Why is the WF so obsessed with "Going Offline"

[TimCastleman]

Alan -

I agree with you. Once you stop trading your hours for dollars you see what is really possible. Like I said I made 4 figures today, in my old life I would of had to work two weeks for the same amount I made in a couple of hours.

You get paid for the results you offer, not the time it takes.

Tim

[Michael Mayo]

Originally Posted by Alan Petersen

That's an employee mentality--why make 30K for someone else when you can make it for yourself and you don't have to be at their beckon call.

I was paid what is a good salary as an employee in the corporate world but not as good as the CEO who made millions.

It seems those who make money offline soon have an online ebook/course/coaching program to sell online.

Lol...Alan,
Tell me it ain't so...lol

Michael

[Steve Porcaro]

I agree with the post however I do my PPC campaigns for companies that I meet offline that want an online presence. I only do a few as I like my me time.

I agree that I cannot and will not fill up my entire week with clients offline, however a couple here and there. It helps keep contacts, gives you a different perspective on where people are really at in using the internet.

But I do not want the issue of having to be there, but offline does have value but to me only in moderation, severly moderated.

Plus it is low hanging fruit

[Frank Bruno]

Its called another marketing channel.

Frank Bruno

[haridasz]

Warriors are entreprenuers by nature.
Im Skills picked up here and elsewhare are gems.

So when we see opportunity that allows to expand and use our skills to further deepenour pockets....why not.

Offline Mrketing has several simple techniques that can be used to get clients.
I mean...forget the cold calling! Get clients from sitting right there on your precious seat.

cheers
hari

[AndrewCavanagh]

Another vital point...

Working with a brick and mortar business can be a huge shortcut to making money with your internet marketing skills.

To make money online you're going to need clients or customers and a product or service to sell.

There are hundreds of ways to increase your profits once you have both those things but getting both can be a whole lot of work.

When you work with a brick and mortar business you often start with both and you get to play with your strategies and skills to make that business more profits.

It's a huge short cut to the usual "find a product, build a list" process.

Kindest regards,
Andrew Cavanagh

[MRomeo09]

Originally Posted by Alan Petersen

That's an employee mentality--why make 30K for someone else when you can make it for yourself and you don't have to be at their beckon call.

I was paid what is a good salary as an employee in the corporate world but not as good as the CEO who made millions.

It seems those who make money offline soon have an online ebook/course/coaching program to sell online.

That's pretty funny actually. I'll make around $6k a month for 2-5 hours a work, but let's double it to ten. Oh yeah, and actually very little of that will be MY work. I'll probably pay around $12 an hour for one of my employees to put together the reporting for me, mail it out, send out an invoice. There will probably be around $800 in PPC costs and things. My work? I'll check the numbers make sure it's looking pretty good. I'll probably call them and see that they are doing ok. All total I might have an hour into any one client in a month. I'll be making $6k-120-800. or around $5,080 for an hours worth of work.

If that makes me an employee. SWEET!

I approach things a little different than most of the offline posts here. I'm actually more like Shoemoney with the local affiliate marketing.

Making Money Online With Local Affiliate Programs - ShoeMoney®

Yes the money is good, but what I like is the control aspect of it. I actually own the traffic, the websites, the phone numbers that are ringing in, every bit of it. They just sit back and let the traffic come in the door.

So your issues with being at someone's beck and call. I agree, I did that when I did straight up SEO and web design. Now, I don't have to deal with that, because it's my site and my traffic. I no longer have to hear from PITA clients who want one column right justified. If they tick me off, it's no hair off my back to call all their competitors within a 5 mile radius, and tell them hey I can get you $30k a month of work for $6k a month fee, and you won't have to lift a finger to make it happen. Think that will be a hard sell?

So it's not like being an employee, it's more about joint venturing with local businesses to be their affiliate. Probably much like you do. I just happen to set it up with local businesses, because they pay just a tad more than your average clickbank product.

The best part is that it's all low hanging fruit, it just ain't that hard. I used to collect $3k in fees a month for a credit repair firm. Now THAT was a huge pain, I did get them into top 5 before for whatever reason they stopped doing it. That was back in 2006/2007. This is Soooo much easier and the pay is better. And you know what the absolute best part of it is, the party never has to end. If you work with a plumber in your city, there is pretty much ALWAYS going to be a plumber who will be willing to pay you.

I actually own a brick and mortar company myself with around 25 employees, and I'll tell you that everytime the phone rings I know that call is worth $80. I would pay somebody every day of the week $20 to get it to ring more often. And that's essentially what I do.

And as an owner of a brick and mortar company I'll tell you that it's also not as easy as you would make it out to be either. Yes, my client will get $30k of business off of my work. But, realistically they are the ones who have to answer the phones, service the clients(i.e. do REAL work), do follow up, collect money, etc. I'd rather be on my side of the transaction realistically.

Personally I'm a people person. I like meeting new business owners, I like that aspect of it. I don't consider it selling. I just ask them questions, tell them how I built my 25 employee company solely from the internet, and wait for them to say "Let's do it".

However, the way I do it is a little different than most. I don't like being an employee just like you mentioned. I could give a hoot if they like my website or the ads I place as long as they will pay me for the business I bring them in. I don't have to run anything by them, or get it checked. And that's true freedom. Plus I bring them in so much business so cheaply that they would be scared to let it go, and double scared to have me go talk to their competitor down the street and give them what they see as "their customers".

Make sense?

M

[MikeAmbrosio]

Originally Posted by jhongren

I was just talking about this matter to a friend who
is working in a company offering PPC management
for ANY Offline business.

He has to make more than 40 cold calls a day!!!

Thinking about that send shivers down my spine :_(

John

Your friend works for someone - in other words, he's an employee.

The owner of the company - is he the one making 40 calls a day?

Or is he outsourcing?

[MikeAmbrosio]

What I want to know is what make anyone think that simply because your work is totally on line that you're not "married" to it in some way?

Do you create products? You need to find customers for it. If you don't, you won't make any money. Simple.

Are you creating the product yourself, outsourcing, or maybe both?

Are you spending ANY time on your business?

At the end of the day, what difference does it make how you spend your time making money - the important thing is that you're doing what you want...

WHEN you want.

And contrary to some of the opinions, face to face time with your clients CAN be controlled rather nicely. They'll even thank you for it. You provide the service you promise, they are happy. They keep paying you. And you keep paying your team while you, um, sit home in your underwear (sorta like doing the online thing).

Finally, FWIW, the biggest reason I decided to try the offline thing is the guy I hire is a heck of a salesman AND a heck of an Adwords guy. I already HAVE people to do the design, content, ect.

So none of it is any skin off my free time.

Mike

[RobertNelsoninc]

OFFLINE-- is BIG BUSINESS, if u can think BIG ENOUGH. There are some great posts here, i am wondering though, when are some of my fellow warriors going to start thinking BIG, HUGE, GIGANTIC, and then take the necessary action to make it happen.

If the naysayers only knew, and for most i feel grateful, most wont take any action even if u hand the the GOLDEN GOOSE !!!!!!!!!!!

When i first started in Real Estate Investing, i was broke and had no credit. However i had one thing, MASSIVE DESIRE, and i knew how to take MASSIVE ACTION. When i started my first deal i made 1k, and thought Jackpot, 10 hrs work made 100.00 an hr, better than a lot of doctors. Next deal 2500.00 now that took about 20 hrs, so just a small raise, well long story short 2 ys later i did a deal, no money out of pocket, and i made a 137k in less than 30 days and 25 hrs of work, do the math, about 5400.00 an hour, my point is this, my wife was a real estate agent when i started, and was my biggest naysayer, she was conditioned that it wouldnt work. I knew it would, and took Massive action, and its been unbelievable since. It has opened up many many doors, and i have made some incredible relationships with people that are incredibly valuable, people with more wealth, than i thought was possible to accumulate.

The Moral of the story, START THINKING HUGE, get outside of the rectangular box, and take some Massive action. Guys, there is enough revenue in OFFLINE gold, to generate easy 7 figure income annually. now if your thinking like we are, u have been asking yourself this one question, How do i push that # too an 8 figure income. Brainstorm, market inside your own mind, Split test ideas online and offline, Personally i dont know anyone, but i am sure someone out there is making 10-20 million a year NET with offline GOLD.

NOW go take some ACTION !!!!!!!!!!!!

Regards,
Robert Nelson

[darknighthatter]

well i dont agree i for one not interested in going offlinr

[Kyle Tully]

Originally Posted by davebo

So what's the appeal to going offline and dealing with customers?

Many of my Consulting Tycoon students took up offline consulting because their "online" business hadn't quite clicked yet, or they simply wanted another revenue stream in their already profitable business.

It's all well and good to complain about dealing with customers, not being "automated", and trading dollars for hours in (one way of doing) the offline model...

... but when your "no-customer, automated, leveraged online business" is only doing $1100 a month the mortgage company doesn't really care how you get the rest of the payment.

... and when you can get $5,500 for a few hours work and simply "plug in" your skills to an already profitable business you can make a BIG difference.

The bottom line is, for many people, the skill set needed for offline consulting is much more in line with where they are at now. They don't have a niche online. They don't have their own products. They don't have enough money coming in.

But they've got more than enough skills to help a local business and make some really nice money in the meantime -- money that they can re-invest into getting their online business cranking.

This is the same kind of argument as the affiliate vs product owner -- there are pros and cons to each and which one is right for you is a personal choice.

[Andyhenry]

This is an interesting subject.

This going offline topic comes up in cycles on the forum and it's been done to death several times over the years, we're just in yet another one of those cycles because a lot of people have joined the forum in the last year and not seen all the same information here before in other threads.

As for the motivation - for me it's easy, I like to spend my time doing things I enjoy and working online can disconnect you from people. Yes, the forum's great and skype and email mean you can communicate better, but I'm a people person and I like meeting people. So for me, the reason I do offline IM is because I enjoy it.

Since I started doing IM I've also started 2 offline companies and I speak at high-tech seminars and run workshops and trainings around the world in that industry - because it's fun and interesting. Yes the money is good too, but I'm basically a lazy person and without stuff to get me out the house travelling and meeting people I'd get really bored.

I can't speak for anyone else, but my offline stuff is something I enjoy and since I have friends and family with their own businesses, and previous clients who are always recommending me to companies that need help, I like to mix things up.

The minute it stops being fun I'll stop doing it.

There seems to be some confusion between working and doing things you don't like. Online or offline, you can work in whatever way you like. I wouldn't take on any work I didn't expect to enjoy, so the concept of me being held captive by customers/clients is crazy. I don't want their money so much that I'll let them dictate what I'm doing - It's the other way around, I will only do the work if I want to do it.

Also, not having all your eggs in one basket always appeals to me, so if my revenue is coming from several sources and I enjoy them all - I don't see a problem with that.

As someone already said - it ALL requires your time, so calling it another job is an illusion because I would never stop working - I just choose to work on things that I like, so why would I want to stop?

Andy

[Angela V. Edwards]

Originally Posted by Michael D

I just don't understand how you are comparing your Restaurant management position to doing internet marketing/marketing for offline business. These aren't even remotely the same thing. When you are a manager somewhere you are an employee. Even though you may oversee the whole store you still have a boss and they do "own" you.

I can see your point about how this could happen with offline clients. But, this will only happen to people who let it happen. Make it very clear to them what you are offering and always get a contract signed. Have a clause in there that if anything doesn't fit into this realm of work it is billed by the hour. So, when they call you at 10PM on Saturday night with a broken computer they think you can fix you can bill them for it if you want to take care of it.

Sure, people that are laid back and accept every customer that comes there way may run into this. But, if you do what you agreed in a contract and they are trying to get you to do extra stuff for nothing you can be polite about it and tell them that will be /hr or "sorry, this isn't part of the agreement".

If they don't like it good for them. They can let you go. There are a lot of businesses out there. The best part is you don't have to work with people you don't want to. Hell, you can "fire" them if you want to. The only way you are going to run into the issues you talked about is if you let it happen to yourself.

Yep; you've got some great points. And I can tell that you saw my point; if the marketer doesn't exercise some control over the whole thing, he or she CAN get into a position to where they are "owned" by the business owner they are contracted with.

Myself, I don't really have an interest in working 'offline' at this point in time. I may someday decide that I'd like to try it. I just don't know. I do know that when my doctor asked me if I had a business card for what I do online, I saw the potential of what people could do working with offline businesses.

[Christie Love]

Because it works. That's what the obsession is about and the reality that it's easier to sell to offline businesses than it is to sell online is what has heightened the attraction. It just makes since. Use your online skills to market to people who are willing to easily dish out a grand for product you can only make a couple hundred online.

[Kevin Riley]

Not me! I have worked offline before, and I love marketing online. And, where I live, offline isn't much of an option.

[fxmmorale]

It boils down to motivations and personalities. If you're desperately in need of a way to make the next car or mortgage payment it could become a lucrative alternative, however if you're not into dealing with people, that could be a problem.

Vice versa if you like getting out there and interacting with people face to face, it's a great way to take all of that marketing knowledge and make some great money, but if there is no real drive to get up and go meet with a client because you're not motivated, that could be a problem also.

The business model itself is really powerful and as others have stated "a matter of preference".

I've worked in the automotive industry for over 20yrs. and out of curiosity decided to make an offer to the owner of a particular dealership not expecting any real feedback, but after a few minutes of conversation and explanation about increasing sales to their website with what I've learned and use to generate traffic to my own sites, they were very receptive.

The potential is there, it's about what your motivations are and what your personality is like.

That's my 1 1/2 cents.
Nando

[dmail333]

I don't get the feeling the WF are obsessed with "Going Offline" ... remember we are Marketers when it's all said and done. And when you combine online and offline it's powerful. Also it's just the time to remember that offline businesses are so far behind us online marketer... that it can be a very profitable opportunity for Warriors.

[davebo]

Originally Posted by MRomeo09

The thing is you're making it more complicated than it has to be. It really ain't that hard. It just isn't.

The client I got who is going to pay me $6k a month will make roughly $30k for that amount of work. How demanding do you think they'll be? I can take my gravy train and take it down the road at any time. Trust me, I'm going to be their best friend they'll ever have. I'm the one they are going to consider part of the family.

As far as time is concerned, I expect I'll spend roughly 20-30 hours building landing pages, facebook ads, etc. I'll pay a few hundred bucks for web design. And for the first few months I'll spend 5-10 hours a month tweaking the ad. After that I'll probably spend 2-5 hours a month. It's not like it's brain surgery. They are getting an excellent return on investment.


M

First off, you're making some huge assumptions. I'm guessing that you've never actually done what you are saying will be pretty easy to do. And the more important question is, if you can take $6k an turn it into $30k for the client, why don't you take your own $6k and do it for yourself?

[MRomeo09]

Originally Posted by Alan Petersen

That's an employee mentality--why make 30K for someone else when you can make it for yourself and you don't have to be at their beckon call.

I was paid what is a good salary as an employee in the corporate world but not as good as the CEO who made millions.

It seems those who make money offline soon have an online ebook/course/coaching program to sell online.

Originally Posted by davebo

First off, you're making some huge assumptions. I'm guessing that you've never actually done what you are saying will be pretty easy to do. And the more important question is, if you can take $6k an turn it into $30k for the client, why don't you take your own $6k and do it for yourself?

Did you read my second post later on, not in direct response to your thread? Read that, and then let me know if you still have questions.

[MikeAmbrosio]

Originally Posted by davebo

First off, you're making some huge assumptions. I'm guessing that you've never actually done what you are saying will be pretty easy to do. And the more important question is, if you can take $6k an turn it into $30k for the client, why don't you take your own $6k and do it for yourself?

Could be that whatever he's doing works best or gets great results in the offline market.

I think it's a bad assumption to say that if it works so well for your client, then it would also work for your on line business.

And as I have stated previously, could be a personal preference to work with off line businesses.

I do both - on and off line. I don't always find things easier or faster or more lucrative on line.

There's more than one way to make a few bucks.

[Nathan Hangen]

I see it as an opportunity to build a business that will create equity. You can outsource almost every part of it if you want (as in hire someone) and for many people it is a nice link between the offline world and the online world.

I like building business and when I return to the states I might try it.

[para]

Originally Posted by zxlewi

Offline IM rocks.... most places that people live don't know what a double meta refresh or a redirect to an offer is so you have easy targets who will signup to get a free wii or free iphone and earn you some easy cash just for spending $10 or so and an hour putting up some posters. It also makes a change from sitting at a pc all day and means that you can get outside and still make cash too :P

You are so right!

I went and met with a client on Friday and they were begging me to work with them. A complete overall of their website. This includes re-designing the lot, with auto responders, article writing, article submission, backlink building etc. And not only that, they are passing me a referral and several more in the pipeline.

I also did 10-minutes of cold call last week and got 1 meeting book with a good size company. Not bad for 1 hours work of offline marketing.

Course, I will be outsourcing most of it.
Regards
Para

[Keith Boisvert]

I think a poster earlier on page one nailed it when they said that the offline niche is another way for people to make money. For some they are grasping at straws looking for that "quick buck", while others find that the niche fits them and they do very well.

The niche is not for anyone, and I don't care what anyone says, there is no quick buck. It has become just like the regular IM gene pool where marketers will sell to marketers. It is a hot niche right now so others are trying to capitalize.

They think because they read the cash cow thread and they have shopped in a store before they are qualified to launch a product. Some are just starting threads in HOPES of being the one to start the next uber-thread.

Look, the niche is not for everyone, and nothing says you can't work the niche in your local area AND do regular internet marketing strategies. You don't have to put all of your eggs in one basket.

The popularity of the 'offline' niche is hot right now, but that will die down once people realize that there is work involved, and those of use who have been doing it right along will keep on chugging.

And as Les said, its a break from the aweber vs getresponse threads

keith

[Dan Sherman]

Not much left to be said, as there has already been a ton of great responses. In just two pages, there has been a number of unique ways to approach this niche.

One thing I think a lot of people are missing with this is that "offline" or "local" doesn't have to define your end of the transaction, just your clients' end. Depending on how you market, you can get clients with whom you never meet face to face. You just do work for them that generates business offline for their brick and mortar.

As Andrew Cavanagh preaches, starting in your local area is where people will likely find the most success when starting out. But that doesn't mean you have to stay there.

Or, as MRomeo09 has shown, even if you're dealing with people in your local area you don't have to let them define or control the relationship. Anyone who didn't take the time to read his great posts in this thread should go back and do so.

Online or off, it's your business. Build it how you want it.

[rlnorthcutt]

Alot of valid thoughts here. As a professional web developer / consultant, and now a Trainer for the "offline thing", here is what I have noticed AND personally experienced.

1) Different people have different skills, abilities and drives. Some people actually LIKE to work directly with clients... and getting out in the world is healthy and fun.

2) Some people ARE grasping at straws. They are jumping on the bandwagon and will fall right back off. But, thats part of their journey.

3) Making a consistent living with IM takes work, skill, patience and some luck (like anything else!). Success is a really personal thing and alot of people give up before they find what works for them. Offline marketing MIGHT be the right direction.

4) GET PAID TO LEARN! Doing IM for yourself is a do or die scenario... either make money and succeed or you just wasted your time. When you are providing services for others, they are paying you to practice your IM!

I got into Real Estate and worked with investors so I could learn about investing in real estate without using my money. And its be a fantastic education.

5) Speaking of which, why would anyone want to do IM when they can make millions passively with real estate... in any market?
ANSWER - because we are all different and we all have different skills and interests.

6) Dealing clients is all about managing expectation. I have learned the hard way (and now teach people) that you have to be VERY CLEAR on the expectation and deliverables when working with people. You have to have good systems for MANAGING THE CLIENT.

EX: The 4500% website system we have put together allows clients to easily edit & change their site. And if they want me to do it, they will pay hourly... I can offer good service and support and still incentivize them to not "bug" me too much (unless they want to pay for it!)

And keep in mind - I decide how much ($500, $1000, $2000, $10,000) to charge for my time...

7) Like ANY business ("straight" IM included), you need to develop systems to streamline and automate your business as much as possible. There is very little difference between online/offline except in the specific way you spend your time. (see Gerber's "E-Myth")

I think the original question of this thread is VERY valid, and I am glad someone has asked! At the same time, I think some of the responses show a bit of arrogance and eliteism... People all make different choices and they are ALL valid choices.

BOTTOM LINE: The offline model is a great business (for sombunal) and should be included in any serious discussion of IM strategies. Whether you choose to not do it all, do it to make extra money or use it as your main source of income... it doesn't matter.

We are all here to learn, share and grow. I wish you all success as you follow your own, unique path.

Thanks again for this thought provoking topic and the honest responses!

regards,
Ron

[Ken Preuss]

Hats off to rlnorthcutt (Ron) for the most thoughtful post on the entire thread.

To each our own. Some people are cut out for offline, others are not. Regardless no one way is more legitimate than the other and everyone gets to choose their path for themselves.

For me personally, I've become used to making money at home in my sweatpants. So that's what I do and that's what I teach.

Unless something changes in the future, offline is not a world I want to touch with a ten foot pole at this point.

But I applaud the heck out of those who are doing so successfully.

Ken

[MikeAmbrosio]

Originally Posted by Ken Preuss

For me personally, I've become used to making money at home in my sweatpants. So that's what I do and that's what I teach.

I actually love to make money in my sweatpants as well.

But I have found that at times I actually miss getting dressed and getting out - as I stated earlier, it's from the 20+ years in the field service business.

Plus, I am getting fat sitting around all the time

One of the reasons I broke down and now rent office space is to get me out of the house. We have 5 adults and 2 children here. It also gets tough to concentrate, make videos, etc.

Does it seem like a job to me? At times, sure - both the off line AND on line stuff I do. I think that's normal. Would I trade it and go back to my old job? Not in a million years!

Because at the end of the day, I still get to CHOOSE whether I want to leave my house or make money in my sweatpants (too many people to sit around in my underwear...)

Mike

[CarolSmith]

I make money both online and offline. Like many have said it's just another stream of income we have available to us. I definitely don't think the offline niche is as easy as many make it out to be though. It is just as hard as the online niche for me.

With money being very tight right now not a whole of businesses have money to spend right now.

Carol

[MikeAmbrosio]

Originally Posted by CarolSmith

With money being very tight right now not a whole of businesses have money to spend right now.

Carol

This could also work the other way. Let me give youo an example...

I am working with a realtor right now - he's an independent who specializes in upstate NY property/acerage.

Not too long ago, he used to run an ad listing his properties every Sunday in the R.E. section of the classifieds. He would but the entire back page. This entire back page cost him $15,000 every week. In our local area paper.

$60,000 per month!

He came to me because the economy has slowed his sales and he can't afford the ad buys any longer (at least not weekly), so we now list his properties on his new and improved website the I personally built with a free realtor software (took me 2 hours), and we are running a geo-targeted PPC Adwords campaign for him.

Let me say that while the money is good for us (my guy spends now about 10 hours per month on this account), we are also saving him a BUNDLE.

There are upsides to a down economy...

[tommygadget]

Originally Posted by lgibbon

I don't think most are actually interested in the going offline aspect.
It's more a case of seeing a popular subject and starting their own thread about it.
It gives us a rest from the "getresponse v aweber" threads I suppose.

I'm really glad you brought this up! Which one is better, in your opinion?

TomG.

[RobertNelsoninc]

Originally Posted by MikeAmbrosio

I actually love to make money in my sweatpants as well.

But I have found that at times I actually miss getting dressed and getting out - as I stated earlier, it's from the 20+ years in the field service business.

Plus, I am getting fat sitting around all the time

One of the reasons I broke down and now rent office space is to get me out of the house. We have 5 adults and 2 children here. It also gets tough to concentrate, make videos, etc.

Does it seem like a job to me? At times, sure - both the off line AND on line stuff I do. I think that's normal. Would I trade it and go back to my old job? Not in a million years!

Because at the end of the day, I still get to CHOOSE whether I want to leave my house or make money in my sweatpants (too many people to sit around in my underwear...)

Mike

Both Mike and Ron have made some incredibly strong points. Its about control, dynamics, multiple income streams, and most importantly RESULTS !!! Now the question becomes what kind of results are you seeking. Not everyone can survive in the offline world, its not that easy, you must, i repeat you must have some skill-sets, and good people skills. In 2009 it has become blatantly apparent too me that people skills are becoming a ZEN THING, i mean good lord, call 20 voice mails at random of business people 2 pick up, 18 go to voicemail ( that sucks and sends the wrong message out ) and the 2 that pick up 1 will be professional and 1 wont. It the race too the offline world, IM people are so use too using Email,skype,texting, and a host of other communication devices that the #1 ingrediant for building an EMPIRE is people skills. Relationships are Monster Revenue builders, and especially if u have them with the right people.

Example: this is a GOLD NUGGET for OFFLINERS. I have a good friend locally, who knows a huge majority of business owners in town, who has Massive Credibility with these folks, and does not reccomend many things. I created a leave behind that he could use as a freebie, and it also has my letter of Reccomendation from him in the leave behind. Now, can u see the referrals i get, i am getting Huge Clout by Association. Every time a new client purchases, i pay him minimum of 150.00 up too 1k depending on what the initial purchase is, in addition, he gets 15% of net earnings from clients he brings me. Now i set these clients up too my schedule not theirs.

The point being, think about what could happen if you had 20 people doing this every week, 200 people, or even 2000, All u have too do is SCALE in accordance with demand, and i can tell u, the bigger my client base grows, the more i charge for my time, if everyone u talk too wants too buy after u give them a PRICE, you need to RAISE your PRICES and Place more VALUE ON YOUR TIME.

There are consultants in various niches globally who get monster fees for a weekend of consulting, i mean 100k plus up too the biggest that i am aware of at this point was
a tidy little some of 325k for a fri,sat,sun consultation. Go try to hire Anthony Robbins for a 3 day private consultation and see what u get.

I have one clinet i have an idea i had too a couple months back, hes made over 70k for that idea in 3 months, What should i have charged him ? Was 10k Out of line up front ? No, i gave him a friggin deal, his income on that one idea will start too compound over time, and i guarantee you i now wish i would have charged him 40k up front and a piece on the back end. See START THINKING BIG !!!!!!!!!!!!

This has been an awesome thread and thanks too Ron and Mike for there contributions.

Regards,
Robert Nelson

[jan roos]

All I know is that before I started in the offline niche I was spending 8- 12 hours every day infront of my pc learning IM, blogging, articles etc. I made some money but not a lot. Now since I started offline marketing I am working wayyy less, outsourcing just about everything except SEO because thats what I like to do and am decent at.

I am also making much more money, people view me as the "internet genius" lol that part still cracks me up. I just explain the difference between ppc ads and organic rankings and people think i'm brilliant. lol

Anyways, If I was making a whole bunch of AUTOMATED money online without slaving away in front of my pc for hours I probably wouldnt do the offline thing and that will probably be part of my long term goal ( maybe) but for right now I am really enjoying the offline gig and making decent money at it.

I also have not made one cold call to date, I had one clienbt who I did work for free for. She loved me and started referring people to me like crazy and now I am getting calls all the time from business owners who heard from me. (shows the demand is huge for us internet marketers)

Just my 2 cents

Oh and one more thing, if you are making a business owner 3 or 4 times back the amount of money he pays you do you really think he is going to start getting demanding on your ass?

Cheers

[Louis Raven]

Write an Adsense post in the main forum and it's rightly so deleted..

Write about your 9-5 offline salesman job and your golden lol??

Regardless of the tactics applied, marketing an offline job is the furthest away from IM in my honest opinion.

Still, the forum main sub-headline is.. "Where We Talk About Making Money".

Louis

[Haltingpoint]

Its great to see all these success stories, but back to the actual question of "why the heck are there so many threads about this on WF...."

Here's a hint: Look at the links in the .sigs of the people who start those threads or who comment very frequently on them.

While a lot of the advice given for free is great and I appreciate their posting it, their posts are often times quite blatant "soft sells" for their own offline marketing products/training.

I won't name any names but if you look at any of the BIG (and by big I mean massive) threads, it is quite obvious that it is nothing but a promotional piece for them--forum marketing if you will. And people eat it up. I wonder how much those people have made as a direct result of their signatures.

Again, I appreciate the advice, but when you see those threads, ask yourself...isn't it a bit of a coincidence that they are making it sound really easy and promising if you know the right approach and then...oh! wait...what's this? They just happen to sell a step-by-step solution for that very thing in their sig!

Its the typical IM sales letter format with the offline niche...build hope, claim it is easy if you know the secrets, give away general information that makes it seem like they too could do it but hint that there is a "secret sauce" or that it requires training to do it effectively, and then offer the solution for the low low price of $XXX.

Call me jaded, but its been an increasingly common occurrence here.

[TimCastleman]

Call me jaded, but its been an increasingly common occurrence here.

You're jaded.

Well you asked for it ;-)

[Steven Carl Kelly]

I make money both online and offline. It's all good.

[David]

Originally Posted by davebo

I guess I see your point. But are you saying that offline marketing is good for people that can't cut it online? Those who can't do, teach?

That is just not fair!

IF you are creative enough to come up with your own product, niche what have you and you use what you learned here... you'll do allright.

Most of us are just not that creative.

We DO have enough gumption to learn the nuts and bolts, to reverse engineer what the gurus tell us.

We even get TOLD to reverse engineer, we get told:

• use our premade templates
• you can use our copy
• you can use our PLR stuff

You ever tried to go up against a Yanik Silver or Willie Crawford with an IM product?

How'd that work out for ya?

My thinking after getting my clock cleaned a few times is to move down to pick on someone that ISN'T in my weight group.

I've marketed stuff of my own with limited success, I just picked a niche with no money in it.

Does that mean the tactics were not valid?

no, of course not.

Now I've not yet joined the War Room yet, waiting for my direct deposit to clear... I do have multiple income streams:

how much do I make on adsense?

try a maximum of $3 a day (or $90 month)

How much do I make on sales of my ebook?

I sold one or two a day, then it dropped off

maybe $50 month?

How much do I make with shoe leather?

enough to pay the rent, pay off the bills I ran up, enough to fix my credit, enough to pay for hosting/ awebber/ flickr pro

see where I'm going with this?

[JohnMcCabe]

Maybe because we can't all teach lonely dog trainers how to cure their acne, get laid and get rich in their underwear...

[RobertNelsoninc]

Originally Posted by Haltingpoint

Its great to see all these success stories, but back to the actual question of "why the heck are there so many threads about this on WF...."

Here's a hint: Look at the links in the .sigs of the people who start those threads or who comment very frequently on them.

While a lot of the advice given for free is great and I appreciate their posting it, their posts are often times quite blatant "soft sells" for their own offline marketing products/training.

I won't name any names but if you look at any of the BIG (and by big I mean massive) threads, it is quite obvious that it is nothing but a promotional piece for them--forum marketing if you will. And people eat it up. I wonder how much those people have made as a direct result of their signatures.

Again, I appreciate the advice, but when you see those threads, ask yourself...isn't it a bit of a coincidence that they are making it sound really easy and promising if you know the right approach and then...oh! wait...what's this? They just happen to sell a step-by-step solution for that very thing in their sig!

Its the typical IM sales letter format with the offline niche...build hope, claim it is easy if you know the secrets, give away general information that makes it seem like they too could do it but hint that there is a "secret sauce" or that it requires training to do it effectively, and then offer the solution for the low low price of .

Call me jaded, but its been an increasingly common occurrence here.

You gotta learn too sreen the fluff.......... I have a ton of posts on this thread and i disagree with your thoughts here. Nothing in my sig line, and i definately have too say, its not easy. Scroll up about 10 posts and read my last one. If noobs read this and think its easy, then they got another thing coming. Thanks for your perspective though, thats what makes the world go round, and creates good topics of discussion, rather than slamming each other.
Regards,
Robert Nelson

[Craig McPherson]

Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe

Maybe because we can't all teach lonely dog trainers how to cure their acne, get laid and get rich in their underwear...

Magnificant John,

I've been reading the thread thinking of a simple answer to a very *simple* question.
Yours is perfect.

I guess if I did have to answer the question I would say:

"Cos it floats my boat"

[braver55b]

As U.S GDP shrank last year and the economy tanks, Going offline can be a good strategy (one I'm considering) as a lot of businesses, they may have a website just to be able to say

we're online; but are otherwise technophobes and with the right approach are much more willing (from what the gurus have shared) to pay a king's ransom as they may have not

thought about doing something we take for granted such as building a contact list or have a strategy drive more traffic via SEO to their sites.

[bobsstuff]

So what's the appeal to going offline and dealing with customers?

Most starting in IM have a long row to hoe before they make any money.

If someone can setup a website, they have the potential to get $$$$ right now instead of six weeks or six months down the road by a little gab with some local businesses.

I think people are here to make money. Ideally it is sitting on a beach while autiomated systems rake in the dough. However, to pay the bills and get experience, any technique that works is OK for many.

[Black Hat Cat]

Originally Posted by MRomeo09

Did you read my second post later on, not in direct response to your thread? Read that, and then let me know if you still have questions.

Dave made a good point. Why NOT turn that $6,000 into $30,000 for yourself? It's not necessary to have your own brick and mortar location, employees, etc, if you know what you're doing. Forget about that though, I want to know how you turn $800 in ppc into $30,000.

Many of my Consulting Tycoon students took up offline consulting because their "online" business hadn't quite clicked yet, or they simply wanted another revenue stream in their already profitable business.

It's all well and good to complain about dealing with customers, not being "automated", and trading dollars for hours in (one way of doing) the offline model...

... but when your "no-customer, automated, leveraged online business" is only doing $1100 a month the mortgage company doesn't really care how you get the rest of the payment.

Which raises a different issue: how are your students going to do for others what they apparently can't do for themselves? If they can't make themselves over $1,100 a month practicing what they preach, what business owner is going to pay them a few grand a month to make them less than that?

[Haltingpoint]

Originally Posted by RobertNelsoninc

You gotta learn too sreen the fluff.......... I have a ton of posts on this thread and i disagree with your thoughts here. Nothing in my sig line, and i definately have too say, its not easy. Scroll up about 10 posts and read my last one. If noobs read this and think its easy, then they got another thing coming. Thanks for your perspective though, thats what makes the world go round, and creates good topics of discussion, rather than slamming each other.
Regards,
Robert Nelson

I'm quite good at screening the fluff, its just damned annoying to see those posts take up so much space on this forum.

And I actually wasn't referring to you at all with my comment Robert--to the contrary your advice and thoughts on the matter have added a welcome dose of reality to the subject.

That said, there is an extremely popular thread on here that is a perfect example of this sort of thing--and it is far from the only example of this.

To be fair, it is not just specific to Offline Marketing either...quite frequently someone will post a thread telling about the great success they've recently had with a strategy or tactic, build the hope, and then make a comment about the one key ingredient that is missing that they just so happen to sell via a sig link. Its forum marketing plain and simple and should be frowned upon and called out whenever it occurs.

[David]

Originally Posted by jan roos

All I know is that before I started in the offline niche I was spending 8- 12 hours every day infront of my pc learning IM, blogging, articles etc. I made some money but not a lot. Now since I started offline marketing I am working wayyy less, outsourcing just about everything except SEO because thats what I like to do and am decent at.

I am also making much more money, people view me as the "internet genius" lol that part still cracks me up. I just explain the difference between ppc ads and organic rankings and people think i'm brilliant. lol

Anyways, If I was making a whole bunch of AUTOMATED money online without slaving away in front of my pc for hours I probably wouldnt do the offline thing and that will probably be part of my long term goal ( maybe) but for right now I am really enjoying the offline gig and making decent money at it.

I also have not made one cold call to date, I had one clienbt who I did work for free for. She loved me and started referring people to me like crazy and now I am getting calls all the time from business owners who heard from me. (shows the demand is huge for us internet marketers)

Just my 2 cents

Oh and one more thing, if you are making a business owner 3 or 4 times back the amount of money he pays you do you really think he is going to start getting demanding on your ass?

Cheers

That's happening for me as well

Only had to get a few paying clients with 'shoe leather' and now they're coming to me. I no longer have to cold call.

[RobertNelsoninc]

Originally Posted by Haltingpoint

I'm quite good at screening the fluff, its just damned annoying to see those posts take up so much space on this forum.

And I actually wasn't referring to you at all with my comment Robert--to the contrary your advice and thoughts on the matter have added a welcome dose of reality to the subject.

That said, there is an extremely popular thread on here that is a perfect example of this sort of thing--and it is far from the only example of this.

To be fair, it is not just specific to Offline Marketing either...quite frequently someone will post a thread telling about the great success they've recently had with a strategy or tactic, build the hope, and then make a comment about the one key ingredient that is missing that they just so happen to sell via a sig link. Its forum marketing plain and simple and should be frowned upon and called out whenever it occurs.

Haltingpoint,

I know what u mean about forum marketing, its a tough call for me, i don't do , at least not yet anyway, and it becomes a dilemma of marketing in general. For me ethics and morals are more important than the almighty dollar. For those that operate differently, it will come back around. It goes back too people learning people skills, for me its tough, i havent been using twitter, i thought it would be a fad. I bought a WSO for 7 or 10 bucks i dont remember, but i bought it to shorten the learning curve now some would say it had holes, and for noobs it might, but i was able to take the info, put 958 followers of my type of people on in less than 24 hrs.... in 3 days time i just did a JV from that twitter thing, and its going to pay around 10k. So what i think we have too do, is sort through what works for us, and leave the rest. I quit trying to police things about a year ago, and trust me i am about as outspoken direct as they come. its bit my ass on more than one occassion. Thanks for the kind words and input, just lettem forum market, or whatever they might do, if someone is a sucker, well, i am sorry, sometimes you just cant fix
STUPID !!!! Good insight though.

Regards,
Robert Nelson

[MikeAmbrosio]

Originally Posted by BlueFartcat

Which raises a different issue: how are your students going to do for others what they apparently can't do for themselves? If they can't make themselves over $1,100 a month practicing what they preach, what business owner is going to pay them a few grand a month to make them less than that?

Because it's not just about "making money online" or PPC that you are doing with off line clients. That's not what you are "preaching" to them. You provide simple services.

I knew how to build websites and install scripts LONG before I made consistent money on line, so this is something that is perfectly logical to either teach or provide as a service to off line clients.

Many off line business owners not only don't know how to manage a mailing list, but have never even thought to build one - so why not provide this as a service?

That's why people who have yet to make money on line can teach/provide services to off line clients. It has very little to do with the make money stuff.

Oh, and PPC? Driving traffic? There are firms out there that can do this. You can simply hire them and mark up the cost to your off line customer (not gouge! mark ups are standard in any business).

So in the end, you have many things to offer.

Mike

[Jared Alberghini]

Originally Posted by lgibbon

I don't think most are actually interested in the going offline aspect.

They may not be interested in doing it by themselves, but they sure do like the 'idea' of the concept...

How to Hire a Sakesperson for Offline/Cash Cow SEO Stuff??

(Please forgive the OP, I'm sure they meant Salesperson, not Sakesperson)

.jrd

[Instructor]

To address the question of "If you can turn $6k into 30k for someone else, why not do it for yourself"

In a word...inventory.

1 prime example could be offering IM services to an automobile dealership. He has the inventory (the vehicles) and you can provide him with the customers via PPC ads, SEO, BTR etc.

Since the average profit per vehicle is about $1500 - $2000 dollars (and that's on the low end), you only have to generate about 15-20 new customers for the 30k to be realistic, something that you can easily do with 6k in IM if you know what you're doing and still have a huge chunk left over in profit. (And you can still utilize outsourcing).

Being that you don't have the inventory (the vehicles), but a know-how of IM its a win-win for both of you.

That's a prime example of how the 6k that he spent with you turns into 30k for him and neither of you would have made any money without the other.

Thanks