Chicken or the Egg (Sales Letter or Content)

Alex Sol · 01-16-2009, 09:45 AM

Hello, Warriors!

I have been planning to do this for a long time and finally found a desperate crowd who need help and are willing to pay for it, so I am ready to build my very first membership website! Yey!

I am very knowledgeable in the niche, and I wrote an outline of what I will have on that membership site, now I need to start writing, just can;t decide what should I write first:

- Sales Page
or
- The Content

???

I am not sure why but this is bothering me and keeping me away from working on it. So what would you craft first; the letter or the content?

Thank YOU for the input,

Alex

JayXtreme · 01-16-2009, 09:47 AM

Content, Content, Content...

That's the way I do it anyways... always get content in place first.. I understand some people might do the sales page first..

BUT

How can you construct a sales page that truly describes the benefits of the content being sold, if the content isn't even alive yet?

Peace

Jay

Alex Sol · 01-16-2009, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayXtreme

Content, Content, Content...

That's the way I do it anyways... always get content in place first.. I understand some people might do the sales page first..

BUT

How can you construct a sales page that truly describes the benefits of the content being sold, if the content isn't even alive yet?

Peace

Jay

Hey bro!

I see your point

I don't have the content itself but I have 5 pages of main parts of the content and detailed descriptions with all the benefits included

So in a way I do have the content... just need to write it down all nice and make it sexy... but this will take at least 4-5 full days...

So I though maybe on the mean time I can write a sales letter with an OPT-IN box and without the "BUY-ORDER-NOW-ADD-TO-CART" button... perhaps a pre-launch sales letter?

Alex

MaskedMarketer · 01-16-2009, 09:53 AM

Is the niche site going to be a drip feed where the person receives new instructions each month- or just a site with content added every month for its members?

In my personal opinion I would start the content first and it may make it easier to write the sales letter.

Or, some people put a sales letter together, sell the product, and have no finished product for it... so it depends on your personal opinion and strategy. I don't think there is a right or wrong but a matter of opinion.

Just make a decision, do it, stick with it, and finish it.

dotslash · 01-16-2009, 09:54 AM

Well I would say write the content first because I'm sure the best benefits for the sales page will come to you when you're compiling it.

The sales page should reflect the actual benefits of the content rather than the other way around.

Just seems more logical to me creating the product first

Create the best content you possibly can then the sales letter should write itself.

But I've never created a membership site so there may be compelling reasons to do it the other way around - can't think of anything though !

Cheers
Neil

Alex Sol · 01-16-2009, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaskedMarketer

Is the niche site going to be a drip feed where the person receives new instructions each month- or just a site with content added every month for its members?

In my personal opinion I would start the content first and it may make it easier to write the sales letter.

Or, some people put a sales letter together, sell the product, and have no finished product for it... so it depends on your personal opinion and strategy. I don't think there is a right or wrong but a matter of opinion.

Just make a decision, do it, stick with it, and finish it.

Thanks for the reply!

The site will have the main parts for all members; such as action plans, step-by-step instructions and so on. I will be adding new content every now and than, but most of the content will be already there.

The thing is, in this particular niches people will be more than happy with the content already put in place. They will go over and over and over the same content time and time again...

Alex

JayXtreme · 01-16-2009, 10:06 AM

Although Alex...

Doing the sales page first might not be a bad idea...

I'd like to insert a plan if I may..

Step 1: Write your sales page as you normally would for the finished content, including price, monthly costs etc..

Step 2: Leave out the purchase button and have a early bird notification opt-in process in place, so that the people who opt-in will get a notification when you open the doors. Maybe insert FREE report here, teaser of some sort.. bit of spice from your current content..

[you following me here, dude?]

Step 3: On the back end of this opt-in, right after they click submit... you have a survey... ask your niche EXACTLY what they want and what YOU can do for THEM. This will allow you to over-deliver by adding even more content to what you already have and the content will be highly targeted because your niche have told you in your survey what they want, right?

Step 4: Think about an interior up-sell inside the membership (this can be skipped if you are happy with your planned model)

Step 5: Drive some traffic to that bad boy.. ideally you want a BIG section of your market to fill in that survey so you can gather plenty of thoughts, opinions, views and ideas of EXACTLY what they want and how they would like it delivered.. yeah?

Step 6: Take the survey data and use that to expand and improve on the content that you already have... bingo

..

During all this, you are building a list of highly targeted, hungry buyers who are ready for you to open the doors on the content that they have asked for...

Selling Ice cold water to runners in the desert....

Could really move this forward into a whole new area, no?

Peace

Jay

Alex Sol · 01-16-2009, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayXtreme

Although Alex...

Doing the sales page first might not be a bad idea...

I'd like to insert a plan if I may..

Step 1: Write your sales page as you normally would for the finished content, including price, monthly costs etc..

Step 2: Leave out the purchase button and have a early bird notification opt-in process in place, so that the people who opt-in will get a notification when you open the doors. Maybe insert FREE report here, teaser of some sort.. bit of spice from your current content..

[you following me here, dude?]

Step 3: On the back end of this opt-in, right after they click submit... you have a survey... ask your niche EXACTLY what they want and what YOU can do for THEM. This will allow you to over-deliver by adding even more content to what you already have and the content will be highly targeted because your niche have told you in your survey what they want, right?

Step 4: Think about an interior up-sell inside the membership (this can be skipped if you are happy with your planned model)

Step 5: Drive some traffic to that bad boy.. ideally you want a BIG section of your market to fill in that survey so you can gather plenty of thoughts, opinions, views and ideas of EXACTLY what they want and how they would like it delivered.. yeah?

Step 6: Take the survey data and use that to expand and improve on the content that you already have... bingo

..

During all this, you are building a list of highly targeted, hungry buyers who are ready for you to open the doors on the content that they have asked for...

Selling Ice cold water to runners in the desert....

Could really move this forward into a whole new area, no?

Peace

Jay

Jamie, is there a way to click the THANKS button 1000 timed for the same post?! Why didn't I come up with that idea?

That sounds great!

YOU ROCK!

Adam Bshero · 01-16-2009, 10:11 AM

I save my sales page till after I have to product fully completed.

I do not think it will matter which one you do first since you outlined what is in the product.

Personally, the reason I save my sales page to do last is because I find it rather exciting to do. I know when I get to this point that my product is almost ready for launch!

Additionally, you might want to place a video squeeze page in front of your sales page (depending on your niche, I use single opt in here). The thing with sales pages is that you have to be ready to test them like crazy, so writing it first might not be to your best advantage, but writing a brief sales letter won't hurt either.

Raydal · 01-16-2009, 10:13 AM

In the field of Education they tell you that you should always
start planning a lesson with the Desire Learning Outcomes (DLO)
in mind. In other words what do you hope your product to
accomplish.

So even before you plan your lessons you know what you want the
students to get from the lessons. It's called a 'backward design'
because you start with the end in mind.

So in this way the sales letter should be written FIRST because
it would force you to deliver on what you promised in the letter
when you create the content.

-Ray Edwards

SlowhandJohn · 01-16-2009, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayXtreme

How can you construct a sales page that truly describes the benefits of the content being sold, if the content isn't even alive yet?

In your imagination. If you can picture it, you can do it too.

I think litle bit crazy way:

- Salesletter writing prosses point is to go customers shoes; who they are, what they think, WHY and what are NEEDS and WHY and how you can fullfill those needs in your salesletter that you can make SELL, so.....

- If you write first your salesletter, then you know 100% exactly what content your customers needs

and content creation is easier + you make more sell

I'm using this method.

Alex Sol · 01-16-2009, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raydal

In the field of Education they tell you that you should always
start planning a lesson with the Desire Learning Outcomes (DLO)
in mind. In other words what do you hope your product to
accomplish.

So even before you plan your lessons you know what you want the
students to get from the lessons. It's called a 'backward design'
because you start with the end in mind.

So in this way the sales letter should be written FIRST because
it would force you to deliver on what you promised in the letter
when you create the content.

-Ray Edwards

Thanks, Ray!

Well, I already wrote down the answer to a few questions;

- What keeps my potential customer awake at night?

- What are they truly afraid of?

- What are they really angry about? Who do they blame for that anger?

- What do they desire the most?

... and so on... in addition to a detailed outline of the future content

As I mentioned earlier, I know the prospect very well as once I walked in their shoes...

Alex

Alex Sol · 01-16-2009, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SlowhandJohn

In your imagination. If you can picture it, you can do it too.

I think litle bit crazy way:

- Salesletter writing prosses point is to go customers shoes; who they are, what they think, WHY and what are NEEDS and WHY and how you can fullfill those needs in your salesletter that you can make SELL, so.....

- If you write first your salesletter, then you know 100% exactly what content your customers needs

and content creation is easier + you make more sell

I'm using this method.

Exactly! What I explained in the previous reply

Tsnyder · 01-16-2009, 12:59 PM

I write the sales letter/page first... I find it helps me develop a better product.

When I'm writing the sales letter I'm not constrained by a product
that already exists... so I write a letter describing what I believe would
be the perfect product.

I then go about attempting to create the perfection I described
in the letter. If there are things in the letter I just can't produce
(or find someone who can) I then edit the letter to conform to
the facts.

Tsnyder

Alex Sol · 01-16-2009, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tsnyder

I write the sales letter/page first... I find it helps me develop a better product.

When I'm writing the sales letter I'm not constrained by a product
that already exists... so I write a letter describing what I believe would
be the perfect product.

I then go about attempting to create the perfection I described
in the letter. If there are things in the letter I just can't produce
(or find someone who can) I then edit the letter to conform to
the facts.

Tsnyder

Thanks for the input!

And I think I will go with Jay's suggestion

I'll do the sales page for the OPT-INS, then SURVEY THEM
and improve the final content + the copy.

Alex

Nick Brighton · 01-16-2009, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayXtreme

Although Alex...

Doing the sales page first might not be a bad idea...

I'd like to insert a plan if I may..

Step 1: Write your sales page as you normally would for the finished content, including price, monthly costs etc..

Step 2: Leave out the purchase button and have a early bird notification opt-in process in place, so that the people who opt-in will get a notification when you open the doors. Maybe insert FREE report here, teaser of some sort.. bit of spice from your current content..

[you following me here, dude?]

Step 3: On the back end of this opt-in, right after they click submit... you have a survey... ask your niche EXACTLY what they want and what YOU can do for THEM. This will allow you to over-deliver by adding even more content to what you already have and the content will be highly targeted because your niche have told you in your survey what they want, right?

Step 4: Think about an interior up-sell inside the membership (this can be skipped if you are happy with your planned model)

Step 5: Drive some traffic to that bad boy.. ideally you want a BIG section of your market to fill in that survey so you can gather plenty of thoughts, opinions, views and ideas of EXACTLY what they want and how they would like it delivered.. yeah?

Step 6: Take the survey data and use that to expand and improve on the content that you already have... bingo

..

During all this, you are building a list of highly targeted, hungry buyers who are ready for you to open the doors on the content that they have asked for...

Selling Ice cold water to runners in the desert....

Could really move this forward into a whole new area, no?

Peace

Jay

Jay, I always knew you were an "underachiever".

ahem...

Dano77 · 01-16-2009, 07:00 PM

I'm a firm believer in the old... Write a salesletter, see if there's interest then, invest in the product... BUT..

If you're sure the niche is viable... selling something that doesn't exist does put a sour taste in people's mouths. With membership sites you can't say the product will be available in 2 weeks time..

I see 2 options...

#1. Signup now and post and answer questions and enjoy free answers for the next 2 months knowing this will be a paid site soon...

OR

#2. Build out all your content hiring experts and writing yourself and hiring others to write related topics, then launch as soon as you have enough content to make the first 30 day membership fee worth it.

Dan

JayXtreme · 01-16-2009, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick Brighton

Jay, I always knew you were an "underachiever".

ahem...

lololol... I do hope your tongue is firmly in your cheek there Nick

Peace

Jay

Nick Brighton · 01-25-2009, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayXtreme

lololol... I do hope your tongue is firmly in your cheek there Nick

Peace

Jay

Of course! Hope you got the reference tho, cuz that plan is Dale & Kern all the way ;->

Samuel Lee · 01-26-2009, 12:13 AM

Great posts, I would write the content first because I think this would compliment the sales page and will make make the information easier to remember when you're compiling it. Typically I think the sales page should reflect and show the actual benefits of the content rather than the other way around. I think you would put some effort into creating the product first and then create the best quality content and then the when writing the sales copy it should all come naturally to you! I can't say I've tried it the other way round, but maybe there are some benfits I'm not aware of! Hope this helps!

01-16-2009, 09:45 AM	#1
Alex Sol Advanced Warrior War Room Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Montreal, QC, Canada. Posts: 621 Thanks: 163 Thanked 160 Times in 55 Posts Social Networking Contact Info	Chicken or the Egg (Sales Letter or Content) Hello, Warriors! I have been planning to do this for a long time and finally found a desperate crowd who need help and are willing to pay for it, so I am ready to build my very first membership website! Yey! I am very knowledgeable in the niche, and I wrote an outline of what I will have on that membership site, now I need to start writing, just can;t decide what should I write first: - Sales Page or - The Content ??? I am not sure why but this is bothering me and keeping me away from working on it. So what would you craft first; the letter or the content? Thank YOU for the input, Alex
	Be The Warrior. Donate to Kim W! New Blog Post --> How to Rank on Google's 1st Page - Step by Step (5,000 views in 2 days!) <--

01-16-2009, 09:47 AM	#2
JayXtreme Lookin at You.... War Room Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Out Of My Mind - Brandy Too Posts: 4,120 Blog Entries: 3 Thanks: 2,885 Thanked 1,344 Times in 710 Posts Social Networking	Re: Chicken or the Egg (Sales Letter or Content) Content, Content, Content... That's the way I do it anyways... always get content in place first.. I understand some people might do the sales page first.. BUT How can you construct a sales page that truly describes the benefits of the content being sold, if the content isn't even alive yet? Peace Jay
	Bare Murkage.........

01-16-2009, 09:53 AM	#4
MaskedMarketer Senior Warrior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 1,030 Thanks: 286 Thanked 85 Times in 71 Posts Social Networking	Re: Chicken or the Egg (Sales Letter or Content) Is the niche site going to be a drip feed where the person receives new instructions each month- or just a site with content added every month for its members? In my personal opinion I would start the content first and it may make it easier to write the sales letter. Or, some people put a sales letter together, sell the product, and have no finished product for it... so it depends on your personal opinion and strategy. I don't think there is a right or wrong but a matter of opinion. Just make a decision, do it, stick with it, and finish it.
	"One Man's Ceiling is Another Man's Floor" "I Pay Less Attention to What Men Say. I Just Watch What They Do."

01-16-2009, 09:54 AM	#5
dotslash HyperActive Warrior War Room Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Wales Posts: 250 Thanks: 43 Thanked 34 Times in 34 Posts	Re: Chicken or the Egg (Sales Letter or Content) Well I would say write the content first because I'm sure the best benefits for the sales page will come to you when you're compiling it. The sales page should reflect the actual benefits of the content rather than the other way around. Just seems more logical to me creating the product first Create the best content you possibly can then the sales letter should write itself. But I've never created a membership site so there may be compelling reasons to do it the other way around - can't think of anything though ! Cheers Neil
	Printer manufacturers rip us off, save money on your printing costs and refill toner cartridges instead. Besides save money and play online roulette it's a better way to waste money.

01-16-2009, 10:06 AM	#7
JayXtreme Lookin at You.... War Room Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Out Of My Mind - Brandy Too Posts: 4,120 Blog Entries: 3 Thanks: 2,885 Thanked 1,344 Times in 710 Posts Social Networking	Re: Chicken or the Egg (Sales Letter or Content) Although Alex... Doing the sales page first might not be a bad idea... I'd like to insert a plan if I may.. Step 1: Write your sales page as you normally would for the finished content, including price, monthly costs etc.. Step 2: Leave out the purchase button and have a early bird notification opt-in process in place, so that the people who opt-in will get a notification when you open the doors. Maybe insert FREE report here, teaser of some sort.. bit of spice from your current content.. [you following me here, dude?] Step 3: On the back end of this opt-in, right after they click submit... you have a survey... ask your niche EXACTLY what they want and what YOU can do for THEM. This will allow you to over-deliver by adding even more content to what you already have and the content will be highly targeted because your niche have told you in your survey what they want, right? Step 4: Think about an interior up-sell inside the membership (this can be skipped if you are happy with your planned model) Step 5: Drive some traffic to that bad boy.. ideally you want a BIG section of your market to fill in that survey so you can gather plenty of thoughts, opinions, views and ideas of EXACTLY what they want and how they would like it delivered.. yeah? Step 6: Take the survey data and use that to expand and improve on the content that you already have... bingo .. During all this, you are building a list of highly targeted, hungry buyers who are ready for you to open the doors on the content that they have asked for... Selling Ice cold water to runners in the desert.... Could really move this forward into a whole new area, no? Peace Jay
	Bare Murkage.........

01-16-2009, 10:11 AM	#9
Adam Bshero Advanced Warrior War Room Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 538 Thanks: 17 Thanked 210 Times in 51 Posts	Re: Chicken or the Egg (Sales Letter or Content) I save my sales page till after I have to product fully completed. I do not think it will matter which one you do first since you outlined what is in the product. Personally, the reason I save my sales page to do last is because I find it rather exciting to do. I know when I get to this point that my product is almost ready for launch! Additionally, you might want to place a video squeeze page in front of your sales page (depending on your niche, I use single opt in here). The thing with sales pages is that you have to be ready to test them like crazy, so writing it first might not be to your best advantage, but writing a brief sales letter won't hurt either.

01-16-2009, 10:13 AM	#10
Raydal Marketing Strategist War Room Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Punta Gorda, FL, USA. Posts: 3,249 Thanks: 150 Thanked 1,132 Times in 502 Posts Social Networking Contact Info	Re: Chicken or the Egg (Sales Letter or Content) In the field of Education they tell you that you should always start planning a lesson with the Desire Learning Outcomes (DLO) in mind. In other words what do you hope your product to accomplish. So even before you plan your lessons you know what you want the students to get from the lessons. It's called a 'backward design' because you start with the end in mind. So in this way the sales letter should be written FIRST because it would force you to deliver on what you promised in the letter when you create the content. -Ray Edwards
	WSO: 6 Months Of Copywriting Coaching For Just $597 By Warrior's Favorite Copywriting Coach! The Economy Sucks Copywriting Special! \| Copywriting Course FIVERR Gig!

01-16-2009, 12:59 PM	#14
Tsnyder Wordsmith War Room Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: , , USA. Posts: 2,530 Thanks: 260 Thanked 621 Times in 320 Posts Social Networking Contact Info	Re: Chicken or the Egg (Sales Letter or Content) I write the sales letter/page first... I find it helps me develop a better product. When I'm writing the sales letter I'm not constrained by a product that already exists... so I write a letter describing what I believe would be the perfect product. I then go about attempting to create the perfection I described in the letter. If there are things in the letter I just can't produce (or find someone who can) I then edit the letter to conform to the facts. Tsnyder
	There is still nothing for sale here but a person with some imagination and a sense of humor might have a bit of fun at http://www.facebook.com/pages/DucTales/195406083832415

01-16-2009, 07:00 PM	#17
Dano77 HyperActive Warrior War Room Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Aldergrove, BC , Canada. Posts: 352 Thanks: 5 Thanked 21 Times in 19 Posts Social Networking Contact Info	Re: Chicken or the Egg (Sales Letter or Content) I'm a firm believer in the old... Write a salesletter, see if there's interest then, invest in the product... BUT.. If you're sure the niche is viable... selling something that doesn't exist does put a sour taste in people's mouths. With membership sites you can't say the product will be available in 2 weeks time.. I see 2 options... #1. Signup now and post and answer questions and enjoy free answers for the next 2 months knowing this will be a paid site soon... OR #2. Build out all your content hiring experts and writing yourself and hiring others to write related topics, then launch as soon as you have enough content to make the first 30 day membership fee worth it. Dan
	Website doesn't sell? Heart pounding at the thought of writing persuasive, convincing copy? Check this WSO out: http://www.warriorforum.com/warrior-...ersuasion.html

01-26-2009, 12:13 AM	#20
Samuel Lee HyperActive Warrior Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Ottawa, Canada Posts: 285 Thanks: 64 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts	Re: Chicken or the Egg (Sales Letter or Content) Great posts, I would write the content first because I think this would compliment the sales page and will make make the information easier to remember when you're compiling it. Typically I think the sales page should reflect and show the actual benefits of the content rather than the other way around. I think you would put some effort into creating the product first and then create the best quality content and then the when writing the sales copy it should all come naturally to you! I can't say I've tried it the other way round, but maybe there are some benfits I'm not aware of! Hope this helps!