75 {{ upvoteCount | shortNum }}
75 {{ upvoteCount | shortNum }}

Is The "Cash Cow" Really So Stupidly Simple?

by Derek Pankaew
63 replies
So, I just sent out my first 30 letters and didn't get any response.

I sent it out to a mix of ...

Antique Shops
Dentists
Acupuncturists
Furniture Stores
Etc ...

I handwrote the front of the envelopes and put a real stamp on it. The inside of the letter was exactly as per David's template on the first page of the "Cash Cow" thread.

It took a surprisingly long amount of time to print 30 pages and address all 30 envelopes.

I suppose my question at this point is whether it's really realistic to expect to send 30 letters and get a response. The first thread said that from just 30 letters a week, you should expect at least 4-6 positive responses. In other words, it sounded like if you send just a few letters you'll get a very excited response from your market.

However, later on Andrew Cavanagh said that in order to expect any kind of response you'll probably have to systematically keep on mailing and mailing en mass. I'm more inclined to believe this is true at this point.

Thoughts? I'm also curious if anyone apart from Andrew or David has taken David's system from reading this thread and had success. If so, what were your stats/response rates like?

- Derek

P.S. I have several other projects that are profitable right now and I'm not sure continuing this technique is a good use of my time. If it were as easy as the "cash cow" thread made it sound I would absolutely keep at it, but I'm having doubts as to whether or not that's the case.
#cash cow #simple #stupidly
  • Profile picture of the author Jeremy Kelsall
    The system laid out really works. I don't do much offline stuff, although I plan on doing so this year, but I've had 2 appointments that i didn't get because I tried to charge too much

    I had a feeling I was over pricing, but said what the hell, it can't hurt to ask.

    Jeremy
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412229].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Jagged
      I can't see you judging that it doesn't work base on only 30 letters. How long ago did you send them? Some business owners will wait weeks to respond. The plan works great for those who apply it on a steady basis. This is proven by the many success stories in the "cash cow" thread. If your letters don't work, get out and talk directly with the owners. Try follow-up letters....try email....I wouldn't toss in the hat base on results of just 30 letters.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412257].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Derek Pankaew
        You know what ... You guys are totally right.

        The message I'm hearing is that I'm not committed enough and that I'm instead just looking for a quick cash solution without putting in the work. Upon closer inspection of my motives, I'm finding you're absolutely right.

        Will I keep it up with this method? I don't know. Like I said, I already spent several hours without any results and my expectations are quite a bit different now than when I read the cash cow thread.

        Instead of mailing letters, I'm more inspired to do cold calling if I take up this technique again.

        Anyway, thank you guys. In just a few minutes you guys have helped me learn a lot more about this business model and about myself.

        Thanks,

        - Derek
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412342].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author 4morereferrals
          Shaun O'reilly [i believe i have the name correct] in the huge azz thread that is the Cash Cow Method - suggsted niches - that way he doesnt have to create new AR messages every time he lands a client, he can do it int'l and .......... drum roll - Ill add that ... you can then create referal networks [or as suggested earlier [JV w/ salespeople - if you will ]

          if you focus on a broad and abundant niche - which in the offline world there are GOBS ... you can

          1. create packages focused on their niche. They like things that seem SPECIAL just for their business / industry group.

          2. You can create significant "referral networks" of other vendors who service your niche'. There's your JV/Salespeople concept. Think of a large abundant niche, that has $ to spend on marketing [yellow page advertisers comes to mind - find the ones in the YP's that have a web address in it already ] chances are the site is dead electron brochure ware ... in need of YOU.

          Think of other service business' that would sell to this niche. Get with them, and create a pact to share referrals - give more referrals than you get and you'll never look for prospects again. Create a USP for that referral partner - think of what's in your offer for them other than another referral. Will your services help close the door on their competition?

          Ive said enuff already

          HTH,

          Steve
          Signature
          Rank Ascend Network - High PR Links / Guaranteed Rankings Increase
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412368].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
    here's a thread of a guy that has seen tremendous results:

    http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...completed.html
    Signature

    "Human thoughts have the tendency to transform themselves into their physical equivalent." Earl Nightingale

    Super Affiliates Hang Out Here

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412238].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Derek Pankaew
      The system laid out really works. I don't do much offline stuff, although I plan on doing so this year, but I've had 2 appointments that i didn't get because I tried to charge too much

      I had a feeling I was over pricing, but said what the hell, it can't hurt to ask.

      Jeremy
      Hey Jeremy,

      Great to hear that. I'm curious, how did you go about getting those 2 appointments?

      Originally Posted by jasondinner View Post

      here's a thread of a guy that has seen tremendous results:

      http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...completed.html
      Hi Jason,

      Thanks for pointing me to that thread. Very inspirational and education read.

      He did use a different approach that. However, I do much more confident now that I've read about the approach he took and know that I can take that approach for myself.

      Best wishes,

      - Derek
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412264].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author telesale1606
        Tried it no results yet has been 4 weeks
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412287].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Ken Strong
          Everyone's results are going to vary widely. Thirty letters really isn't a big enough sample to draw a conclusion one way or the other about the system's effectiveness.

          Instead of spending time and energy creating a thread here and reading and replying to it, print some more letters out and keep trying.
          Signature
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412308].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author TinkBD
            Derek - Ken has a good point, in that 30 letters isn't a big enough sample to draw a conclusion one way or the other about the system's effectiveness.

            The other thing to keep in mind is that while you sent out 30 letters, you have actually contacted each business only once (if I understood the original post correctly)

            If you decide to keep up with this, I would send out more letters AND put a followup system in place... send out a second letter or make a phone call or email each business a certain number of days after sending out the original contact letter.

            Remember, doing business, especially B2B, is about building a relationship based on credibility and trust... one letter won't do that. If you are lucky, it WILL open a door...

            Tink
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412333].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author Corwinnx
              *Sigh,

              David's "Stupidly Simple Cash Cow" is a brilliant

              *starting point*

              nonetheless, it was a 'method' without a 'model.' I presume that more 'methods' which make up the 'model' can be found in the 'upsell'.


              That being said:

              First,
              Direct mail campaigns always must have follow-up systems in place if they are to work properly.

              There are also many many ways to ensure open rates and response rates in a direct mail campaign, which were not mentioned in the thread.

              I didn't buy the 'upsell' so I have no idea if it these things were mentioned in there or not.
              • Have at least 7 'mailings' to a prospect. (Including at least ONE POSTCARD, it's cheap and it doesn't have to be opened)
              • Space these mailings out at 2x a week.
              • 'Handwrite' your envelopes.
              • Use regular stamps
              • Put some kind of 'advertising specialty' or 'promotional item' in the envelope. When they 'feel' something inside, they WILL open it, and the 'item' can serve as a 'reminder' for your sercives.
              And THAT is how you use 'direct mail' to turn cold calls>prospects>clients.

              -Marcus

              [Edit] P.S. Check out Dan Kennedy. [/Edit]
              Signature
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412389].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author Matt Bard
              Originally Posted by TinkBD View Post

              Remember, doing business, especially B2B, is about building a relationship based on credibility and trust... one letter won't do that. If you are lucky, it WILL open a door...Tink
              As someone who has owned two "brick and mortar" businesses maybe I can give you a little insight from the owners perspective.

              I'm a busy guy with a lot of day to day headaches. Bills, personnel, maintenance, (stuff breaks down a lot, right in the middle of the rush), phone ringing, customer complaints, wrong orders, no orders so fire the manager, delivery truck just hit a customer's car...you get the picture. Or maybe you don't and that's why you think you can just call out of the blue and sell me something.

              Me, I'm going to hang up. So you hop on your bike and stroll through the door and you're going to sell me in person. I'm not interested. "buy something yourself or hit the road".

              There is a little dance we do with each other. You're new and want some business with me you gotta "court" me. Introduction letter. I'm standing over the trash like you've read. If your letter is really good I might set it aside to look at it later or not.

              Now when you do a follow-up call you refer to the letter..."Hello Mr. Maiden did you get a chance to read my letter"? Then you try to set an appointment. I give objections you overcome my objections and if you're good you get some of my time. You try to sell me something over the phone and I hang up.

              If and when we meet you have to remember that I know the people that I already do business with. Would I like to lower my advertising cost? Yeah you betcha but me and Bob the ad guy that I pay at the paper sit together at the Rotary Club and I play golf with his boss.

              If you get a good copywriter to write that first letter, then you have a better chance. You know how to overcome objections and can "close" you can probably get my time.

              This is why you have read that it can take a few follow up letters and cards because if you show me that you are serious and persistent then you might get my attention.

              Do you know how many people call daily trying to sell me stuff or how many people walk in off the street with a binder full of junk.

              Matt
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[444293].message }}
              • Profile picture of the author jnapier
                Originally Posted by Matthew Maiden View Post

                As someone who has owned two "brick and mortar" businesses maybe I can give you a little insight from the owners perspective.

                I'm a busy guy with a lot of day to day headaches. Bills, personnel, maintenance, (stuff breaks down a lot, right in the middle of the rush), phone ringing, customer complaints, wrong orders, no orders so fire the manager, delivery truck just hit a customer's car...you get the picture. Or maybe you don't and that's why you think you can just call out of the blue and sell me something.

                Me, I'm going to hang up. So you hop on your bike and stroll through the door and you're going to sell me in person. I'm not interested. "buy something yourself or hit the road".

                There is a little dance we do with each other. You're new and want some business with me you gotta "court" me. Introduction letter. I'm standing over the trash like you've read. If your letter is really good I might set it aside to look at it later or not.

                Now when you do a follow-up call you refer to the letter..."Hello Mr. Maiden did you get a chance to read my letter"? Then you try to set an appointment. I give objections you overcome my objections and if you're good you get some of my time. You try to sell me something over the phone and I hang up.

                If and when we meet you have to remember that I know the people that I already do business with. Would I like to lower my advertising cost? Yeah you betcha but me and Bob the ad guy that I pay at the paper sit together at the Rotary Club and I play golf with his boss.

                If you get a good copywriter to write that first letter, then you have a better chance. You know how to overcome objections and can "close" you can probably get my time.

                This is why you have read that it can take a few follow up letters and cards because if you show me that you are serious and persistent then you might get my attention.

                Do you know how many people call daily trying to sell me stuff or how many people walk in off the street with a binder full of junk.

                Matt
                Matt makes some very good points. I too have owned several offline businesses and can tell you that it IS a challenge....BUT....you also need to know how to balance your stress.

                I had a bad experience with a local business owner who is a local member of BNI. In fact, she's the treasurer of the group. I set an appointment and she didn't show for it. - No biggie - she called me back to reschedule. We agreed to get our schedules together and I called her today. lol, well.....she was rude and wouldn't agree to see me.

                Now - here's where she really will lose. When I'm treated well, I remember and I refer business to other business owners (even if they do not do business with me). It takes no extra effort to be nice and to be honest.

                I've been buying nutritional suppliments from her for several years. In fact, about 3 weeks ago about another suppliment from her ($38). In the past, I've bought cases of water from her at several hundred dollars for the order.

                As of today - I'll be taking my business somewhere else. Being rude is not called for when your working in the local community and you do business with someone. SHE needs me more than I need her - Why?

                Who in their right mind would marry a Nutritional Suppliment store with a Coffee Bar. Those of us who know proper nutrition wouldn't buy coffee.

                AND....to add to it. The previous owner had a hard time making ago of the coffee business by itself.

                So, I called the guy who invited me to the BNI meeting in the first place to let him know about the cold shoulder. He said he's got that reputation.

                Jay NaPier
                Signature

                Do LIVE webinars on FACEBOOK... Yes, you can attract an audience for your webinar on Facebook MeetCheap

                {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[444496].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author 4morereferrals
        Mr. Mayo's story indicates that your target clients value is in the neighborhood of $2k a year each? What if you add the monthly maintenence fees at $100? Hosting and Maint $100 ??? Trying to establish an approx baseline client value or lifetime client value ...

        If you consider a start up FEE of $2k + $100 a month for ongoing services - hosting / AR / maint / etc ... client value year one $3200 approx?

        Would a wise marketer spend $13.50 each x 30 prospects mailed [$400] to increase the odds that their marketing "letter" was opened AND read by 90+% ? Would you need to mail 30 pieces? Would you do it x 10 prospects for $135?

        What if the marketing piece mailed also allowed you to identify you/your firm as a savvy marketer with out of the box ideas and concepts the instant they opened it?

        I do b2b offline sales for business insurance to technology companies, contractors and many others. Liability, Work Comp, grp benefits, commercial auto fleets etc ... very competitive arena. Our mail pieces really have to stand out from the daily DELUGE our prospects get. Our target account generates about $10-15k in commissions so our system and its costs of $13.50 ea prospect warrants the expense - but the results of getting our piece opened by and read by the principal of the firm are damn good, and it's important to us.

        Anyone seriously going after the OFFLINE Biz niche's and using USPS mail to deliver the sales letter / message really needs to get with me on this.

        PM me a mailing address where you can recieve some LUMPY mail and I'll send you a sample of what we use to get our Direct Mail message opened and read with near 100% success. Now, following up and getting appoints isnt 100% - but nearly 100% say they rec'd our piece and read it - much easier opening line when calling to follow up. And we do generate call backs from the pieces as well. Cold Call elimination is the objective.

        Good job on sending the pieces 1st class stamped and handwritten - thats far better than mere metered mail or labels ... but - what a time killer. I know I used to do it by the hundreds my friend - anything to avoid the ROUND FILE :-)

        PS - the tool used is online and can be put on near 100% autopilot. Has OFFLINE follow up campaigns as well.
        Signature
        Rank Ascend Network - High PR Links / Guaranteed Rankings Increase
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412335].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Dana_W
    I appreciate the perspective about this. I wonder how hard it would be to find sales people and offer them a generous commission for each deal that is closed? I've never worked with sales people, but I've thought about it in connection with the whole offline gold thing.

    I agree that there are countless offline businesses out there with terrible websites and that most of us on here could make a huge difference in those websites and get them more visitors and business if we could only convince them of that - the question is HOW?

    And simply mailing letters sounds like it may not be the easiest way to do it.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412330].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author David_Thompson
      Originally Posted by Dana_W View Post

      I appreciate the perspective about this. I wonder how hard it would be to find sales people and offer them a generous commission for each deal that is closed? I've never worked with sales people, but I've thought about it in connection with the whole offline gold thing.

      I agree that there are countless offline businesses out there with terrible websites and that most of us on here could make a huge difference in those websites and get them more visitors and business if we could only convince them of that - the question is HOW?

      And simply mailing letters sounds like it may not be the easiest way to do it.
      Dana, this is a great tip you just added to the thread
      outsourcing brilliant...

      --David
      Signature
      JV partnership wanted, Lets grow your list for free. Nothing to do with giveaways. PM Now
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412340].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Dana_W
        Originally Posted by David_Thompson View Post

        Dana, this is a great tip you just added to the thread
        outsourcing brilliant...

        --David
        Thank you. Here's the thing. We all have our talents. Sales talent is one thing - internet marketing and website optimization are different sets of talents - and not everyone who can do one can do the other.

        I absolutely break into a sweat at the thought of cold calling. I hate it. A good sales person would be worth his/her weight in gold to me - and I think would be PERFECT for the whole offline gold concept.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412360].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author IWelcomesocialmedia
          Hi Dana

          Again you are absolutely right.

          We all have different talents and it is great if we could feed of each other talent. I have been doing cold calling over 11 years now for myself and also on behalf of other businesses, and believe me - a good telemarketer is worh their weight in gold. The thing is with cold calling is that you have to be prepared to contact lots of decision maker before you get to speak with any at all. (It's a lot more to it than meets the eye)

          But following up after a mailing, seminar, event etc. is more like a warm call. It is an easier way of getting to speak with the decission maker quicker and faster. It is a first point of connection but you still need to grab their attention, build rapport, build relationship with them. Get someone who cal do all that for a few hours a day and you have someone who you'll want to hang on to.

          Regards
          Para

          Originally Posted by Dana_W View Post

          Thank you. Here's the thing. We all have our talents. Sales talent is one thing - internet marketing and website optimization are different sets of talents - and not everyone who can do one can do the other.

          I absolutely break into a sweat at the thought of cold calling. I hate it. A good sales person would be worth his/her weight in gold to me - and I think would be PERFECT for the whole offline gold concept.
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[444081].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author David_Thompson
    I agree with you all the way we all have our
    own special talents, just pay someone else
    to do for you brilliant...

    --David
    Signature
    JV partnership wanted, Lets grow your list for free. Nothing to do with giveaways. PM Now
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412364].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Cynthia A.
      Derek,

      A lot of it really depends on whether you are in a large city or small town. Some places the biz owners are too busy to look at anything but the bills (& they have someone else to deal with the mail), & others have time to read all the mail that hits their door because they're not very busy. I sent out a letter to a business a couple of years ago & 8 or 9 months later he responded!

      Originally Posted by Dana_W View Post

      I appreciate the perspective about this. I wonder how hard it would be to find sales people and offer them a generous commission for each deal that is closed? I've never worked with sales people, but I've thought about it in connection with the whole offline gold thing.
      That is exactly the approach that David recommends. Dig around in the thread & you'll see. I think it's close to 70 pages now though! (I personally haven't been able to keep up with it.)

      Cynthia
      Signature
      [WSO]: Learn the The Easiest Way To Get Your Emails OPENED So You Can SELL MORE & MAKE MORE MONEY! Find out here

      Is It Worth The Money?
      Video Reviews of Internet Marketing Products: The Good, the Bad & the Ugly. www.IsItWorthTheMoney.com
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412401].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author madison_avenue
    A 2% response rate on mail shotting is usually considered a good return, so if you send out 100 mail shots we can expect 2 replies. Unless this system is so revolutionary that it breaks all previous benchmarks of direct mail. It is a numbers game, so I presume(I am a member too) we just have to mail out the numbers.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412371].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author 4morereferrals
      Originally Posted by madison_avenue View Post

      A 2% response rate on mail shotting is usually considered a good return, so if you send out 100 mail shots we can expect 2 replies. Unless this system is so revolutionary that it breaks all previous benchmarks of direct mail. It is a numbers game, so I presume(I am a member too) we just have to mail out the numbers.
      If this was directed at my earlier post ...

      80% of the battle is getting the piece OPENED and READ before it gets trashed. Thats a different stat than a response rate.

      Stats also show that the vast majority of sales come AFTER 5 contacts.
      Signature
      Rank Ascend Network - High PR Links / Guaranteed Rankings Increase
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412383].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author madison_avenue
        Originally Posted by 4morereferrals View Post

        If this was directed at my earlier post ...

        80% of the battle is getting the piece OPENED and READ before it gets trashed. Thats a different stat than a response rate.

        Stats also show that the vast majority of sales come AFTER 5 contacts.
        No it was not directed at you but just a response to the OP. Thanks for some
        useful information though.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412420].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Andyhenry
    Hi Derek,


    I think you need to focus.

    I now get companies coming to me offering me MUCH more than you guys are all quoting.

    This is just down to finding a few initial clients and then doing a great job so that they spread the word.

    For the pricing - I think you're all aiming too low and thinking your time isn't worth a lot. The companies I deal with already spent $20k on their website getting it made and will happily spend thousands of dollars for my services to market it.

    If you're aiming low and at small businesses with small budgets, you're gonna need a lot of customers to keep making decent money.

    Andy
    Signature

    nothing to see here.

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412395].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author SteveJohnson
    Making a deal with a professional sales person can be a great way to go, although you do have to keep a tight rein on them so they don't start promising the moon...

    Small/medium-sized businesses (5-20 employees) are a good target. They are big enough to have developed (usually) enough business savvy to know that they need a web presence, and small enough that you can develop a relationship with the owner.
    Signature

    The 2nd Amendment, 1789 - The Original Homeland Security.

    Gun control means never having to say, "I missed you."

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412433].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Debbie Songster
    Yes David recommends and talks at length in the material I received about hiring an outside sales person. More specifically to fill the seats at your seminars.
    He also recommends heavily in outsourcing the work for a lot of the technical parts of the projects.
    After all, your main function is to consult with the businesses. Its hard to do all parts of the project youself if you are juggling several clients.


    I believe you can consider "Online Business Consultant" to be the "model".

    Direct mail
    Seminars
    Personal cold calls
    Telemarketing

    These are all methods

    Steve - I'm really interested in seeing what your mailing package looks like. I'll PM my snail mail info to you.
    I work with a lot of different offline business (you saw one of my client sites). I'm always interested in how to improve the game.
    Signature

    Getting back in the grove after taking a year off following a family tragedy.

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412443].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Don Schenk
    Derek,

    Yes, as others have said you do need to do more than one mailing to those same owners. Marcus mentioned 7 times, and I have heard others like Dan Kennedy say 11 times.

    I speak from having done much mailing over the past 20 years, one mailing isn't enough, nor is 30 prospects. And lumpy mail (like Steve suggested) is more likely to get it opened. Then there is the Gary Halbert $1 attached to the letter technique.

    The Gary Halbert Letter

    and this explanation by Andrew Cavanagh...
    Copywriting: Gary Halbert Dollar Bill Letter

    Alternate this with postcards - they don't even need to be opened to be read. Print them black ink on a bright color stock like yellow.

    I've owned several small businesses and get a stack of mail an inch or two thick every day! This is VERY common. I pitch 98% of it unopened. This happens to all other small business owners too.

    :-Don
    Signature

    Studies prove happier people have massively more success. It has worked for me. Use this one trick too... Click Here

    Total Competition Stomper - Simply the most powerful tactic your IM or Offline business will ever use... See it here!
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412461].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author 4morereferrals
      If it takes 2-3 hrs to :

      1. Handwrite 30 envelopes, provided you dont smear ink, make a mistake ...
      2. Lick the stamps and apply
      3. Buy the stamps from the vending machine
      4. Hand Sign your sales letter
      5. Attach a $1 bill
      6. Fold and stuff the letters
      7. Lick the envelopes
      8. Take the pieces to the post office

      How much did each letter just really cost you to mail? Whats your time and aggravation worth? If you're a avg person @ $25 hr

      $75 Time
      $30 1 dollar bills
      $13 Postage
      $25 Letterhead, Envelopes, Paperclips
      $20 Gas / Time - trip to the USPS
      -------------
      $150+ [I know there's more costs in there but you get the idea]

      And then .. then ... you're still only sending a marginally lumpy A10 standard envelope ... doesnt even really stand out that much. Been there, done that - thousands of times.
      Signature
      Rank Ascend Network - High PR Links / Guaranteed Rankings Increase
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412574].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author sunnyman
        Originally Posted by 4morereferrals View Post

        If it takes 2-3 hrs to :

        1. Handwrite 30 envelopes, provided you dont smear ink, make a mistake ...
        2. Lick the stamps and apply
        3. Buy the stamps from the vending machine
        4. Hand Sign your sales letter
        5. Attach a $1 bill
        6. Fold and stuff the letters
        7. Lick the envelopes
        8. Take the pieces to the post office

        How much did each letter just really cost you to mail? Whats your time and aggravation worth? If you're a avg person @ $25 hr

        $75 Time
        $30 1 dollar bills
        $13 Postage
        $25 Letterhead, Envelopes, Paperclips
        $20 Gas / Time - trip to the USPS
        -------------
        $150+ [I know there's more costs in there but you get the idea]

        And then .. then ... you're still only sending a marginally lumpy A10 standard envelope ... doesnt even really stand out that much. Been there, done that - thousands of times.
        SPOT-ON! -- AND how do you think you're gonna get ANY attention unless you can SHOW the prospective client that you are a seasoned web designer.

        To tell you the truth: web designers are A DIME A DOZEN nowadays! The times are gone when there was some mysterious glamor about that profession.
        If you cannot SHOW them a UNIQUE, HAND-BUILT web site as PROOF of your talent -- forget it.

        I have been in the web design business myself a bit, as freelancer. I can tell you the customers are DEMANDING. "Can you please get that line moved 0.4 cm to the left?" (etc)

        This is nothing I'd like to do for a living - frankly.
        Signature

        » Get Started Making Money Online - How To

        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412780].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author dorothydot
          Seems to me that it depends a great deal on your approach. If you give them something constructive, with an honest intent to help and the honest conviction that you can help them, then you have a good start.

          Praise carries a great deal of weight, sometimes more than criticism. And it can go a long way in credentializing you. Then just proposing the opt-in box is a small thing, initially. That's the "front-end" part of this process.

          Maybe that's all your client would want or need. Fine. Or maybe an opt-in box and a consultation about how to do autoresponders. Let them write their own and maintain their own list. Fine again. Just them knowing you're in the background could be reassuring and lead to future recommendations or consultations.

          Enthusiastic, helpful, being convinced that YOU can help them - that's the approach I'm taking. And I've already had several interested nibbles, just from talking to neighbors. This could be the recession-saving technique these small businesses sadly need.

          Dot
          Signature

          "Sell the Magic of A Dream"
          www.DP-Copywriting-Service.com

          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412863].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
            Originally Posted by Corwinnx View Post

            *Sigh,

            David's "Stupidly Simple Cash Cow" is a brilliant

            *starting point*

            nonetheless, it was a 'method' without a 'model.' I presume that more 'methods' which make up the 'model' can be found in the 'upsell'.


            That being said:

            First,
            Direct mail campaigns always must have follow-up systems in place if they are to work properly.

            There are also many many ways to ensure open rates and response rates in a direct mail campaign, which were not mentioned in the thread.

            I didn't buy the 'upsell' so I have no idea if it these things were mentioned in there or not.
            • Have at least 7 'mailings' to a prospect. (Including at least ONE POSTCARD, it's cheap and it doesn't have to be opened)
            • Space these mailings out at 2x a week.
            • 'Handwrite' your envelopes.
            • Use regular stamps
            • Put some kind of 'advertising specialty' or 'promotional item' in the envelope. When they 'feel' something inside, they WILL open it, and the 'item' can serve as a 'reminder' for your sercives.
            And THAT is how you use 'direct mail' to turn cold calls>prospects>clients.

            -Marcus

            [Edit] P.S. Check out Dan Kennedy. [/Edit]
            Two things...

            First, one of Kennedy's best direct mail strategies was actually 'swiped' from the collections industry. Start missing payments and you don't just get one letter. You get a series of letters, each a little stronger than the last and referencing the previous one. One example he uses in his books is a set of three letters (one 'lumpy') and a postcard, written for an Italian restaurant.

            As Kennedy says, many people sort their mail over the trash can. Bill, bill, bill, junk, junk, read later, bill... If you don't believe me, watch business people check their PO boxes some time.

            Second, the lumps in 'lumpy mail' don't have to be expensive. Kennedy uses three pennies taped to the letter in his example. Gary Halbert got me to send him ten bucks for the secret metal insert that had magical powers to make people open your mailing (it was a single penny to go with Halbert's original story).

            A radio station mails out gift certificates with a little piece of molded plastic. I'm sure the sole function is to make a lump in the envelope so postal workers process by hand and recipients open to see what the lump is.

            You could use key blanks, coins, whatever...
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412925].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author JustDean
    Hey Derek
    You said you were doing other offline products or projects, would you mind PM or sharing what they are and your successes with them
    Signature
    ARK PIF

    A    cts of Random Kindness
    Pay It Forward
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412610].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author DH Harris
    It seems to me that you can stop at 30 why not send out 100?

    Even if you get a 1 - 3 percent return you will have covered the cost of postage and the time it took to write the letter (template).

    Also you know have a few new customers that will share their success with outher business owners.

    Why not take it a step futher and get your local business phone book or get a listing of all the new businesses that have just registered for a business license and contact them. then you could offer not only opt-in services but website consulting as well.

    Just my 2 cents...
    Signature

    DH Harris
    *****************************

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[412721].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author jnapier
    I've followed the Cash Cow thread for some time. I bought the $27 WSO webinar (disappointing) and over all I think the idea is good, but what happened to all the back end stuff we were supposed to get from David?

    The Jobless Dad thread is a much better thread and give more than just theory. I bought one of Richard Hunters Portal Domination portals and the WSO from John Spangler (way better value than the cash cow wso).

    The idea is stupidly simple and I believe that sending 200-300 of those letters will get results, BUT only if you personally follow up with a phone call.

    Next, your gonna have to realize that some businesses are smart and others...well, they just are not. That's why your gonna want to focus on the folks who have money to spend.

    Jay NaPier
    Signature

    Do LIVE webinars on FACEBOOK... Yes, you can attract an audience for your webinar on Facebook MeetCheap

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[413108].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author intratec10
    Okay okay, get this..... I got around to asking family and friends, as

    stated on the Cash Cow thread. I'll say, this really gave me some great

    ideas on some places to actually try first.

    Here are some:

    Mother's, sisters', aunts, wife's, cousins, in-laws', and everyone's friends' : (These should be some of the places they use)

    Hair Salons, Nail Salons, Shoe departments( if locally owned), and
    locally owned grocery stores that they shop at.



    Dad's, uncles', cousins', brother's, in-laws' and all their friends' :
    (Again,these should be some of the places they use )


    Locally owned hardware stores that they shop, some of the
    favorite little bar-b-q spots they all eat, and also try some flea markets.

    Trust me when I tell you, the ice should be broken and all you should do

    to first get the ball rolling is to get the fam and friends to mention

    something to these places about "how their business is doing",

    etc. Then, "I(fam/friends) know a guy(you), that has actually

    been helping their(biz owner) types of businesses thrive, etc."

    "....and something to do with those businesses' websites..."

    [However you/fam/friends choose to relay the message.]

    Emphasize how 'the competition' seems to be doing much better than before.. Get the idea?

    Not a bad idea to offer the help(fam/friends) some sort of referral incentive.

    This should make this so mush easier to get started for all of you....

    Best of luck!!
    Signature

    kill the mortgage. ....i'm the guy they tried to hide.

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[443891].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Mark Brian
    Now if only we can create a high tech product to track snail mail open rate.
    Now that's a good product idea for those with huge cash to invest with.
    Signature

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[443901].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author JohnSpangler
    Hi Derek,

    I appreciate the question, I was just curious if you tried calling on businesses via the phone to set up an appointment to meet with them because went I first started I didn't want to talk to business owners because I was scared to death and once I had gotten over that "initial fear" I found these business owners are really great people.

    Are there a couple of knuckleheads yes-but I think that's good because that keeps the people who really know that they are bringing value to a business working with these business.

    Plus you can ask for a lot more money being in front of them than you can via the post, you can use your locality to your advantage.

    I use the fact I am local with my clients and they love the fact they can pick up the phone and get me not push 1 for this or push 2 for that, they call they get me-plus I am local to the area and can meet with them one on one if they want.

    Just my thoughts

    John
    Signature
    Used Commercial Trucks For Sale<<<
    Used Cargo Vans In PA<<<
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[443956].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author RC7000
    Hi,

    If you're in the UK get a Skype 'unlimited local calls' plan for less than 10 bucks a month and get ringing people.

    You probably already know that they're a lot more receptive if they've received a mailshot beforehand.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[443966].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author jnapier
      John makes a great point. You already have a phone, why spend money send out letters when you don't have to.

      Here's another point: You can buy a TON of WSO on the Offline topic, but I think you've got to consider the person. I don't know john, but if you ask me to trade all the other WSOs I've bought for his - You'll have to fight me.

      The Point - Why spend months in trial and error when you can learn from someone DOING the Deal!

      Is the Cash Cow so Stupidly Simply - YES! You simply have to be following the right direction.

      1) I went in the direction that best fit my skills (portal domination)

      2) I picked too small an area to build a portal (Thanks Richard for being a stand up business person)

      3) Get the knowledge (You've got to invest in yourself - If you take 1 gem away, it was worth the investment)

      4) Local is good. (Remember local business owners like to buy local - you can run a "Buy Local" campain in your community)

      5) Network. There are some great networking groups out there (BNI) but they come with a fee after your 2nd visit - Start your own networking group.

      I hope these few thoughts assist others in building their business - if they do, pay it forward.

      Jay NaPier
      Signature

      Do LIVE webinars on FACEBOOK... Yes, you can attract an audience for your webinar on Facebook MeetCheap

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[443977].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author laird
    Derek,

    I went the email route rather than physical mail based on the Cash Cow Thread and my modified introduction letter. I've done it several weeks now and I've gotten a wide range of responses - immediate "Let's talk", bounced emails, "Take me off your $%#@*! spam list." and "No Thank You's", along with lots of no replies.

    I went the email route for two reasons:

    I'm lazy. I've done my fair share of placing stamps and labels on envelopes and postcards along with trifolding letters and stuffing them. Too damn time-consuming (Try doing that for 2,500 mailers.) Email is simple copy & paste along and simple typing.

    Cost. Direct mail can be expensive depending on what you do. I've gone through Oriental Trading to pick up beanie babies, erasers, magnifying glasses, fake coins, etc to add dimension to my envelopes. That plus the envelopes, postage, labels adds up. My cost for email is time and minimal physical labor.

    My biggest success was to have partnered with my CPA who did an endorsed mailing extolling my web design services to HIS customer base. By having the endorsed testimonial from someone THEY new, my percentage of interested parties is pretty high.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[444112].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Debbie Songster
    Matt
    I'm so glad you wrote all that.
    Personally I hate it when sale people call me. I don't have time. I tell them to pitch me through a letter mailed to me (not emailed).
    99% of the time they don't bother. If they can't be bothered to send me something, I can't be bothered to work with them.
    Same thing at the dealership - no one has time unless you are buying something or can save us money

    Your right its all about connections.

    Also you better know your stuff before you pitch me.
    Signature

    Getting back in the grove after taking a year off following a family tragedy.

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[444427].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Clark
    Originally Posted by laird View Post

    My biggest success was to have partnered with my CPA who did an endorsed mailing extolling my web design services to HIS customer base. By having the endorsed testimonial from someone THEY new, my percentage of interested parties is pretty high.
    We have a winner!

    Attaching your wagon to a credible source's ride in the community is a sure-fire way to get noticed and also, get your foot in the door to secure your first appointment over and above the nameless snail mail spammers.

    "Trusted" Referral systems work wonders.

    I would also target local web designers to set up a JV with them to sell what they consider to be an "add-on" to their bloated web design prices.

    This could be a blessing in disguise for you because the web designer is setting the market value for online services for you so there's no sticker shock with when your offer is presented in whole or as a design package with this warm lead.

    Local Web Designers hang out everyday with the INTERESTED BUYERS in your market

    Further to that, the web designers have a list of past (current) clients you can tap in to easily.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[444464].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author jhiggins
    Originally Posted by Derek Pankaew View Post

    So, I just sent out my first 30 letters and didn't get any response.

    I sent it out to a mix of ...

    Antique Shops
    Dentists
    Acupuncturists
    Furniture Stores
    Etc ...

    I handwrote the front of the envelopes and put a real stamp on it. The inside of the letter was exactly as per David's template on the first page of the "Cash Cow" thread.

    It took a surprisingly long amount of time to print 30 pages and address all 30 envelopes.

    I suppose my question at this point is whether it's really realistic to expect to send 30 letters and get a response. The first thread said that from just 30 letters a week, you should expect at least 4-6 positive responses. In other words, it sounded like if you send just a few letters you'll get a very excited response from your market.

    However, later on Andrew Cavanagh said that in order to expect any kind of response you'll probably have to systematically keep on mailing and mailing en mass. I'm more inclined to believe this is true at this point.

    Thoughts? I'm also curious if anyone apart from Andrew or David has taken David's system from reading this thread and had success. If so, what were your stats/response rates like?

    - Derek

    P.S. I have several other projects that are profitable right now and I'm not sure continuing this technique is a good use of my time. If it were as easy as the "cash cow" thread made it sound I would absolutely keep at it, but I'm having doubts as to whether or not that's the case.
    Like anything else, you need to do it. I know that's what everybody says, but it's true. The more letters and follow up phone calls you make, the more success you will have. What I did find interesting was the very few people on that thread that reported success with the method. I don't think this means the system is flawed, but rather warriors were more interested in reading the thread than implementing it.

    Regards,

    Jonathan
    Signature
    My 2009 IM Success Story! $50,000+!.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[444515].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author crunch
    Lets not forget that this is marketing forum, and those guys got thousands of views to what they were selling...
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[444582].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Matt Bard
    Just to give you some hope, it will work with me too. You just have to get my attention. Like I stated already, you are one of many tapping me on the shoulder and telling me what you can do for me.

    I don't think you guys can even imagine the amount of mail that comes in.
    Do you really think that you are the only one who knows how to research business owners?

    Now with that said, how can you do it? Someone mentioned "lumpy mail" that gets my attention and so do a lot of other direct mail techniques.

    Now you see why Jay Abraham gets paid what he does. Or copywriters.
    The referral method is a winner.

    If you don't know how to write good copy then hire someone. If you never heard of direct mail then hire someone. If you are serious about making this a business then get serious.

    As a business owner yes I want to get more bang for my advertising buck. A website? Bring it on! But I don't have time (working 16 hrs a day) to sort through every letter and listen to every sales call or have the patience for every knucklehead that walks through the door with a binder full of bullsh*t.

    If you take the time to learn how to get my attention and you can do for me what you say you can then we have a deal.

    Matt
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[444586].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author madison_avenue
    Two genius copywriting phrases: "Stupidly Simple" and "Cash Cow". Guaranteed to catch the eye.

    I loved the way we subliminally bought into the idea that it was stupidly simple and hence tried to prove it was going to be cake walk which it isn't

    Cash Cow it may be, but it's implementation will take imagination, a high degree of emotional intelligence and a great deal of persistence.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[445175].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author atxmichael
    Can anyone post the template letter from: Here's A Stupidly Simple Cash Cow and it's FREE -) thanks!
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[482186].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Ernie Lo
    It is quite easy, I got another appoitment tomorrow, got a call today after leaving a card a couple months ago, so it does work.

    You just need to have a effective method of getting your message across, and its not hard to get some nice money doing this.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[482245].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author jbarnes77777
      Ernie, what did your business card look like? Basically I'm wondering what on your business card prompted the business owner to call you.

      Also how/ where did you distribute your cards.

      I am wondering if certain businesses e.g. auto dealers or lawyers are have a higher response rate. Has anyone notices any such trends?

      Thanks guys.


      Originally Posted by Ernie Lonardo View Post

      It is quite easy, I got another appoitment tomorrow, got a call today after leaving a card a couple months ago, so it does work.

      You just need to have a effective method of getting your message across, and its not hard to get some nice money doing this.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[484203].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Ernie Lo
        I dont think my business card was the reason they called me. When I dropped it off, the lady said to me she has been wanting to go online but just never got around to it..so it was just good timing,

        I spoke to her today and shes "nearly" said yes to $1700! Im so happy

        Some big SEO company was trying to rip her off (they asked for $6000 and promised her the moon)

        I set her straight and charged much less after 1hr of talking.

        I havent noticed any trends really as my data is too small to work with at the moment.




        Originally Posted by jbarnes77777 View Post

        Ernie, what did your business card look like? Basically I'm wondering what on your business card prompted the business owner to call you.

        Also how/ where did you distribute your cards.

        I am wondering if certain businesses e.g. auto dealers or lawyers are have a higher response rate. Has anyone notices any such trends?

        Thanks guys.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[486400].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author AndrewCavanagh
    Originally Posted by Derek Pankaew View Post

    I suppose my question at this point is whether it's really realistic to expect to send 30 letters and get a response. The first thread said that from just 30 letters a week, you should expect at least 4-6 positive responses. In other words, it sounded like if you send just a few letters you'll get a very excited response from your market.

    However, later on Andrew Cavanagh said that in order to expect any kind of response you'll probably have to systematically keep on mailing and mailing en mass. I'm more inclined to believe this is true at this point.

    You have to understand how probability works.

    Even if you got a 10% response from this letter (3 for every 30) it's quite likely that at some point you'll send out 100-200 letters and get no response.

    If you're going to test this, yes you need to do it with more serious intent thinking along the lines of mailing several hundred letters or even a couple of thousand letters over time so you can get all the clients you need.

    I have seen a few people get a response from the cash cow letter.

    We use it and we use something else that's getting a much higher percentage of business owners calling at offlinebiz.com.

    But that's really not the issue.

    What is important is that you take the whole business seriously.

    Whatever you do you should do enough of it with a serious enough intent that you get results.

    If you have another method that's getting you paying clients and you're getting a better return on effort then run with it.

    In my experience of teaching thousands of people in this business model the people who start making a full time income the fastest are those who simply physically go and talk to business owners.

    So far that's the fastest way from A to B.

    Other methods will work and are valuable but I figure Warriors would like to know the truth about what works the quickest.

    Kindest regards,
    Andrew Cavanagh
    Signature
    Old School Copy Like This Is BACK & Converting Like Crazy!
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[482446].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author jatchue
      Banned
      Actually, the original post from David Preston did make it sound easy. He said to only send out 30 letters because if you sent out more you would be overwhelmed. I sent out 50 exactly as described with no results.

      So no, it's not as simple as he spelled out. He didn't mention anything other stipulations as everyone else here is.

      Yes, I understand all the points made on this thread but the original question was is it as easy as David claimed? No.

      If you would like more in depth information on marketing to offline businesses I would highly recommend Andrew Cavanaugh's Offline Gold.

      He added much more value to that old thread than anyone else, and he keeps it very simple without a bunch of junk.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[482526].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author TimCastleman
        Originally Posted by jatchue View Post

        Actually, the original post from David Preston did make it sound easy. He said to only send out 30 letters because if you sent out more you would be overwhelmed. I sent out 50 exactly as described with no results.

        So no, it's not as simple as he spelled out. He didn't mention anything other stipulations as everyone else here is.

        Yes, I understand all the points made on this thread but the original question was is it as easy as David claimed? No.

        If you would like more in depth information on marketing to offline businesses I would highly recommend Andrew Cavanaugh's Offline Gold.

        He added much more value to that old thread than anyone else, and he keeps it very simple without a bunch of junk.

        J -

        Do you really think you did everything to make your efforts a success? 50 letters and you stopped because you didn't get a response? How many times would you try to learn to walk and then give up?

        Everyone gives up way too easy. I send out thousands of postcards a month and get a small response. I could give up but then I would miss on the $900 job I landed today.

        My point is this - if you are serious about doing this as a business then you need to be fully committed to it. Don't send out just a couple of letters, commit yourself to sending out 10 letters a day for 90 days.

        Stop quitting so quickly on your dreams.

        Tim
        Signature
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[482635].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author bingbang
    Hello fellow Warriors, where has the LONG thread from David Preston's post gone to? I've been trying to follow all the replies with great interest and suddenly it has gone!
    Anyway, I live in the UK and have started this, sent out 55 letters and one appointment so far which is a restaurant. Appointment this afternoon.
    Has any of the UK warriors had much success with this?
    Thanks,
    Stuart
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[486345].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Richard Tunnah
      Originally Posted by bingbang View Post

      Hello fellow Warriors, where has the LONG thread from David Preston's post gone to? I've been trying to follow all the replies with great interest and suddenly it has gone!
      Anyway, I live in the UK and have started this, sent out 55 letters and one appointment so far which is a restaurant. Appointment this afternoon.
      Has any of the UK warriors had much success with this?
      Thanks,
      Stuart
      Hi Stuart,
      Well done. 1 appointment out of 55 is a fantastic start even if you don't get anything from it!
      I like Andy am now seeing referals and have changed the way I do business. I tested most methods out over the last 7 months or so I've been doing 'offline' marketing. Most if not all methods will require you to send/call 1000 businesses to start to see great results. I've sent flyers, postcards, letters and had someone cold call as well. Consistancy and following up is the key. Think of it like a giant snowball in that once you get a few clients and do a great job then they'll naturally refer business too you. In fact last week I got my biggest deal so far from offline marketing from a referal. The deal could top $40K a year from one client. I have now changed my prices as I've decided I want to deal with less clients but charge them considerably more.

      Rich
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[486470].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Riz
      Good luck in the meeting Stuart.

      My offline success started with an Indian Restaurant and 90% of my clients since have been restaurants. I solely concentrate on email marketing and occasionaly web design if they don't have a site.

      Baal


      Originally Posted by bingbang View Post

      Hello fellow Warriors, where has the LONG thread from David Preston's post gone to? I've been trying to follow all the replies with great interest and suddenly it has gone!
      Anyway, I live in the UK and have started this, sent out 55 letters and one appointment so far which is a restaurant. Appointment this afternoon.
      Has any of the UK warriors had much success with this?
      Thanks,
      Stuart
      Signature
      NEWBIES - Stuck on Technical Issues?

      Ask me For a FREE copy of my upcoming course that will eliminate all your technical gremlins....:
      SEND ME A PRIVATE MESSAGE NOW!
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[486611].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Gail Sober
    Here's an idea.

    Before sending your letter, do a search for their business type and by city. ie: "Orlando Carpet Cleaning Service".

    If they aren't showing on the results page, print that out and enclose it with a post-it note saying something like, "Your competition is taking all of this free business. Call me for a free consultation"

    Then mail it to all the carpet cleaning services that aren't showing on the search results page.

    Seeing their competition in the search results may help to put things in perspective for them.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[486929].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author bingbang
    Well, I had the appointment and was great experience for me being my first client visit. BUT, because it was a family run business the owner had already had his brother build his current website (which is mediocre). Before I sat down with him he showed me around the restaurant and how he has bought the next two shops, knocked them thru to make one big restaurant. Now, this got me asking him all sorts of questions about his business and how he intends to market the newly refurbished place, he then said he has his brother re-design the whole website but wanted my opinion on it. Well from that point onwards I knew I wasn't going to get anywhere with this owner BUT then I thought perhaps he knew of other local businesses I could approach based on his recommendations. Well he passed me another restaurant to go talk to in another town nearby.
    Well till next time.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[492178].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author dorothydot
      "he then said he has his brother re-design the whole website but wanted my opinion on it. Well from that point onwards I knew I wasn't going to get anywhere with this owner"

      Uh, why did you think you wouldn't get anywhere? You're a writer, aren't you?

      Is there a reason you didn't offer to work with the brother? Make a team of it, complete with opt-in box? After all, the owner did ask your opinion - shows he would be open for someone else to work with the brother.

      IMO, I wouldn't have written this off so quickly.
      Dot
      Signature

      "Sell the Magic of A Dream"
      www.DP-Copywriting-Service.com

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[492200].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author bingbang
    Yes, I did think about working with his brother BUT the owner's last words were, "Sorry, I don't want to upset my brother, as he has ALL what you have told me under control".

    Thinking back, I think he was just after some more "techniques/ideas" that he can pass onto his brother.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[492421].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author bingbang
    You learn from your mistakes I guess and work on them for the next meeting elsewhere.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[492422].message }}

Trending Topics