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Do "The coders always win?"

by lexilexi
17 replies
So I was reading good ole' Eli Blue Hat's blog recently and he made the statement that "the coders always win."

If I understood his point correctly, he was basically saying that the ones who make the most loot in this internet marketing game, are the ones who have the technical chops to build their own software, web 2.0 sites, etc.

However.... I just came away from Aymen's inspiring "Arbitrage Conspiracy" conference call... and one point he made was that a friend of his is making 7 figures just from direct linking / CPA - and has no "tech" whatsoever.

Tomorrow I am meeting with an accomplished web designer who is going to introduce me to a whole bunch of Ajax stuff. I've made lots of html sites and pages - but this will be an entirely new territory to me. I'm fascinated to learn whether this will be a key element in raising my game.

Here's my question, then: If you were to recommend to an enthusiastic, fresh internet marketer, a particular "course of study" which would increase their ability to make money online - what would you suggest they go and devour?

There are obviously many ways to succeed, but I thought it would be interesting to get several different opinions.
#the coders always win
  • Profile picture of the author freudianslip27
    This is a good question. I think that a lot of internet marketing software stinks because the person that coded it doesn't really understand internet marketing to the level that an experienced person would.

    Software that sells well seems to have both ends covered. It is coded well and does what it is suppose to, and was built from the ground up to suit an internet marketer's needs. That's when the magic happens!

    Matt
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  • Profile picture of the author Kyle Tully
    Technical skills DO NOT make you money.

    Marketing makes you money.

    Study marketing and become a good marketer.
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  • Profile picture of the author GeorgR.
    LOL..i wish. ( Dives back into huge pile of dollar bills..NOT )
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  • Profile picture of the author Chris Lockwood
    Originally Posted by lexilexi View Post

    So I was reading good ole' Eli Blue Hat's blog recently and he made the statement that "the coders always win."

    If I understood his point correctly, he was basically saying that the ones who make the most loot in this internet marketing game, are the ones who have the technical chops to build their own software, web 2.0 sites, etc.
    Just the opposite is more often true. Coders usually are not marketers, and you're much more likely to find a marketing expert who paid a coder a relatively small price to create software that the marketer made a fortune from.

    I'm sure Jeff Bezos is a lot richer than the programmers who developed amazon.com.

    The marketers who are also programmers would usually do just as well if they had someone else do the coding.
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  • Profile picture of the author lexilexi
    You're obviously not a black hat, Kyle
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  • Profile picture of the author eshera
    I can only reply to the first part of your question...

    The 'ones' that made and are still making a killing on creating their own software are ones that made plugins for facebook early on like...poker...

    You get only so many coins per day....do you still want to play against these same players right now? Well.. it will cost you if you don't want to wait until tomorrow...screen...pay money for fake chips...

    These programmers have no idea about marketing. Are you kidding me, they ask me about a 'button' or color on a daily basis (well, not now fortunately)

    If they get someone who understands PPC...which is the front-end and the money. Match made, but the programmer is not the one making the money.

    As for AJAX, simply javascript and XML....

    Basically, as you would start to put in the name of a movie for your favorite today...the screen will fill in the blanks. It still 'talks' to a database to make or help your browser experience (as they call it), but you don't see any jumps or pauses on the screen and seems seamless....just silly stuff really...not that hard at all.

    Hope that helps
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    • Profile picture of the author novasoft
      Hell yeah I agree totally.. but then again I'm biased coz im a coder amongst many other roles.

      When it comes to blackhat if you can code and have an idea heck you can make boatloads of money and there is no way on earth that id trust some kid on RAC or scriptlance to make my personal bots.

      Cheers
      Satya
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  • Profile picture of the author lexilexi
    Ah good this is warming up a bit, a nice spectrum of viewpoints. Thanks folks. I'm still hoping for some specifics as to actual training that could be the most valuable in terms of giving the ability to make profit.

    So, what about Mark Pincus or whatever his name is from plentyoffish. Nothing Black Hat about that one AFAIK. I'm told he runs the site single handed and is making bank, but did he build the whole thing himself? What tech skills would you need in order to run a profile-based membership site like that?

    What about the guys who started Google. Were they marketers or coders? Or both? Did they outsource the creation of Googlebot and their algos?

    Novasoft, what programming languages etc do you need to learn to do what you do?
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    • Profile picture of the author David Neale
      Markus Frind

      The Paradigm Shift

      I do believe Markus did most of the stuff himself and, until recently ran the site himself.

      He posted in another forum that in 2006 he made $1,000,000 in three months from AdSense alone.

      How I made a million in 3 months.

      I don't think he started POF knowing much about marketing at all. Just built something that people really wanted and then it marketed itself.

      Facebook was similar but without the revenue But they found another way to cash in.

      I don't think they were marketers either, just built something that people really wanted.

      I think the coding referred to over at BlueHat has more to do with automation than Web 2.0. A coder will win the SEO game if he can automate the processes involved VS the individual who can't. He is also referring to a server side language like PHP, Coldfusion, ASP etc.

      Excellent Post

      Blue Hat SEO-Advanced SEO Tactics SEO Empire - Part 1





      Originally Posted by lexilexi View Post

      Ah good this is warming up a bit, a nice spectrum of viewpoints. Thanks folks. I'm still hoping for some specifics as to actual training that could be the most valuable in terms of giving the ability to make profit.

      So, what about Mark Pincus or whatever his name is from plentyoffish. Nothing Black Hat about that one AFAIK. I'm told he runs the site single handed and is making bank, but did he build the whole thing himself? What tech skills would you need in order to run a profile-based membership site like that?

      What about the guys who started Google. Were they marketers or coders? Or both? Did they outsource the creation of Googlebot and their algos?

      Novasoft, what programming languages etc do you need to learn to do what you do?
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  • Profile picture of the author Andy Fletcher
    Marketing is far and away the most important thing but technical skills cannot be over looked. Its not so much about being able to do stuff other people can't than its about not trying to do stupid things that won't work.

    I've lost count of the number of "great" ideas I've heard people talk about that fall at the first hurdle that they just don't work. Worse still when someone describes something as "just a case of X" and makes X sound really easy. My favourite case being, "Its just a case of raising Google's search result CTR by 0.1% and its worth millions." Said as if everyone else in the room wasn't aware that doing so would be worth millions. That doesn't exactly make it easy.
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    • Profile picture of the author Neil Morgan
      A combination of technical skill and real-world commercial savvy is a killer combination in both the online and offline worlds.

      It's quite rare to have both so you can actually do very well if you have them, whether you choose to do it online or off.

      Cheers,

      Neil
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  • Profile picture of the author BIG Mike
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    • Profile picture of the author GeorgR.
      So, focus on becoming a leader, a business manager if you will, and then develop the resources you need to become successful rather than develop specific skills that are by their very nature, self-limiting.
      nicely spoken, appreciated!

      G.
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    • Profile picture of the author novasoft
      Originally Posted by BIG Mike View Post

      I find it highly unlikely that you will find many, if any individuals possessing everything needed among coding and marketing to be a winner.
      LOL, I'm one of those few individuals

      Originally Posted by lexilexi View Post

      Novasoft, what programming languages etc do you need to learn to do what you do?
      Well, start with learning a simple scripting language like PHP, you can build some decent bot script with it. Once you are confident with php move to C# or vb.net


      Cheers,
      Satya
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  • Profile picture of the author lexilexi
    Mike, David. Fantastic answers gentlemen, thank you.

    Looking at Markus's "Paradigm Shift" blog - wow, its a never ending learning curve, isn't it... who said striking gold made life simple?
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  • Profile picture of the author Steven Fullman
    Originally Posted by lexilexi View Post

    So I was reading good ole' Eli Blue Hat's blog recently and he made the statement that "the coders always win."
    $random_statement = "the coders always win";
    if ($surname == "Fullman") {
    $random_statement = str_replace("always", "rarely", $random_statement);
    $reality_check = $random_statement;
    echo $reality_check.", haven't you figured it out yet Steve?";
    }
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  • Profile picture of the author Marcus Paul
    Coders make money when they solve a problem THEY have and sell it to others.

    Marketers make money when they solve a problem MANY have and sell it to others.

    Marketers tend to think more outside of themselves. This breeds more business savvy and opportunity.

    I have to chuckle at the Arbitrage Conspiracy guys, as they advocate techniques in their free report that will get your ads flagged (such as using the trademarked name in the ad.) CPA is nothing new and they didn't show a technique that many PPC people don't already know. My point is that their whole approach is a new marketing angle to an old process and they will make money because people will perceive it as different.
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