How Can I Make A Consistent Income Online?

Profile picture of the author Don Luis by Don Luis Posted: 10/13/2011
Greetings to my fellow Warrior Forum members here. In my short time hanging around here, I've learned a lot of things about making money online, Internet marketing, and life in general. I'm amazed by the generosity and kindness of most people in this forum, so forgive me if I'm posting another thread asking for help and advice.

My goal is to earn a consistent income from the Internet. I've read true stories of people making hundreds of dollars while they sleep, that's why I quit my previous job and tried to make money from Internet marketing.

Well, it's been 21 months since I quit my job and I'm still not making a consistent income from my online moneymaking activities. I've earned a few affiliate commission checks and Google Adsense payouts, but I usually get them every 3-4 months, so my monthly income is quite low. So my monthly income from IM is less than $100 and I'm not satisfied with this.

So I will write an inventory of my skills, assets, problems, etc. hoping that some of my fellow Warriors can give me some advice on how I can improve my current situation.

My Present Status

I'm single, currently living together with my family (Mom and siblings) on a rented house which my sister pays for. I don't contribute to the rent nor to the electricity, Internet and water bills because I don't have enough money (although I contribute a small amount every time I get a paycheck). I often buy groceries or food for the family.

I have a desktop computer which I acquired over a year ago, and my sister helped me in paying for the monthly installments. Good thing the unit is already paid for so I no longer have to pay for it or ask for help from my sister.

I work in my bedroom with an electric fan. It can get really really hot during the afternoon, so sometimes I work without a shirt on. LOL. It doesn't discourage me though but sometimes I wish I can work more comfortably, and I'm also worried that my computer might easily break down due to the heat of the environment. I'm planning to have an air conditioner unit installed but I have to save money for it.

My Goals

My goal is to earn a consistent income from my online activities without sacrificing my good health. I'm working 6-12 hours per day and I want to reduce that to maybe 3-5 hours per day.

After that, I want to save money to buy a house or build one, so that I can live on my own and be independent.

If I'm successful and become rich, I want to tour around the world.

What I Currently Have

I have 3 websites where I'm earning income from Adsense (all in all they make more or less $1 per day). I have another 4 websites being planned and already with domain names.

I have a hosting account from Hostgator wherein I pay $10 per month.

I have several ebooks and video courses which I bought and downloaded over the course of a year and a half. A few of them were given free by their creators who took pity on me. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to read or watch them all because of all the distractions such as my freelance writing and web design jobs.

My Skills

I am pretty good at writing and I've been getting jobs on Odesk. However, the pay is quite low. I want to write for my own self rather than getting paid a few bucks for my hard work.

I'm also quite good in making websites having made a few sites for clients. I'm fond of computer stuff so I quickly learn how to install scripts, troubleshoot, etc.

My Weaknesses

I am terrible in managing my time. I sometimes write plans for the day but I tend not to follow them and instead work on other things. I bought a planner but had few entries because I don't know how to manage my time properly.

I easily get distracted by lots of stuff such as browsing forums, reading blogs, Facebook, playing games, etc. I have done a better job at controlling them lately, but I still get tempted. Oftentimes my friends call or text me to go to the malls, eat out, watch movies, etc.

What I Think I Need To Do

1. I need to take a few days off from the computer. Go to a faraway place if needed. I need to clear my head and think about my future.

2. I need to get rid of educational materials (ebooks, videos, etc.) that I don't need and keep only those I think will be useful to me.

3. Set a few days to study. Read books and watch videos. Take notes.

4. Compile my personal plan of action which will be my guide and reference.

5. Create a daily schedule that I have to follow strictly and without fail.

6. Make it a habit to wake up early and sleep early. I'm a night owl and I often sleep at 2 in the morning. I need to change this bad habit.

7. Impose self-discipline and self-control. I don't know how, though (need your advice on this).

Final Thoughts

I have on my table several printed ebooks on various IM methods such as Adsense, Amazon, product creation, etc. Is it okay if I read them all, or just concentrate on one method? I don't know if it's okay if I read them all and work on 2 or 3 methods at a time. Or maybe I should read only one method and work on it until I succeed?

I'm leaning more towards creating niche sites with Adsense and Amazon. I love creating websites so I don't think it will be a big problem if I create websites for Adsense and also for Amazon. Let me know what you think.

I would love to hear your suggestions, questions, advices, etc. Thank you in advance!
#consistent #income #make #online

  • Profile picture of the author roboh
    roboh
    Don Luis, Wow you are a busy dude. Sounds like you have a pretty good Idea of what you need to do. You have a plan maybe I can tweek it a little by telling you what I got out of your very well written post.

    First you are good at writing judging from your post. You realize however that it is sometimes hard work. But you do have a gig there that pays.

    You stated upfront that you wanted to make consistent income on the web. I may be oversimplifying but think about this. if you want consistent income then you need to consistently put more effort into the thing that make you money. If writing makes you money write more there are tons of places to write articles for. You already have one. I don't know what odesk pays but there are many places that pay 3-5 dollars for a 400 - 700 word article. If you are working 6-12 hrs a day at this and you spend 4 hours writing articles for $4 each and you write 5 aticles thats $20.00 a day. Just do that three days and there is $60.00 per week. Roughly 240.00 per month.

    Writing is a good thing because it helps with anything you do. Once you get going with writing article and content for your sites (which can sometimes be the same articles) you can start learning about other related things and still write. Copywriting, writing good headlines, benefit chains, and other IM things. You can write about them while you are learning at the same time and make money.

    If you have customers that want you to build websites write scripts and other things, give more time to them if that is making you money. If it makes money it has Earned Your Time, so give it more.

    Your websites should make more money, so get someone, possible on here to look at them and make suggestions. Take their advice, plan to implement it and give a small amount of your time to improving them and see what happens. It takes time for websites to produce but you do have to pay attention to them like plants to get them to grow traffic wise and money wise.

    Basically it sounds like you have fallen into the same trap we all do. Trying to learn everything at once and loosing focus on the things that require your time. Stop trying to learn it all at once. Improve what you got then start learning the things that build on your particular business one thing at a time one day at a time.

    You are a sharp guy and you'll get where you want to be, take smaller steps, first things first. It's important to see progress and money is where we usually look first. Just put your focus on what is needed most and you'll do great.
  • Profile picture of the author sanjon
    sanjon
    I would say, get into weebsite designing using custom made templates which you can buy from activeden and a few other websites.
    Besides Learn SEO.
    Get hold of some flash templates and learn hoe to edit them and integrate flash websites on facebook.
  • Profile picture of the author NestZone
    NestZone
    There is nothing like consistent making of money online. It fluctuates. some times you earn high, at other times little or nothing. so one keeps moving up and down the income ladder.
  • Profile picture of the author Yogini
    Yogini
    Don,

    You write very well so that is a good skill. From everything you listed, it seems to me if you are good at making websites that you might want to participate in the offline marketing forum because often there are posts there from marketers who have offline clients that need websites. You can also browse the warriors looking to hire other warriors section as I've seen posts there looking for people to make websites for their clients.

    You have a lot of determination which is a good quality. If you are going in the adsense direction then studying more on keyword research and low competition phrases with high cpc could be helpful.

    Have you looked into textbroker or iwriter as they pay writers and it isn't a bidding situation.

    Debbie
  • Profile picture of the author vishalduggal
    vishalduggal
    Here's what you are missing.
    1. Start building an E-Mail list. If you want long and consistent income this is the way to go.
    2. Create one or more your own info products(Outside the IM niche). Get some affiliates to promote it and then cash big bucks.
    3. Did you try to monetize your website with CPA, Clickbank or Amazon products? If not then maybe you should, there is much more money to make from CPA if most of your traffic is coming from USA and UK.

    I din't think i need to go into more details, you already know what you have to do and how to do it. Just focus on your goals.
  • Profile picture of the author Benjamin Ehinger
    Benjamin Ehinger
    I think you are on the right track with writing for yourself, but for the short term you should take advantage of the skills you have. If you are a good writer spend the $47 and join the war room. Then, spend the $20 and get an ad up in the Warrior for Hire section. You can earn a much better rate there than you will get on Odesk.

    Also, if you cannot afford the $67 to get started look in the Warriors looking to hire section for writing jobs and build a webpage with information about your writing for your signature on here. It will probably only take 1 to 3 small writing jobs to get the $67 you need, then you can get an ad up.

    Once your ad is up you will be able to make a little money every week writing for others. This is income you can use to build your business. I recommend splitting your time evenly between writing for others and for your own projects.

    This can also help to keep your mind fresh as you will be writing for a varied of subjects for others.

    Benjamin Ehinger
  • Profile picture of the author Tommy Smith
    Tommy Smith
    I would say start with web designing. For most online jobs web designing is one of the best job. Then go with your writing, a combination of web designing and writing is great.
  • Profile picture of the author Dapper Fellow
    Dapper Fellow
    I admire your determination to make money with your online activities. I think the self-discipline is the most difficult to acquire over the long term. In my opinion, it is vitally important not to try to do too many things online at one time in order to achieve self-discipline because the income can't be forced with blogging.

    It is very tough to do the same three or four things every day without seeing great leaps in revenue.

    However, it is doing the same three or four things every day that will eventually produce the income you want from your Internet Marketing.

    I also agree with Benjamin Ehinger that offering your writing services is a great way to generate income. If nothing else, you can reduce the time between work and reward with freelance writing for WF clients because you will have more control over the time line.

    In other words, you can collect money from freelance writing almost immediately in many cases, but you might have to wait a year or more to collect money from a blog post or backlink article you write for yourself.

    I suppose it is really about realistic expectations concerning the distance between the work and the reward.

    Good luck!
  • Profile picture of the author sscot
    sscot
    Don, You have enough experience for this. AT THE BEGINNING, Develop a method it's possible to earn $5.00 per day. Easily, you will be able to achieve this target via getting more traffic into your Adsense sites.

    Now, start thinking as "Except MY METHOD (Adsense) ALL other money making methods are stupid useless craps" (Mindset technique)

    Believe this, "At the beginning I made $5.00 per day with this method. Means, I can increase earnings day by day with honest dedication and effort.

    NEVER stop learning, follow related information, test them and develop new strategies and techniques. Involvethem with"YOUR GREAT METHOD" and continue....

    (Do not use this technique with a money making method which you haven't earn money yet. Because, you need initial confidence as "it works")
  • Profile picture of the author Don Luis
    Don Luis
    Thank you to everyone who posted their helpful comments and suggestions here. I have read all your replies and have put a great deal of thought into them. I'm really serious in my quest for success in Internet marketing.

    @roboh

    Thanks for your compliments and advice. Before I entered the IM world, I was a freelance writer. However, I'm starting to get tired of writing articles almost every day. I'm more interested in building a business because I think being a freelance writer is still like being an employee, not a boss. Of course, I set my own working hours but I have clients to attend to. I don't want to be a freelance writer for the rest of my life, but I'm not quitting my writing jobs because they bring me money on the side, which can be used to invest in my online business.

    I agree with you that writing for others is a great way to learn new things. I'm interested in copywriting, but I think it takes a great deal of skill. So I have decided to take on writing jobs while still trying to build my online business. My biggest problem, however, is managing my time. My plan is to write articles in the morning and then work on my online business in the afternoon and evening.

    You're right in saying that I'm trying to learn too many things at once. I'm somewhat of an impatient person that's why I want to learn everything as fast as I can. I know it's not good because I won't be able to fully internalize what I've learned.

    @Yogini

    Thanks for your suggestions, Debbie. I have heard of offline marketing but I don't know if it's applicable in my setting. I live in the Philippines and in a small city in a small island. My place has few big businesses but I have worked for a few clients here who have travel and tour businesses; the tourism industry is booming here. I'll definitely take a look at offline marketing and see what's in store for me.

    I have signed up for iWriter but I haven't written articles for them because the rates are too low.

    @vishaldugal

    Unfortunately, I haven't built an email list because I don't know much about email marketing yet. But I have signed for GetResponse recently and I'm planning to put up a mailing list on some of my sites.

    I actually have a gambling system ebook which I'm planning to sell online. I just need to come up with a salesletter, a website and a payment processing system. I've signed up for eJunkie but if I have the funds, I will try Clickbank.

    I haven't monetized my website with CPA, Clickbank and Amazon offers. My websites are currently monetized with Adsense and some affiliate programs from Commission Junction. I'm planning, though, to make Amazon and Clickbank niche sites.

    Thank you for your suggestions.

    @Benjamin Ehinger

    Thanks for your suggestions, Benjamin. I'm actually thinking about putting up my Warrior For Hire thread offering my writing services but I need to put my personal life in order first. As I've said before, I'm having a torrid time with time management. I need to set down a schedule before I start offering my services here; that way, I won't be overwhelmed by my responsibilities.

    I have viewed your WFH thread and I see that your business is doing great. Would you care sharing with me your tips on how you managed your time between your writing jobs and IM activities?

    @Dapper Fellow

    You're right, discipline is one of the most difficult things to instill in one's self. It seems that everyday there's a thing or two that manages to sidetrack me from my work. It's all the more difficult if there's no one to watch over you and tell you not to do this or that.

    Thanks a lot for your helpful comment.

    @sscot

    Sound advice coming from you. Thank you!

    I have made money from Adsense, so do I have to concentrate on this method of earning money online? Actually, I just slapped Adsense ads on my travel websites, without studying about Adsense methods. They have low CPC rates so I earn more or less $1 per day from them. I'm actually excited to receive another Adsense payout at the end of this month.

    So I guess I need to concentrate on Adsense first. And then after I have mastered the art of making money from Adsense, I will move on to other methods, right?
  • Profile picture of the author BXPS
    BXPS
    Why dont your try been an amazon affliate?
  • Profile picture of the author Zack Lim
    Zack Lim
    Hi Don,

    There are many systems on making money online and you will want to make sure that you are FOCUSING on one system at a time. Each of the systems will requires you to do different works and you will need to make sure that you are marketing your business consistently over a period of time before you will see any results.

    Many warriors here have emphasized on the importance of making the whole business model simple. Stick with one system, do all the required work and focusing the majority of the time on marketing activities is the key to growing the business in the right direction.

    All the best to your venture

    Zack
  • Profile picture of the author Don Luis
    Don Luis
    Originally Posted by BXPS View Post
    Why dont your try been an amazon affliate?
    I'm planning to promote Amazon affiliate offers soon. Are you earning good money from your Amazon niche sites?
  • Profile picture of the author adficere
    adficere
    Hi Don,

    It looks to me that you're already well on the road towards success. You're a talented writer, you have realistic expectations, and you're not afraid to judge personal strengths AND weaknesses (a quality many marketers lack!).

    Distraction has always been an issue for me also -- my mind often works quicker than my fingers, and I'm often devising new business plans and concepts before all prior ones have been fully executed. Over the years I've learned to tame the inner beast and focus on priorities, but it never goes away. Once you get to the point where you can outsource much of the work it'll be a breeze, but until then it's a tricky balance between observing the marketplace for concepts and trends that you can apply to your own business and focusing on your core business rather than chasing unrelated distractions. There's no easy answer or magical solution to preventing distraction either; it's just a matter of putting nose to grindstone, forcibly shutting distractions out, and doing what needs to be done.

    Since you have the advantage of family and are not currently in a "do or die" situation, a solid conservative plan would be to combine continued article writing for instant dollars (clearly you have the talent and experience) with your passion for content site creation. Writing for others isn't a good long-term plan (at least for me), so I agree with your desire to ultimately take control and work for yourself rather than others. But in the shorter term, as other Warriors have wisely pointed out, since you're good at it why not continue to use that talent to bring in some regular and/or investment income?

    You can also consider ways to write for others beyond the "article grind" that so many dread. See if you can specialize in writing ebooks, press releases, reports, and such. Article writing is fine to pad the down times, but specialty writing allows for significantly higher prices for much less work. Or consider putting together PLR packages of content that you've written; you may not get rich from them, but you can bring short bursts of income via lower-priced WSOs, then build your business over time from repeat sales to existing customers as well as selling PLR packages directly from your own site.

    As far as content site creation goes, passive income rocks. I personally have always focused more on direct mail and offline endeavors, but I wouldn't give away my passive Internet streams for the world. Since you're already making $1 a day average, you know the basic formula: create new content, slap up Adsense ads, and over time as traffic increases so too will the clicks. Sure, there are ways to maximize growth and profit via keyword selection, niche selection, SEO, etc., but ultimately it's almost impossible not to grow over time simply by cranking out new content... even while ignoring keywords and SEO considerations entirely.

    Often when creating authority sites I'll initially start with Adsense ads as the site is still being built up and expanded upon. Once traffic starts flowing, I'll start inserting affiliate ads, whether it be in-article Amazon links or generic banner ads applicable to my market. Depending on the market, it may also be a good idea to start building a mailing list too. Most marketers use them to expose prior visitors to new products or affiliate products, which is obviously great, but I've found that they can be useful in just "recycling" past visitors back to your website regularly (resulting in more Adsense clicks, possible affiliate sales, etc.).

    Finally, if the market you're targeting warrants it (and hopefully it does), it's time to bang out your own products, whether they be ebooks, physical books, CDs, wholesale/private label products, etc.

    Multiple sites are great, and I have a slew of them, but I tend to favor the authority site approach over the micro-site approach. It's sometimes slower to build up, but over time an authority site crushes all in its path with countless more visitors and multiple revenue streams. So when you find a niche or a site that seems to be doing better than the others, strike that site hard. Don't stop adding content to old ones or creating new sites, but some sites will just naturally take off more than others, and upon finding such a site it's best to continually expand it.

    One final note: I actually disagree with #6 in your original post... to a point. When you have to work traditional hours, early to bed and early to rise is for the best, but when you're self-employed and can dictate your own hours, sometimes it's best to listen to your inner rhythm. I've always been a night owl myself, particularly during my youth, and I noticed that I was clearly more productive, inspired and focused during the evening hours than the morning hours. So rather than fight my preferences, I embraced them; I worked late and got up late. Once I went beyond direct mailing I slowly adopted a more traditional work schedule, but the great thing about being self-employed is that you don't necessarily have to be a slave to the 9-5 grind.

    Jeffrey
  • Profile picture of the author ephame
    ephame
    I think you will do just fine judging by your maturity in your response to help. I agree with most of the above spread your risk a little and try some other affiliate offers Amazon, Clickbank etc..

    Definitely do build a list if you are a good writer which I believe you are you will surely attract people to your articles which will hopefully subscribe to your updates/mail-outs and in turn *cross fingers* purchase your books or whatever you settle on selling.

    Best of luck, now just take action!

    Keep us posted
  • Profile picture of the author Sandycmy
    Sandycmy
    Online is a stocks and shares market.

    You need to invest time here :

    a) Half of your productive time on a service : like writing or general transcription .. etc

    Output: Regular definitive income + you will be enhancing the skills needed to be good in online opportunities. Yeah, your time management will fall in place.

    b) Remaining of your productive time: Your bigger ambitions.

    output: It won't be stable, however, after tweaking and testing it can leveraged - Bigger income.

    No matter what the combination works. In my opinion, there isn't any other way.

    Starting with only option b) - Makes many of us - Lazy, overwhelmed, feeling of uselessness .. etc. These traits turned into a habit results in pain and we call it entrepreneurship. The other side is equally bright !
  • Profile picture of the author TimothyTorrents
    TimothyTorrents
    I work without a shirt on as well.

    Have you started working on your own product yet?
  • Profile picture of the author maximus242
    maximus242
    Originally Posted by Don Luis View Post
    Greetings to my fellow Warrior Forum members here. In my short time hanging around here, I've learned a lot of things about making money online, Internet marketing, and life in general. I'm amazed by the generosity and kindness of most people in this forum, so forgive me if I'm posting another thread asking for help and advice.

    My goal is to earn a consistent income from the Internet. I've read true stories of people making hundreds of dollars while they sleep, that's why I quit my previous job and tried to make money from Internet marketing.

    Well, it's been 21 months since I quit my job and I'm still not making a consistent income from my online moneymaking activities. I've earned a few affiliate commission checks and Google Adsense payouts, but I usually get them every 3-4 months, so my monthly income is quite low. So my monthly income from IM is less than $100 and I'm not satisfied with this.

    So I will write an inventory of my skills, assets, problems, etc. hoping that some of my fellow Warriors can give me some advice on how I can improve my current situation.

    My Present Status

    I'm single, currently living together with my family (Mom and siblings) on a rented house which my sister pays for. I don't contribute to the rent nor to the electricity, Internet and water bills because I don't have enough money (although I contribute a small amount every time I get a paycheck). I often buy groceries or food for the family.

    I have a desktop computer which I acquired over a year ago, and my sister helped me in paying for the monthly installments. Good thing the unit is already paid for so I no longer have to pay for it or ask for help from my sister.

    I work in my bedroom with an electric fan. It can get really really hot during the afternoon, so sometimes I work without a shirt on. LOL. It doesn't discourage me though but sometimes I wish I can work more comfortably, and I'm also worried that my computer might easily break down due to the heat of the environment. I'm planning to have an air conditioner unit installed but I have to save money for it.

    My Goals

    My goal is to earn a consistent income from my online activities without sacrificing my good health. I'm working 6-12 hours per day and I want to reduce that to maybe 3-5 hours per day.

    After that, I want to save money to buy a house or build one, so that I can live on my own and be independent.

    If I'm successful and become rich, I want to tour around the world.

    What I Currently Have

    I have 3 websites where I'm earning income from Adsense (all in all they make more or less $1 per day). I have another 4 websites being planned and already with domain names.

    I have a hosting account from Hostgator wherein I pay $10 per month.

    I have several ebooks and video courses which I bought and downloaded over the course of a year and a half. A few of them were given free by their creators who took pity on me. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to read or watch them all because of all the distractions such as my freelance writing and web design jobs.

    My Skills

    I am pretty good at writing and I've been getting jobs on Odesk. However, the pay is quite low. I want to write for my own self rather than getting paid a few bucks for my hard work.

    I'm also quite good in making websites having made a few sites for clients. I'm fond of computer stuff so I quickly learn how to install scripts, troubleshoot, etc.

    My Weaknesses

    I am terrible in managing my time. I sometimes write plans for the day but I tend not to follow them and instead work on other things. I bought a planner but had few entries because I don't know how to manage my time properly.

    I easily get distracted by lots of stuff such as browsing forums, reading blogs, Facebook, playing games, etc. I have done a better job at controlling them lately, but I still get tempted. Oftentimes my friends call or text me to go to the malls, eat out, watch movies, etc.

    What I Think I Need To Do

    1. I need to take a few days off from the computer. Go to a faraway place if needed. I need to clear my head and think about my future.

    2. I need to get rid of educational materials (ebooks, videos, etc.) that I don't need and keep only those I think will be useful to me.

    3. Set a few days to study. Read books and watch videos. Take notes.

    4. Compile my personal plan of action which will be my guide and reference.

    5. Create a daily schedule that I have to follow strictly and without fail.

    6. Make it a habit to wake up early and sleep early. I'm a night owl and I often sleep at 2 in the morning. I need to change this bad habit.

    7. Impose self-discipline and self-control. I don't know how, though (need your advice on this).

    Final Thoughts

    I have on my table several printed ebooks on various IM methods such as Adsense, Amazon, product creation, etc. Is it okay if I read them all, or just concentrate on one method? I don't know if it's okay if I read them all and work on 2 or 3 methods at a time. Or maybe I should read only one method and work on it until I succeed?

    I'm leaning more towards creating niche sites with Adsense and Amazon. I love creating websites so I don't think it will be a big problem if I create websites for Adsense and also for Amazon. Let me know what you think.

    I would love to hear your suggestions, questions, advices, etc. Thank you in advance!
    1. Go get a job (or a second one)

    2. Invest money into your business

    3. Build a real company instead of fooling around
  • Profile picture of the author alvinchua91
    alvinchua91
    You sound really serious about this, that's great

    Okay don't go on fiverr.. You want a passive, recurring income. If you become a freelancer on fiverr or odesk, you are creating an active income.

    If you want consistent, passive income, I recommend you come up with your own products and promote them through affiliates. Either that or have a blog promoting affiliate offers!
  • Profile picture of the author jbsmith
    jbsmith
    You are closer than you may think.

    What you really want to do is get maximum leverage out of your writing - freelancing is definitely NOT the way to do that (as you mention in your own post).

    What topics have you "specialized in" or are interested in writing about through your freelancing and article writing experience? That may be a good place to start looking at matching up with a profitable niche.

    In terms of how to leverage your writing I would suggest the following

    1. You start a blog in that niche and write daily to attract traffic and begin building your own platform of readers
    2. You put together a report, short ebook targeting a strong desire within your target market and setup a lead funnel from your blog so you can start building a list (that list will become one of your most valuable assets to both higher and more stable income)
    3. You package content for sale to that market - ebooks, reports, membership site content, etc... Once you have a couple of your own products selling and can market some related affiliate products you will have a full-time, consistent income of your own.

    Jeff

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