Borrow the WSO that i've purchased

71 replies
Hi..last night someone call me with skype and he want to borrow all of the WSO that i`ve purchased, he`ll borrow it for a week and want to learn the IM niche, he will pay $97 for all the WSO, btw i purchased a lot of WSO every day and he knows that, what do you think?, is it OK/legal?
#borrow #purchased #wso
  • Profile picture of the author socialbacklinks
    Banned
    Sounds very very VERY shady. If you don't have resell rights you can't even share it!
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  • Profile picture of the author ErikNilsson
    I think it's illegal coz you are not allowed to share.If a particular WSO has give away Rights then you are allowed to share.
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    • Profile picture of the author M Thompson
      It depends on what the rights are ... but i seriously doubt that they will allow this, i know mine specifically forbid any type of sharing

      below is the list of rights I put inside my front cover.

      It would be naive to think it doesn't go on but i like to discourage it...it' takes effort and work to put a good wso together so it's nice to get some reward!

      [NO] Can be given away
      [NO] Can be use on a membership site
      [NO] Can be packaged
      [NO] Can be offered as a bonus
      [NO] Can be sold
      [NO] Can be edited completely and your name put on it
      [NO] Can be packaged into an ebook or new product
      [NO] Can sell Resale Rights
      [NO] Can sell Master Resale Rights
      [NO] Can sell Private Label Rights
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  • Profile picture of the author DianaHeuser
    There is no 'think' or 'sounds shady' about it. It is illegal!!!

    I would report him to the help desk.

    Di
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  • Profile picture of the author the_icon
    Personally i wouldnt do it because you taking away sales from the creator of the WSO, not too mention the chances are the WSO contains legal jargon that would prevent this.

    I would just say no regardless but if you want to check the WSOs you can do. Chances are some of them will have giveaway rights and some wont.
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  • Profile picture of the author bayumaulana2003
    yes...i also think the same way too..
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    • Profile picture of the author Dean Thompson
      Does this person, who wants the WSO's, work for a Nigerian bank?


      Ozzelli
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      • Profile picture of the author tunity
        Originally Posted by Ozzelli View Post

        Does this person, who wants the WSO's, work for a Nigerian bank?


        Ozzelli
        I wonder why you'd tie "specific" country into a singular act of someone requesting for free WSO.

        Just about anyone from any country who does not want to spend money or does not value intellectual profit or lack moral values make such request. its not tied to a specific country.



        And to OP, i'll say Don't give this out in anyway, irrespective of the request. Its Illegal
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  • Profile picture of the author bayumaulana2003
    a lot of WSO doesn`t have a clear right, and they should have it
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    • Profile picture of the author James Foster
      Originally Posted by bayumaulana2003 View Post

      a lot of WSO doesn`t have a clear right, and they should have it
      They dont' need to have rights listed.

      Do you carry around a sign saying "it's not OK to punch me in the face"?

      They only need to list them if you get rights BEYOND private use.
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  • Profile picture of the author Nail Yener
    In digital world, there is no act of borrowing.
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    • Profile picture of the author buckeyes09
      Originally Posted by Nail Yener View Post

      In digital world, there is no act of borrowing.
      Succinctly, my thoughts on the matter.
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  • Profile picture of the author katakogi
    if you get the mrr or plr then you can sale or share it for free other than that ...
    you cannot do that it's illegal
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  • Profile picture of the author YasirYar
    As others have mentioned, it is probably not legal unless the WSO specifically gave you the right to rent it out to others, which is rather unlikely. Moreover, it is quite immoral to do something like that and I would refrain from doing it. You could refer this friend of yours to the person you bought the WSO from so that he can get himself a copy and not get either of you into trouble.
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  • Profile picture of the author WillR
    You are looking to make money off other people's work. I wonder why this was actually a question you needed to ask? Obviously it is illegal. Where's the confusion?
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  • Profile picture of the author Steve Peters Benn
    Sadly, this is exactly the kind of thing we had to build our anti piracy system for. Remember, if they download or share the material, you just enabled that. Heck, it could be argued the sharing is an act of piracy - and the whole money changing hands doesn't help.
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    • Profile picture of the author M Thompson
      Originally Posted by Steve Peters Benn View Post

      Heck, it could be argued the sharing is an act of piracy -
      No need to argue that one - it is!!
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      • Profile picture of the author Alan Petersen
        Originally Posted by M Thompson View Post

        No need to argue that one - it is!!
        Agree. "Sharing" is the term coined to try and sugar coat piracy.

        New terms to try and put lipstick on a pig. Reminds me how you rarely find used cars for sale anymore. A lot of these "previously owned cars" are available though.
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  • Profile picture of the author Entrecon
    How do you "borrow" digital material. When you send it all to him are you going to delete all copies off your machine? When he sends them back is he going to delete all copies?
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  • Profile picture of the author Chris Q
    Banned
    Don't attempt to share it (unless the WSO has PLR or resale rights). If he "borrows" your WSOs, can he promise to delete it after? I don't think so!

    He should buy instead of borrowing.
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  • Profile picture of the author DP55
    How can you 'borrow' digital goods? He's buying them off you which is illegal, unethical and unfair.

    Do the right thing and say NO.
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  • Profile picture of the author Arief Ramadhan
    Many of WSOs are not allowing the buyer to share the product to another people. Even there are no clear rights there. The owner of the product must be not allow you to share it.

    So, it is illegal for sure. Don't get money by this way. This is absolutely wrong way to get money. Even $97 is really big deals for Indonesian like us. It is really unectichal. There are many other ways to get bucks
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  • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
    Folks, I'm going to play the other side of this (and will probably be flamed for it).

    For example, if I purchase an eBook in PDF format, print it, read it, sell it, then delete it from my harddrive, I don't think there is anything legally wrong with that. This would be covered (at least in the US) under the First-Sale Doctrine.

    TBH, I'm not even sure, legally, there is anything wrong with sharing it (ie. lending it, not making a copy) provided an illegal copy is not made.

    I'm not sure where all the previous posters are getting their info but it seems contradictory to existing US law (not sure about other countries).
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    • Profile picture of the author JennyPellicer
      Banned
      I've read the entire thread and I'd say that it's not very ethical to share a WSO with someone else, yet still a lot of users do that.
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      • Profile picture of the author Christines Dream
        You can't borrow WSOs. Why would you even contemplate loaning??
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    • Profile picture of the author WillR
      Originally Posted by wolfmmiii View Post

      This would be covered (at least in the US) under the First-Sale Doctrine.
      Just having a quick read around I came across this:

      Technically, the First Sale Doctrine only applies to the original copy. In the case of a download, the original copy is data on the hard-drive from the original download. Copying the data to a disk, attaching it to an email, and other methods of transferring the good, all require making a copy of the original data. So the First Sale Doctrine does not apply, and sellers can prohibit resale of their copyrighted products.

      Congress considered applying the First Sale Doctrine to digital goods, allowing the "forward and delete" resale method in the Balance Act of 2003. However, the bill failed to pass.
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      • Profile picture of the author Kay King
        a lot of WSO doesn`t have a clear right, and they should have it
        You may not know who has a clear right - but you know you don't have master resale rights. You can't run purchased WSO's as a "rental library".

        You know that is simply reselling WSOs. I'll guarantee a majority of those WSO's clearly state "personal use only" and prohibit transfer to others.
        Question for you is:

        This "buyer" is clearly willing to cheat - can you trust him to pay you?
        Do you need $97 bad enough to cheat others?

        I don't trust anyone who tries to justify this as "legal and ethical". It's not - and I think you realize that.

        kay
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      • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
        Originally Posted by WillR View Post

        Just having a quick read around I came across this:
        Just found this today:

        Court rules that it is legal to sell used MP3s - First Sale Doctrine Applies

        I would imagine this would apply to other digital items as well. Can't see why not.
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        • Profile picture of the author WillR
          Originally Posted by wolfmmiii View Post

          Just found this today:

          Court rules that it is legal to sell used MP3s - First Sale Doctrine Applies

          I would imagine this would apply to other digital items as well. Can't see why not.
          The reason the judge ruled it is legal in THAT case is because of the technology they are using that makes sure the original copy of the download is deleted from the sellers computer.

          Without that software then there is no way to verify the file has been deleted and they would have ruled against them. So as for all other digital products, I don't think this applies.
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          • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
            Originally Posted by WillR View Post

            The reason the judge ruled it is legal in THAT case is because of the technology they are using that makes sure the original copy of the download is deleted from the sellers computer.
            No, I have to disagree with you there:

            U.S. District Court Judge Richard Sullivan ruled that reselling MP3s was a protected right by way of the first-sale doctrine, which states that a person who buys a copyrighted work has the right to sell it.

            That makes no mention that the technology has anything to do with it. The fact of the matter is that if the seller deletes his copy, there is nothing legally wrong with selling it.

            My contention all along has been that there is nothing illegal about selling something digital provided I delete it. That said, with no way of proving the seller has not deleted the original, it can be difficult to police.
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            • Profile picture of the author Claire Koch
              i agree but what does that have to do with renting out items with personal rights

              Originally Posted by wolfmmiii View Post

              No, I have to disagree with you there:

              U.S. District Court Judge Richard Sullivan ruled that reselling MP3s was a protected right by way of the first-sale doctrine, which states that a person who buys a copyrighted work has the right to sell it.

              That makes no mention that the technology has anything to do with it. The fact of the matter is that if the seller deletes his copy, there is nothing legally wrong with selling it.

              My contention all along has been that there is nothing illegal about selling something digital provided I delete it. That said, with no way of proving the seller has not deleted the original, it can be difficult to police.
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              • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
                Originally Posted by Claire Koch View Post

                i agree but what does that have to do with renting out items with personal rights
                Nothing. The topic of the thread pertains to lending them or selling them. I don't think anyone is defending the rental of such products. I certainly am not.
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  • Profile picture of the author tryinhere
    Originally Posted by bayumaulana2003 View Post

    he will pay $97 for all the WSO
    - probably be listed up on fiver next - hang him by the balls n all things pointy
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    • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
      Originally Posted by tryinhere View Post

      - probably be listed up on fiver next - hang him by the balls n all things pointy
      Provided the current owner deletes all of the WSO's from his machine, I'm not sure there is anything wrong selling all of them for $97.

      Can anyone point to any sort of case law that shows this to be illegal?
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      • Profile picture of the author tryinhere
        Originally Posted by wolfmmiii View Post

        Provided the current owner deletes all of the WSO's from his machine, I'm not sure there is anything wrong selling all of them for $97.

        Can anyone point to any sort of case law that shows this to be illegal?
        [NO] Can be sold
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      • Profile picture of the author WillR
        Originally Posted by wolfmmiii View Post

        Provided the current owner deletes all of the WSO's from his machine, I'm not sure there is anything wrong selling all of them for $97.

        Can anyone point to any sort of case law that shows this to be illegal?
        Are you able to point us to a law that says this is legal for digital goods? The same rules don't always apply for physical and digital goods.

        I find it very odd that US law says I could download a digital file, such as a song, then sell a copy of that file to another person if I promise to delete the file from my computer. The file you sell is NOT the original file, it is a copy.

        I may be wrong but that sounds just a little silly to me.
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      • Profile picture of the author E. Brian Rose
        Originally Posted by wolfmmiii View Post


        Can anyone point to any sort of case law that shows this to be illegal?
        U.S. Copyright Office - Copyright Law: Chapter 5
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  • Profile picture of the author chrisjenva
    Think about it, if you created WSOs, would you want your customers sharing them with others? That's money out of your pocket and the affiliates promoting for you.

    Not to mention, you have no idea what this person will do with them once he gets them. Bad idea...
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  • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
    Banned
    Originally Posted by bayumaulana2003 View Post

    Hi..last night someone call me with skype and he want to borrow all of the WSO that i`ve purchased, he`ll borrow it for a week and want to learn the IM niche, he will pay $97 for all the WSO, btw i purchased a lot of WSO every day and he knows that, what do you think?, is it OK/legal?
    Are you serious? Of course it isn't legal or ethical. You do not have the rights to sell someone else's WSO. Period.
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  • Profile picture of the author Joey Tribbiani
    Don't do it as you spent much more money buying it. It's illegal if the author of ebooks states that you can't share, copy, reproduce, etc.

    If that $97 will save you from jail or similar then do it.
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  • Profile picture of the author jaiganeshv
    Thsi is not allowed per the WSO rules. You may share it with people in your business not others that too for $$ its like reselling without permission..
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  • Profile picture of the author AffScot
    I wouldn't do it if I were you. You've no doubt paid a lot more for these WSO's.

    If he is really interested in learning IM then why don't you create a product for him using the knowledge that you've gathered and sell that to him, who knows if you think it's good enough you could sell it to more than just this person.

    Either that, or recommend him the best product you've bought, for him to go and buy.
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  • Profile picture of the author bayumaulana2003
    i`m not gonna do that...i`m an honest man , i also have a WSO so i know how the seller will feel..

    but what do you think about all the blackhat forum that share all of the WSO for free...can we do something about it??
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    • Profile picture of the author AffScot
      Originally Posted by bayumaulana2003 View Post

      i`m not gonna do that...i`m an honest man , i also have a WSO so i know how the seller will feel..

      but what do you think about all the blackhat forum that share all of the WSO for free...can we do something about it??
      Report the file to whichever host it is uploaded to, and the host will have it taken down. It's a bit of a pain to have to do it, but it works.
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    • Profile picture of the author buckeyes09
      Originally Posted by bayumaulana2003 View Post

      i`m not gonna do that...i`m an honest man , i also have a WSO so i know how the seller will feel..

      but what do you think about all the blackhat forum that share all of the WSO for free...can we do something about it??
      You could make every WSO have a license (okay, that would work a week until someone develops a crack). Don't give any away for free, even as a review, unless you know the person and trust him or her.
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  • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
    a lot of WSO doesn`t have a clear right, and they should have it
    If it doesn't specifically say "You have X, Y and Z rights," you don't. Any rights other than personal use must be specified or you don't have them.

    Not only should you NOT "loan" anyone digital products like this, you will find yourself banned here for good if it's discovered you did so.

    Why? They'll end up being pirated everywhere, and it's you who made it happen.
    For example, if I purchase an eBook in PDF format, print it, read it, sell it, then delete it from my harddrive, I don't think there is anything legally wrong with that. This would be covered (at least in the US) under the First-Sale Doctrine.

    TBH, I'm not even sure, legally, there is anything wrong with sharing it (ie. lending it, not making a copy) provided an illegal copy is not made.
    All quite true. Do you really believe that's what's happening here? The person who contacted him did say "he will pay $97 for all the WSO."


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    • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
      Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

      Do you really believe that's what's happening here?


      Paul
      Paul...

      No, not at all. My point was simply that "sharing" or "re-selling" digital items is not necessarily illegal as so many seem to be saying. "Illegal" and "unethical" are two different entities. I think many on this thread are confusing the two.
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  • Profile picture of the author ryanmilligan
    Banned
    If you don't have PLR to any of these products then you are doing something very unethical. Although you're not actually going to go to prison or anything for it, it's still shady.
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  • Profile picture of the author warriorwoman2011
    Like others have already mentioned, it is highly illegal and the creator of the WSOs can possibly sue you.

    I'd suggest staying away from such people asking those things. If you know their warrior forum id, report them to any mod.
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  • Profile picture of the author Adie
    Originally Posted by bayumaulana2003 View Post

    Hi..last night someone call me with skype and he want to borrow all of the WSO that i`ve purchased, he`ll borrow it for a week and want to learn the IM niche, he will pay $97 for all the WSO, btw i purchased a lot of WSO every day and he knows that, what do you think?, is it OK/legal?
    Didn't most of WSOs have "can't be shared, can't be resold" thingee? Since he is paying, you are actually reselling and I think it's illegal..
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  • Profile picture of the author George Wright
    First off I in no way shape or form feel lending WSOs is proper and I say don't do it unless it's in the TOS that you can do it.

    I'm posting this to counter the comments that it is "never" legal to loan digital products.

    Amazon lets you choose to let others lend your books to friends and family for a period of two weeks. Also they have a library where you can "check out" a book if the author has allowed his/her book to be placed in the library.

    Who knows as digital books become more secure we might see WSOs with the right [May lend to a friend]

    Just an afterthought here, why are not WSO sellers releasing eBooks in Kindle format? Even if someone doesn't have a Kindle there are Kindle apps and readers.

    George Wright
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    • Profile picture of the author Alan Petersen
      Originally Posted by George Wright View Post

      First off I in no way shape or form feel lending WSOs is proper and I say don't do it unless it's in the TOS that you can do it.

      I'm posting this to counter the comments that it is "never" legal to loan digital products.

      Amazon lets you choose to let others lend your books to friends and family for a period of two weeks. Also they have a library where you can "check out" a book if the author has allowed his/her book to be placed in the library.

      Who knows as digital books become more secure we might see WSOs with the right [May lend to a friend]

      Just an afterthought here, why are not WSO sellers releasing eBooks in Kindle format? Even if someone doesn't have a Kindle there are Kindle apps and readers.

      George Wright
      Author/publisher can opt out of the Kindle Lending Program if they choose.

      If we might see WSO's with that right the publisher should have the choice to opt out.

      Just like a WSO publisher has the right to allow lending rights to their WSO.

      What the OP described is a whole different enchilada.
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      • Profile picture of the author George Wright
        Sorry Allan

        Not different at all. I was responding to the blanket statements that digital products can never be loaned and how it depends on the TOS.

        George Wright

        Originally Posted by Alan Petersen View Post

        Author/publisher can opt out of the Kindle Lending Program if they choose.

        If we might see WSO's with that right the publisher should have the choice to opt out.

        Just like a WSO publisher has the right to allow lending rights to their WSO.

        What the OP described is a whole different enchilada.
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  • Profile picture of the author Tim3
    Originally Posted by bayumaulana2003 View Post

    Hi..last night someone call me with skype and he want to borrow all of the WSO that i`ve purchased, he`ll borrow it for a week and want to learn the IM niche, he will pay $97 for all the WSO, btw i purchased a lot of WSO every day and he knows that, what do you think?, is it OK/legal?

    If you have any respect for your fellow Warriors, who may one day become your friends and allies - tell him to Sod Off, and that is being as polite as possible as their are ladies on this forum.
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    • Profile picture of the author trevpen
      Originally Posted by Tim3 View Post

      If you have any respect for your fellow Warriors, who may one day become your friends and allies - tell him to Sod Off, and that is being as polite as possible as their are ladies on this forum.
      Ah, Tim3, exactly my sentiments. There's no need to think about this, in my view, and it should be immediately obvious to anyone that it is wrong.
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  • Profile picture of the author Claire Koch
    i like to follow the rules as much as i can. since when can you rent out info that has no rights
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  • Profile picture of the author ryuchi
    I won't trust that person, do you really believe that he can learn internet marketing in just a matter of a week? I don't think so.

    Save yourself the worries and just ignore his request.

    Ryuchi
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  • Profile picture of the author WillR
    Right, that does it. I'm setting up a Blockbuster for WSO's. If anyone has some old WSO's they don't want anymore just let me know and I will buy them from you.
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    • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
      Originally Posted by WillR View Post

      Right, that does it. I'm setting up a Blockbuster for WSO's. If anyone has some old WSO's they don't want anymore just let me know and I will buy them from you.
      I don't think anyone condones this nor said it was legal.
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  • Profile picture of the author AlenGeorgeson
    That's certainly not allowed. You don't have the rights to the products.
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  • Profile picture of the author sunray
    I thought about it a little. Sure, it can not be borrowed, it can not be sold, because in either case, where is the guarantee that only one copy (which was purchased) remains? But then, could we call digital products goods at all? A good, like a physical book, a pencil, pair of gloves CAN BE borrowed, can be sold. A virtual product is more like a ticket to a performance or a seminar. Or a service fee.
    By the way, information is NOT copyrighted. Not a single idea (if not patented) in a WSO falls under copyright protection. Only the text (and images) itself.
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  • Profile picture of the author GarrieWilson
    The key in the OP is "give $97"... That makes it a sell or rental.

    But what's funny is not a single person has provided case law showing selling digital items when you are done with them is illegal.

    This entire:

    "My license says:

    [NO] Resell
    [YES] Personal use only"

    Doesn't really cut it either.

    1. "resell" in this meaning doesn't mean the same thing is the context of transfer ownership
    2. "personal use" doesnt mean cant transfer ownership.

    If you don't want people to transfer ownership, you need to start licensing it BUT simply saying it's a license doesnt make it so.

    None of this is legal advice.

    Garrie
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  • Profile picture of the author Ken Strong
    Originally Posted by bayumaulana2003 View Post

    Hi..last night someone call me with skype and he want to borrow all of the WSO that i`ve purchased, he`ll borrow it for a week and want to learn the IM niche, he will pay $97 for all the WSO, btw i purchased a lot of WSO every day and he knows that, what do you think?, is it OK/legal?
    About as legal as what you're offering in your sig...
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    • Profile picture of the author GarrieWilson
      Originally Posted by Ken Strong View Post

      About as legal as what you're offering in your sig...
      LOL His sig is actually an affiliate page on his domain. Using an iframe.
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  • Profile picture of the author Haroon Ballim
    Umm .. How does this guy even know what WSO 's you purchased , if many or even if any .
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  • Profile picture of the author Elluminati
    Originally Posted by bayumaulana2003 View Post

    he`ll borrow it for a week and want to learn the IM niche, he will pay $97 for all the WSO, btw i purchased a lot of WSO every day and he knows that, what do you think?, is it OK/legal?
    #1: So, he wants to borrow the WSOs for a week, and that's really enough time to learn what all he needs to know about IM? If he was too broke to purchase an WSO (many of which are very reasonably priced!) all he had to do was take notes by spending more time here...for FREE. There is a wealth of information here on this forum; a lot of freebies, such as e-books that he could take advantage of. I mean, dude, really...

    #2: He will pay $97 for all the WSOs that you've purchased because he's too cheap to support his fellow Warriors? How was the $97 determined, considering all the money you've spent on WSOs? It would not have even set well with me to consider it.

    #3: You purchased a lot of WSOs and he knows it....Well, I know that I would've told him to go and smoke something, trying to use me. That's just like I'm always paying for courtside seats at an NBA game for me and my ace, yet ace always buys the hotdogs and drinks...hugely disproportionate.

    Before you even asked for input, I think we ALL could assume that the answer is/should be NO...All technical stuf/logic/assumptions aside, don't play with anybody's money...
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