People who say you can't make it overnight?

Matt Huggins

12 years ago

Good explanation it takes money to make money, thanks for the post it is determination that brought you that far

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ryanmilligan

Banned 12 years ago

If a newbie was brave enough and was 100% sure he could stick this out. I would probably encourage them to get together all the money they can and just blow it on building a list. The moneys in the list.

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JayDoh

12 years ago

Originally Posted by ryanmilligan

If a newbie was brave enough and was 100% sure he could stick this out. I would probably encourage them to get together all the money they can and just blow it on building a list. The moneys in the list.

I have recently got an aweber account but I am not throwing all my weight behind it. I know the phrase "the money is in the list" but I also know that email open rates are plummeting. Has the best days of email marketing past?

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ryanmilligan

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by JayDoh

I have recently got an aweber account but I am not throwing all my weight behind it. I know the phrase "the money is in the list" but I also know that email open rates are plummeting. Has the best days of email marketing past?

That's pretty debatable. I still think if you actually give your list what they want then they will look foward to your emails. I have a few lists that I'm testing at the moment.

I provide them all with the same high quality info everyday but then I promote offers to them differently.

List 1- An offer every other day
List 2- An offer a week
List 3- An offer a fortnight
List 4- An offer a month

Now I will have to keep this running for atleast 2-3 months to see what the conversion rates are actually like.

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RhondaG 12 years ago

Ryan, that appears to be a great way to do some testing. Keep us posted.
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- ryanmilligan Banned 12 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by RhondaG
  
  Ryan, that appears to be a great way to do some testing. Keep us posted.
  
  Subscribe to the thread. A couple months down the line I will post results.
  
  Thanks
  
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HansM

12 years ago

Originally Posted by JayDoh

I have recently got an aweber account but I am not throwing all my weight behind it. I know the phrase "the money is in the list" but I also know that email open rates are plummeting. Has the best days of email marketing past?

A list is not a list.

If you have a list built quickly using giveaways and other free gifts, it's a different list than the list of customers who already bought something from you, and probably are happy with their buy and trust you. People on the first list may not be buyers at all, and besides that, you still have some relationship building to do, to 'make' them trust you and follow your advice, buying your products or affiliate products you promote.

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Bryan

12 years ago

Originally Posted by ryanmilligan

But people can make it 'overnight' provided the have a large investment. Think about it. If you had $5000 and you spent let's say $4000 on solo ads.

I reckon you could get about 20'000 clicks from that. From that if you have a decent report or something to give away, you could probably get a 20% conversion. So 4000 people are now on your list.

You then pay somebody who is decent at copywriting, email marketing $1000 to email your list for a month while teaching you the basics. Going by the general rule of thumb that each subscriber is worth $1, then in one month you have made $4000.

You do the same the next month, but now you have a list of 8000. Then 12, then 16, 20. Then once you have a list of twenty thousand, you are basically set for life. You could higher a top notch copy-writer to do the emails and probably have an even higher conversion rate. Maybe even $1.5 per person on your list.

Now you are set for life.

I know it isn't that easy in the real world but if you are a newbie and you have money then this is going to be a lot easier for you.

A lot of things seem cut and dry but they are not. This advice is very presumptious, and a "newbie" could lose their shirt following it!

It doesn't appear that you have done this yourself but you think "newbies" should follow it? Have you advertised much?

No one is guaranteed a positive ROI and it usually takes awhile to master an advertising source. I did risky things like this when I started out and it's not wise, and it started with presumtious thinking. You can litterally watch your money burn away, when you get started with some adv. sources. People are so eager to make money fast that they ASSUME throwing some money into advertising can help them make money faster.

In addition, it can take new marketers time in tweaking everything to acheive good optins, open rate, ctr, and conversion of products they're promoting.

Originally Posted by ryanmilligan

If a newbie was brave enough and was 100% sure he could stick this out. I would probably encourage them to get together all the money they can and just blow it on building a list. The moneys in the list.

You should test this out yourself to see if your assumptions are close, instead of encouraging new marketers to blow money on solo ads to build list.

Wanting overnight success is really a recipe for disaster, and success with internet marketing should not be treated like gambling. I know some successful affiliates that use Adv. to promote CPA offers but they're willing to dump a few hundred to a few thousand to get back some data, but they don't assume they will even break even when launching a new campaign.

New internet marketer's would be WAY better off investing their money in building small, yet content rich websites, which primary keywords have commercial intent. They could learn MUCH more in the process and they would be building assets. Even if it took time them 3-4 months to start seeing money come in, they could be well on their way making a passive income and they would get a far better ROI in INVESTING in building assets.

Getting rich quick schemes are a snare, and new marketers should focus on building a real business. List building can be done with this model as well, but I believe people should start with SEO for there is no traffic that is more targeted than search traffic and email marketing is not as easy as people say it is, and it takes a lot of work in refining it as well. This should be something to focus on after achieving some success with the above business model.

As well, if people need some money they can sell one or more of the websites they had built.

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RhondaG

12 years ago

The scary thing about that, unless you had money to burn, is that you don't know if everyone will like your product or service, and you have spent all your money in the first blast. You need to kind of launch to a small group to get feedback first in my opinion so you can tweak if needed. But, I will agree that you could certainly make money faster if you had money. Most people that have that kind of money already know how to get it, and probably would not be changing the goose that laid the golden egg, if you know what I mean, lol

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Roan

12 years ago

I definitely found out that money will make more money and you do need money to build an online business. If you dont have any it will be a slow start. thats why most of the people give up. They dont see any results soon enough and keep spending..

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buckeyes09

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Roan

I definitely found out that money will make more money and you do need money to build an online business. If you dont have any it will be a slow start. thats why most of the people give up. They dont see any results soon enough and keep spending..

Starting with no money is definitely doable, but it may require a lot of time to see the fruits of one's labor. It's definitely easier if you have money to invest.

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fin

12 years ago

If we all gave recommendations based on guesses it wouldn't make for a good forum.

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mlord10

12 years ago

This is one of those things that in theory sounds great...making it overnight or in a relatively short period of time. Can it be done? Sure. However, I would caution anyone who is thinking that making it overnight is the norm in this industry.

There is a 90% chance you will fail in some way, shape, or form the first time you try to make money on the Internet.

Having something that works in theory vs. something that works in the real world is very different.

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World Marketing

12 years ago

Interesting post...I am always investing more money into my business to make more money in the long run

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Flores

12 years ago

I always thought that you could do it for free (when I got started, anyway). Now, I am starting to realize more and more that this industry needs to be treated just like a business, and businesses have some overhead. Granted, not as much as an offline business, but still some expenses.

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dvduval

12 years ago

There can be such a thing as being in the right place at the right time, or being highly motivated and having an excellent plan, but you really do need to learn through experience, and you need to build contacts, and both of those take time.

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Jere Kuisma

12 years ago

I agree with the above poster. You just need the experience of doing things on your own.

Also I think that solo ad subscriptions have very low conversions, since they probably are on a dozen of lists. So I wouldn't consider solo ads to be the best investment.
I'd rather pay someone to design a high converting funnel on my specific niche and put the rest on proven paid traffic systems.

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HeySal

12 years ago

Make it online, and "make some money" are two different animals. Sure, advertising money will make or break a business - but exactly what are they spending money on? What product - time to create or find affiliate products. What text? Takes time to write the salescopy. What about writing the email progression? The squeeze page? Setting up a blog or website? What is the follow-up plan in case your first products or site completely bomb out? After all, there are no guarantees on any product - even the very successful have some total flops that were a surprise to them. What if a good portion of your advertising funds bomb out unexpectedly so you are reduced to limited advertising? What if your product turns out to be crap and you are "refunded" right out of the market or just get no bites?

The people who make money "over night" are few and far in between - and I would almost guarantee they didn't just wake up one morning and say "I think I'll go build a web business today" and suddenly get rich. Planning takes some time, and those that already have experience in marketing and other areas of business aren't going to jump in over night - those without that background, might jump, but they better be able to walk on water when they do.

So you luck out and grab an affiliate product that sells some - what do you do next to keep flow in instead of just a flash in the pan? Long term plan overnight?

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AdenWhite

12 years ago

Trouble is there are so many who would never have that kind of money to spend, or would be scared too even if they had it.

Here's another idea. What if you just sent the solo ad clicks straight to a sales page?

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PeterBruce

12 years ago

Yes. Money = More money. If invested correctly.

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mightiest

12 years ago

If marketing were that easy, everyone would be millionaires.

Marketing is all about putting a compelling message in front of the right audience at the right time.

Not all traffic is the same.
An ad isn't just an ad.

The little variables (background color, ad image, ad copy) can have a tremendous impact on your sales. So much so that changes in those things can make an unprofitable campaign profitable. Taking a bunch of money and blindly flinging it at one offer isn't smart because an inexperienced person probably is going to wind up making a lot of mistakes. That's why you do much smaller buys with smaller offers, find out what works, and then scale the crap out of it.

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MarkUSA

12 years ago

Ryan,
I think the real value is in the knowledge, I mean knowing exactly what to do. I personally have $5000 to invest in IM... problem is... I don't really know what to do.

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Bruce NewMedia

12 years ago

Originally Posted by ryanmilligan

I beg to differ,

I haven't done so myself. It took me about 2 years until I was making a decent income.

By overnight i don't really mean overnight, I mean in a month or so. Generally this is what we mean by the term.

But people can make it 'overnight' provided the have a large investment. Think about it. If you had $5000 and you spent let's say $4000 on solo ads.

I reckon you could get about 20'000 clicks from that. From that if you have a decent report or something to give away, you could probably get a 20% conversion. So 4000 people are now on your list.

You then pay somebody who is decent at copywriting, email marketing $1000 to email your list for a month while teaching you the basics. Going by the general rule of thumb that each subscriber is worth $1, then in one month you have made $4000.

You do the same the next month, but now you have a list of 8000. Then 12, then 16, 20. Then once you have a list of twenty thousand, you are basically set for life. You could higher a top notch copy-writer to do the emails and probably have an even higher conversion rate. Maybe even $1.5 per person on your list.

Now you are set for life.

I know it isn't that easy in the real world but if you are a newbie and you have money then this is going to be a lot easier for you.

Most of this is highly unlikely to happen. A few parts might happen, but with much smaller results...for example, a list of people who got a 'free' report will not be as productive as your post suggests.

The people I know who have cultivated lots of 'free report' subscribers usually don't get much revenue from those lists. The "$1" per month often quoted earnings expectation can be wildly overstated for many niches.

A brand new marketer, with no real experience, and carrying around $5000, will probably blow it all, long before he/she sees much of a payday.

I'm actually glad I didn't have lots of money to throw at internet marketing in the beginning, as I would have wasted most of it.
_____
Bruce

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buckeyes09 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Bruce NewMedia

I'm actually glad I didn't have lots of money to throw at internet marketing in the beginning, as I would have wasted most of it.

Ain't that the truth. But then again, how do you know what works if you don't try?
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MarkUSA

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Bruce NewMedia

A brand new marketer, with no real experience, and carrying around $5000, will probably blow it all, long before he/she sees much of a payday.

I'm actually glad I didn't have lots of money to throw at internet marketing in the beginning, as I would have wasted most of it.
_____
Bruce

Bruce,
Don't mean to hijack the thread, but can you tell us what *not* to do? Reason I ask: I am a new marketer getting ready to dump that amount into IM =)

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JForsberg 12 years ago

Originally Posted by MarkUSA

Bruce,
Don't mean to hijack the thread, but can you tell us what *not* to do? Reason I ask: I am a new marketer getting ready to dump that amount into IM =)

Don't buy ads in a traffic exchange side. Can tell you that much . People don't really care much there, all they want, is hits for them self.

I'm new myself, but this is a fair guess - Facebook ads might work for you. Granted you can pin point your market, and got a real catchy picture plus text. Ain't that horrible expensive - as long you target the right people.
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Bruce NewMedia 12 years ago

Originally Posted by MarkUSA

Bruce,
Don't mean to hijack the thread, but can you tell us what *not* to do? Reason I ask: I am a new marketer getting ready to dump that amount into IM =)

Ok, don't buy any expensive courses. (say, more than $50) EARN your money back from things before you invest in more new things....

Don't buy any paid ads until you understand copy and what is working.
(you'll still be wrong a lot, but less wrong than most.)

Test very small amounts when you do buy ads....expect most things NOT to work.

What you do spend should be to experiment and learn...not just learn by reading/watching videos, but LEARN BY DOING (small steps)..

Expect to fail at most things, initially. Expect to not ever get good at mny things and expect to pay others to do those things as soon as you are able.

Have very realistic small goals. Forget about getting rich or even some arbitary dollar amount (ie: "I'll be happy with $100 a day", kind of talk.)

For most that's not realistic. Most should set sights in the beginning on something closer to TEN DOLLARS a DAY. Maybe even less.

Determine what aptitude you have for this, what comes easier to you than something else. Then as you make a little bit try to buy the services of what you don;t do well at all, and do for yourself what you have some aptitude for.

The above is why you'll not see much profit for awhile. You'll be re-investing to grow your little business and not taking anything out.

Also, consider Offline business as well as Online. Some are better suited to one over the other.

Set no timetable. Decide to keep doing this until you succeed or die trying.
If you never quit, eventually you will succeed, in some manner at some level.

Besides, what better business is there than this?
Hope that helps,
Bruce
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olavlind

12 years ago

An ad works just as well if you send it to 1,000 subscribers or 1,000,000 subscribers. So I would start small, Advertise 2 ads - Split test - Trash the bad one - Repeat using $20 solo ads or so. You could do this 10-20 times to maximize your return before spending higher amounts.

~Olav

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DreamWarrior

12 years ago

It does help to have some money in order to make you more money.

But as other Warriors have stated, it is possible to start from scratch with minimal money. You just have to have half a brain, be able to put 1 and 1 together, be willing to give things a go, and be persistant.

Some things don't happen over night, but it will happen.

On the other hand, if you are in the right place and the right time, then who says you can't be an overnight success?!

Plus, it pays to know people who can help you along.

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Austin357

12 years ago

Find something you like and master that technique. The problem I had early on was trying to bounce around with too many methods. Stick to one thing and get great at it. Make money with it then move to something else.

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George Wright

12 years ago

Hi Ryan,

I do agree with all you said about building a list, marketing to the list, it can be done "overnight," etc.

The one thing I do not agree with is that it takes money to make money. Played right it simply does not. Anyone can start with $0, build a list market to to your list members and start making money. Having up front money can even get in the way because it takes time to spend the money all the while you could be making $$$ not spending them.

IMHO

George Wright

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Will Edwards

12 years ago

Originally Posted by ryanmilligan

Going by the general rule of thumb that each subscriber is worth $1, then in one month you have made $4000.

^^^ There is the flaw in your logic!

There was a guy who posted here recently saying he had a list of $200K and could not figure out how to monetise it.

Your list could be worth a lot more than $1/visitor per month if you know what you are doing. But it could be worth a lot less too.

I wish you success, but you are making a big assumption.

Will

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revstan

12 years ago

Wait, you paid 4k on the ads that will get you a 4k-emaillist wich will make you 4k and you call it profit?

I call it break-even. Wait, loss, you make -1000 $ in the first month.

Simple Stan

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wolfmmiii

12 years ago

Originally Posted by ryanmilligan

If you had $5000 and you spent let's say $4000 on solo ads.

I reckon you could get about 20'000 clicks from that. From that if you have a decent report or something to give away, you could probably get a 20% conversion. So 4000 people are now on your list.

These are just a few "assumptions" you are making. Where are you getting these numbers from? Just pulling them out of the air?

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webmaster1742 12 years ago

this is awesome post, Ryan, that appears to be a great way to do some kind of test. Please keep us informed
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ryanmilligan Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by wolfmmiii

These are just a few "assumptions" you are making. Where are you getting these numbers from? Just pulling them out of the air?

From averages I have got from my own testing. Yours could be very different.
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bonz04

Banned 12 years ago

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MarkUSA 12 years ago

Originally Posted by bonz04

It helps us in sticking in one method or technique to do in our works.

bonz, you are not going to survive here very long with making random comments, plus the porn site in your signature doesn't exactly help your case either
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User-Name

12 years ago

Interesting post
Shows how easy it would be to sell this as a course/wso
Add some hype

The main point is it took you 2 years before you found something that you are just now tweaking.

I provide SEO services and one of my clients had nothing at the start now he has massive exposure at the top of google.
He invested heavily in this and I was honest with him at the start this will take some time perhaps a year.
A year is up and now he is laughing.
How many wemasters would commit to 1 year time frame
1 year cost?
Give me something right here right now so I can be wealthy tomorrow is why 90% fail.
It is not that pretty when you say it will require 1 year with commitment and dedication. Maybe we can eliminate some risks where we can run it where we have failsafe methods in place.
Maybe we can generate income after 6 months and break even after a year.
If a client wanted to pay me for seo services where they would be top of google in 1 month I would walk away.
Forget about loopholes and quick fixes give google what it wants quality unique content that converts.
I wish You Success
Andrew

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ryanmilligan

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by User-Name

Interesting post
Shows how easy it would be to sell this as a course/wso
Add some hype

The main point is it took you 2 years before you found something that you are just now tweaking.

I provide SEO services and one of my clients had nothing at the start now he has massive exposure at the top of google.
He invested heavily in this and I was honest with him at the start this will take some time perhaps a year.
A year is up and now he is laughing.
How many wemasters would commit to 1 year time frame
1 year cost?
Give me something right here right now so I can be wealthy tomorrow is why 90% fail.
It is not that pretty when you say it will require 1 year with commitment and dedication. Maybe we can eliminate some risks where we can run it where we have failsafe methods in place.
Maybe we can generate income after 6 months and break even after a year.
If a client wanted to pay me for seo services where they would be top of google in 1 month I would walk away.
Forget about loopholes and quick fixes give google what it wants quality unique content that converts.
I wish You Success
Andrew

Yeah, well done to both you and him.

Basically the whole point of this thread was to show IF you have money IM can be a whole lot easier and quicker. But most people don't have money to start with. Hell, I never had money to start with. I was only a kid.

However the thread, I think it has p***** a couple people off due to 'assumptions' but they are in actual fact not assumptioms, but a glance at my own findings/averages.

Peoples will defiantly vary and apologies to all who don't appreciate this thread. Just sharing what i thought may be useful to a couple others.

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wolfmmiii

12 years ago

Originally Posted by ryanmilligan

However the thread, I think it has p***** a couple people off due to 'assumptions' but they are in actual fact not assumptioms, but a glance at my own findings/averages.

Who said anyone is pissed off? They are, indeed, assumptions though. They are assumptions because you have not experienced these numbers first-hand. You are taking smaller averages (your own words) and extrapolating them into much larger sample sets. That is an assumption.

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