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The 'Man that Can' does he have a place in IM Gurus Stafflists?

by graphicsgenie
20 replies
I am wondering.......

I currently work a full time job, my partner in my business is full time.

It would really help my business if I too were full time. I'm thinking of offering my services to a small clientbase as 'a general man that can'....

I am sure I can make clients money, certainly save them some.

For some deep set reason I am unable to move my own business forward. But once I get brain storming with my graphic clients some real nuggets just pop out, and I can say I am an ideas machine.

I am sure that there are people out there that already do this.. what would your advise be, go for many clients for a smaller figure, or concentrate on say 5 at a high monthly price.

Just after some thoughts )
#gurus #man #place #stafflists
  • Profile picture of the author Sean A McAlister
    Hey Darren,

    My suggestion is to get the word out but be a bit selective. If you bring on too much too fast you will get burned out and less productive...could b counter productive.

    I would continue doing a great job...as you do...and focus a bit more on
    the good ones who keep giving you business...building up that referral base...until you go full time and can handle a lot more.

    just my 2 cents for what its worth!

    Sean
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  • Profile picture of the author George Wright
    Hi Darren

    I'm no Guru (as if you didn't know that). However, I can vouch that you are a GREAT Idea Man. In addition you are a most talented graphics artist. Your company provides quality.

    You helped me with projects in the past and opened my eyes to possibilities I wouldn't have thought of on my own. You also gave me and Tammy a break by utlizing our services. I hope some big names do the same for you if that is what you need.

    I wish you the best,
    George Wright
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  • Profile picture of the author tomw
    Hi Darren,

    When it comes to consulting ALWAYS focus on a higher paying smaller number of clients. It's true what people often say; those that pay less are more trouble than they're worth. Those that pay higher rates will trust you more, believe in your strategies and ideas AND have the resources to implement them. They will actually see the results of your input, appreciate this and advocate your services to others.

    Like all other exchanges of products and services it's all about value. Consulting, or rather charging for consulting, is also about perception of value and then delivering on the expectation. You have to deliver tangible measurable results.

    Always have the confidence to charge what you are worth. If you do, clients will treat you accordingly. This is true at both ends of the scale.

    Getting paid simply for your ideas is the most satisfying and rewarding professional experience imaginable. I know because this is what I do.

    I could go on and on about this, but the simple fact is that you need to align your business and lifestyle goals with the type of clients that will help you achieve these.

    Those paying a small fee will make your life hell, trust me! You will be caught up in all kinds of ridiculous petty requests for mundane tasks that consume your time and sap your energy.

    You always want to work with people that KNOW what THEY want, have the resources to achieve this, but are simply happy to pay someone to lead the way, to help them achieve their business goals and take them to a higher level. Never get involved in anything lower down in any sector...you'll end up feeling as though you work full time for your clients and they will assume you do and treat you as such!

    Also, never simply be "a man than can." Always sell yourself as "a man that DOES!"

    Feel free to PM me if you need any further information/direction.

    Thomas
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  • Profile picture of the author graphicsgenie
    Hi Tom,

    This was exactly the post I was looking for. Regarding the pricing, yes I would go top end. I currently do this in the graphics and predominantly the video market, not creating videos for any less than $1000, and many a lot more.

    I aim for the top guys becuase as you say they know what they want and in many cases are prepared to leave you the job at hand. As long as you deliver on your promises they will be back time and time again

    Tom, PM sent your way

    Thanks

    Darren 'The man that does' Kaye
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    • Profile picture of the author AndrewCavanagh
      As great as they might be the ideas aren't worth much.

      We all have ideas that we haven't implemented...mainly due to time constraints or the difficulty of finding someone to implement an idea.

      But if you're willing to come up with great ideas (or work with the ideas marketers already have) and actually implement them yourself then I'm sure you could do very well indeed.

      That's the key though...actually doing if FOR marketers from start to finish.

      Kindest regards,
      Andrew Cavanagh
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      • Profile picture of the author graphicsgenie
        Hi Andrew,

        Yes, sure, I can run with an idea and put this into fruition, obviously budget dependant, but I've seen enough people around that are seemingly doing this kind of work and I'm thinking... I can do much better than that.

        I have the contacts and skills to really make a difference

        Darren
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        • Profile picture of the author AndrewCavanagh
          Personally I have projects that require a good english speaker but I'd need someone who did everything...no budget except paying that person and no hand holding...that would defeat the purpose.

          Also I'd be paying based on the project...not the hours you worked...that would be your problem.

          On top of that if the projects didn't turn out to make me money you might not get hired again.

          If you can understand the mindest behind all that, embrace it and do kick arse work fast then I don't think you'll have any trouble at all getting hired.

          Kindest regards,
          Andrew Cavanagh
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          • Profile picture of the author graphicsgenie
            Originally Posted by AndrewCavanagh View Post

            Personally I have projects that require a good english speaker but I'd need someone who did everything...no budget except paying that person and no hand holding...that would defeat the purpose.

            Also I'd be paying based on the project...not the hours you worked...that would be your problem.

            On top of that if the projects didn't turn out to make me money you might not get hired again.

            If you can understand the mindest behind all that, embrace it and do kick arse work fast then I don't think you'll have any trouble at all getting hired.

            Kindest regards,
            Andrew Cavanagh
            Hi Andrew,

            Exactly the kind of stuff I would be looking for, the longer the reign the better the results would be, in my opinion.

            Just for reference sake, when you say everything, in your respect what would that cover? Also wondering why you specifically mention English Speaker?

            Thanks again for your responses, it's very much appreciated to get some feedback to help formalise my thinking

            Thanks

            Darren
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            • Profile picture of the author AndrewCavanagh
              Most of the stuff I have that I know can make me money that isn't too complex for someone skilled to do involves putting SEO pages, articles online and turning those articles into simple videos and putting those online too.

              Speaking english and having some writing skill helps a lot with the last task.

              Also understanding how to put a page on a website, embed a youtube video on a page etc etc.

              But also I'm not interested in trying to have back and forth conversations with someone who can't understand my emails.

              I think you'd also have to expect that while with many of these projects you might end up making $20+ an hour doing them it would almost certainly take you time to work out how to get that efficient.

              Obviously I'd have to price projects based on the money I anticipate they would make me.

              Kindest regards,
              Andrew Cavanagh
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              • Profile picture of the author graphicsgenie
                I'd possibly say that the work you mention would be beneath what I would be looking at.

                I would maybe concentrate more on product creation, higher end, higher paying clients

                client supplies an idea.... and the idea is produced, some of it would be outsourcing, but I have made contacts through networking for the last 2/3 years where I feel I can be a highly regarded staff member

                Just my 2cents, maybe I need to think a little more

                Darren
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                • Profile picture of the author graphicsgenie
                  Originally Posted by Lee McIntyre View Post

                  Hi Darren

                  You might also want to consider 'giving' up a period of time to work exclusively with one marketer so you can learn everything that goes on behind the scenes in their business.

                  A few months ago I hired James as my Ops Manager and he now works in my Manchester office. Initially he was going to manage one particular project for a fixed fee, but when I saw the work he was doing I offered him a full time contract plus a percentage of profits.

                  Without being boastful about my business he gets to see EVERYTHING and I'm sure this is a valuable marketing education for him (working alongside him is also a great education for ME too).

                  If you were flexible about salary expectations, and knowing the talents you have, I have no doubt you could get an ambitious full time IMer to give you a year's contract. You help build their business and in return you'd probably gain ten years worth of knowledge that you could profit from in the future.

                  Anyway, I hope this helps!

                  Lee McIntyre
                  Hi Lee,

                  Enjoy your holiday ?

                  Yes I would probably be looking for exactly what you mention. I am doing this to learn too, there are some aspects of IM where I do lack the right stuff, but there are many other areas where I feel I am able to bring a lot to the table.

                  Currently I have a full time job where I get paid quite well. I am married with 3 beautiful children (that I want to spend more time with).

                  The job security issue is what scares me, so a years contract would certainly help in that respect.

                  Thanks for giving me a different slant on this,

                  Regards

                  Darren
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  • Profile picture of the author Lee McIntyre
    Hi Darren

    You might also want to consider 'giving' up a period of time to work exclusively with one marketer so you can learn everything that goes on behind the scenes in their business.

    A few months ago I hired James as my Ops Manager and he now works in my Manchester office. Initially he was going to manage one particular project for a fixed fee, but when I saw the work he was doing I offered him a full time contract plus a percentage of profits.

    Without being boastful about my business he gets to see EVERYTHING and I'm sure this is a valuable marketing education for him (working alongside him is also a great education for ME too).

    If you were flexible about salary expectations, and knowing the talents you have, I have no doubt you could get an ambitious full time IMer to give you a year's contract. You help build their business and in return you'd probably gain ten years worth of knowledge that you could profit from in the future.

    Anyway, I hope this helps!

    Lee McIntyre
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    • Profile picture of the author AndrewCavanagh
      Originally Posted by Lee McIntyre View Post

      A few months ago I hired James as my Ops Manager and he now works in my Manchester office. Initially he was going to manage one particular project for a fixed fee, but when I saw the work he was doing I offered him a full time contract plus a percentage of profits.
      This is the most likely way you're going to move into a trusted position like this.

      You have to expect that a leading marketer is not going to give you the keys to his kingdom until you've demonstrated your ability and your ability to work with him.

      Kindest regards,
      Andrew Cavanagh
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      • Profile picture of the author graphicsgenie
        Originally Posted by AndrewCavanagh View Post

        This is the most likely way you're going to move into a trusted position like this.

        You have to expect that a leading marketer is not going to give you the keys to his kingdom until you've demonstrated your ability and your ability to work with him.

        Kindest regards,
        Andrew Cavanagh
        Hi Andrew,

        I'm not asking for the keys to the kingdom, just a key to the shed where I can start piling up money for them.

        I aren't coming out of the woodwork with no experience of doing this already. I have already worked with quite a few big named marketers, recently working quite closely with a marketer that launched a product that did really well.

        Maybe I need to come at this from a different angle

        Thanks

        Darren
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      • Profile picture of the author Lee McIntyre
        Hi Darren

        Yes my holiday was amazing but now I feel like my head has been beaten by a shovel

        While I was away James managed my entire business for the week and took care of absolutely everything (I still haven't been back to our offices).

        He even launched my Beginners Mastermind DVD while I was drinking Czech beer in Prague and I didn't even know we'd sold so many until I got back!

        He set up the promotion. He sent the email. He withdrew the money to my account. He answered customer emails. He paid the invoice on my office. And he even created a new product, changed around an optin process, and added a new OTO to one of my sites.

        He did all of this while I was out seeing the world and having fun!

        As Andrew says, to give him this level of access only happened because I'd worked with him in the past and trusted his abilities. I also made sure he had an incentive to perform by paying out a large share of the profits.

        Having worked with you I know you would have a huge amount to offer another IMer in this respect. If I were you I'd place a value on this kind of experience, and then figure out what's the lowest amount you can work for during the year. Once you have that figure you've then got something solid that you can propose to other marketers.

        I should also say that when I offered James a percentage of profits it was under the understanding that he would almost "bleed" for my business. We've had a LOT of late nights eating pizza at our PCs at 11pm but the rewards are huge for the both of us.

        I hope this helps!

        Lee McIntyre
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        • Profile picture of the author Sean A McAlister
          Originally Posted by tomw View Post

          Hi Darren,

          When it comes to consulting ALWAYS focus on a higher paying smaller number of clients. It's true what people often say; those that pay less are more trouble than they're worth. Those that pay higher rates will trust you more, believe in your strategies and ideas AND have the resources to implement them. They will actually see the results of your input, appreciate this and advocate your services to others.

          Like all other exchanges of products and services it's all about value. Consulting, or rather charging for consulting, is also about perception of value and then delivering on the expectation. You have to deliver tangible measurable results.

          Always have the confidence to charge what you are worth. If you do, clients will treat you accordingly. This is true at both ends of the scale.

          Getting paid simply for your ideas is the most satisfying and rewarding professional experience imaginable. I know because this is what I do.

          I could go on and on about this, but the simple fact is that you need to align your business and lifestyle goals with the type of clients that will help you achieve these.

          Those paying a small fee will make your life hell, trust me! You will be caught up in all kinds of ridiculous petty requests for mundane tasks that consume your time and sap your energy.

          You always want to work with people that KNOW what THEY want, have the resources to achieve this, but are simply happy to pay someone to lead the way, to help them achieve their business goals and take them to a higher level. Never get involved in anything lower down in any sector...you'll end up feeling as though you work full time for your clients and they will assume you do and treat you as such!

          Also, never simply be "a man than can." Always sell yourself as "a man that DOES!"

          Feel free to PM me if you need any further information/direction.

          Thomas
          Originally Posted by graphicsgenie View Post

          Hi Tom,

          This was exactly the post I was looking for. Regarding the pricing, yes I would go top end. I currently do this in the graphics and predominantly the video market, not creating videos for any less than $1000, and many a lot more.

          I aim for the top guys becuase as you say they know what they want and in many cases are prepared to leave you the job at hand. As long as you deliver on your promises they will be back time and time again

          Tom, PM sent your way

          Thanks

          Darren 'The man that does' Kaye

          Toms post is on the money Darren,

          and your reply was on the money.

          This business and any business can be rough at times.
          I have been self employed for 12 years, integrated marketing solutions and operational management... my business has grown as a result of "Doing what I say I am going to do" and over delivering. This can only be done though by being selective and prudent.

          If you go about things with the right intent then good things tend to follow.

          And Tom is 100% correct. My client base has grew an autopilot just word of mouth. My clients became larger over the years and so did the money. You are better off to focus on the Larger Opportunities!

          Focus on the trees that bear the most fruit....if they come across your path.

          One more thing, as Tom pointed out, it is usually easier to deal with the larger paying clients because the communication level are better. If you are designing graphics for some one who can better speak the lingo...you are more than likely going to get the job completed quicker with less change orders.

          You CAN DO IT!

          Sean
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