"Digital Nomads" (Working abroad on Internet Marketing)?

[LocoDice]

Hi folks,

I just wondered if anybody else out there is leading a similar life to me and travelling in far off distant places while keeping up their IM career. It would be great to network with some of you!

I've worked so far in NYC, London, Riga, KL, Melbourne and I am currently in Buenos Aires.

Would love to hear your stories!

[TryBPO]

We're Americans, living in Davao City, Philippines where we have our company, home base, etc. We both travel throughout Asia quite a bit, though...mostly for fun but a little bit of business mixed in! (Thailand, Vietnam, Hong Kong, China, Singapore, etc.) I like the Digital Nomads lifestyle because I just love to travel and make money while I'm doing it...can't beat it!

[LocoDice]

Cool! Sounds awesome, do you know any good websites that focus on the 'digital nomad' style life?

[TryBPO]

These guys have a really nice community:
Location Independent | Live and Work Anywhere

Cody McKibben's pretty interesting to follow, although last time I talked to him he beat me up for my social media "tactics"...ouch!
Lifestyle Entrepreneurship, Permanent Travel & the Digital Nomad Lifestyle | Thrilling Heroics

That should give you a couple of good places to look!

[Andyhenry]

I'm now back in the UK and settled again but in the last 3 years I've lived in America (Boston), Singapore and been all over the world to more countries than I can remember- doing IM the whole time.

[LocoDice]

Great to see some good responses here, where do you think some of the best countries to minimise costs and have a good quality of life are?

I've lived in Riga, Latvia and Buenos Aires, Argentina and have good things to say about both. I can live a lot cheaper in both these places than my home town of Melbourne, Australia.

But I'd like to know what other options I have. I'm thinking of dropping into SE Asia for 2-4 weeks in July/August and wondering about tips. Anybody done Bangkok?

I'd love to do that stereotype, sit on a beach with pina colada in hand and work on my laptop.. just because

[allenjohn]

Vietnam = $1 per bottle of Heinekin
Paris = $15 per bottle of Heinekin

Tough call all the very best, Allen

[LocoDice]

Haha, funny I usually go on can of coke or the price of a big mac...

[Chris Kent]

Out of interest, where do you pay your taxes?

Having a company resident in one country does not necessarily make a difference if you control the company from somewhere else that you are resident (normally that country wants a piece of your pie).

But what if you live in 3 countries and none for more than 6 months? Are you liable for any taxes?

[Anonymous Affiliate]

I've been working+traveling for years. I dont do the backpacking trail anymore (did it extensively through my 20s). Instead, what I do now is to move somewhere, rent an appartment, settle in like a local, live for half a year or so, move on, etc. I've been doing that in France, Germany, Thailand, Spain, Argentina and some other places along the way.

Nothing, NOTHING, beats the feeling of knowing that you're in full control of your next destination and your location in the world, and you can change it within the day.

[Willie Murray]

All being well we're moving out to Thailand this year and plan to travel in Asia, from the UK.... Can't wait...

[LocoDice]

Great to read similar stories to what I'm doing. I always think that this kind if lifestyle really was not possible until very recently.

It is funny in a way because this is what they were predicting back in the 1960's/1970's.. so called 'telecommuting'. Well for some it is happening.

If anybody knows any beaches I can work on with wifi and that are cheap in SE Asia let me know.. I am interested in doing this in a month or two.

[Brazilraider]

thanks for posting this question. Currently I'm living in Brazil and looking to implement some local marketing. I'm very interested in reading more about how to live abroad and make cash. I will ck out the community links that were offered.

How about the issue that was raised with the paying of taxes. If I have an LLC in the U.S. and live abroad? any recommendations?

[Reed Floren]

I've done this too but always found it hard to focus being in a new time zone, adjusting to food/culture, seeing the sites and then finding time to do internet stuff when I know that I may never be at that specific place ever again

As for taxes I was away on April 15th and my accountant filed for an extension so my taxes are due in October. (I think being overseas you can get an automatic 2 month but it may be an automatic 6)

[TryBPO]

The Philippines is an excellent place for a low cost of living, beautiful beaches, etc. If you get outside of dusty, smoggy Manila, there are some amazingly beautiful places you can go. (Boracay, Palawan, Bohol, etc.) I highly recommend stopping in if you're out and about on an adventure. Locationally, it's a little out of the way, but it's a great place to check out.

For the best tax advice, definitely speak to an accounting professional! I can tell you that it's a really good idea to set up a corporation or LLC...we have a corp based out of California and another corp here in the Philippines. As a foreigner, you can't own a business here in the Phils, so what we had to do was have our corporation in the US own 95% of the corporation here. The other 5 percent is split up between my partner and I and three Filipino placeholders.

As an American, you're taxed on worldwide income, not just income made in the US, but there are tax breaks for those living abroad X% of the year...but, again, speak to a tax professional.

[hardraysnight]

i have lived in asia for much of the past 10 years, mainly china, south korea and philippines. i have worked, on a wage structure in both china and south korea

i have successfully launched and maintained an im business pertaining to sports betting, soon to make it bigger and better and a wider subscription base

i do not pay tax except on interest in my home country

you forgot baguio, joe, strawberries and the best shopping in the philippines

[Mac Wheeler]

I have not been home to the UK for 5 years, all I need is my laptop and an internet connection and I can work anywhere. I even managed to keep working whilst I was trekking, half way up a mountain in Northern Thailand thanks to mobile internet.

[Superior Content Creation]

I've been living in Thailand for the past 3 years, and I can't get enough of it. At the moment, I'm actually visiting family in the States for the first time since i left. I've been here for 3 months, and it was great to see everyone, but I can't wait to get out there again. I'm planning on heading back in a couple weeks.

[Apollo-Articles]

How do you manage the tax side of your business when being a "digital nomad"?

I.E. Who do you pay taxes to?

Sam

[Simin]

Great men.. IM really a border-less business...
I hope some day I can do my IM business in other country..

[flyinghammers]

What an inspiring thread. I have heard that U.S. citizens don't have to pay federal taxes on earned income as long as they are not in the country for more than 30 days out of the year.

[Chris Kent]

Originally Posted by Apollo-Articles

How do you manage the tax side of your business when being a "digital nomad"?

I.E. Who do you pay taxes to?

Sam

For most citizens, you pay if you are resident >6 months in a country (unless emigrating part way through a year, in which case you split pro-rata).

So I think you can live 4 months in 3 different countries and pay no tax. I'm looking for clarification on this though.

If you are American, this is not the case, you are taxed no matter where you are, but this does not apply until you hit something like 50K a year or thereabouts.

What many people wrongly think is that if they own a company based in one country then they only pay taxes there. That is not true. If the company is owned by you and you are resident overseas and control it from there, then that overseas jurisdiction can get taxes from you. It does not matter if the company itself is resident overseas. It's called anti-avoidance legislation and is why tax authorities have a claim on your earnings, even if they come from an offshore company.

This is for most countries. Some countries use a different tax system and only tax when the money comes back into the country. And some countries are lax altogether on tax and couldn't really care less about any overseas earned income, even if it hits your bank account.


People talk about the freedom of the west, but the west impose great punitive taxes on its people, in my opinion.

[JCorp]

Originally Posted by mkterbynite

Hi folks,

I just wondered if anybody else out there is leading a similar life to me and travelling in far off distant places while keeping up their IM career. It would be great to network with some of you!

I've worked so far in NYC, London, Riga, KL, Melbourne and I am currently in Buenos Aires.

Would love to hear your stories!

Cool man! Great job...

Doing the same as well, but found a place to stay a bit longer to really dig deep in the culture, life, etc. That's the beauty of working online, you can choose to stay in a place for a day, or for a year and move to another place...

[JCorp]

Regarding taxes, that's a complex subject, but I know that if you're traveling outside the U.S., many countries don't allow you to work unless you have a special visa (work visa, etc.)

So if you're in one of those countries, you have to work under the radar... how hard is that working online anyway

[TLCarroll]

Just curious about language barriers...

For those of you in other countries, did you find it hard to learn the new languages?

I'm looking forward to living several places outside of the US in my upcoming retirement, but I worry that it'll be hard for me to pick up new languages at my age. LOL

[Globe_Trotter13]

I'm also a digital nomad/location independent person. I just returned from a 4 months mini retirement in Asia where I got to travel around the area. I stayed mainly in Bangkok where I fell in love with the city. It's truly an addictive and intoxicating city in the positive sense. The kind of city that has an energy and vibe life few cities in the world. Cost of living is cheap, food is delicious, weather is good, it's a fabulous location strategically speaking as you're an hour away from some of the most glorious beaches of the world such as Phuket, Krabi etc...2 hours from Singapore, Bali, KL, 3 hours from the Philippines, 7 hours from Tokyo etc...plus the women are sexy, feminine and beautiful, just the way women should be. I'm now visiting family back home but I'll be back to Asia next month and I can't wait!
I've been running my online biz everywhere I go as all I need is my laptop and internet connection and i'm good to go.
So yeah, being a digital nomad or location independent is truly addictive and the more I travel and see new places, the more I want to do some more.

[Alexa Smith]

Originally Posted by Chris Kent

I think you can live 4 months in 3 different countries and pay no tax.

You certainly can, at least under some circumstances, if you're British - regarding income tax, anyway.

Other taxes aren't so easy to avoid.

Originally Posted by Chris Kent

What many people wrongly think is that if they own a company based in one country then they only pay taxes there.

Yes, many people imagine this. At best, it's a gross oversimplification (i.e. it generally isn't true).

[davemiz]

its one of the 'perks' of what we do.... gotta take advantage of it. been living in amsterdam for the last 3 months.

back to the states next week

[TryBPO]

The Philippines has some pretty slick tax laws to encourage foreign investment. Your corp can apply for a PEZA or BOI tax exemption/holiday, depending on where your business is located, avoiding corporate taxes for 4 years.

They also have something called the SVEG (Special Visa For Employment Generation) which basically gives you permanent resident status, the ability to work, etc. My business partner has his, but there was a mistake made on mine and I have to get the 1 year probationary again before mine's permanent (ugh).

It's true about Baguio being nice, from what I hear. WAY up in the north on the Luzon island. I wanted to go, but they're pretty random about getting flights up there (sometimes they have them, sometimes they don't!) and sitting on a bus for 10-12 hours sounds pretty miserable. I'm thinking about taking a quick trip to Camiguin Island which is here in the south, close to CDO. BEAUTIFUL beaches and fairly untouched, from what I hear. Will definitely do the drink-in-hand, toes-in-sand WF posting when I go! :-)

[Scott Lilly]

I'm originally from the US, but moved to Montevideo, Uruguay last year. Yesterday I just moved to Paraguay. I plan on staying here for at least a month, but it could end up being much longer.

There are a few other countries in South America that I'll visit. Once the money starts to come in, I'm thinking of doing a year-long trip through several countries in Asia. But I've learned to keep my plans flexible - they tend to change frequently.

[GetMoreTraffic]

When my online business took off ten years ago, it allowed me to leave cold, rainy, expensive London and move to a house near the beach in Australia. Now I can travel the world and run the whole business from my laptop - or even from my iphone. Awesome!

[JackPowers]

Chris from The Journal Of An Entrepreneur Traveling Around Asia has travelled SE-Asia for the last 7 years at least.

I've lived in Bangkok and can only recommend Thailand. Maybe not Bangkok actually unless you wan't to study Thai or some other course. The city has a lot going for it, never a dull moment, big and diverse expat base, lots of possibilities to pursue your interests, but it's also a very polluted, crowded concrete jungle.

Phuket and Koh Samui on the other hand have awesome beaches (get away from the touristy ones, they're the worst!), you can dive off Koh Tao or many places around Phuket. You have a banging nightlife in both places (for all tastes), great seafood and a generally relaxed lifestyle. You can also rent a nice house for as little as $500 a month or a condo for $200 up. Cons is that there is a limited expat base, mostly retirees. There also isn't much in the cultural and educational department if you're someone who needs that.

All in all, Thailand is an awesom place to be if you have some money.

I would be interested to hear how some of you travel? Do you just stay in hotels and go as you like or do you get something more permanent.

I would preferably like to have business interests in a lot of places.

[jan roos]

I am originally from South Africa and went travelling at age 21 through Europe and have been in the USA for the last 5 years while getting my IM business setup.

I am now making more than enough online to go travel the world comfortably. My wife finish college in December and then we are off.

We are starting in Nicaragua then Thailand, Fiji, Australia and then back to South Africa.

We might actually end up settling somewhere like this.

Rancho Santana: Stunning Pacific Oceanfront

I'm so grateful for finding IM at a relatively young age.

Cheers

Jan

[TryBPO]

Big thanks to the OP for bringing this topic up and all the wonderful, inspiring comments.

To be honest, these types of posts are much more encouraging to me than the "how much money we all make" posts. They tend to remind me of the freedom I have and reading everyone else's stories and travels also reminds me of all the amazing exciting places I have yet to go.

[Drew Jones]

Wow, Traveling Internet Marketer....Where do I sign up???

[Mac Wheeler]

Originally Posted by Drew Jones

Wow, Traveling Internet Marketer....Where do I sign up???

There are those who call me TIM *chuckle*

Google that if you don't get the joke

[theultimate1]

Originally Posted by TryBPO

We're Americans, living in Davao City, Philippines where we have our company, home base, etc. We both travel throughout Asia quite a bit, though...mostly for fun but a little bit of business mixed in! (Thailand, Vietnam, Hong Kong, China, Singapore, etc.) I like the Digital Nomads lifestyle because I just love to travel and make money while I'm doing it...can't beat it!

I'm just curious... which country do you pay your taxes to? Your websites are probably hosted on US servers, so would that mean (assuming that you run web-based businesses, other than of course TryBPO) that you should pay taxes to the US Govt.?

[ExRat]

Hi Mac,

There are those who call me TIM *chuckle*

Google that if you don't get the joke

Enchanting.

[Billy Rey]

Mostly Asia, Vietnam, Singapore, Japan and the likes but stay away from Beijing, you'll probably have a hard time working online there like i did 2 years ago....just dont know how strict they are now. Love the place, hated the Great Firewall

[Mac Wheeler]

Originally Posted by ExRat

Hi Mac,


Enchanting.

+1 for that man!

[ChrisAlta]

This is awesome, I hope to be living the dream like you guys very soon! What would you guys recommend doing as far as buying a house? I feel like if a buy a house but then go live abroad being an internet marketing nomad I'll basically have a house for nothing.

Should I live abroad first and then buy a house? I also want to buy a car haha..decisions decisions!

[TryBPO]

Originally Posted by theultimate1

I'm just curious... which country do you pay your taxes to? Your websites are probably hosted on US servers, so would that mean (assuming that you run web-based businesses, other than of course TryBPO) that you should pay taxes to the US Govt.?

Our taxes are based on how we get paid, not where the servers are located. Since we earn all income through our US corporation, dba TryBPO, that's how we're taxed. We're taxed based on US profits minus expenses (to include the money sent offshore to the Philippines corporation) We then apply the K-1's to our personal taxes as we're an S-Corp and that's it.

It gets a little confusing, but we have some helpful bookkeepers in the US and the Philippines that help us keep everything sorted out.

[TryBPO]

Originally Posted by ChrisAlta

This is awesome, I hope to be living the dream like you guys very soon! What would you guys recommend doing as far as buying a house? I feel like if a buy a house but then go live abroad being an internet marketing nomad I'll basically have a house for nothing.

Should I live abroad first and then buy a house? I also want to buy a car haha..decisions decisions!

Hey Chris!

If you're seriously considering buying a house/car, then this lifestyle is probably not for you, honestly.

You might be able to buy a house and use it as a rental or something, but that would be an expense and a physical responsibility that would be a bit limiting. When it comes to a car, there would be ABSOLUTELY no reason to buy a car if you planned on living and traveling abroad regularly. What would you do with it? Where would you buy/keep it?

[Joanne D]

I've been researching places like Costa Rica, Panama, etc... We are planning to move to Latin America sometime within the next few years (once my husband decides to retire). We'll be renting so that we can move when and where we want. I am so looking forward to that time so this topic is very interesting to me.

[Chris-]

Originally Posted by theultimate1

I'm just curious... which country do you pay your taxes to? Your websites are probably hosted on US servers, so would that mean (assuming that you run web-based businesses, other than of course TryBPO) that you should pay taxes to the US Govt.?

If you only rent space on a shared hosting server (and have no other business interest, or personal citzenship etc.) in the US, that is NOT considered a "business presense" in the US so you have no tax liability there . . . that's what I've heard from 2 major US companies anyway.

If you own your own server there, I guess that would be different.

As for UK citizens, if you spend less than 3 months a year in the UK, and have no earnings (or assets etc.) there, you don't pay any tax there, because you are are "non resident for tax purposes".

Of course, these are my "opinions" only, you need to do your own research to be sure

Chris

[Alexa Smith]

Originally Posted by Chris-

As for UK citizens, if you spend less than 3 months a year in the UK, and have no earnings (or assets etc.) there, you don't pay any tax there, because you are are "non resident for tax purposes".

I believe you can actually make it a lot more than 3 months, if you want to, because the day of entry and day of exit don't count. People who live in the British Channel Islands (or in Eire) and fly into London on Monday morning and out on Friday evening, for example, have only "spent three days in the country". Similarly, a "three-day visit" can count as one day for tax-residency purposes.

Of course, these are my "opinions" only, you need to do your own research to be sure.

[Ruka]

I don't think you can avoid UK tax by hopping around from place to place ...

Usually you can't lose your UK tax residency until you become a tax resident of another country.

(ps disclaimer - see your accountant for a professional opinion)

[RustyF]

Doing a little market research for a possible niche? I have been thinking about it as well but from a little different angle. Time for a new project? I don't have time for my current projects. LOL

I too live in the Philippines, in the Central part of the country.

I'm not here because I IM but it allows me to continue supplement my retirement pay. One of the benefits of IM is that it can follow you any place.

Some people take it a step further. Not only do they make money online but become travel writers. Getting paid to travel then write about their travels and get paid again. Nice gig!

[Ruka]

Originally Posted by Alexa Smith

I believe you can actually make it a lot more than 3 months, if you want to, because the day of entry and day of exit don't count. People who live in the British Channel Islands (or in Eire) and fly into London on Monday morning and out on Friday evening, for example, have only "spent three days in the country". Similarly, a "three-day visit" can count as one day for tax-residency purposes.

Of course, these are my "opinions" only, you need to do your own research to be sure.

Hi Alexa! Sorry to correct, but I think that's a great description of how it used to be before they changed the law on that one ...

Now if you arrive in the UK on 1st day, stay for the 2nd day, leave on the 3rd day - that's counted as 3 days in the UK.

[RustyF]

Someone asked about taxes. You're generally not going to escape tax reporting to your home country, you certainly don't escape US taxes. Your overseas income may not be taxable in your home country. It would depend on many things, including your home country.

If you're a visitor in another country, it is likely you cannot work or operate a business thus your income would need to be based on your homeland.

There are usually visa's that can be obtained. There is a special retirement visa in the Philippines for example that gives you permanent residents status and allows you to operate a business. (SRRV) This one is kind of costly, you need at least 10K in the bank BUT once it is approved you can invest that 10K in a condo that you live in. There is also a $1500 or so application fee and I think renewal fees of around $400 to $500 a year. Still cheaper than getting married. lol I will probably go this route.

There is the SVEG which allows you to operate a business but it is not an immigrant visa. Just might be the easiest way to do it. Generally, you have to hire 10 Filipino in your business. Employment laws seem complex to me. You'll need a lawyer for sure. What I've wondered is if these employees have to be full time or not. I've read the law and I didn't see that as a requirement. There is substantial talent here at low cost in the IM field. I've not yet put any of it to work for me but I'm at the point where I need too. I'm not at the point I can hire full time employees. Salaries for college grades in my part of the country are often around $200 a month or less. TryBPO, do you know about the full time requirement?

And there is the ultimate sacrifice, you can get married. LOL

I'm sure other countries have similar programs to encourage international investment.