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Question on single opt in

by ttdub
20 replies
I have really been in a debate about single or double opt in, and I read tons of threads on it here, but I thought of something that doesn't seem to be discussed. With single opt in, if someone puts another person's email in the form, and you send them email, couldn't they report you using the CAN SPAM act? It would be sending unsolicited email, even if you didn't know it. That would mean you could have to pay thousands of dollars per email.
#opt #question #single
  • Profile picture of the author retsced
    ...and the sky could fall tomorrow. Do what works for you. If that's the reason for not using single opt-in, i'm sorry, but it's not a good enough reason IMO. You can let people know that their freebie will be sent to their best email address.
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      Exactly the same could be said of the confirmation email itself, if you use confirmed opt-in.
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      • Profile picture of the author ttdub
        Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

        Exactly the same could be said of the confirmation email itself, if you use confirmed opt-in.
        But if you use confirmed opt in, they can't put a wrong email and it get confirmed. I don't understand how this is similar because they won't get the follow up emails.
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        • Profile picture of the author myob
          This is not a problem with commercial providers that offer the single opt-in feature. In cases of dispute as a violation of the CAN SPAM act, the recorded subscriber IP is always considered. Using best email practices, including a conspicuous unsubscribe link within every message, there is seldom a valid reason for confirmed opt-in unless it is required by the provider.
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          • Profile picture of the author ttdub
            Originally Posted by myob View Post

            This is not a problem with commercial providers that offer the single opt-in feature. In cases of dispute as a violation of the CAN SPAM act, the recorded subscriber IP is always considered. Using best email practices, including a conspicuous unsubscribe link within every message, there is seldom a valid reason for confirmed opt-in unless it is required by the provider.
            That makes sense. So you're saying if the IP of the person who actually typed in the email is different from the IP of the email owner, it will probably prove that it's fraudulent, so they will know. That's cool. Thanks!
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        • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
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          Originally Posted by ttdub View Post

          I don't understand how this is similar because they won't get the follow up emails.
          Indeed - that was why I said only that the point you made above (about sending someone an email without their permission) could equally be said to apply to the confirmation email itself, if you use confirmed opt-in.
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          • Profile picture of the author ttdub
            Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

            Indeed - that was why I said only that the point you made above (about sending someone an email without their permission) could equally be said to apply to the confirmation email itself, if you use confirmed opt-in.
            I get what you're saying, but I'm pretty sure a confirmation email wouldn't be looked at as bad. Just my opinion though. That would be really horrible for someone to get in trouble over that though... lol
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  • Profile picture of the author intergen
    I had to research this with a company I was working for in the past - an excerpt from the research:

    Whatever side you fall on, one thing is clear: Single opt-in is by far the accepted standard by most e-mailers today. Both at the Direct Marketing Association's Email Experience Council conference, (where the vast majority of the audience agreed that single opt-in was the "best practice" during our keynote debate on the topic), and the real world data that my company collects each day, single opt-in is the most practiced method of list management.

    Enjoy!
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  • Profile picture of the author scottsihm
    If you get 100 opt-in, probably 50 will vanish through double opt-in
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  • Profile picture of the author dkla27
    I wonder how inflated your list gets by using single opt-in.

    I have double opt-in and there's a number of signups that never confirm and consequently never receive their freebie...
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
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      Originally Posted by dkla27 View Post

      I wonder how inflated your list gets by using single opt-in.
      Well, if you mean "how inflated compared with using confirmed opt-in under exactly the same circumstances", it depends (mostly) on how good you are at encouraging/explaining, I think? There are various things you can do to try to get the successful confirmation response up to about 85% - 90%, though I think it's probably fair to surmise that most people are considerably less successful than this?

      One can always split-test, given reasonably constant and consistent traffic sources?
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      • Profile picture of the author dkla27
        Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

        There are various things you can do to try to get the successful confirmation response up to about 85% - 90%, though I think it's probably fair to surmise that most people are considerably less successful than this?
        Exactly, that 10%-15% is what I'm talking about only it's much more in my case, to the point that I get paranoid thinking that Aweber doesn't deliver all the confirmation e-mails...
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        • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
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          Originally Posted by dkla27 View Post

          it's much more in my case
          Do you tell and show people really clearly, in great detail, how they have to confirm, tell them to add your "from" addresses to the safe-list in their email client, and so on and so forth?
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          • Profile picture of the author dkla27
            Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

            Do you tell and show people really clearly, in great detail, how they have to confirm, tell them to add your "from" addresses to the safe-list in their email client, and so on and so forth?
            I do tell them they have to confirm in a couple of places but I don't mention the "check your junk folder" story. I really don't get it. They give me their e-mail because they want the freebie. Why give up before they get it? The most logical explanation is that they give me a bogus e-mail hoping they 'll find the freebie on the thank you page.
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            • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
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              Originally Posted by dkla27 View Post

              The most logical explanation is that they give me a bogus e-mail hoping they 'll find the freebie on the thank you page.
              Hadn't occurred to me. I do see that that's possible. But these things do often land up in my own junk folder, I must say - I look out for them, but unlike nearly all my subscribers, I'm a marketer and familiar with this stuff.

              I mostly use single opt-in, now, and ask for email addresses only (no names) and this works well for me.
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            • Profile picture of the author RogueOne
              Originally Posted by dkla27 View Post

              I don't mention the "check your junk folder" story.
              BIG MISTAKE!

              I've opted in to my own lists and had the confirmation go to spam. I have the filters jacked up and a lot of other people do as well.

              It may also be a good idea to tell them to add your email to their contacts.
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        • Profile picture of the author RogueOne
          Originally Posted by dkla27 View Post

          Exactly, that 10%-15% is what I'm talking about only it's much more in my case, to the point that I get paranoid thinking that Aweber doesn't deliver all the confirmation e-mails...
          A lot of people opt-in on impulse and when your confirmation email arrives they simply ignore it. I do it all the time while conducting research.
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  • Profile picture of the author RodneyIvanJohnson
    Should it come to a vote , I'd vote for single opt-in. Especially as people nowadays are conscious of time. Single optin is much quiker and for me it's a pain to log in to my email afterwards then sometimes having to wait ....sometimes waiting a minute is too long.
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  • Profile picture of the author AndrewStark
    How long is a piece of string?

    Alexa and others are right, if someone does enter a false email you will get IP address details, but you still have to deal with the pain of someone complaining about this that you wouldn't get if you used double opt-in.

    For me I use aweber and the video that explains what is required to confirm the email. My confirm rates are pretty good, and to me if someone can't confirm their e-mail then the chances of them actually reading my e-mails in the future are pretty slim.

    I would rather have 10 confirmed double opt-in leads who want my lead magnet than 50 single opt-in leads who may have just used a throw away e-mail they never check.

    Ultimately it's down to you about what you use, and what works best for your niche. If you do prefer single opt-in then I would stick with getresponse as they're happier to let you use this method of single opt-in than aweber.
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