I Am Sensing FRUSTRATION...

by sal64
37 replies
In the words of Grand Master Flash: Don't push me coz I'm close to the edge... I'm trying not to lose my head etc etc.

I am sensing a degree of frustration creeping into our family. Mostly from some of the more established posters - myself included.

Every day there's at least one or two useless rants started on here.

If people check the forum tag, it clearly states: This Is Where We Talk About Making Money... or words to that effect.

I guess this isn't my forum, but why all these negative threads?

Seriously, who cares if you hate pop ups, oto's gurus or the next door neighbour's dog pooping on your lawn?

What do these rants achieve apart from stimulating the OP's ego and creating a negative energy.

What's is interesting to observe is that any half decent thread goes by the way of (as Bill Platt said) the Do Do bird.

Yet the rants go on and on.

Sadly, I have seen a few decent and intelligent people leave the forum over the past few years.

Maybe we need a RANT ONLY special forum? I suspect it would be 2nd in popularity to the WSO section... but only just.

Come on people... take a long hard look at the thread to help Kenny Strong with his challenge. So much good will, so many insights about what it takes to succeed. Truly inspiring. This is what you should focus on, not useless distractions that do nothing for your business.

Shrugs shoulders.

How about we stick to making money? How about noobs look carefully at the more successful people's posts? I can guarantee you one thing... you'll learn more around here that you ever would in a $10k program is you're prepared to look, understand and learn.

Perhaps if you have nothing of value to give, then just STFU and don't start threads for the sake of it. All they do is brand you as childish and small minded.

Sure you'll get a reaction, if that's what you want. There will be polarized opinions that either agree or disagree. But the sum total of any real value? ZERO... big fat dohnuts!

Sal
#frustration #sensing
  • Profile picture of the author sal64
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      Sal,

      It probably doesn't help that we have a number of senior members who regularly post meta-rants...

      I've seriously considered deleting all rants and meta-discussions of any kind for a week. The premise being that anything we can do anything about that's worth griping over should be reported to the mods or the help desk.


      Paul
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      • Profile picture of the author Paul Barrs
        Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

        Sal,

        It probably doesn't help that we have a number of senior members who regularly post meta-rants...

        I've seriously considered deleting all rants and meta-discussions of any kind for a week. The premise being that anything we can do anything about that's worth griping over should be reported to the mods or the help desk.


        Paul
        Paul, maybe we could have a separate area just for Rants - now that could be fun reading, LOL.

        P.
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  • Profile picture of the author rosetrees
    What. And spoil my fun. Killjoy
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  • Profile picture of the author Mike Hlatky
    Does anyone else enjoy the irony of this thread?
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    • Profile picture of the author Michael Mayo
      Originally Posted by Mike Hlatky View Post

      Does anyone else enjoy the irony of this thread?
      No, I didn't enjoy the irony of this thread and this is not the first ironic
      thread Sal has created.

      In reply to Sal's thread title of "I Am Sensing FRUSTRATION..." all I can say
      is if you see something negative and you don't like it then leave it and find
      something else to do.

      Yes, Negative threads here on the WF tend to p me off too although I've
      learned that the only thing I can do is to report them and move on.

      Allowing negative things to inject you with negativity is no ones fault but
      the person that allows it to happen to them. You are the person in charge
      of your life so you need to draw a line.

      If you allow it to bother you then you loose. If you can do something to
      make a difference then many win. You have to know if the battle can be
      won before you start the battle other wise the results may differ from
      what you expect and cause you even more pain and grief.

      I lost my day job 21 days ago. Today I spent the morning looking for
      employment. The afternoon I spent with my Wife. Later in the day
      after the Grand Children came home from school, I spent time with them.

      Today was a Good Day! We are all fine and everyone is alive.

      It's what you make it. If you make it bad it will be really bad.
      If you make it good then no one can take that away from you as long as
      you believe in yourself.

      Have a Great Day!
      Michael
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      • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
        Sal,
        Actually, in case there are cross wires... the whole set up a rant forum was more sarcasm than an actual request.
        Ah. I didn't get that. It wasn't sarcasm for everyone.

        I considered recommending such a sub-forum once. Thought about calling it "The Kindergarten Korner." Tagline: "Where we throw fits when things don't go our way." Even that would have seemed like saying the rants had an appropriate place here. So, I dropped the thought.
        Hope this makes sense.
        More than most of these threads...


        Paul
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        • Profile picture of the author sal64
          Irony? In what sense? Is it the anti rant rant?

          There's method in the madness Mike. It seems that any half decent message on here gets drowned out.

          And yes I do ignore pretty much all the crap on here. I might annoy some, but I ain't no hypocrite.

          FWIW the the thread was started based on what I have sensed, not just from me, but from the senior members whose answers are quite blunt at times.

          Hence the frustration part. There seems to be a few more upper cuts being delivered by them.

          Life is good.

          Originally Posted by Michael Mayo View Post

          No, I didn't enjoy the irony of this thread and this is not the first ironic
          thread Sal has created.

          In reply to Sal's thread title of "I Am Sensing FRUSTRATION..." all I can say
          is if you see something negative and you don't like it then leave it and find
          something else to do.

          Yes, Negative threads here on the WF tend to p me off too although I've
          learned that the only thing I can do is to report them and move on.

          Allowing negative things to inject you with negativity is no ones fault but
          the person that allows it to happen to them. You are the person in charge
          of your life so you need to draw a line.

          If you allow it to bother you then you loose. If you can do something to
          make a difference then many win. You have to know if the battle can be
          won before you start the battle other wise the results may differ from
          what you expect and cause you even more pain and grief.

          I lost my day job 21 days ago. Today I spent the morning looking for
          employment. The afternoon I spent with my Wife. Later in the day
          after the Grand Children came home from school, I spent time with them.

          Today was a Good Day! We are all fine and everyone is alive.

          It's what you make it. If you make it bad it will be really bad.
          If you make it good then no one can take that away from you as long as
          you believe in yourself.

          Have a Great Day!
          Michael
          lol it's an Australian thing.

          As far as your suggestion for an alternative...

          Life's too short mate. people should just get on with it rather than waste that most finite of resources.

          I guess it just gets a bit too much Groundhog Day around here at times.

          Best,

          Sal

          Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

          Sal,Ah. I didn't get that. It wasn't sarcasm for everyone.

          I considered recommending such a sub-forum once. Thought about calling it "The Kindergarten Korner." Tagline: "Where we throw fits when things don't go our way." Even that would have seemed like saying the rants had an appropriate place here. So, I dropped the thought.More than most of these threads...


          Paul
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  • Profile picture of the author Winlin
    Good point and well taken. I will admit, that left unchecked, I can comment towards the dark side now and again.

    Fortunately, for those posts that taunt my cynical side, I only respond to a tiny fraction. :rolleyes:
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  • Profile picture of the author cypherslock
    Diana: Grok means to understand or truly "get it."
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  • Profile picture of the author tpw
    Unfortunately Sal, if they take away the rants, the posts that could be confused for articles, the product reviews and the guru-bashing, the only thing that will be left are newbie questions.

    If we eliminate also all of the questions that have been answered in the forum a hundred times already, then with all that will be left, this place will be a ghost town.
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    • Profile picture of the author Winlin
      Originally Posted by tpw View Post

      If we eliminate also all of the questions that have been answered in the forum a hundred times already, then with all that will be left, this place will be a ghost town.
      Shhh! Your'e going to give away the secret to perpetual marketing.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      Bill,
      Unfortunately Sal, if they take away the rants, the posts that could be confused for articles, the product reviews and the guru-bashing, the only thing that will be left are newbie questions.

      If we eliminate also all of the questions that have been answered in the forum a hundred times already, then with all that will be left, this place will be a ghost town.
      My arms aren't long enough. Please Gibb-smack yourself.


      Paul
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  • Profile picture of the author Daniel Wilson
    It is easier to point fingers than getting into work
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  • Profile picture of the author Aira Bongco
    Let us come up with a rant and question sub-forum then. Haha!

    I guess it comes with the need for self expression and having a crowd that feels the same way.
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  • Profile picture of the author aniebee
    I don't mean to belabor this thread, but one thing to remember is that even though IM is huge online, I don't know one single person in my life outside of online that even vaguely knows what IM is, or is even remotely interested. "Ranting" about frustration is a normal part of life & when you're new - Lord knows I'm still learning a ton! - there's a lot of frustration, and who wants to vent to someone who doesn't get it (maybe a spouse or friend?) or could care less?

    Online is where I find people who understand my pain or can offer actual helpful suggestions.

    That being said, a "rant" or "vent" section would probably be a good idea
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  • Profile picture of the author Raydal
    As much as we would like to sterilize the main forum from such
    weaknesses of humanity, if you remove such stories then the
    WF would go dead.

    Facts don't sell. Stories do.

    The WF is what it is because people have a chance to share
    their LIFE experiences which includes the negative ones.

    PROOF: What is the most popular post in the main forum
    right now.

    CLUE: It's NOT a thread about how to make more money.

    I understand the need to be positive and all that good stuff
    but the forum would read like a fairy tale and not a human
    community if we pushed that rule.

    If you follow the X-Factor show the people who get dumped
    are not those with the least talent. It's those with the least
    interesting story. Stories sell.

    So the main forum would read like an instruction manual if you
    edited all the frustrations, disappointments and struggles of
    making a buck online.

    Please keep the main forum "dirty". If I don't know what
    people's rants are then how can I sell the solution to them?

    Long live rants!

    -Ray Edwards
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    I have to agree with Ray on this one. Maybe other people's rants seem annoying - or a downer to some people, but aren't we the ones who show people that IM isn't to be approached with rose colored glasses on? This is not a tea party. It's reality - and reality bites sometimes. The solution to that is not censorship. I would be absolutely horrified to come into a forum and see that every post that wasn't made for cutting and pasting to a nice picture of fluffy clouds, flowers, rainbows, and baby animals. Who can learn or grow from conversations in which people are not allowed to disagree or give an honest opinion just because it doesn't begin and end with la la la la happy happy happy?

    I prefer keepin' it real - even if we don't like what some people think of as real. If you see their reality and don't like it - either click away or tell them something that will help them change it -- and forget about idea censorship. That's just nuts.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      forget about the idea of censorship
      Excellent thought. The mods can all walk away, and we'll disable the "Report Post" function. Then you can have what you claim you want, for exactly as long as you can stomach it.

      I predict no more than a week, at the outside.


      Paul
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  • Profile picture of the author art72
    Originally Posted by sal64 View Post


    Maybe we need a RANT ONLY special forum? I suspect it would be 2nd in popularity to the WSO section... but only just.

    Sal
    I absolutely agree, and would cast my vote for such a thread to be added.

    There too, it almost beckons having a reputation meter on a users publicly displayed profile. Perhaps, then it would be easy to see who "contributes" and who "pollutes". I suppose the "Thanks" establishes that to a degree.

    They say a picture's worth a thosand words, so with that I'll STFU






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  • Profile picture of the author sal64
    Sorry folks.

    It was a genuine post born from a degree of sadness. But that's just my opinion. Nothing more.

    I am pretty upbeat in most cases.

    Paul I once recall you saying that if you want to post a negative, at least provide a solution. And is really where I was aiming at... perhaps not as eloquently as you... but in the same direction.

    We are taught to mix with like minded people. But the whole like minded aspect has become blurred. Like minded positive or negative?

    Perhaps I am being naive about it. Perhaps this phenomena has been going on since day 1.

    This isn't intended to be a rant. It's more a call to arms. I know what Ken is facing and I see what Ken is going through. These are the stories that should inspire us... not the usual daily dose of nonsense.

    Look, I know it won't change anything because people don't want to change. But the day you give up is the day we go one step backwards.

    Best to all,

    Sal
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  • Profile picture of the author Ryan David
    I don't think it's too far out of whack. There are still lots of "Make Money" posts.

    I personally get more annoyed with the posts like "The ONE reason you're not making money!", which is followed by some self-righteous post. To me, those posts are as ridiculous as the newbie that asks how to make $10K in the next week.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      Sal,

      Other than "Don't do that" and "Put the stuff that shouldn't be here at all in a special section," I'm not seeing the suggested alternative.

      Here's how it looks from this side of things:

      In general: If you allow the rants, people gripe about the negativity. If you don't allow them, people gripe about censorship.

      In the WSO section: If you remove abusive comments, the posters claim you're supporting "scammers." If you don't remove legit negative reviews, the sellers scream about how you're scamming them.

      In the review section: Delete personal attacks and you're supposedly promoting thieves. Don't remove legitimate review comments that aren't positive, and you're allegedly aiding libelous assaults on the seller's business.

      In OT: If you allow political discussions, some of the locals get vicious and insult anyone and everyone who disagrees with them. If you don't, they scream about being treated like children.

      Most of the members look at these issues from their own perspective - period. That's not likely to change any time soon. The mods see both sides, every day. We look for the balance. If it tips too far one way or the other, we try to correct it.

      Rants almost never accomplish anything except to make other people as miserable/angry/indignant as the ranter.

      Very few have any place here.


      Paul
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      • Profile picture of the author Bill Farnham
        Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

        Most of the members look at these issues from their own perspective - period.
        Paul,

        I've been thinking about this, as well, and I just don't see it that way.

        ~Bill





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        • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
          Bill,
          I've been thinking about this, as well, and I just don't see it that way.
          Humor aside, that's because you're one of the exceptions.

          I don't think it's so much that people can't see the other sides of the thing. Just that they're not exposed to them enough to understand those other viewpoints even exist.


          Paul
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          • Profile picture of the author tpw
            Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

            I don't think it's so much that people can't see the other sides of the thing. Just that they're not exposed to them enough to understand those other viewpoints even exist.


            Paul

            You mean to say that sometimes you have opinions that differ from mine??? I have never seen such a thing... That is why I respected you so much, b/c you seemed to think just like me.
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            • Profile picture of the author Michael Mayo
              Originally Posted by tpw View Post

              You mean to say that sometimes you have opinions that differ from mine??? I have never seen such a thing... That is why I respected you so much, b/c you seemed to think just like me.
              Bill, You must have Paul mixed up with the other Paul Myers...
              Runs Away Fast......

              J/K
              ~MM~
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      • Profile picture of the author sal64
        Actually, in case there are cross wires... the whole set up a rant forum was more sarcasm than an actual request.

        The gist was more for people to take on a more positive approach and try and be constructive.

        The one aspect of the OP which hasn't been mentioned is the fact that there are so many gold nuggets in this place.

        In all seriousness... $37 for the war room and investing time looking for the gold is pretty much all anyone would ever need to succeed.

        Hope this makes sense.

        Sal



        Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

        Sal,

        Other than "Don't do that" and "Put the stuff that shouldn't be here at all in a special section," I'm not seeing the suggested alternative.

        Here's how it looks from this side of things:

        In general: If you allow the rants, people gripe about the negativity. If you don't allow them, people gripe about censorship.

        In the WSO section: If you remove abusive comments, the posters claim you're supporting "scammers." If you don't remove legit negative reviews, the sellers scream about how you're scamming them.

        In the review section: Delete personal attacks and you're supposedly promoting thieves. Don't remove legitimate review comments that aren't positive, and you're allegedly aiding libelous assaults on the seller's business.

        In OT: If you allow political discussions, some of the locals get vicious and insult anyone and everyone who disagrees with them. If you don't, they scream about being treated like children.

        Most of the members look at these issues from their own perspective - period. That's not likely to change any time soon. The mods see both sides, every day. We look for the balance. If it tips too far one way or the other, we try to correct it.

        Rants almost never accomplish anything except to make other people as miserable/angry/indignant as the ranter.

        Very few have any place here.


        Paul
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      • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
        Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

        Rants almost never accomplish anything except to make other people as miserable/angry/indignant as the ranter.
        Anger is the single most effective emotion to inspire people to action.

        Some few of us in the marketing world understand this and are deliberately using it to give people that boot in the arse they've been needing.

        The single biggest problem in this industry is inaction. Angry people do things. Make people angry, and things get done. If you do it right, the right things get done. If you do it wrong, the wrong things get done. And as a general rule, we're not very good at doing it right in this industry. Not with anger.

        We're good at fear. We've been using fear for decades. But fear paralyses.

        Anger motivates.

        I've been rather fascinated by Sal's quite deliberate efforts to get this right, and have been learning a lot from them. I'm not sure why other people aren't.

        My two cents, for what it's worth. Which would be, you know... two cents.
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        • Profile picture of the author sal64
          It must be my Sicilian background, CD.

          Sometimes a good smack on the back of the head works miracles.

          But I sense some people are too thick headed to notice or feel the pain.

          Maybe others don't like it because it holds a mirror to their face?

          I don't mind rants, and people are entitled to them. The problem is - and I am guessing - that the ones with that sort of mindset just happen to be the ones struggling to succeed.

          Just keep on ranting so that everyone else is to blame, eh?

          As Granny used to say: Don't point the fingers at others cuz there's always 3 pointing back at you. Clever girl my Gran.

          Thankfully you can see where I'm heading with it.

          Peace.

          Sal


          Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

          Anger is the single most effective emotion to inspire people to action.

          Some few of us in the marketing world understand this and are deliberately using it to give people that boot in the arse they've been needing.

          The single biggest problem in this industry is inaction. Angry people do things. Make people angry, and things get done. If you do it right, the right things get done. If you do it wrong, the wrong things get done. And as a general rule, we're not very good at doing it right in this industry. Not with anger.

          We're good at fear. We've been using fear for decades. But fear paralyses.

          Anger motivates.

          I've been rather fascinated by Sal's quite deliberate efforts to get this right, and have been learning a lot from them. I'm not sure why other people aren't.

          My two cents, for what it's worth. Which would be, you know... two cents.
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  • Profile picture of the author Seth Bias
    I enjoy the ranting makes for entertaining reading.... :grabs popcorn:
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  • Profile picture of the author Jason Rankin
    Sometimes people just like to let off a little steam. If they work all alone and this is the only place where they get to talk to others that may understand where there coming from, you find a rant from time to time. Even the Eagles said "I can't complain but sometimes I still do... lifes been good to me so far". I see rants and don't really woory too much about them. If the (ranter) is serious I simply move on to the next thread.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rach72
    I find the rant threads quite entertaining and a great insight into how people react and think - sure beats the 'I made $10,000 and you can too' and 'I'm so new I can't look anywhere for anything' stuff.

    What frustrates me about the rants is that people join in the rant and then think better of their comment and delete it, which totally turns the whole discussion into a pile of junk because suddenly nothing that follows makes sense. Have the gumption to stick to your opinion or back down - don't just delete your comment it because you can or because you didn't think it through enough first time 'round.
    (ok rant over )

    I strongly believe that allowing rants on this forum gives us the opportunity to become better people - whether we take that opportunity or not is up to us.

    Just my humble opinion

    Rach
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