Newbie question for the masters. WHY do all squeeze pages look so dodgy ?!

28 replies
Hi guys,

I am newb, massively scavanging this magnificent forum for more info so I can hopefully crack the code to starting seing some money's come in... so far no luck at all, but steadily at it ! :p

So coming as a recent buyer of a system, it took me ALOT of throat clearing, money despising and disregard for my own gut-feeling and judgment, to click on the paypal button and commit.

I have hardly ever seen true to the bone, straight up, cards on the table landing page.

Make it look unprofessional and not mega-sales oriented ? Sure, I get that!

What I DONT get get is all the huge bold red titles with yellow highlights, and recycles arrows that point to clickbank screeenshots ot ludicrous numbers on the screen.

Now, if everyone is using them, its clearly because they seem to work, but my question here is if someone has taken the time to actually think that there are probably thousands and thousands of people who are simply put off by the scammy look of these landing pages, and that maybe a more sober look might bring in more conversions? Look more legit without going all corporate looking?

Now obviously, I would also answer my self saying "Sure man, why don't YOU do such test and report back" ?

Well, 'cos I haven't made anything yet, just started early this month and still wrapping my head around all this wealth of knowledge

But I'd sure like to understand this one
#dodgy #masters #newbie #pages #question #squeeze
  • Profile picture of the author BrainCopy
    Your a victim of information overload. It happens to the best of us.
    I've read at least over 400 pages of information regarding TRAFFIC
    ALONE! this week

    I usually do it to keep up to date and see what my competitors are
    doing to either get their rankings or traffic period.

    Anyhow, the only way to be successful in this business or in any business
    for that matter... Is test test test and you shall receive.
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  • Profile picture of the author barbling
    Because it works for them?
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  • Profile picture of the author DianaHeuser
    If some of the best marketers on this forum are using them, then it must be working. When you launch a WSO, run a test using both options and then let us know which one worked.
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  • Profile picture of the author VilPietersen@
    Most successful marketers will have different "landing pages" and do what they call a split test to see which page converts better.

    On the internet it is statistically proven that you have under 7 secs to catch the attention of the reader and if you don't they simply hit the back button.

    A page with a bold headline is similar to a magazine or newspaper article and people pay money to read those.
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    • Profile picture of the author gurruwiwi
      Yup, information overload is getting to me... but I am enjoying the process!!

      despite the lack of success, my morale is high!

      This forum is great!

      The thing that gets to me is that I truly do, and will, maintain a strict ethical approach to IM. But I really dislike those landing pages. I feel that most people landing there are caught from psychological despair and get credit-card trigger happy.

      Ok, less moaning and more research now...
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      • Profile picture of the author Mark Andrews
        Banned
        Originally Posted by gurruwiwi View Post

        Yup, information overload is getting to me... but I am enjoying the process!!

        despite the lack of success, my morale is high!

        This forum is great!

        The thing that gets to me is that I truly do, and will, maintain a strict ethical approach to IM. But I really dislike those landing pages. I feel that most people landing there are caught from psychological despair and get credit-card trigger happy.

        Ok, less moaning and more research now...
        You're allowing your personal preferences and prior judgement to get in the way of making good business decisions. It really is that simple. Might not be what you want to hear but unfortunately it's true.

        Your personal tastes have nothing whatsoever to do with the equation. You are not your target market. Don't you think all of the professional marketers and copywriters on this forum have tested all of these elements and their conversion rates down to the last detail?

        Why do these marketers use these elements in their squeezepages? Hmmm...

        ...perhaps because they've been proven via testing to work over and over again?

        Sometimes you need to learn as a newbie not to rely on your own judgement but to lean on the experience of other marketers who have just perhaps been in this game for a lot longer than you have.

        Best,


        Mark Andrews...
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  • Profile picture of the author gurruwiwi
    Wise words Mark, thank you very much!
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  • Profile picture of the author Luke Rafferty
    i was the same when I started, the thing about it was i found myself reading thru these squeeze pages and buying the wso / service. these pages work, they work very very well when crafted correctly and the wso is clearly going to help you.
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    • Profile picture of the author Christine Brady
      Hi,

      Adding my 2 cents - I like what Mark said about personal preferences -

      That is something that I have just recently learned - do not let your taste or your likes play a part in your squeeze page design. Trust me - quite frankly, I think many of the elements are an overkill, gasp!

      But they work, and furthermore, they've been tested!

      Hope that helps!
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  • Profile picture of the author TopKat22
    Like everyone has said, because they work and these top marketers test and tweak and keep up to date and when a page stops working so well, they tweak it some more. That is why I use the templates that a top marketer uses still to this day and my conversion rate is currently 75%.

    To succeed in any business, you have to get over one of the biggest problems business owners have on and offline. It is that they want to use what they like.

    In my offline businesses, in the beginning, I, like most new business owners, did everything that I liked, didn't make any money and since I had all my money tied up into this very expensive brick and mortar business, I HAD to make money. I quickly got rid of some fancy full color glossy brochures I was using and went to 2 color on regular paper (because that was all I could afford after spending all my other money) and guess what happened.

    The plain 2 color on regular paper brochure hugely out performed the full color high gloss one. I continued to use that plain one for 7 years at every location as we expanded from coast to coast until I finally sold the whole thing.

    So major point to learn sooner rather than later in making money:

    Do what works to get you paying clients, not just what you like.
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    • Profile picture of the author Azarna
      This baffled me too. I printed a pile of them out and showed them to friends and family. Everyone said 'no, wouldn't touch that with a barge pole, clearly a scam' etc

      And yet I am told over and over that they do work.

      I have since read a few times that this style of marketing is far more successful in the American market than here in England, so perhaps that is partly why I, and my friends, are surprised they work. We English are a cynical bunch of buggers at the best of times :-)

      I am currently designing my first IM website, and admit I still find it very hard indeed to lean towards this style. I instinctively want to use what has been considered best practice in website design, on this side of the pond, for ages. By this I mean a wide, uncluttered website, with prices clearly upfront and no P.S. (or P.P.S. or P.P.P.S.), no crossed out prices, no red text or big arrows pointing at things, no phrases like 'no brainer' and nothing popping up to obstruct the visitor's view. In other words, a normal website like 'the big companies' have, not a 'letter' style.

      But I am trusting that the facts speak for themselves. Over and over I am told that this style is what will sell. So that is what I am trying to learn to do. And, despite being an opinionated, old-fashioned English woman, I am doing my best to ignore my own aversions and get on with it :-)
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    • Profile picture of the author barbling
      Originally Posted by TopKat22 View Post


      So major point to learn sooner rather than later in making money:

      Do what works to get you paying clients, not just what you like.
      Gold gold gold.

      The above is true gold; took me years to internalize too!
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  • Profile picture of the author kaper7
    When you design squeeze pages, you split test a few and tweak then test again and again. Whatever converts the highest is the one you keep.

    Since you are not the one opting in or buying, you should not worry about how it looks as long as you're not misleading people and the page converts.

    Some of the ugliest ecovers and websites are raking in huge cash every single day.
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  • Profile picture of the author Daniel Deegan
    Personally I don't think its so cut and dry. There are multiple variables that should be taken into consideration...On the whole there are indeed certain principles of layout and design that are proven to be most effective across most markets...HOWEVER...

    The devil is in the details...

    Fox maximum conversion you really need to design and write for your target audiences market profile while factoring in the traffic sources bringing the prospect to your actual landing page.

    In the end it all comes down to testing but we do have to make some initial judgments and assumptions when we first launch a campaign.

    Another thing I want to point out is that when you study and model what people are doing within your market, make sure you are analyzing people who actually know what they are doing. For example, in the biz-op/IM niche most people follow the next guy because they assume stuff works since everyone is doing it.

    Just because the majority are doing things 1 way doesn't mean you have to follow suite. In many cases if the majority are doing things 1 way you might get better results going the other direction.

    Don't get me wrong, you want to use fundamental marketing and conversion principles whenever possible, but if your target audience has been over exposed to certain ideas or methods, it's worth testing the effects of going in the opposite direction (at least with some elements).

    It's also worth noting that there is a new breed of conversion focused web design emerging that blends traditional direct response ideas with web 2.0 design elements to create web copy and sales pages that are perceived as less "sleazy". You can find some good info on this exact topic in Ben Hunt's book's called "Convert" on amazon.
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    • Profile picture of the author Courtney Lee
      Believe it or not, but this format still converts at high rates if done properly. If you are looking at it from an internet marketers perspective, it does seem odd; however, many of these products and squeeze pages are not aimed at people like us which means they are less privy to the actual methodology of landing page morphology.
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  • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
    Originally Posted by gurruwiwi View Post

    I have hardly ever seen true to the bone, straight up, cards on the table landing page.
    That's because you are buying from the wrong people.

    Paul Myers uses them.

    Paul Myers Internet

    Dennis Becker uses them.

    The 5 Bucks A Day System - e1kad.com

    I use them.

    SEO Forever: Yes, FOREVER

    I can't speak for Paul or Dennis, but my conversion rate on that page is no lower than my conversion on flashy hypey sales pages.

    People who sell on substance, rather than flash and hype, don't need those kinds of sales pages.

    What surprises me is how many of them still use those, and I think the real reason is that on some level they're in love with the flash and the hype.

    I understand that part, of course; I like the carnival, too. But I don't need to put one in my back yard.
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  • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
    Banned
    Originally Posted by barbling View Post

    Because it works for them?
    Sometimes, for sure. Call me a skepchick but I strongly suspect that isn't always the reason, actually.

    Originally Posted by gurruwiwi View Post

    WHY do all squeeze pages look so dodgy ?!
    On different sorts of sites, it's for a very complicated mixture of three main reasons, I think (and they're partly conflicting ones) ...

    (i) For all the reasons given above, which boil down to "dodgy-looking can perform better than other types" (though not nearly as often as people claim, in my opinion);

    (ii) Because - like so many other things in internet marketing - many people don't split-test - or don't split-test adequately - but only pretend to, while secretly just using what they assume "must" work ("otherwise everyone wouldn't be using them, would they?" :p);

    (iii) Because many people who do split-test actually draw the wrong conclusions from their results anyway. For example, it's easy to assume, if you're testing a squeeze page, that the one that produces the highest opt-in rate is necessarily "the best one". It's ludicrous nonsense, and it's often totally wrong (as I've proven repeatedly, myself), but it genuinely is what most people mistakenly assume: in other words, they define their parameters inappropriately. Such is life. :rolleyes:
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  • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
    Q: Why do all squeeze pages look so dodgy?

    A: They don't. You have taught yourself to equate certain visual cues with the word "dodgy". Someone without the same association won't draw the same conclusion.

    Printing off a few of these pages and asking others if they think it looks dodgy to them isn't a fair test; it telegraphs the 'correct answer' and leads people to tell you what you want to hear or what they think they should say.

    Personally, I don't care for such pages myself, but I know that in the correct situation they work well.

    Several years ago, when I was promoting a business opportunity, I ran a split test. One page was the kind many people here claim to prefer. The other was identical, except it had the red headline, points of emphasis highlighted with a neon green highlighter, bold text, underlines, etc. All of those 'dodgy' style points. I thought it was the butt-ugliest page I'd ever come up with. But that sucker outpulled the clean one by over 3:1.

    If your plain, no-nonsense page isn't getting the job done, try adding a little razzle-dazzle, even if it repels you. You might be surprised how pretty some of those pages get when you blink at the results...
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  • Profile picture of the author Luke Rafferty
    i love coming back to this thread and reading thru it. make me smile especially as some the responses have a bit of comedy attached to them :-)
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  • Profile picture of the author MikeTucker
    There once was a little company who spent millions trying to figure out what the most successful colors were when it comes to attracting attention.

    Those colors turned out to be red and yellow.

    And, along with their other business strengths, McDonalds has a 96% success rate (meaning that less than 4% of their stores ever have to close) and they own some of the most valuable real estate on the planet.



    ...That being said, I agree 100% with Alexa. Many people simply don't test and track enough, and interpret what they do track with their own rose-colored glasses on.

    With the exception of perhaps the "make money online" niches and the "how to make money with squeezepages" niche in particular, I have found that the opt-ins from squeezepages are not the highest quality.

    In general, you get a much better lead when someone reads some of the other things you have written, on your blog for example, and then they want to opt-in to your list.

    (Thus the name, "opt-in"?)

    This way, they will actually look forward to getting your emails, and you know, open and read them.
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  • Profile picture of the author steven sanderson
    Great post Daniel Deegan,

    I was just about to write a comment but to be honest you said it all, there is no cut and dry rule in this industry, an old lady who knits cardigans for people does not think or act the same way as someone who does up Harley motorbikes

    the same as someone who has not slept for weeks because they have a bad back thinks the same as someone who wants to breed poodles for a living when they retire

    So food for thought, just like the squeeze page the autoresponders also take a different slant, we sell into some niches from the very first outset, others we dont offer a thing for weeks

    the gurus like to teach a nice square cut method because it is simple to do this, but the industry is not square cut, and neither are the prospects who are online

    All the best
    Steven
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  • Profile picture of the author Derek Soto
    Originally Posted by gurruwiwi View Post

    Hi guys,

    I am newb, massively scavanging this magnificent forum for more info so I can hopefully crack the code to starting seing some money's come in... so far no luck at all, but steadily at it ! :p

    So coming as a recent buyer of a system, it took me ALOT of throat clearing, money despising and disregard for my own gut-feeling and judgment, to click on the paypal button and commit.

    I have hardly ever seen true to the bone, straight up, cards on the table landing page.

    Make it look unprofessional and not mega-sales oriented ? Sure, I get that!

    What I DONT get get is all the huge bold red titles with yellow highlights, and recycles arrows that point to clickbank screeenshots ot ludicrous numbers on the screen.

    Now, if everyone is using them, its clearly because they seem to work, but my question here is if someone has taken the time to actually think that there are probably thousands and thousands of people who are simply put off by the scammy look of these landing pages, and that maybe a more sober look might bring in more conversions? Look more legit without going all corporate looking?

    Now obviously, I would also answer my self saying "Sure man, why don't YOU do such test and report back" ?

    Well, 'cos I haven't made anything yet, just started early this month and still wrapping my head around all this wealth of knowledge

    But I'd sure like to understand this one
    The ONLY guy that I know is doing well and does things COMPLETELY different than everyone else, as far as keeping things very simple and non hypey at all is "Sean Mize"

    he's the number one publisher on ezinearticles.com with over 20,000 articles last time I saw and his approach I've always liked because it's very simple, and very effective. If you are tired of this hype, his style will be a breath of fresh air for you for sure!
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  • Profile picture of the author Robin Blinds
    I dont like seafood. I think it looks and tastes disgusting. But yet billions are still sold.

    I hope that helps you.

    Learn what elements make up a good sales letter or squeeze page, and you'll find your own answer
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    • Profile picture of the author mysterrio
      A wise person once said- it is not the thing - it is the marketing of the thing. When it comes to that squeeze page you will see that there are some pages that grab information much better than others.

      This is just one reason that they all look kind of the same. There are also colors that produce better and copy that produces better results.

      Now, information overload might be your problem and if it is - it is not your fault. Everyone suffers from this at one time or another. Read your information and put it away for a day. On the next day- re-read it and take some action. Work online for 60 minutes and take a 15 to 20 min break. Give your brain a rest.

      I trust some of this will help you and others. Enjoy!
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  • Profile picture of the author celente
    ok, you may laugh at this, but the ugly pages convert. yes!

    Do not be shocked. We even have some CPA ads, and the ones that stick our are the ugly ones that we hand drawn in paint. DO not ask me why, but when we test them, they just seem to work and outrank the neat ones.

    So I do not care how ugly or neat anything is, if it pulls prospects and converts well, then I will use it over neatness. Realistically it probably comes down to your copy a bit too. However if you have something that is crappy or what you call messy, and it converts more than your other better looking pages why would you NOT use the messy one.
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    • Profile picture of the author aaronchen1
      in my experience, the best squeeze pages are the ones that are super simple AND create curiosity. that's all you need really to get someone to want to find out whats on the other side.

      but, the whole bold, red circle, yellow highlight thing works too because it grabs attention. and while it may not seem enticing to you, it does to other people. and it must convert, otherwise people woulnd't be using them.

      plus its easier to get people through the page if you have those types of elements if you're not so good at copy writing.

      but if you are really good at copy writing, you'll see that these marketers don't really use that style of squeeze or sales page. again it depends. both work.
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