A real question for real IM VETS

13 years ago

While there is more competition now compared to when I started in 94, there are more opportunities and sources for customers now.

An example would be all of the social bookmarking sites that allow you to link back to your blog. We didn't have all of the places that will send you a link back for free.

You had to work a little j.v. link exchange or pay to place your link on someone's site.

We didn't have dynamic pages (blogs) that would get you in a search engine almost immediately. Thereby allowing you to analyze your efforts quicker.

Speaking of analyzing, there was not a whole lot of software that would give you the kind of data you can get now and free at that.

Any free web host that gave you a page also had their 15 ads and banners all over the thing.

Now you can get free hosting, free auto-responders, free fully functional websites that are designed nicer than what we had to pay for.

(Back in 95 I paid $800 to be an affiliate for a product and the setup fee for a replicated sales page was $300)

So I'm not one for looking back in fondness to the "good old days" of 14.4 baud rate dial-up and people not comfortable with purchasing online.

Newbies now can get all of the resources mentioned above for free then come in here and ask any questions they want and find more than enough willing people to help them make money.

Unfortunately, the same thing that held someone back 100 years ago is still here today.

Fear.

Until one decides to surrender to the unavoidable mistakes and setbacks that come with learning, they won't succeed.

No amount of competition can do the damage that a little fear can do to you.

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Roaddog 13 years ago

Great answer Matt,

Exactly what I was hoping for.
To many people pine for a good old day that never existed.
And I agree that the same underlying things determine success or failure today.

Being a history buff, I am always interested to get the real story from the horses mouth if I can, Before it is used as an excuse for failure.

Jim
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frankfihn

13 years ago

Jim,

I'm far from an IM Vet. However, I just had a thought on your post.

The opposite side of that coin is that there was certainly a time when people were infinitely more skeptical about numerous things online and in general, less dollars were spent online. Although I wasn't in it from the beginning, I'd be surprised if that much has changed about the industry. Yes I know that backlinking and various aspects of search engines were night and day apart from now but the basics are still the same.

I really think it's the general perseverance and sticking through it as this just isn't the business that is a "get rich quick" scheme. When you have those false expectations, you're bound to give up too quickly. There's a story in think and grow rich about a guy who was digging for gold on his property and gave up. He sold the property and the next guy found the gold 3 feet after where the last guy stopped.

Comparing that metaphor to IM, if you want to use PPC, you can have a site with real traffic 5 minutes after it's made. In reality though, if you don't know what to do with that traffic, it really doesn't matter. So yes there are more people trying to make money but there are also more people willing to spend. The need for ingenuinity and creativity to get that money remains the same.

The marketing principles and solving problems aspects of the business remain the same and for that, I still believe anyone can make it with the right mindset. Just my 2 cents.

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Roaddog

13 years ago

The opposite side of that coin is that there was certainly a time when people were infinitely more skeptical about numerous things online and in general, less dollars were spent online. Although I wasn't in it from the beginning, I'd be surprised if that much has changed about the industry. Yes I know that backlinking and various aspects of search engines were night and day apart from now but the basics are still the same.

frankfihn

Maybe my writing is getting a little better:p

Both you and Matt really got one of my points I was trying to bring out.

The more things change the more they stay the same.

The cons grow with the pros and equally as important the pros grow with the cons.

Intelligent reply

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Jim

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Tina Golden

13 years ago

Competition has grown incredibly but the great thing is that so has the market. The market is growing by leaps and bounds as more people globally get online. Now we have an entire generation growing up with the internet being old hat - they're not in the least bit afraid of ordering something online.

If anything, in my opinion, the internet continues to create far more opportunities, no matter how many start a new business. Before the internet, you would not be able to build a real business that specialized in a particular genre of music, for example. Now you can because you can reach that audience all over the world.

Tina

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Roaddog

13 years ago

Now we have an entire generation growing up with the internet being old hat - they're not in the least bit afraid of ordering something online.

I am still in awe, I still remember actually having to get out of your chair to change the channel, all eight of them

(kinda aging myself there)

Before the internet, you would not be able to build a real business that specialized in a particular genre of music, for example. Now you can because you can reach that audience all over the world.

That's a good analogy.
The market for the smallest part, niche, of anything is enough to make good money, whereas before you would starve trying to sell something that small and specialized to a small area.

Thanks

Jim

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Matt Bard

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Roaddog

... all eight of them

(kinda aging myself there)

Eight? Wow you had it made.

We had three and only two of them would be viewable if someone stood next to the t.v. touching the rabbit ear with the tin foil

I remember the look on my son's face when I told him that they would go off the air at midnight too.

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Roaddog

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Matt Maiden

Eight? Wow you had it made.

We had three and only two of them would be viewable if someone stood next to the t.v. touching the rabbit ear with the tin foil

I remember the look on my son's face when I told him that they would go off the air at midnight too.

I just kind of threw out a number there. I don't really remember how many we had when I first saw TV. But thanks for reminding me of the tin foil dance, I had forgotten. :rolleyes:

When I was about 5 and 6. I lived in South Africa for 3 years.
In those days they didn't even have tv yet. We listened to the radio.
remember the favorite show too..."the fly".

I tell kids that now and they look at me like a Martian.
I didn't see my first tv show until about 8 or 9.

It's kind of amazing how quick technology comes. I read somewhere once that 75% of what we use now has only come in the last 60 to 70 years.
Maybe an even higher % now, it's rolling in so fast.

Jim

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Kay King 13 years ago

It's easier to get started today - but because of that many have unrealistic expectations when they start out.

To many people pine for a good old day that never existed.

That's true online and offline. The grass is (or was) always greener where you aren't standing at the moment.

People didn't trust buying online - the payment processor we use today weren't available. When you registered a domain it cost $60-80 per domain. Keyword search software? What's that? Analytics? Huh?

I think initially with the search engines it was easier to move up - but there wasn't nearly as much at the top as there is now. Today it may be harder for newbies to make a dent in the market due to so many people jumping on the internet to do business - but there are so many tools and tutorials and inexpensive promotional methods to help them succeed.

Cream rises to the top - that hasn't changed.

kay
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- Roaddog 13 years ago
  
  If anything this IM game has gotten a lot easier, if you think all people did was stuff meta tags back in the day then you are dead wrong
  
  That was a deliberate oversimplification and one of the reasons for the thread.
  
  To show that things were not necessarily "easier" back in the day, so to speak.
  
  Hopefully one of the "old timers" that actually had to hand crank their computers on, will tell of some of the hardships they faced.
  
  Make some of the newer people realize that it wasn't all peaches and cream back then.
  
  Thanks for the contribution
  
  Jim
  
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alcymart

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Roaddog

Lately, I have seen a lot of people with threads about giving up because they feel they are not succeeding at IM. Whether it be, not quick enough or what have you.

Which in turn made me think of a question for the older veterans of IM. The reason being some of the people on this forum were there when all you had to do was fill your meta tags with the keywords and get ranked, you could still get three letter exact domain names etc...

Please allow me this 'disclaimer' first. I am not in the IM niche, nor will I ever be. My interests and niches are not huge money makers, unfortunately, but I will stick with what interests me. I have sites, I make money, nothing to write grandma about, but enough to write the IRS. I have no personal agenda, no personal motive. I don't have anything to sell anyone here. I have always been into history, and the history is happening so fast and I think it will only snowball (faster and faster).

My question is this.

Do you think that more people on the internet getting into internet marketing has caused your business to slow down thru more competition and/or that it just maybe, IS harder to get started and get going now?
I am more asking the vets who are not in the im niche, because obviously more people more customers. For those vets maybe a more general question, if you care to answer, what are the changes you have noticed in what is it now, roughly 30 years.

For instance, if you had told me thirty, forty years ago, someone would be able to own a singular word in any language, I would have laughed at you.
Hell, one hundred fifty years ago they would have probably burned you at the stake

This question is a bit of a double edge sword, because if you say yes it may discourage people, which I am not trying to do.

For all the people that wish to give up, all I have to say is if it's becoming a hardship for you and especially a family, then do something else, you can always come back, when you get sorted.

Let's be real.

I did.

If you have three questions for every answer that's a healthy thing. It does take work. Quality counts. And yes, it takes time. If you build a BETTER mousetrap people will link a path to your site. It is a great disservice to think that the net and IM are anything less than an extension of "real life". Cracks me up when people say "Is it just like in real life" or the "real world".

Anyhow, if you can,

stay the course

The tutti de tutti guru is still out there somewhere.

Peace
Jim

I am an IM veteran, and I would say it is much harder to succeed online today indeed! However, there is still room for the wannabees out there that are willing to commit themselves entirely in the IM industry if only they could stay focused!

It's not for everyone, if it would be, everyone would be rich and there would be an imbalance within the social Pyramid in which the Illuminati doesn't want to see happen...

Take care,

Bernard St-Pierre
Marketing Consultant
Copywriter/Teacher

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Dennis Gaskill

13 years ago

While there is more competition, there are more people online as well. In other words, there are more people getting a piece of the pie, but the pie is much bigger and keeps growing. There are also better tools to use, and better information to help you get started. All in all I'd say it's probably about the same. Those who persevere will succeed; and those who do not, will not.

It's the same as it ever was, same as it ever was, same as it ever was, same as it ever was, same as it ever was...

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tencentpiece

13 years ago

If anything this IM game has gotten a lot easier, if you think all people did was stuff meta tags back in the day then you are dead wrong.

There's also A LOT more traffic out there now, people actually buy stuff online (putting credit card info onto a site for a product was unheard of). You can do more interesting stuff with split testing/graphics due to the fact that you don't need to optimize your page for 28.6k modems anymore.

Registering a domain doesn't cost you $80/year anymore.

There is still so many opportunities out there and if you think that the golden days of the web are gone, you're an idiot.

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Matt Bard

13 years ago

If you rely solely on getting your leads from search engines, then the competition is much harder because there are still only ten spots on the front page of Google.

Back in 94 and 95 I dominated Web Crawler, Excite, Lycos and HotBot for the terms "chat" "software" and a few others but there were only a handful of us competing with each other.

Now, there are hundreds of thousands competing for one of the front ten spots.

With all of the other traffic streams now like Social Media sites, you can make up the difference for the lost traffic if you are not on the front page of the engines.

Actually, you can make more now from the other avenues and don't need to worry about keeping up with the search engine changes.

I know that it's so much easier to make it now that it kills me when I hear people say that they can't do it.

Do you realize that any home computer already has a full sized digital studio built into it that can make professional graphics, videos, and audio that most of the creative forces just 30 years ago could only imagine.

The Beatles had a 4 track tape recorder that they bounced to 10 tracks.

Most computers right off the shelf have a 64 track digital stereo sound system that can be used to start your own professional recording studio.

Most printers now can start cranking out your own cards and brochures.

A guy got Hollywood's attention with a 3 minute YouTube video...

This is why I believe the problem is not "out here" with needing stuff to succeed. It's "inside" our heads.

How much more stuff does someone need to make it? How many more people do they need telling them that they can do it? How many more books and mentors?

p.s. Dennis, you got a "Thanks" from me for the Talking Heads line

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Orator

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Matt Maiden

If you rely solely on getting your leads from search engines, then the competition is much harder because there are still only ten spots on the front page of Google.

Back in 94 and 95 I dominated Web Crawler, Excite, Lycos and HotBot for the terms "chat" "software" and a few others but there were only a handful of us competing with each other.

Now, there are hundreds of thousands competing for one of the front ten spots.

With all of the other traffic streams now like Social Media sites, you can make up the difference for the lost traffic if you are not on the front page of the engines.

Actually, you can make more now from the other avenues and don't need to worry about keeping up with the search engine changes.

I know that it's so much easier to make it now that it kills me when I hear people say that they can't do it.

Do you realize that any home computer already has a full sized digital studio built into it that can make professional graphics, videos, and audio that most of the creative forces just 30 years ago could only imagine.

The Beatles had a 4 track tape recorder that they bounced to 10 tracks.

Most computers right off the shelf have a 64 track digital stereo sound system that can be used to start your own professional recording studio.

Most printers now can start cranking out your own cards and brochures.

A guy got Hollywood's attention with a 3 minute YouTube video...

This is why I believe the problem is not "out here" with needing stuff to succeed. It's "inside" our heads.

How much more stuff does someone need to make it? How many more people do they need telling them that they can do it? How many more books and mentors?

p.s. Dennis, you got a "Thanks" from me for the Talking Heads line

I'm not really one for "raw raw" feel good posts that try to motivate people. Still this has got to be one of the best, and true posts I've ever read on this forum.

The fact is anyone can succeed in IM marketing, all the information is out there. You could most likely get all the resources you need totally free to if you looked hard enough.

I've always figured the key battle to be fought is one's own head. Besides I don't mind the competition so much. Competition is the only way to get better, faster, smarter, etc.

Whn your not being challenged, then you should be worried.

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Roaddog 13 years ago

I'm not really one for "raw raw" feel good posts that try to motivate people. Still this has got to be one of the best, and true posts I've ever read on this forum.

Orator

I wasn't trying so much as to make a feel good post, (although I see your point), as I was to show the actual, tangible problems that IMers had when the market was "wide open".
As we can see, the people back then had their own set of issues to deal with.

I myself got started in 2004, just learning how to type and use a computer, and shortly after that got into IM.

A couple of the answers hit on something, that even I have noticed in this short time,
that a lot of the stuff that I paid good bucks for are free now.

Thanks Orator

I appreciate your comments

Peace

Jim
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