How Would You Handle This Refund Request?

58 replies
This didn't happen to me but I recently saw it
happen to someone else, and I've had similar
things happen to me. So, I'm just curious how
you would handle it.

I'll preface things by sticking my neck out and
saying that I don't think that there IS a correct
answer.

Here's the situation...

A customer signs up for a product, say a $497
webinar series, where you pay 50% commission to
affiliates. You offer a 90-days no-questions-asked,
money-back guarantee.

You only offer the webinar series once but do
record it to create a product.

Six MONTHS later someone comes to you saying that
they were hospitalized when the webinars actually
happened, missed everything and now have NO interest
in the topic. Since they couldn't make the webinar
and aren't interested in the recordings, they
want a refund.

You have already paid the 50% commission to the
affiliate, if that matters in your decision.

What would you do?

Willie
#handle #refund #request
  • Profile picture of the author Joshua Rigley
    Banned
    Depends. You certainly don't have to give them a refund. Although, even if they were hospitalized, I wonder why it took them so long to ask for a refund?

    To me though, it sounds like they're being honest. If it were me, I would stick with my refund policy: I'm sorry, but it's been over 90 days since your purchase, so I can not refund your money.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mike Hlatky
    These are tricky situations, and I usually do not give people the benefit of the doubt when they post their sob stories (Meaning I do not believe them).

    However, if someone were in the hospital for 6 months, I think that $497 is probably the least of their concerns. Hospital bills can be racked up and the person might seriously have something wrong with them.

    I would say sorry that they were in the hospital for so long and not refund the money, stating the 90 day time period.
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  • Profile picture of the author Sour
    If they could send me legitimate proof that they were hospitalized for those dates for a serious cause, I'd consider refunding the remaining half of the money I have left. Chances are they're just lying, though, but I'm a cynic at heart .
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  • Profile picture of the author getsmartt
    Willie, I would probably end up refunding the purchase and "writing off" the commission. Even though it is well outside of the normal refund time frame, I would be hard pressed to tell them to suck it up, or asking for proof they were actually in the hospital.

    If they are being honest about the hospital incident, my refund should help them see I am a quality marketer who cares about his customers, and maybe they will buy something from me again in the future.

    If they are lying about the hospital incident, yeah I lost out on some money, but I still feel like I did the right thing.

    James
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  • Profile picture of the author tryinhere
    ? was the person incapacitated in hospital for those 6 months ? if so then yes maybe it would be an option ? you may explain that it would be a 50% refund due to matters beyond your control the 90 day period or pay in full if you felt cheerful.

    if not in hospital for that time ?
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  • Profile picture of the author Brad Gosse
    I judge these cases on a number of factors including customer history and how they are interacting with me.

    I would likely not grant a refund after 6 months.
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    • Profile picture of the author Bingo123
      I would make my judgement based on whether I could actually afford to refund him and lose the affiliate commission. It may sound strange, but if I was really wealthy and could afford it I would give him the benefit of the doubt. If not, I may have to think about it a bit further.
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  • Profile picture of the author Willie Crawford
    It looks like we all think very similar here.

    I don't think that I would ask for proof of the
    hospitalization since that's very easy to fabricate.
    Some people even fabricate death certificates

    Since tons of people buy products that they do
    nothing with, and I would have had hard expenses,
    my first inclination would be to say no... but I
    would also look for reasons to say yes.

    "Life happens" to all of us and if you are in
    business long enough you will encounter such
    situations.

    I personally don't mind giving a person a break and
    help people out routinely, but absolutely hate
    thinking that I might be getting ripped off.

    Willie
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    • Profile picture of the author tpw
      Originally Posted by Willie Crawford View Post

      I personally don't mind giving a person a break and help people out routinely, but absolutely hate thinking that I might be getting ripped off.

      I had a whole bunch to say, but it struck me that people might think I was just being petty. So I typed this instead.
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    • Profile picture of the author Frank Donovan
      Hi Willie,

      Originally Posted by Willie Crawford View Post

      I personally don't mind giving a person a break and
      help people out routinely, but absolutely hate
      thinking that I might be getting ripped off.
      I'm not sure why you'd feel any more ripped off in this instance than if someone requested a refund within the 90 days. Who knows whether your 'legitimate' 90-day refunders were any more genuine in their motives?

      The 90-day period is an arbitrary limit chosen by you (it could have been 30, 60, 120...days). You don't say whether you withheld all affiliate commission payments for the full 90 days - if not, what would happen to refunds after say, 89 days? Isn't that the same effective loss? And even if you withheld the commission, would an 89-day refunder who had never intended to use your product care either way?

      My point is, you were willing to let buyers refund for 90 days regardless of their motives, so, really, what's the difference with this one, late refunder who may or may not have a genuine case?

      You might ask where one draws the line as far as the elapsed time is concerned. I'd say that's something you could only judge after examining the overall refund rate and operating costs of your business. But I've seen strong arguments for an open-ended (or at least a 12-month) refund period.

      For one, the psychology runs that if a buyer feels under no pressure to return a product by a specific date, it might well escape their mind completely (although this may depend, to an extent, on the cost of the product).

      In this particular case, unless you were dealing with a serial refunder, I'd be inclined to offer a full refund on the offchance that you might impress the customer enough to either tempt him back in future, or to sing your praises to other potential buyers.


      Frank
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  • Profile picture of the author Thomas W
    I came across plenty of chargebacks and refund request in my time. I can tell you lot of them were bogus claims. I would think of it being suspect story.
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  • Profile picture of the author Kevin_Hutto
    I give them all refunds... To a fault. I know I get ripped off, but as long as I am still doing good, I would rather be too generous than hurt someone who is legit.

    I had a guy who bought a $30 ebook 2 years ago ask for a refund the other day - I gave it to him (even though the refund period was 60 days)... My cust service people hate this, but I just figure its good karma.
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      I don't know what I'd do.

      I think that at best (from the customer's perspective) I'd refund "my half", explaining the position to him and saying that I really can't be expected to make a loss on it, having paid the affiliate for the work he did.
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  • Profile picture of the author Sleaklight
    I'm with Alexa on this. If they are a previous customer who has a good track record, then I might refund it all just to keep the customer for future purchase he/she might make. If it's their first time buying, then I would I would offer to give them the recording plus refund half and explain why I can't refund the entire amount.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jpaige
    if your refund policy is 90 days, just stick to it. I dont see how it is your problem when they come 6 month later.
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    • Profile picture of the author takara
      Wow Willie:

      It's a very interesting question.

      Luckily I rarely get refund requests. However, the one's I do get, on time or not, I usually honor.

      I believe in over-delivery on products and on customer service. I just don't want grumbly people out there pointing that grumble in my direction.

      And if what I'm offering isn't what they are needing, then I truly do hope they find it somewhere else. So I wish them well.

      Again, very good question
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    • Profile picture of the author powercomm
      Hi Willie both Jonathan Mizel and Marlon Sanders told me, don't argue or question just give them a refund, easier said than done I know. Peter
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      • Profile picture of the author Willie Crawford
        Originally Posted by powercomm View Post

        Hi Willie both Jonathan Mizel and Marlon Sanders told me, don't argue or question just give them a refund, easier said than done I know. Peter

        Hi Peter,

        It's been a while!

        Marlon and Jonathan have both influenced my thinking too. The issue
        that would cause me to just give the refund in this particular case is
        the fact that I would have already paid the affiliate, and since the
        refund period was over I don't think that it would be "fair" to the
        affiliate to touch their commissions. So, you end up losing if you
        refund, in that case.

        Willie
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        • Profile picture of the author Black Hat Cat
          Banned
          Originally Posted by Willie Crawford View Post

          Hi Peter,

          It's been a while!

          Marlon and Jonathan have both influenced my thinking too. The issue
          that would cause me to just give the refund in this particular case is
          the fact that I would have already paid the affiliate, and since the
          refund period was over I don't think that it would be "fair" to the
          affiliate to touch their commissions. So, you end up losing if you
          refund, in that case.

          Willie
          Not only that, it's not fair to any other customers who wanted a refund after 90 days, but were refused.

          The accident part isn't even relevant. They said they wanted a refund because they weren't interested anymore, not because they had an accident. Sorry, that's on you, Mr. Customer. It doesn't say 90 day refund unless you decide you aren't interested in 6 months.

          My decision: No refund.
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    • Profile picture of the author donhx
      Originally Posted by Jpaige View Post

      if your refund policy is 90 days, just stick to it. I dont see how it is your problem when they come 6 month later.

      I agree. All sorts of thing happen to people and it's not your role to be a nanny. The person was wrong to ask for a refund. No dilemma here.
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      • Profile picture of the author mcmahanusa
        I would respond reminding the person of the 90 day policy but then state that as a goodwill gesture you will refund one-half the price.

        I would also express my hope that his medical problem is not severe and that he is doing better.
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        • Profile picture of the author Diane S
          Originally Posted by mcmahanusa View Post

          I would respond reminding the person of the 90 day policy but then state that as a goodwill gesture you will refund one-half the price.

          I would also express my hope that his medical problem is not severe and that he is doing better.
          That is what I would do, too.
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        • Profile picture of the author davezan
          Originally Posted by Diane S View Post

          Originally Posted by mcmahanusa View Post

          I would respond reminding the person of the 90 day policy but then state that as a goodwill gesture you will refund one-half the price.

          I would also express my hope that his medical problem is not severe and that he is doing better.
          That is what I would do, too.
          This is actually what I did about last year. Someone emailed me their plight, I
          empathized as best as I could, gave them half their money back, and gave an
          explanation why only that rather than full.

          I was rather expecting the person to berate me or, worse, threaten to do a
          chargeback. I heaved a sigh of relief when he replied back saying he will take
          whatever I give back, and thanked me for understanding.

          (Mind you, this was all via email!)

          Willie, hope that someone does the "right" thing soon.
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    • Profile picture of the author Willie Crawford
      Originally Posted by Jpaige View Post

      if your refund policy is 90 days, just stick to it. I dont see how it is your problem when they come 6 month later.
      You are correct. It's not your problem but future relations
      with that customer, and unofficial policy does come into play.
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  • Profile picture of the author dcmarketer
    Willie,

    It would depend on my gut feeling about it (if they are a known customer with a history of doing business etc) but if it raised an eyebrow I'd tell them that whilst I sympathize with their situation, I'm not a bank, and the refund policy is what it is for a reason.

    How long it too long? 12 months? 24 months?

    Have they gone and asked their car insurance company for a 6 month refund because they couldn't drive their car for that same 6 months? How about their Teleco 'cause they weren't around to answer the phone? What about their local council because they didn't live at their house for 6 months so shouldn't need to pay rates for that period. What would their responses be?

    Ultimately, there's a point in time where regardless of the situation, you need to stick by your guns.

    Whilst I've never had this one pulled on me, I've had very similar "situations".

    I'd basically just send the a very polite "no" and go from there.

    "Since tons of people buy products that they do
    nothing with, and I would have had hard expenses,
    my first inclination would be to say no... but I
    would also look for reasons to say yes."

    ...and indeed, based on their response if you ever hear from them again, I'd look for a valid reason to say yes and contemplate the 50% refund.

    Best...

    Duncan
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  • Profile picture of the author jasonmorgan
    The entire story sounds suspicious.

    Six months, in the hospital, no interest anymore. Stuff happens but it sounds fishy, a case of buyers remorse or someone looking to cheat you.

    Tell them to send you a doctors note

    If your a softy, maybe a 50% refund.
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  • Profile picture of the author Daniel Deegan
    I'd refund and bite the loss or give half the refund and simply explain why it's only half. I might even tell them they could keep access to the recordings even with the partial refund. Your better off giving people the benefit of the doubt in these cases.

    The whole do unto others as you would have done unto you philosophy is something I strive to live by. Sometimes it bites you in the ass, but when it does, at least you know you did what you honestly felt was the best you could do.
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  • Profile picture of the author x3xsolxdierx3x
    "You offer a 90-days no-questions-asked,
    money-back guarantee."

    You offered a 90-days-no-questions-asked-money-back-guarantee. If it happened within 90 days, don't ask questions and give the money back.

    If it happened outside of the 90 days, don't give the money back.

    Six months later is around 120 days....

    This buyer didn't deem this important enough during the 90 days, and came back almost 120 days later saying he wanted his money back?
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  • Profile picture of the author Mark R Carter
    Well, I think this one is a matter of perspective, and I don't think there's a wrong answer. Personally, I would offer the customer the taped recordings, but I think the decision is totally up to the merchant.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rus Sells
    Companies have policies in place for reasons.

    They are and should be designed to take the emotional judgment out of making decisions that could harm the company in a situation like this.

    As one poster mentioned, we could not expect our insurance company to refund our insurance for the months we could not drive because we were in the hospital.

    As much as my heart would tell me to give the money back I would have to decline the request for the refund based on company policy.

    Additionally it is a no questions asked 90 day refund policy, at day 91 you'd be entitled to ask as many questions as you want if you are willing to entertain the idea of refunding the money.

    I know I am a cold, huh.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      Russ,
      I know I am a cold, huh.
      Nope. Like Willie said in the first post, there really is no right answer to this one.

      That's what makes questions like this so useful. When there's nothing to point to that gives an outside definition of what's right and wrong, we have to think about our own values and decision-making processes. Those are the ones that help us learn.


      Paul
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      • Profile picture of the author Black Hat Cat
        Banned
        Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

        Russ,Nope. Like Willie said in the first post, there really is no right answer to this one.


        Paul
        Of course there's a right answer.....honor your refund policy. The person changed their mind 6 months later. Nothing more, nothing less. The hospital part, which may or may not be true, is anecdotal. It has nothing to do with the decision at hand. If you wouldn't refund someone else 6 months later for changing their mind, you shouldn't refund this person either.
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        • Profile picture of the author flowbee77
          I agree Willie, you have to honor your refund policy. That is the reason you have a refund policy to begin with. Otherwise why have one at all. Good luck!
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        • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
          Cat,
          Of course there's a right answer.....honor your refund policy.
          Unless the policy explicitly states that no refunds will be given after X days/weeks/whatever, this isn't covered by it.

          It might be better said that every answer is equally right.


          Paul
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  • Profile picture of the author Marvin Johnston
    My inclination would be along the lines of the others who said they would refund 50% since the affiliate had already been paid.

    That said, I would also ask why they signed up in the first place and what caused them to lose interest ... and refund after that. No sense losing a possible opportunity for a bit of market research .

    Marvin
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  • Profile picture of the author Jordan Kovats
    As stated above, maybe refund your half explaining why you can't refund the other half. If they make a stink about it, offer up a future purchase at a reduced rate to show goodwill. That way, if you offer anything else of value to them, you can earn them back as a future customer.
    Who knows what really happened. A for effort on the excuse though if it wasn't true.
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  • Profile picture of the author debra
    Originally Posted by Willie Crawford View Post

    This didn't happen to me but I recently saw it
    happen to someone else, and I've had similar
    things happen to me. So, I'm just curious how
    you would handle it.

    I'll preface things by sticking my neck out and
    saying that I don't think that there IS a correct
    answer.

    Here's the situation...

    A customer signs up for a product, say a $497
    webinar series, where you pay 50% commission to
    affiliates. You offer a 90-days no-questions-asked,
    money-back guarantee.

    You only offer the webinar series once but do
    record it to create a product.

    Six MONTHS later someone comes to you saying that
    they were hospitalized when the webinars actually
    happened, missed everything and now have NO interest
    in the topic. Since they couldn't make the webinar
    and aren't interested in the recordings, they
    want a refund.

    You have already paid the 50% commission to the
    affiliate, if that matters in your decision.

    What would you do?

    Willie
    I would forward them a digital copy of my refund policy and include a voucher worth the cost of the original purchase towards any other product in my inventory.

    Then...I would personally make the phone call to introduce myself and follow up.
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      May have been hospitalized - but then goes on with the "total lack of interest".

      I would refund - but only 50% - with an explanation. For the seller, it's the cost of being a nice guy - for the buyer it's the cost of waiting six months to request a refund.

      I wonder if there are more late refund requests at this time of year - people sorting through receipts for taxes notice they bought something and forgot about it.:p

      kay
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  • Profile picture of the author Lee Wilson
    If the person didn't give me a bad attitude I'd probably refund, but...

    Where do you draw the line. If you refund then you've moved the goal post. Is there a real difference between this situation and someone who woke up from a coma after three years. Would you still refund that one or decide to stick to your policy?
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  • Profile picture of the author AndyBlackSEO
    I think if they waited six months before asking for a request, then they haven't helped matters. Could you go to a shop and return an item that you purchased 6 months ago.. just because you do not plan on using it? The answer is of course no.

    Six months is WAY to long a period to ask for a refund when a generous 90 day period is already in place.

    Just my opinion.
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  • Profile picture of the author wello
    1.: you for sure have a policy ... well ... stick to it
    2.: but... being nice is always uplifting...
    3.: but... this is business...
    4.: where is the 'borderline' between being nice and being a loser?
    5.: when money is involved like this (affiliate) you must consider those expenses as well...
    6.: hospital? 6 months? ... hospital stories always come with 'emotional state' ... especially when they're true... not easy...
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    • Profile picture of the author Shaun OReilly
      It's YOUR business and it's up to you to decide what
      you will do outside of your normal refund policy.

      Of course, honor your refund policy to all customers.

      However, your refund policy can't cover every possible
      scenario - real or fake.

      I'm in business to do things EXACTLY as I want to -
      not to be dictated to by an inflexible refund policy or
      unreasonable demands from customers for that matter.

      I'd deal with each case on merit.

      In this specific situation, I'd give them the benefit of
      the doubt, refund them in full and wish them all the
      best.

      Sure. The hospital story could be a complete fabrication
      or it could be completely true.

      Either way, expect the best in people (accepting that
      sometimes they'll disappoint you).

      Show compassion. At least you'll feel better in the process.

      Dedicated to mutual success,

      Shaun
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      • Profile picture of the author tpw
        Originally Posted by Shaun OReilly View Post

        Either way, expect the best in people (accepting that sometimes they'll disappoint you).

        Shaun: Excellent advice. I will take it if you don't mind.
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        • Profile picture of the author redhalls7
          Hi,

          I think that's something that happens rarely, and I would do the refund, because you don't want an angry customer, he'll probably complain for sure somewhere since it's a high priced product.

          If these things don't happen rarely, I don't know that, then I stick with the 90 day policy and will explain to him in a very friendly way the policy after all it's his problem not yours. But if this request happens just once very rare I won't mind do refund... the affiliate has to understand too that such things happen, and if he is a super affiliate you can also give him some money or reward to have him...

          It's always better to save your reputation and that kind of thing than worry about a sale.

          Karl
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        • Profile picture of the author Willie Crawford
          Originally Posted by tpw View Post

          Shaun: Excellent advice. I will take it if you don't mind.

          Ditto.

          Willie
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  • Profile picture of the author DannyDarwin
    Willie,

    Although I can not rationalize it, I would give the client the refund. To explain why I would need to write a much to long essay, but first I would have to contemplate about my belief systems.

    Instead, I give you this...

    Sam Harris: Science can answer moral questions

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  • Profile picture of the author J.M.Wilson
    Whilst your refund guarantee is 90 days sometimes you have to show some leeway.

    I'd refund it personally. It's sometimes not worth it to deal with the hassle of saying no and engaging in a war of words with a pissed of customer. Also, sometimes it's just nice to be nice and especially in the run up to Xmas, this person may really need the money. Could you live without it?

    It's a touchy subject because some will stand hard on their guarantees and others will be more lenient. As you asked for what I would do, I would refund it, all things considered.
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  • Profile picture of the author Maddi
    I'd give them 50% refund and point out that not only the refund policy duration had passed, I could technically and lawfully refuse to refund but also that the remaining 50% had gone to the affiliate and I'm refunding my part of the sale.

    That way, I'm not being a sad sob, I'm not unprofessional to either the customer or my affiliate and I'm showing that I care enough to look after my customers.

    In the past, I've had people refund and then buy my higher ticket items just because of my work ethic and communication during the refund.

    I've had people who bought, refunded and at a later stage when I added something to the product or for whatever reason buy it back again at a higher price.

    I've also had email replies to broadcasts I send, of buyers who had refunded simply saying how they enjoyed my communications and they'd love to do business again.

    I think this is a very sensitive period for the buyer when asking for a refund (not serial refunders) and everything you say or do during that period, how you conduct the transaction and how you treat them during this time will be remembered more than your normal communication i.e. email or support tickets.

    It helps leaving your mark and becoming memorable for them, so much so that they will open your emails and buy from you again.

    It also helps you stand out from the crowd, specially in the IM niche where the market is generally skeptic and there is just too many fly by night marketers/products going.

    My 0.02 cents

    Maddi Murtaza
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  • Profile picture of the author Drizlek
    Most times I am one to stick with the refund policy of anything I either purchase or that someone purchases from me. Some years back when I worked in a call center I heard stories day in and day out about how this was never ordered r how they never received the product. But with the tools I had on hand I could quickly tell the customer who exactly ordered the product, where it was going and give them a copy of the tracking information. 9 times out of 10 it was either another family member or a child had ordered something or it was supposedly delivered and then vanished.

    But there were times where I was glad to give out refunds. In this situation I would just give them the money back. I realize that for many folks money is becoming harder to come by these days, but you have to think about it. 6 months. Even when I have forgotten to return something it was not for that long.

    In the end though, you have to think long term. Is it worth the possible negative impact it may have to future business let alone your conscious to keep the money?
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  • Profile picture of the author cashcow
    I would most likely eat the commission and give a full refund. I can't stand the thought of anyone being unhappy with something they have bought from me. Thankfully, I hardly ever get refund requests

    Lee
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Oksa
    I like the idea of refunding your net amount.

    However, as I was reading the thread, I wondered how differently people would answer if the price point were different, too.

    What if it were a $7 product, or a $1997 product? Would it matter? Should it matter?

    All the best,
    Michael
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    • Profile picture of the author Willie Crawford
      Originally Posted by Michael Oksa View Post

      I like the idea of refunding your net amount.

      However, as I was reading the thread, I wondered how differently people would answer if the price point were different, too.

      What if it were a $7 product, or a $1997 product? Would it matter? Should it matter?

      All the best,
      Michael

      Hi Michael,

      I'd likely refund the net amount too, but yes, the amount
      would matter... even if I just subconsciously weighted the
      impact on my cash flow of issuing the refund.

      I don't know whether it "should" matter.

      Willie
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    • Profile picture of the author paulie888
      Originally Posted by Michael Oksa View Post

      I like the idea of refunding your net amount.

      However, as I was reading the thread, I wondered how differently people would answer if the price point were different, too.

      What if it were a $7 product, or a $1997 product? Would it matter? Should it matter?

      All the best,
      Michael
      As a matter of principle, the transaction amount should ideally not matter one whit. But when we're talking about a vast difference in figures like what you've mentioned above, psychologically it's going to be a lot harder for the majority of us to refund that larger amount unless it was truly justified.

      Paul
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    • Profile picture of the author cashcow
      Originally Posted by Michael Oksa View Post

      I like the idea of refunding your net amount.

      However, as I was reading the thread, I wondered how differently people would answer if the price point were different, too.

      What if it were a $7 product, or a $1997 product? Would it matter? Should it matter?

      All the best,
      Michael
      I think this depends on how much "extra" money you have for refunds etc...

      In theory, if you are selling products for $1997 you probably make a lot more than if you are selling them for $7.

      Is it possible that a person that each person would be equally impacted financially - assuming a person that sells products for $1997 makes that much more than a person that sells products for $7?

      I guess that's not a fair assumption as there is a lot of other factors involved in how much profit one makes etc...

      Lee
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      • Profile picture of the author Devid Farah
        You really don’t know if this person is telling the truth at all, so I would stick to the 90-day policy.
        If you have money to spare and are feeling generous, then sure, offer him (your) half back.
        But you are under no obligation and it was the customer’s responsibility to make the request within the 90 days.
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  • Profile picture of the author jimcal
    Hi,
    If they could show me a verifiable hospital bill, I would refund their money and take the hit. Then I would use them as a testimonial.
    Thanks,
    Jim
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