27 replies
Hey guys,

Hardcore IM'er from back in the day here.

Finished my degree, moved to a new city, got a great job - let my online work virtually disappear for years & most everything is gone. I'd like to start up & over again from square one.

I have a list with about 23 million emails, and another with about 7 million. About 70% are opt-in, other 30% GI. I would imagine after some validation I'd end up with anywhere from 250k to 1.5 million good emails left.

Because internet time is vastly different from real time; I was hoping for some tips, suggestions, input etc. for what you guys think might be the best route to go with all of this data essentially at square 1.

I look forward to your replies - thank you!

EDIT: I'm aware of the fact that I'd need to refresh the opt-ins; thank you though if this was something you were about to suggest - definitely interested in hearing methods on how to do this efficiently by all means.
#email #list #million
  • Profile picture of the author E. Brian Rose
    Welcome back to the IM game. What niche is your database of emails? With a list that large, I am guessing that it is very broad, rather than targeted. Also, how did you go about opting them in the first time around?
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  • All depends on what the market lists are for...I imagine if they're mortgage-related that by now they'd be crap. If they're "MMO" related then you may be able to scrape some use out of the opt-ins - maybe.

    What's the market?
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  • Profile picture of the author david carr
    Would depend on how you got the list!

    What niche?

    Easiest way is set up a website, create a product and sell them the product.

    Regards
    Dave
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  • Profile picture of the author Victoria Gates
    Welcome back. I suggest along with your re-validation you start adding folks who are willing to mobile lists since those are more effective these days. For now I always suggest you make mobile an (optional) spot on all forms.
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  • Profile picture of the author entrprnr
    Hey guys.

    The data is separated by acquisition. Some are based mostly in correlation to what they purchased. This would be very outdated though.

    Don't have it in front of me right now but the three I can remember were vacation, adult & luxury goods (coach purses etc.).

    The actual list acquisition is a tricky question, this obviously is a huge list which is a compilation of everything in which I did some high-profile (limited) list trades, purchases and some GI spidering with an append-to-opt-in method (could be outdated now!); the rest I can't remember.



    I see a suggestion for creating a product - but that's pretty blanket. I'm curious if you're referring to ebooks, PLR or the like as it's kind of surprising this would be lucrative for re-segmenting & opting in a resurrection list.
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  • Profile picture of the author luckyshah290
    thats cool ... its a big list ..

    Welcome to IM ...

    Start easy with validating your list ... get to know you customers taste ..

    their likes and dislikes ... and then its time to log into your clickbank account ..
    And do some favour to your list by sending them some awesome product ..

    Make some money .. and then more , more ,and more ....

    Best of luck
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  • Profile picture of the author ~kev~
    Make sure your list is current. If you start bouncing emails off of servers, your probably going to get blacklisted and banned.
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  • Profile picture of the author lotsofsnow
    Old email addresses are dynamite.

    If you can find somebody to host the list you can try to revive it. You might wind up with a fraction of the original list. But even if you only get 50k to 100k "new" and alive optins you have at least a starting point.

    I used to have a list of 1.5 million. After not using if for a few years I just dumped it and started from scratch - probably not the wisest decision.

    HP
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  • Profile picture of the author luckyshah290
    Make sure your list is current. If you start bouncing emails off of servers, your probably going to get blacklisted and banned.
    Point to be noted ,

    if you are going to use any third pary autoresponder like Aweber ... you would have to say goodbye to your account before you can say Oops .... with a bouncing list

    I recommend you to use a dedicated linux server ... it can easily handle your email marketing campaigns ... just a advice ...
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  • Profile picture of the author WillR
    Originally Posted by entrprnr View Post

    I would imagine after some validation I'd end up with anywhere from 250k to 1.5 million good emails left.
    Some wishful thinking in my opinion.

    #1. People change and discard email addresses so frequently I would be surprised how many of the validation emails even ended up at a valid email address.

    #2. Why on earth would someone who has not heard from you in years reconfirm to be on your list - I just cannot see that happening.

    I think you would be lucky to get a handful of that list active again. I'd love to be proven wrong but just thinking logically here.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      If your "old school" days involved this forum, you might remember that we don't allow discussion/endorsement of the sending of unsolicited bulk email here.

      You may not be aware (or you may) of the changes in spam prevention technology. Sending to those lists will get whatever host they're sent from blacklisted, quick. And, unless you hide your identity and plan to keep doing so, it will likely put you on the radar of the blacklist operators.

      What you've got there is what's called a 'toxic asset.'


      Paul
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  • Profile picture of the author entrprnr
    WillR - it could very well be wishful thinking regarding the numbers, but hell even 500 would do me good. I'll find out post validation. Regarding the people remembering me, that's easy to correct.

    Paul Myers - I have valid opt in data, only about 30% is undocumented; which makes this topic expressly not about "unsolicited bulk email" but about resurrecting an old, valid opt-in list.

    It's nice to see cynicism alive & well in IMers all these years later. Stuff it fellas, not interested in any negativity or forum pissing. Just looking for positive feedback on how to exploit any edge I may still have to jump back on the saddle.

    Any useful or productive suggestions are appreciated.

    Thanks
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    Often the difference between a successful person and a failure is not one has better abilities or ideas, but the courage that one has to bet on one’s ideas, to take a calculated risk – and to act.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      It's nice to see cynicism alive & well in IMers all these years later. Stuff it fellas, not interested in any negativity or forum pissing. Just looking for positive feedback on how to exploit any edge I may still have to jump back on the saddle.
      It's a lot safer to say that stuff to me, in terms of your continued participation here, if you leave the other members out of it.

      Just something to consider.


      Paul
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    • Profile picture of the author rts2271
      That list is AIDS to any email service.

      Your talking thousands to try to send to a list that big not to mention not many services will allow a monstrosity like that. Washing a list like that would run a DIY guy 3-4 months, yield about 1-3% and take a whole lot of heat.

      Sending it to freshaddress and having them do it will cost a few thousand but you get a legit optin list with credentials after. You'll end up with under 1% from them.

      The reason I say this is because if you have to ask what to do with a list that big you did not aquire them yourself through any standard optin mechanism. It's scraped or a ditchlist.
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      • Profile picture of the author entrprnr
        Originally Posted by rts2271 View Post

        Sending it to freshaddress and having them do it will cost a few thousand but you get a legit optin list with credentials after. You'll end up with under 1% from them.
        Thanks for the tip about freshaddress. 1% of around 30 million is still 30,000 - which is a hell of a list.



        Look guys, I'm aware it's not ideal, but it's data and all data is worth something if you do it right.

        I've already stated it was not solely 100% acquired by myself. I mailed to it back in the day and after validation; will be mailing to it again. Just that this time it will be under a whole new set of circumstances.

        I'm not an idiot, I'm confident I can find a solution to clean these up - it's not about the quality of the list or about the method with which I'll be sending them - these are all my problems, and not what I'm seeking input about.

        What I am seeking input about is what you guys would do with a resurrection list like this; what offer would you send? What product do you think might do well for a generic campaign designed to re-segment and refresh optins?

        Thank you
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  • Profile picture of the author Mr Bill
    I had a big list once. I could only send out 5,000 emails a day and even then I was blacklisted. At 5,000 a day it will take you 1,400 days to send on email. Even if you double or triple those send rates it will still take you a hell of a long time to send. I looked for months for a way to send emails quicker and found none. To this day it's a mystery (to this little black duck) how people can use large lists. I have been offered large lists and I just knock them back as unusable. I'd be interested to know if it's even possible to ever send that many emails without getting blacklisted.
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    • Profile picture of the author rts2271
      Originally Posted by MrBaz View Post

      I had a big list once. I could only send out 5,000 emails a day and even then I was blacklisted. At 5,000 a day it will take you 1,400 days to send on email. Even if you double or triple those send rates it will still take you a hell of a long time to send. I looked for months for a way to send emails quicker and found none. To this day it's a mystery (to this little black duck) how people can use large lists. I have been offered large lists and I just knock them back as unusable. I'd be interested to know if it's even possible to ever send that many emails without getting blacklisted.
      Ya its easy, have a clean list of legit subs. I have clients on self hosted solutions with great delivery and 250k subscribers.

      I have clients with 10k and poor performance and bad delivery. Its all in how clean the list is no ifs ands or buts about it.
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  • Profile picture of the author entrprnr
    Rereading my initial post I should have clarified better.

    How to handle working the data = check
    What to market and ideas on how to re-segment & refresh opt-ins = input desired.

    Thank you
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    Often the difference between a successful person and a failure is not one has better abilities or ideas, but the courage that one has to bet on one’s ideas, to take a calculated risk – and to act.
    -Andre Malraux
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  • 30 million email addresses from years ago? I agree with others that it is a toxic asset. No system will let you run that list, even trying to re-verify them.

    Even with my system (that allows up to 10,000 email loads a day) for building a verified list would take 8 years to run that list.

    There is just no way around it. What you have is a spammer list and it will kill you if you try to push that list even on your own server and IP connections.

    There are just too many other ways to build success. Email marketing 10 years ago worked OK, not today.

    Dump the list, start a new campaign, use your new education and build your empire a fresh.

    Just sayin

    Thomas Prendergast
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  • Profile picture of the author richgrad
    Sending out emails to 30 million email addresses with god knows how many % of that list being outdated and having high bounce rate and (likely) spam complaints just seems like a bad lawsuit about to happen.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      Perhaps I'm being unclear on my point. My apologies.

      You said 70% are opt-in. That leaves about 9 million addresses that aren't. That's UBE, by your own statement. Any recommendation on how to email them that doesn't involve "Nuke the list" is out of bounds for this forum.

      I don't think you realize how seriously the "No UBE" rule is taken here. You may need to find somewhere else for the type of recommendations you're seeking.

      Not to mention that the bounces alone will get it tagged as pure black spam at any site you mail from. And the addresses that are almost certainly spamtraps at this point.


      Paul
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  • Profile picture of the author Targeted Traffic
    Yep..what's your list about how and where did you get them? what is their niche???
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  • Profile picture of the author timpears
    I think your list spoiled while you let it sit. It is pretty much unusable now, in my opinion. I have been wrong before, and I could be wrong now. But if you insist on using it, then you need to put together an offer based on the reason they joined your list in the first place. Doing anything else will make it pretty much a waste of time.

    Use your knowledge to put together a new offer and start building your list again. What you have now has all the makings of something that will bite you in the arse, big time. You can get SPAM complaints from small lists that you recently put together. With a list that size and they have not heard from you in a long time, with that number of people, you are bound to get multiple SPAM complaints, and as you said, 30% are not opt in, you are looking at massive amounts of $11,000 fines.

    Dump them and start again.
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  • Profile picture of the author DIABL0
    If your really set on doing this...

    Dump the addresses that you don't have full opt-in data for.

    I would then strip all the domains out and see which are still valid.

    Then take all the domains / addresses that are still valid and have the GI cleaned of known complainers/traps by a decent service. Then the big domain (non GI) I would try and get set up on their feedback loops.

    Then get a server/IPs from a service that specializes in co-reg mailing. Use this for your initial cleaning and make sure your mailings are can-spam compliant. Your IPs may still get on black lists from the GI portion, but all your opens(less complaints/unsubs)/opt-ins or just the opt-ins if you want to play it real safe can be moved to another server/IPs.

    Oh, you'll need a decent mail platform as well to do the mailings. Something that knows how to handle errors, gray listings, etc...

    All of which is a big task for someone starting from scratch.

    Anyway, that's my 2 cents. Good Luck.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      Re: Diablo's comments...

      Okay. I don't agree with this approach, but you folks should pay attention. This is someone with real clue, giving advice that could actually help. Not much is going to get around the 85% or higher bounce rate due to address attrition for a list that is multiple years old, but this is the best conceptual summary I've seen here in quite a while for this kind of question.

      There are a few problems with the suggestions, but they're consistent with the question. For example, the OP would have to lie to get set up on some of those FBLs. If he's willing to spam 9 million addresses, he's unlikely to be too scrupulous for that.

      It's an open question if he'd be willing to pay for the kind of scrubbing described. That's not cheap, especially for this size list. He would probably be better off creating a solid, self-liquidating opt-in funnel and spending that money on a PPC campaign or other paid ads to build a whole new list.

      Still, overall... Very intelligent answer. Well thought out.

      Someone has been doing their homework.


      Paul
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      • Profile picture of the author DIABL0
        Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

        Re: Diablo's comments...

        Okay. I don't agree with this approach, but you folks should pay attention. This is someone with real clue, giving advice that could actually help. Not much is going to get around the 85% or higher bounce rate due to address attrition for a list that is multiple years old, but this is the best conceptual summary I've seen here in quite a while for this kind of question.

        There are a few problems with the suggestions, but they're consistent with the question. For example, the OP would have to lie to get set up on some of those FBLs. If he's willing to spam 9 million addresses, he's unlikely to be too scrupulous for that.

        It's an open question if he'd be willing to pay for the kind of scrubbing described. That's not cheap, especially for this size list. He would probably be better off creating a solid, self-liquidating opt-in funnel and spending that money on a PPC campaign or other paid ads to build a whole new list.

        Still, overall... Very intelligent answer. Well thought out.

        Someone has been doing their homework.


        Paul
        Yea, no guarantee that it will be a cost effective approach if all you trying to do is reoptin users. It's really more an approach for co-reg than trying to optin users on a single niche.
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  • Profile picture of the author celente
    Welcome back, but sorry to say, if you got a list that big and havent been talking with them and giving them good stuff, you know creating a repore with them, I doubt you would do well at all.

    Its highly likely you start emailing they will think it is spam.

    Now if you had a list that you were emailing every week and giving them great stuff that is different.

    I think someone with a list of 100 people that has been giving them graet info and helping them has about a 10000 % chance of making money over you right now. But I bet you are about to find that out pretty quickly.

    I hope you can prove me wrong, but I seriously doubt that. *winks*
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