Writing

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Yellowcake

Hi everyone

I'm a magazine editor in my day job and want to start an online business that involves selling my writing services. I read a lot about places like Odesk and elance but are these worth bothering with?

I'm really not interested in writing for less than about $50 an article so that maybe will give you some idea of what I'm aiming at. I'm a native English speaker (quite literally - I'm English) and want to pitch kind of mid range price wise and build from there.

I guess a website is a prerequisite I guess as a 'base' but then what?

Thanks for any advice you can give me!

YC

I'm going to save you a lot of headache from someone who's done writing for places like Odesk/Digital Point and from someone who's hired services from these places. Stay away, far away.

I know there are a good few people on there but they're very few and far in-between.

Your best bet for $50 an article will be to contact corporate companies or clients who actually have the cash to require such services. I know a lot of people who browse the forums certainly can't fork over $50 per article. It might be in your interest to start up a thread in the "Hire Me" section but it costs $20 I believe?

Basically, you'll need a website, a portfolio and then you'll have to contact companies and offer your services as a content writer or SEO content writer. Everyone's always looking for a way to rank higher.

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Yellowcake

12 years ago

Thanks. Would you mind telling me fundamentally what's wrong with these places? Is it just that they pay peanuts and it's simply not worth your time?

I am a decent writer and can knock decent articles together pretty quickly ... but I just don't want to get sucked into this $5 an article mullarkey!

Cheers

YC

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Corey Geer

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Yellowcake

Thanks. Would you mind telling me fundamentally what's wrong with these places? Is it just that they pay peanuts and it's simply not worth your time?

I am a decent writer and can knock decent articles together pretty quickly ... but I just don't want to get sucked into this $5 an article mullarkey!

Cheers

YC

EDIT: AGAIN, this is just my experience. Please to anyone reading, don't take this as me saying "everyone" is like this. This is just my personal experience when writing and hiring the $1.00 per 100 words people. Which seems to be the majority on places like ODesk

Well, I know some people will disagree here and tell me they've found good people there. I'm not saying quality clients and writers don't exist in these places. Hell, I spent a lot of time on Digital Point and Odesk before I started only writing for Warrior Forum people and looking to move onto my own website and business clients.

Here's a basic rundown of what it's like to be a client who hires $1 per 100 words writers:

1) You hire said writer.
2) They accept your task, you're excited about their fast turn around rate and quality.
3) You don't hear from them for days or a week (or longer).
4) You finally receive your work, and it's the most jumbled garbage you've ever read.

They had good English though during the interview, what happened? Well, these people have "agents" that do interviews for them, or they have proper English templates they copy and paste to every single employer.

"Dear Hiring Manager,"

Anyways, here's how it is to write on Odesk for those cheap clients.

1) They assign you work, usually the requirements are ridiculous for the price tag.
2) You send in the work, they're not happy with the "quality" they expected and they try to lowball the price on you.
3) Or, they offer a "joint venture" opportunity because they don't have the money to pay you for services. They ask you to write for free and they'll send you some ad revenue money they earn because they can't pay you up front.

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Yellowcake 12 years ago

Are there any of these type of sites worth checking out? From what you've said they all seem a bit dire!

YC
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Corey Geer

12 years ago

Elance does have some higher paying clients on there, I haven't fully investigated that one yet. I've been trying to find some solid and steady clients right here on the WF.

There might be some people who require $50 per article services which is why I would suggest opening up a "Hire Me" thread which costs $20. I might be doing the same soon. I keep finding people who buy a couple of articles to start up a website then end up abandoning the website. Also, I'm finding a lot of people who take forever to respond to e-mails, inquiries. I'm talking a week+.

Stay away from Odesk and Digital Point though.

One thing on Elance though, you'll have to compete with a lot of people who are willing to write for pennies per word, like $1.00 per 100 words writers. You have to find a corporate company or someone that needs copywriting work in my opinion. I've never sought after people who would be willing to pay that much so I can't really give the best advice there.

The only thing I can truly recommend that works is contacting companies. You can look them up in cities via Google Maps, etc.

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Jarvis Edwards 12 years ago

Yellowcake,

I'd have to agree with the other posters; odesk, elance and such sites are a waste of time unless you are willing to be engulfed in price wars with people willing to accept much less than is sensible.

I also second contacting companies directly as you really aren't going to get more than $20-$25 per article with content mills. You may want to try out "Constant Content" if you haven't yet; you can price your articles at the price you want (that is reasonable) and you can get some good exposure and momentum going. Of course you'd have to write, price your articles, then wait for them to sell.

You can possibly accomplish a lot with a "cold-calling" plan to get some initial clients. Either canvassing companies in your local area or putting together a list of companies in the niche you are interested in writing for, then calling them up and offering your services.

You could even offer a "first time" discount to try your services. For example, invoice $50 with a credit showing of $10 or whatever you choose, then your final total is the amount due--first time only--no exceptions (many companies pay after invoicing). That way you can entice people into trying your services at a lower rate, without undermining and undervaluing your price structure.
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cashp0wer 12 years ago

I wouldn't even bother with oDesk either. You should do exactly what you've already been told. I can't think of any sites that are going to pay you that price range. Contacting companies directly is your best bet once you get your website and portfolio done.
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- Yellowcake 12 years ago
  
  Thanks for your responses guys
  
  Thanks
  
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Alexa Smith

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Yellowcake

I read a lot about places like Odesk and elance but are these worth bothering with?

No!

Originally Posted by Yellowcake

I'm really not interested in writing for less than about $50 an article

Very wise indeed.

There's a big market available at higher prices.

Much more so, "pro rata", than there is at lower prices, where there are nearly as many service-providers as customers.

The classic mistake is to start at low prices imagining that you can build up some clients and then increase the prices. This is all fallacious and mistaken, because the market doesn't work like that. You're better off starting with higher prices (which is what I did myself). However, you have to know exactly what to produce and sell (just "articles" isn't detailed enough) and you need real marketing skills to sell it. The great reward is that unlike the people buying $10 articles, those customers know how to use the product, and if you know what to sell them they come back for more, and their own businesses survive, so you don't need to keep advertising and replacing your clients all the time like writers of lower-priced articles do. But you do need to know what to supply them with, and what works (so you need to understand how article marketing really works), and how to keep them. Your own marketing skills are at least as important as your writing skills.

Originally Posted by Yellowcake

I guess a website is a prerequisite

Oh yes ... an absolute prerequisite. And you need to pitch it at the right market.

Originally Posted by Yellowcake

Thanks for any advice you can give me!

Here are some posts/threads which may help you ...(one of these posts also has a long list of additional resources linked to, some of which are about "writing and selling articles at higher prices").

http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...ml#post5368108

http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...ml#post6855000

http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...ml#post6829400

http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...ml#post6794793

http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...ml#post6140296

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Michael Ten

12 years ago

Why not start your own site and publish your own articles and monetize them? Don't sell them to anyone, perhaps.

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Corey Geer 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael55555

Why not start your own site and publish your own articles and monetize them? Don't sell them to anyone, perhaps.

That's something I would actually like to get into but for now I need the income from the content produced.

I've been messing around on Elance today, and unless these people go with the highest bidder, I'll never get picked for jobs lol.

There are people who bid at .50c per 100 words which is just insanity.

As Alexis said, set your prices high at the start. However, I didn't do this which was my mistake. I went onto DP and set my prices at an abysmal $1.00 per 100 words and the clients I found? Yikes.. I would've been better off working at McDonalds as a burger flipper.
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dcmarketer

12 years ago

YellowCake,

You can also check out Buy Unique Articles, Order Web Site Content, Hire Freelance Article Writers and SEO Content Writers - Constant Content - Custom Website Content - basically you decide what you're going to write about (I'm sure you already have some idea as to your preferred markets), write a piece, and set the price you're going to offer the article for. People can come in and browse a sample of your work, and purchase the rights to it. Obviously Constant Content takes a commission, but again you set the price. This is basically a marketplace for ready made premium content. That could kick start you off nicely to get the ball rolling. Obviously long term you'll want to get your own site setup however.

Best...

Duncan

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TheWrightWords

12 years ago

You mentioned you are a magazine editor--do you have some contacts you could use as a starting point? Features, articles, essays and filler pay pretty well. I'd also check MediaBistro and LinkedIn, too-- they often have high quality freelance writing jobs listed.
I also like Constant Content, but it can take a while for things to sell. Try to pick seasonal or niche topics if possible, and get them out there early -- I'm selling Halloween related content (usage rights, articles from last year, no time to write on spec yet this year) like crazy right now. _

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Randall Magwood

12 years ago

You will need a site and some case studies and samples of your work. Along with marketing on your site, be proactive and join the freelance sites, and be stern with your fees... but also make them reasonable.

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davidreese

12 years ago

Not everyone on elance is looking for the lowest price. I hired a couple of people to write articles and the prices were between $50 to $75 per article. I was looking for unique quality. I was also looking for writers that had business experience.

I passed many proposals for much lower rates. I had the same project on odesk and wasn't happy with any of the responses.

When I get quotes for anything I usually follow this process:

A minimum of three quotes
Throw out the lowest and throw out the highest (unless they are specific and good)
Look at the samples and the references
Look for the most professional with the highest ratings
Look at the ones that write to me (directly) and my proposal specifcally most
Go through the sites and profiles of the person submitting the pitch
Look at resumes and portfolios of the short list

I would use every resource you have available to develop your client base. You never know where a client is going to come from...

I've have used lower priced article services and my experience is the writing isn't effective. You may get traffic but it will bounce fast rather than leading to a meaningful relationship with your site.

People that are paid a higher price typically work harder, provide better service, and are more interested in developing an ongoing relationship.

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cferfland247

12 years ago

You won't get much rate in oDesk but I can recommend you LinkedIn. Many client looking for quality writer in LinkedIn and they are ready to pay you for good writing service.

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myob 12 years ago

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Writers' Market. Although in most cases you need to be credentialed or previously published for the top paying magazines, it's not hard to find publishers who pay $50 and a whole lot more for well-written articles.
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- Alexa Smith Banned 12 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by myob
  
  I'm surprised no one has mentioned Writers' Market.
  
  I always forget. I just do my usual trick of linking to a post which links to another post which contains a set of links in it, one of which mentions that somewhere (probably in a link to one of your posts). But it's more helpful just to mention it, of course.
  
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  myob 12 years ago
  
  Oops - I didn't read your referenced links. Writers' Market has always been one of my first go to resources.
  
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  Alexa Smith Banned 12 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by myob
  
  Oops - I didn't read your referenced links.
  
  Noooo, I didn't mean it that way at all. I just forgot (not for the first time) to mention it. I get lazy and "assume my links cover it", and of course it's much more helpful to mention this stuff directly.
  
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In the know

12 years ago

Hi Yellow Cake,

Like you I'm English, and managed to get a client through eLance that eventually paid me $50 an article.

He specialised in the legal sector and had high fee paying clients who didn't mind paying me 50 USD in return for high ranks on local search results.

This was a couple of years ago mind you, not sure what it's like now.

My advice would be to build a portfolio, bid on a lot of projects and progress from there.

And some of the other members gave very pertinent advice also, well worth following.

Regards

Dan

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tpw

12 years ago

Avoid "seo articles"... "SEO articles" appeal to people who don't value the contribution that a writer can make to their business.

I do recommend your own website. The key is to show people what they will get, and how what you will do for them is of more value than they are paying you to do the work.

Targeting the right people is the key to making the right kind of money for the work that you do.

I also would avoid elance/odesk etc., although sometimes you can find good clients there and move them up to a higher price point.

More often, whatever price point people enter the market at is the highest they will be willing to pay for the work.

If you eventually want to be paid $250 for 1000 words, then start there and pursue the clients who are willing to pay at that level.

If you start people at $100 per 1000 words, then try to increase your prices, you will most often find yourself starting over again with an entirely new customer base when you increase your prices.

In order to reach plus 10 cents a word, I would target specifically offline companies.

I have been able to make a good living as a ghost writer for online businesses for up to 10 cents a word. Beyond that price point, I have sold a few, but never made a living at those higher prices.

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PhilippaWrites

12 years ago

Like others above I would recommend Constant Content. You set your own prices and pick your own topics, although sales aren't guaranteed (not that they are anywhere, I suppose!).

Posted from Warriorforum.com App for Android

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Alexa Smith Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by PhilippaWrites

Posted from Warriorforum.com App for Android

Oooooh, Philippa has that nice Commander Data standing by, to post for her ...
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picnic

Banned 12 years ago

Probably web portals and other corporate clients would be your best bet in that price range, since the $1 or $2 per 100 words is the typical going rate on freelancing sites

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