WF Link Packages, OR... Hire a VA?

by thedog
13 replies
Hi guys, I'm living in a small, but busy, tourist town in China.

The word is out that I can make sites, and pretty much handle any media related job.

I do most of the work myself, and outsource some, logo's, writing, translation etc...

I'm being asked to do SEO work... something I personally don't want to do.

So, 2 options.

1. Outsource on here, link packages

or

2. Hire a VA to do SEO.

I Understand that a VA would probalby work out cheaper, and I'd have more control... but, it's the drag of having to train them... I've used them in the past... have never been that impressed... I take it it's difficult to find a good one.

Should I just re-sell warrior services?

Or would I be better off with a good VA?

Cheers

thedog
#hire #link #packages
  • Profile picture of the author masterjani
    If it is for your clients then always choose warrior services, if it is for you then choose VA, as you can handle them even if there is any mistakes happened.
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  • Profile picture of the author Andyhenry
    I would say hire your own person/people.

    There are a lot of gigs offered by people who don't know what the hell they're doing and will ultimately damage your clients sites (I know this from experience of testing a lot of them).

    If you're going to make your business have a critical aspect reliant on other people do not just pick random people from the forum that you don't know or have any experience with.

    Find people who know what they're doing - if you're not sure, find out exactly what they're going to do and then get a reliable second opinion about whether it's something you want done.

    Many people sell automated stuff like bookmarking, blog commenting, profile links etc.. that if that's all that you clients get done - Google will slap their site and it's you they'll want to fix it, so make sure you know what's being done, that it's safe, effective and that you'll know how to undo it if Google decides they don't like it anymore.

    There are a lot of people who talk a good game but don't actually understand that what they're offering can hurt peoples businesses.

    Andy
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    nothing to see here.

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    • Profile picture of the author thedog
      Originally Posted by Andyhenry View Post

      I would say hire your own person/people.

      There are a lot of gigs offered by people who don't know what the hell they're doing and will ultimately damage your clients sites (I know this from experience of testing a lot of them).

      If you're going to make your business have a critical aspect reliant on other people do not just pick random people from the forum that you don't know or have any experience with.

      Find people who know what they're doing - if you're not sure, find out exactly what they're going to do and then get a reliable second opinion about whether it's something you want done.

      Many people sell automated stuff like bookmarking, blog commenting, profile links etc.. that if that's all that you clients get done - Google will slap their site and it's you they'll want to fix it, so make sure you know what's being done, that it's safe, effective and that you'll know how to undo it if Google decides they don't like it anymore.

      There are a lot of people who talk a good game but don't actually understand that what they're offering can hurt peoples businesses.

      Andy
      Thanks for the advice Andy.

      I've looked around, and there's services offered with really good feedback, and lots of it... this has to mean that their service is pretty good, no?

      I understand what you're saying... but, to be honest, there's been so many changes on google, and my seo knowledge is pretty limited, that, to learn all the in's and outs, and then, teach a va, would take up so much time.

      Of course I don't want to harm anyone's business... I'm sure there's unreliable services on here that would do that... but, a service with hundreds of positive reviews can't be all that bad?
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      • Profile picture of the author Andyhenry
        Originally Posted by thedog View Post

        Of course I don't want to harm anyone's business... I'm sure there's unreliable services on here that would do that... but, a service with hundreds of positive reviews can't be all that bad?
        That's what you'd think isn't it.

        I don't want to get all down on WSOs, but just because there are good reviews doesn't mean the service is good for you.

        Many people sell these types of services by hyping up the value of certain SEO practices which in reality are at best useless and at worst harmful to your business. They tell you that "this is what Google wants" or "these are Panda friendly links" and then when you buy they tell you "don't register your site in Google Webmaster tools" because they know that if Google actually look at the links they're providing then you'll get hammered for them.

        Also you might not notice that the reviews are all from before recent Google changes, so there's an assumption that the service is still working but it may not be. You can't tell just by looking at a sales thread.

        The best thing you can do is focus on getting good on-page seo for your clients sites and then using targeted outsourcing for specific activities to people who know what they're doing, for example - you could for $5 get a press release nicely distributed by someone who is in the PR business and using Fiverr to supplement their income. The same for videos etc..

        If you start using services that are nothing more than largely automated link pyramids - it'll come back to bite you.

        So, make sure you at least find someone who does know what they're doing and get them to 'vet' any potential outsourcing you do until you can tell for yourself what's being done.

        Many of the services with lots of good reviews are because the reviews just say "this service is great" but they don't even realise it made no difference to their results or that they may have been penalised because of it - they just see the report they got which shows lots of links and they can see they're live and they think that's it - that's "got" to help.

        Also many offers don't make any results promises so the reviews are just about that they delivered what they said - nothing to do with whether it made them money, or whether later on they got slammed by Google. They people offering services will selectively choose which reviews to show you and report anyone who calls them on the downsides of their service as "ruining my business by making negative posts in my thread", so you often won't see the downsides even when they're there.

        So I repeat - don't just take a fancy sales letter and a bunch of reviews and buy from strangers until you understand what they're actually selling - if they won't tell you and it's not in their sales letter - don't buy it.
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        nothing to see here.

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        • Profile picture of the author Johnno
          Originally Posted by Andyhenry View Post

          That's what you'd think isn't it.
          So I repeat - don't just take a fancy sales letter and a bunch of reviews and buy from strangers until you understand what they're actually selling - if they won't tell you and it's not in their sales letter - don't buy it.
          Even then there is no guarantee.

          I stumped up $199 for a link building WSO with heaps of good reviews. My site along with many others got obliterated - see WSO 565703 and go to the last couple of pages.

          The only guarantee is that there is no guarantee.
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          Wanna see something you've NEVER seen before?

          How about real UNBIASED WSO reviews with NO AFFILIATE LINKS !!!
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          • Profile picture of the author thedog
            I think my best bet is a good VA... pm sent johnpaulgrant, cheers!

            How much would I expect to pay for a decent va from the philipeans?

            I used a very cheap va service on here, my va was nice, but not very good... and there seemed to be a lot of times when her electricity went out...

            Right now, I'm a big fish in a small pond... there's so much work here right now, but I'm really stretched...

            If I could find an experienced SEO va, who can work on their own initiatiave, that would be awesome... and if they could spell properly, unlike me, that would be good too!
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            • Profile picture of the author MatthewWoodward
              Originally Posted by thedog View Post

              I think my best bet is a good VA... pm sent johnpaulgrant, cheers!

              How much would I expect to pay for a decent va from the philipeans?

              I used a very cheap va service on here, my va was nice, but not very good... and there seemed to be a lot of times when her electricity went out...

              Right now, I'm a big fish in a small pond... there's so much work here right now, but I'm really stretched...

              If I could find an experienced SEO va, who can work on their own initiatiave, that would be awesome... and if they could spell properly, unlike me, that would be good too!
              I have hired a number of VA's in my time and I have found getting one through the agencys/services that offer VA's usually results in getting assigned a right divvy.

              I have had much better experience using onlinejobs.ph and going through workers profiles and creating a shortlist.

              Then depending on what I'm hiring them for (in this example I'm going to use content spinner/article writer) I contact each of them and offer them a paid test.

              In this case of hiring a spinner I send them an article along with my instructions/guidelines on how to spin it and once they complete that task I send over the payment for their time (usually like 300-400PHP).

              This allows me to very quickly weed out the poor workers and end up with the cream of the crop. Yes it costs a bit more doing paid tests for ~10 people but I consider it an essential investment in the future of my business.

              In terms of what you should be paying, on OnlineJobs.ph they specify what they want to work for. I tend to offer them what they were asking +10% with another 10% increase after 3 months if they produce the goods.

              Typically I pay between 13,000PHP - 18,000 PHP depending on the person which is like $300-$400 a month I think (I'm from UK so just guessing).
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              • Profile picture of the author thedog
                Originally Posted by MatthewWoodward View Post

                I have hired a number of VA's in my time and I have found getting one through the agencys/services that offer VA's usually results in getting assigned a right divvy.

                I have had much better experience using onlinejobs.ph and going through workers profiles and creating a shortlist.

                Then depending on what I'm hiring them for (in this example I'm going to use content spinner/article writer) I contact each of them and offer them a paid test.

                In this case of hiring a spinner I send them an article along with my instructions/guidelines on how to spin it and once they complete that task I send over the payment for their time (usually like 300-400PHP).

                This allows me to very quickly weed out the poor workers and end up with the cream of the crop. Yes it costs a bit more doing paid tests for ~10 people but I consider it an essential investment in the future of my business.

                In terms of what you should be paying, on OnlineJobs.ph they specify what they want to work for. I tend to offer them what they were asking +10% with another 10% increase after 3 months if they produce the goods.

                Typically I pay between 13,000PHP - 18,000 PHP depending on the person which is like $300-$400 a month I think (I'm from UK so just guessing).
                Excellent advice, just what I needed.

                That site looks pretty good too.

                Agree, that offering a bonus will get better results.
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      • Profile picture of the author MatthewWoodward
        Originally Posted by thedog View Post

        Of course I don't want to harm anyone's business...
        If you outsource your SEO and it goes horribly wrong you will not only hurt the clients business but your own as well, word will soon spread if you make a pigs ear of it.

        In your position I would find a local business that offers SEO services and then resell their packages with a 10% kicker or something like that. Ensure they have a good reputation and can provide you with real live examples of sites they are currently ranking.

        It will be much better to deal with a local business in the long run
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  • Profile picture of the author stodog77
    Hire and train a VA. This way you know what you are getting. Google looks for patterns, and when you have the same types of link building, it is easy to spot over time. Google is no dummy. They are getting really good at spotting unnatural link building.

    I'm going to write a tutorial on this later this week on how I rank post Penguin, but if you want to hit me up on Skype I will explain the exact methods.
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    Local SEO Reseller Packages Starting at $299 per month - Guaranteed Results!
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    • Profile picture of the author thedog
      Cheers guys, great advice.

      I'm not really in a postion to hire local seo services, I'm in China

      I've hired va's in the past, but the thing is, I don't really know the best things I need them to be working on.

      I've sent you a pm stodog77, would be great to have a chat over skype.

      Cheers.
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  • Profile picture of the author johnpaulgrant
    Hey I would suggest you hire a reliable VA from the Philippines. A lot of them are really good in SEO, well-trained that is. I've worked with quite a lot of VAs here for my projects and they got better services than other Asian countries, very skilled and no weird accents. So send me pm if you're interested and I could recommend the right person for you.
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    I am an expert in outsourcing to The Philippines and have been working with Filipino virtual assistants for more than 5 years. I am the co-founder of RemoteWorkMate (VA management service) and RemoteStaffRecruit (VA recruitment service) Check out my blog >>>LifeStyleBusinessDesign<<<!

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  • Profile picture of the author JustinKendall
    I think you should hire a VA and manage your link building tasks yourself. It would give you more exposure to your work and will give you results that you desire.
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