and scaling volume...but I'm not going to go through that trouble unless the offer itself is converting in the first place.

However, on the rare occassion I do push an information product, aka CB product, I will build a page for it. But not a middle-man page, a straight up sales page complete with a purchase button, etc. That links directly to the checkout w/ my aff id. Problem is, I want the sales process to be as fast and streamlined as possible (as few pages required as possible) and most of the sales pages of products I've seen are just ugly and wouldn't convert if I sent traffic to them anyway.

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Troy_Phillips

14 years ago

Not implying my business model is the only one . I agree I should have inserted long term business.

CPA is a lot different than CB

I don't do review type pages either , the buy now button is the way to go.

Just wondering , if Google decides that direct linking to any affiliate product is not in their better interest , what happens to those that have no customer list .

Sure , by your post I think you would change with the new rules ... could the average marketer do the same ?

Originally Posted by BobJutsu

Thats not true whatsoever. That implies that your business model is the one, and only model that qualifies as a business, and that just isn't the case. There is an infinate number of ways to make money, lots of money.

I have direct linked many an adwords campaign, and made plenty of coin doing so. Although, I have to say that I don't do much volume in CB 'cause I prefer CPA's, I have direct linked many CPA offers for a pretty little profit. I don't mind throwing a few hundred bucks at an offer just to test the water and see if it's warm, and maybe then I'll bother with building a landing page and scaling volume...but I'm not going to go through that trouble unless the offer itself is converting in the first place.

However, on the rare occassion I do push an information product, aka CB product, I will build a page for it. But not a middle-man page, a straight up sales page complete with a purchase button, etc. That links directly to the checkout w/ my aff id. Problem is, I want the sales process to be as fast and streamlined as possible (as few pages required as possible) and most of the sales pages of products I've seen are just ugly and wouldn't convert if I sent traffic to them anyway.

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ape263

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Troy_Phillips

Direct linking will not build your business whatsoever. Of course if you do not want to build a site and actually have any part of the selling process, you don't want a business.. you want a hobby that might pay you a buck or two occasionally .

Yes .. there is ways of taking code from a buy now button and placing it on your review page .

That being said, I'd like to refer you to BobJutsu's comment just below yours. I know a couple of people who were making real money, and I'm not talking about the type of money to where you make it and then sell an ebook about it, I'm talking about actual money, and a process that they could use over and over again, through direct linking. Neither of them had a website, but you couldn't walk into Chase and tell the branch president they didn't have a business.

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Troy_Phillips

14 years ago

Hey .. if it works for you , go for it .

I am sure the producers love it when you build their business for them.

What happens when the rules change ? Will the producer appreciate your past efforts to the point of giving you a customer list .

When appraising the value of a business, would a business with no customer list bring the same as a business with the same profit margin and a list of past customers who have purchased again and again from that business.

Wow repeat business.. guess the profit margins would not be the same .

Originally Posted by ape263

That being said, I'd like to refer you to BobJutsu's comment just below yours. I know a couple of people who were making real money, and I'm not talking about the type of money to where you make it and then sell an ebook about it, I'm talking about actual money, and a process that they could use over and over again, through direct linking. Neither of them had a website, but you couldn't walk into Chase and tell the branch president they didn't have a business.

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Cosmo Demopoulos

14 years ago

I use AdWords, but have had little success with Click Bank or other affiliate programs.

I have had success, a lot of it, selling services, like training and offshore fishing charters.

For example. I'm using it to drive traffic to a friends site, Maine Offshore Fishing - Captain John Pappas, Portland, Maine , and even though the Website sucks and isn't quite done yet, he's getting calls for $1000 charters for about $10 a day and booking some - extremely positive ROI

I've found AdWords to work well where almost NO ONE ELSE is using them!

Now in some cases, it's been to get a customer at break even, for example in selling training courses.

I've given up in using it for affiliate stuff

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Daniel_James_Warburton

14 years ago

From what I gather, it sounds like a few people are blaming their work tools instead of themselves.

Although, from my experience, I'd say google adwords is slowly becoming a thing of the past. I much prefer the use of other smaller networks and cpa adverts. Much more effective.

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HEYitsZEUS

14 years ago

Pertaining to the adwords discussion, what is another way to get out there for affiliate marketing if you can't use adwords?

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Daniel_James_Warburton 14 years ago

I'd say article marketing and press releases, both are free and both do the job.

I personally stay away from anything requiring crawling to the top of page 1 on google when there is more than 30'000 competitors per keyword. S/e rankings take far too long to accomplish and time is money after all.

If you really are content with using ppc, try and find other networks to buy adverts on and experiment with them until you discover one that gives good efficiency.

it's up to you what you do, but good luck!
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rmolina88

14 years ago

I've heard horror stories of people losing thousands and only earning hundreds from PPC. I have a PPC guide, but I feel that it's too risky for me.

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JordanFrancis

14 years ago

In my experience, having luck, or the ability to lose hundreds or thousands of dollars, are not requirements for making Adwords "work."

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John Atkins

14 years ago

Don't forget that some products convert at 1:150, 1:200
or even worse, no matter what the product owner says. (because
they all usually say it has a super high conversion rate)

I think that's what happened here. You promoted a
product with a bad conversion rate & you just didn't send
enough traffic.

Could be a lot of things though, that's why you always
need to test a lot when it comes to PPC.

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Deepak Media

14 years ago

You can see better conversions if you build a list, a relationship with your subscribers

... and then use product launch formula tactics and do an "affiliate launch".

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Midas3 Consulting

14 years ago

My advice as a PPC'er making a ROI daily in multiple niches is to take
everything you read in this thread with a huge pinch of salt.

Some flat out horrible advice and statements being given by people
who think because they died on their asses with PPC, that therefore
it doesn't work and probably a bunch of people who have never even
tried PPC simply repeating parrot fashion what they "heard".

I'm not going to single out some of the stupidest comments, but jeez.

Talk about the blind leading the blind.

Arrghh!

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tedka1978

14 years ago

I think you are waisting your money with Adwords. There are more effective ways to get a high conversion. You have to find your ideal client and talk directly to him. This is more effective than to get hundreds or thousands of visitors and no sales.

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jordanberg2311

14 years ago

are you practicing Google Cash? =)

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Martin Luxton 14 years ago

Obviously there are people making money with Adwords (apart from Google).

What you have to discover is HOW they're doing it.

Adwords + CB product?
Adwords + own landing page ----> CB product?
Adwords + high ticket item (non-CB with good conversion rate)?

etc, etc, etc

Personally, I'm not the kind of methodical/anal person who is good with researching, setting up, testing and tweaking an Adwords campaign so affiliate marketing with Adwords doesn't work for me. That's just me. Other people have the necessary mindset to succeed with it.

I'm happy I learned my limitations before I spent a lot of money for nothing.

Another point. Why not put your own product on CB or e-junkie and let others take the risk with Adwords?

Martin
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theemperor

14 years ago

I'm a vendor, I do a little bit of PPC and collect the affiliate and vendor commissions on a $29 product. It costs slightly more in PPC than I get, so I make a loss. However I am running of a free £75 voucher at the moment, so I'll burn that up then probably quit on an even keel. Obviously for me the back-end up sell and opt-ins have some value too.

Edit: Just checked and I have spent $140 to make $80 (aff) + $26 (vendor), but got $112 free voucher (pure luck)

Very very competitive niche though and I am new to this as well. I am sure it is possible to make a small profit but it takes hard work (research, testing), not a get rich quick solution by any means.

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MarkSherris

14 years ago

I've moved away from adwords as it's too risky. It can build you a decent list if your using target keywords and a squeeze page, but direct linking you'll never make much because it's too costly.

Most of my traffic to various things comes from free methods now like organic search engine results, twitter etc..

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kursat

14 years ago

I agree wit many responses here that Adwords is a difficult way to make success with CB.

Also, I am not sure but I was under the impression that you can not directly link Adwords to a CB Product.?? you need your own landing page.

I think, that got some people suspended from Adwords for direct aff links.

Anyway, for me success with CB is with a good landing page and preselling.

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yongjj

14 years ago

Originally Posted by nzdealer

SO this is my 5th try at bidding for product name and product name related keywords but I get 0 conversions all the time!

I bid on these keywords on launch day and 2-3 days into the launch but still I get ZERO conversions from it.

I have over 100 clicks on each campaign yet still I don't see any conversions. The tracking seems to be working fine as well.

My ads are well written with high ctr but I am confused now.

BTW are they direct linked to the sales page.

If you have problems with Adwords to drive traffic to your websites, you can try using a low-cost and less risky way of generating targeted traffic to your sites via article marketing.

From article marketing, you can build more backlinks on the long run. Think about it.

Jaden J.

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Chris Worner

14 years ago

Has anybody tried putting the opt-in box in the resource box of your articles so that if you run an Adwords campaign that links to your blog, they person reads the articles then sees the opt-in in box below?

Chris

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Is it just me or is everyone losing money with CB & ADwords

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