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How did JohnChow & ShoeMoney build their traffic?

by BarberShop
80 replies
How did these guys start out? What did they do to get such popularity?

And if you're going to start today building a blog career with a goal of getting a similar success if not more than they do, what would your traffic strategy be?
#build #johnchow #shoemoney #traffic
  • Profile picture of the author yukon
    Banned
    How did JohnChow & ShoeMoney build their traffic?
    A lot of BS & some hype thrown in just for kicks.
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    • Profile picture of the author satrap
      Originally Posted by yukon View Post

      A lot of BS & some hype thrown in just for kicks.
      Completely agree with yukon. Both their blogs, especially shomoney's blog is like a product review blog. Every single post there is a paid review and it has been for a long time now.

      I really don't get it. When I first got started, I visited their blogs a few times, but I was like this is it, this guy just promotes products left and right and the other guy just promot himself and talks about his so called Internet celebrity status all day long.


      I agree that their early success was because they we're the early guys of IM blogs, so newbies were attracted. If they were to start today though, I think they would not get much traction at all.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mr. Ken Russell
        Originally Posted by satrap View Post

        Completely agree with yukon. Both their blogs, especially shomoney's blog is like a product review blog. Every single post there is a paid review and it has been for a long time now.

        I really don't get it. When I first got started, I visited their blogs a few times, but I was like this is it, this guy just promotes products left and right and the other guy just promot himself and talks about his so called Internet celebrity status all day long.


        I agree that their early success was because they we're the early guys of IM blogs, so newbies were attracted. If they were to start today though, I think they would not get much traction at all.
        Yeah I agree with this, it's kinda sad to see bloggers get taken in by their success and start to not put as much effort as they do in their early ages of building up - I guess the level of motivation and perspective changes. More money > less passion > more hype > more products.
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    • Profile picture of the author ryanoryan
      Originally Posted by yukon View Post

      A lot of BS & some hype thrown in just for kicks.
      I got a big from this
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  • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
    They pretty much started during the IM boom years ago and they were one of the few IM blogs around. Back then nearly everyone was a newbie and blogging for money was a big thing. These two were at the top and newbies latched on like leeches trying to learn anything they could.

    Slowly both blogs kind of died off over the years (Well I know shoemoey's did). Newbies that didn't make it left the business. The ones who stuck around knew that shoemoney and johnchow were just catering to the newbie market.

    Shoemoney's blog use to be interesting back in the day, but the last time I checked the site it basically turned into a full on personal blog and didn't really have much to do with IM anymore. The community he had on there also doesn't seem to be very active. Although he did have some off shoot IM products so maybe they all meet there now. Who knows, but the site hasn't been very relevant for awhile now.

    Can't say much about johnchow I know he's still around promoting his "internet celebrity" status. I don't think hes been relevant for awhile either. They both do their own things now and I think they both kind of moved on from the blog thing. It was big years ago, but nowadays most people don't flock to blogs like they use to. It's mostly forums or private communities.

    I guess the point I'm trying to make here is not to focus on what they did and how they did it. I'd say a lot of their success had to do with being in the right place at the right time. They are both very good at what they do, but the mentality back then was a lot different than it is today. Make money by blogging was the big thing back then. Nowadays your better off doing something else. Blogging is time consuming and the possibility of making it worth it is very slim. Especially if your just a newbie starting out.
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    • Profile picture of the author BarberShop
      Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

      Nowadays your better off doing something else.
      Such as?

      What would the JohnChow and ShoeMoney of today be doing? What's the equivalent today of blogging for money in 2005?
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      • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
        Originally Posted by BarberShop View Post

        Such as?

        What would the JohnChow and ShoeMoney of today be doing? What's the equivalent today of blogging for money in 2005?
        As far as shoemoney goes I think he sells training / coaching / internet marketing tools and software? Or something like that. Most of his money doesn't come from actual blogging. He's basically using his blog as a tool to recruit newbies on his mailing list, then sell them stuff. That's pretty much what all blogs do nowadays.

        So would you rather spend months, if not years, creating a blog and trying to position yourself as an authority figure. Or would you rather just go out and create a squeeze page, collect emails, and start selling your own products by next week? In the end that's what both roads end up leading too.
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  • Profile picture of the author brunom
    They started something that wasn't common back then and that was why they gained such popularity.
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  • Profile picture of the author BarberShop
    ^^ I appreciate the candor. Its a nice wake up call. I was planning there for a second to start a blog.
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    • Profile picture of the author mikelmraz
      Originally Posted by BarberShop View Post

      ^^ I appreciate the candor. Its a nice wake up call. I was planning there for a second to start a blog.
      Actually, starting a blog is the best way to go. It is the basis of the entire business model.
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      • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
        Originally Posted by mikelmraz View Post

        Actually, starting a blog is the best way to go. It is the basis of the entire business model.
        and what entire business model would that be?
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        • Profile picture of the author captainron4
          Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

          and what entire business model would that be?
          The Blogging Business Model...it was clear to me.
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  • Profile picture of the author Anton543
    Essentially, their sites were make money sites and were the first on the gravy train and took full advantage of it. I think they manipulated the figures quite a bit to give themselves an 'aura' and people took the bait.
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  • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
    Banned
    Both of them are affiliate marketers and make good commissions from that. Shoemoney actually made his first big money from his photography site rather than a MMO site.

    John Chow's blog seems relevant if you're interested in what he eats at restaurants. Never forget the link scheme he had going, bribing his readers to link to him and giving them a link back ... until Google found out and then he couldn't even rank for his own name. lol.
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    • Profile picture of the author ShoeMoney
      Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

      Both of them are affiliate marketers and make good commissions from that. Shoemoney actually made his first big money from his photography site rather than a MMO site.
      You are thinking of problogger.net . he has the photography site. I made most of my money in the ringtone affiliate industry and from selling my advertising network AuctionAds and currently I run a company called the PAR Program.

      My blog has done well but its never been a significant source of revenue for my company.
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      • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
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        Originally Posted by ShoeMoney View Post

        You are thinking of problogger.net . he has the photography site. I made most of my money in the ringtone affiliate industry and from selling my advertising network AuctionAds and currently I run a company called the PAR Program.

        My blog has done well but its never been a significant source of revenue for my company.
        You're right ... sorry about that. I've read both Shoemoney and Problogger. In fact, when I made my first Adsense check, I posted this on my blog.




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    • Profile picture of the author J Bold
      Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

      Both of them are affiliate marketers and make good commissions from that. Shoemoney actually made his first big money from his photography site rather than a MMO site.

      John Chow's blog seems relevant if you're interested in what he eats at restaurants. Never forget the link scheme he had going, bribing his readers to link to him and giving them a link back ... until Google found out and then he couldn't even rank for his own name. lol.


      I search for John Chow and the first result I get is his name. So looks like he got over that little problem.

      Also, I don't know about his traffic, but his blog hasn't "died off." like salesbooster said.

      He blogs just about every day, it looks like. Latest blog entry is today, Nov. 17.

      He's probably still relevant to his readers, I'm sure. And he may appeal to newbies or less experienced marketers.

      I don't know if he's terribly innovative with the latest greatest flavor of the month strategies but I bet he still gets tons of blog traffic. Looks pretty consistent and focused to me, which definitely works for him.
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      • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
        Originally Posted by J Bold View Post

        I search for John Chow and the first result I get is his name. So looks like he got over that little problem.

        Also, I don't know about his traffic, but his blog hasn't "died off." like salesbooster said.

        He blogs just about every day, it looks like. Latest blog entry is today, Nov. 17.

        He's probably still relevant to his readers, I'm sure. And he may appeal to newbies or less experienced marketers.

        I don't know if he's terribly innovative with the latest greatest flavor of the month strategies but I bet he still gets tons of blog traffic. Looks pretty consistent and focused to me, which definitely works for him.
        When I say died off I mean he isn't getting the same attention he was 4-5 years ago.

        Go on alexa and look shoemoney and johnchows traffic stats. Shoemoney says traffic has never been better, but that's probably true for his other websites. His blog has been in a steady decline for years. I'm sure when he says "Traffic is at a all time high" he's talking about his other websites because his blog isn't doing half as good as it was years ago.

        I have nothing against shoemoney. He won't admit his brand is dying. It's his job to convince his fan base that hes still relevant. He even said himself that his focus isn't his blog which is what I said.

        He's got more important things to worry about. Back in the day you would see hundreds of comments on his blog. Nowadays you're lucky if you see 20. The writing is on the wall. Just because someone posts new blog entries doesn't mean they haven't died off.
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        • Profile picture of the author Mike Hill
          Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

          When I say died off I mean he isn't getting the same attention he was 4-5 years ago.

          Go on alexa and look shoemoney and johnchows traffic stats. Shoemoney says traffic has never been better, but that's probably true for his other websites. His blog has been in a steady decline for years. I'm sure when he says "Traffic is at a all time high" he's talking about his other websites because his blog isn't doing half as good as it was years ago.

          I have nothing against shoemoney. He won't admit his brand is dying. It's his job to convince his fan base that hes still relevant. He even said himself that his focus isn't his blog which is what I said.

          He's got more important things to worry about. Back in the day you would see hundreds of comments on his blog. Nowadays you're lucky if you see 20. The writing is on the wall. Just because someone posts new blog entries doesn't mean they haven't died off.

          Yowsers, you really like to speculate a whole bunch and "THINK" you know what his business model is, future plans and what he had for lunch...

          The trouble is I really hope no one listens to your "Assumptions" unless you have a direct line to ShoeMoney's house that is...
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          • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
            Originally Posted by Mike Hill View Post

            Yowsers, you really like to speculate a whole bunch and "THINK" you know what his business model is, future plans and what he had for lunch...

            The trouble is I really hope no one listens to your "Assumptions" unless you have a direct line to ShoeMoney's house that is...
            Like I said earlier, the writing is on the wall. If you wanted to know for yourself just pull up the stats. If you don't want to believe what I have to say then you don't have to, but what I said isn't wrong.
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            • Profile picture of the author Mike Hill
              Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

              Like I said earlier, the writing is on the wall. If you wanted to know for yourself just pull up the stats. If you don't want to believe what I have to say then you don't have to, but what I said isn't wrong.

              Well, you're going completely off the stats of Alexa and other sites which have been known to be wrong. You have no idea if his visitor value has increased, list retention, and many other factors. Just because Alexa shows a decline doesn't mean it's going under by any means.

              It seems as though you're going mostly off of one stat and mere speculation at this point.
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              • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
                Originally Posted by Mike Hill View Post

                Well, you're going completely off the stats of Alexa and other sites which have been known to be wrong. You have no idea if his visitor value has increased, list retention, and many other factors. Just because Alexa shows a decline doesn't mean it's going under by any means.

                It seems as though you're going mostly off of one stat and mere speculation at this point.
                Don't have to use alexa, can use compete.com if you want. They all say the same thing.

                I know alexa isn't the most accurate tool in the world, but it doesn't take a genius to figure out that his blog traffic has been in a decline for years.

                Does that mean he isn't making money? No, like I said, he does other things now. Some how you all twisted it around like I'm saying shoemoney is broke. He obviously still makes money from his brand, but he even said it himself. He doesn't focus on the blog. He does other things now.

                The original question was about how shoemoney got where he was with his blog. He wanted to try and do the same thing and I had to explain that most of shoemoney and johnchows success was just being in the right place at the right time. Does that mean it's impossible to build a successful IM blog? No. But to expect to hit it off like shoemoney and johnchow is reaching for the stars, especially when so much has changed in this business. It's not all about blogs anymore.
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                • Profile picture of the author BarberShop
                  What do you recommend doing for earning big bucks?
                  Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

                  Don't have to use alexa, can use compete.com if you want. They all say the same thing.

                  I know alexa isn't the most accurate tool in the world, but it doesn't take a genius to figure out that his blog traffic has been in a decline for years.

                  Does that mean he isn't making money? No, like I said, he does other things now. Some how you all twisted it around like I'm saying shoemoney is broke. He obviously still makes money from his brand, but he even said it himself. He doesn't focus on the blog. He does other things now.

                  The original question was about how shoemoney got where he was with his blog. He wanted to try and do the same thing and I had to explain that most of shoemoney and johnchows success was just being in the right place at the right time. Does that mean it's impossible to build a successful IM blog? No. But to expect to hit it off like shoemoney and johnchow is reaching for the stars, especially when so much has changed in this business. It's not all about blogs anymore.
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        • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
          Originally Posted by drunkenmonkey View Post

          I'm laughing so much I'm choking..

          Do you have any idea in ANY capacity at all what Shoemoneys bank account looks like?

          And I would DOUBT his brand is dying?..Shoemoney? F***g doubtful...VERY doubtful.

          I notice your AVA is Kevin o'leary if I'm not mistaken..that makes sense, he talks sh!t too.

          DM
          I think I've seen you post a couple of times and you aren't to keen on reading. Probably because you're always drunk. So I'll make this easier for you to understand.

          Where did i ever say shoemoney was broke?

          Also I guess dying wasn't the right word to use. I should of said, decline.

          If any of you were around years ago in the internet marketing scene, you would know how big these two guys were. They are still big in their own right, but at this point I'd say they are just trying to maintain their blogs for branding reasons.

          I'm sure both of them would rather spend time working on other things rather than their blogs. I'm sure both of them know that blogging for the rest of their lives isn't going to cut it. The big money is in owning your own products / companies. The blog is just there for the image.

          So do you understand why I say the blog traffic is in decline? I'm sure they don't actively try and build as much traffic to their blogs anymore like they use to. They know that their time is better spent putting that kind of effort into selling their own products or running side companies.
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        • Profile picture of the author ShoeMoney
          Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

          When I say died off I mean he isn't getting the same attention he was 4-5 years ago.

          Go on alexa and look shoemoney and johnchows traffic stats. Shoemoney says traffic has never been better, but that's probably true for his other websites. His blog has been in a steady decline for years. I'm sure when he says "Traffic is at a all time high" he's talking about his other websites because his blog isn't doing half as good as it was years ago.

          I have nothing against shoemoney. He won't admit his brand is dying. It's his job to convince his fan base that hes still relevant. He even said himself that his focus isn't his blog which is what I said.

          He's got more important things to worry about. Back in the day you would see hundreds of comments on his blog. Nowadays you're lucky if you see 20. The writing is on the wall. Just because someone posts new blog entries doesn't mean they haven't died off.
          You guys re a riot. My brand died 5 years ago didn't you read?

          I will be the first to tell you that the readership that found value in my blog (newbies to the industry) will not find NEAR the value now.

          Again its a personal blog and I share what I am learning. I am learning now how to manage employees and run multiple companies.

          So yes there is not 50 million people getting value... but the small few who are doing what I do now.

          Btw just a lesson - don't put much stock in Alexa traffic. If you do I have a Alexa 1000 site to sell you that gets nothing but .00001 cent junk exit pops.
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  • Profile picture of the author denysapu
    Originally Posted by BarberShop View Post

    How did these guys start out? What did they do to get such popularity?
    You may only get blurry answers lol

    Originally Posted by BarberShop View Post

    And if you're going to start today building a blog career with a goal of getting a similar success if not more than they do, what would your traffic strategy be?
    Free traffic, then that really engage visitors in an interaction.
    Guest blogging, connecting with other bloggers and get some of their readers.
    SEO, social media, etc. Also do not forget to create a direct conversation with the user, perhaps with the blog comments sections, or through social media conversation.
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  • Profile picture of the author ShoeMoney
    I started my blog in 2003 and nobody read it for years. I talked about new things I was learning and it started to get traction as people found it interesting.

    I started earning good money by 2005ish and continued to share all that I was learning. Some people found value in it.

    ShoeMoney.com has always been a personal blog. Its about me, my life, what I do.

    Now that I have sold 3 companies and am now more into funding startups, building new businesses, and not hustling nearly as hard as I was I relate to a totally different audience.

    Traffic is at an all time high but I credit that mostly to the syndication of my blog by businessweek, yahoo news, forbes online etc etc.

    Anyway people always ask my secret to making a successful blog... I have no secret. I write about what I am interested in. I was there writing when nobody read it and when nobody reads it again someday I will still write.
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    • Profile picture of the author Awethentic
      Originally Posted by ShoeMoney View Post

      I started my blog in 2003 and nobody read it for years. I talked about new things I was learning and it started to get traction as people found it interesting.

      I started earning good money by 2005ish and continued to share all that I was learning. Some people found value in it.

      ShoeMoney.com has always been a personal blog. Its about me, my life, what I do.

      Now that I have sold 3 companies and am now more into funding startups, building new businesses, and not hustling nearly as hard as I was I relate to a totally different audience.

      Traffic is at an all time high but I credit that mostly to the syndication of my blog by businessweek, yahoo news, forbes online etc etc.

      Anyway people always ask my secret to making a successful blog... I have no secret. I write about what I am interested in. I was there writing when nobody read it and when nobody reads it again someday I will still write.
      Thanks for this - very useful.

      What is your funding startup website link please?

      Cheers,

      M
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  • Profile picture of the author Randall Magwood
    Thanks for the input ShoeMoney.
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  • Profile picture of the author shane_k
    ok I am probably going to embarrass myself, but who are shoemoney and john chow?

    from looking at the above I see that they are/were bloggers or affiliate bloggers?
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  • Profile picture of the author BarberShop
    ^^ Think Justin Bieber & Selena Gomez of Make Money Online.
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    • Profile picture of the author Michael Ten
      Originally Posted by BarberShop View Post

      ^^ Think Justin Bieber & Selena Gomez of Make Money Online.
      Lolol. Yeah. Quite possibly.
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    • Profile picture of the author shane_k
      Originally Posted by BarberShop View Post

      ^^ Think Justin Bieber & Selena Gomez of Make Money Online.
      Not sure if you are being sarcastic or not, but assuming you are, I guess I just have to do my own Google search then.

      Or maybe you thought I was joking so you threw in a joke yourself?

      Not sure, but again I will do my own google search.

      Thanks
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  • Profile picture of the author igl0w
    They were right on time. Now they wouldnt do that
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    • Profile picture of the author DubDubDubDot
      The famous photo of ShoeMoney covering the bottom half of his face with a $100,000 AdSense check is what put him on the map as I remember it. That photo went viral unlike anything we have ever seen on the business side of affiliate marketing and everyone wanted to know who the guy in the photo was.

      Originally Posted by igl0w View Post

      They were right on time. Now they wouldnt do that
      John Chow wouldn't, but Shoemoney would still be able to gather a following if his blog just opened today.

      A good portion of WarriorForum is fascinated by the notion of making money online by merely talking about making money online. The concept that people generally find success prior to writing about business is what slips by a lot of you.

      This success is going to support a blog/book/speaking/whatever regardless of when any of it is introduced. That's obviously a lot harder if you don't have the verifiable success to back it up. If guys like Frank Kern, Filsaime, Chow and so on just started today, they would likely get lost in the newbie shuffle since the fake guru game has changed so greatly since they started.
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      • Profile picture of the author Ron Douglas
        Originally Posted by DubDubDubDot View Post

        If guys like Frank Kern, Filsaime, Chow and so on just started today, they would likely get lost in the newbie shuffle since the fake guru game has changed so greatly since they started.
        What is the fake guru game?
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        • Profile picture of the author DubDubDubDot
          Originally Posted by Ron Douglas View Post

          What is the fake guru game?
          "Fake it until you make it."

          It's a lot more difficult to fake it here in 2012. You can try, but few will bat an eye at you. That wasn't the case several years ago when it was assumed by far more people that the "gurus" had really been places.

          ShoeMoney obviously isn't a Mark Zuckerberg or something, but there are at least some publicly verifiable accomplishments. Then you look at one fake guru in particular, who had to throw up a dog training site because people started to question if he was a doer or just a talker. Then this rumor goes around that the site had generated millions for him (gee, who started that rumor?). And to this day, based entirely on that rumor, his fans (who still don't "get it") build dog training sites thinking that you can make a ton of money with them.

          That type of BS is in stark contrast to people who've actually done something and you can go out and look at it and see that the success is actually there.
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          • Profile picture of the author Charles Harper
            Originally Posted by DubDubDubDot View Post

            "Fake it until you make it."

            It's a lot more difficult to fake it here in 2012. You can try, but few will bat an eye at you. That wasn't the case several years ago when it was assumed by far more people that the "gurus" had really been places.

            ShoeMoney obviously isn't a Mark Zuckerberg or something, but there are at least some publicly verifiable accomplishments. Then you look at one fake guru in particular, who had to throw up a dog training site because people started to question if he was a doer or just a talker. Then this rumor goes around that the site had generated millions for him (gee, who started that rumor?). And to this day, based entirely on that rumor, his fans (who still don't "get it") build dog training sites thinking that you can make a ton of money with them.

            That type of BS is in stark contrast to people who've actually done something and you can go out and look at it and see that the success is actually there.
            Publicly verifiable yes. Interesting, that they may not be very popular here (some might not have even heard of them), but they are recognized by people who read magazines and watch television. Old media still does boost popularity and to some degree, that is why the MMO community can't figure out what the attraction is. Their blogs aren't necessarily written to you and I (those of us who fancy ourselves 'hardcore' bloggers and marketers). Yet the blogs remain "popular".

            Traffic, SEO and Social Media are great when you are anonymous. They level the playing field and allow us to compete with people that we would not have had to do otherwise. But all of this is even better when you are a "somebody" and people have made your site a destination, NOT because they found it on their way to look for something in a search, but because they heard about you and are now curious.

            You've seen him comment here, but Ron Douglass, I believe has been on a couple of national television networks. I'm guessing it didn't "make" him, but it didn't hurt him at all. I noticed that he pretty much doesn't talk much about it publicly--among Warriors, not because he is hiding anything, but because most instantly dismiss PR and way too much work and something that they could never achieve.

            David Bullock, Taguchi-testing guy from StomperNet (are they around anymore), wrote a book about Barack Obama (this is not political--so don't shoot me okay?) and leap frogged the whole SEO, Social Media game and now lectures at Ivy League schools and is in demand. When one's blogging income includes, "please come teach our college students or our ladies group about this Social Media thing" -- none of that comes (directly) from one's site.

            There is more than one way to "skin a cat", and sometime we (myself included) can be prisoners to the options that we surround ourselves with (does a fish know he or she is wet?). But our brains work perfectly fine and when we use them to be creative, and as such there are ways to be successful at blogging without the canisters of methods (affiliate sales, information products, adsense) that the information products we buy put us into.
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          • Profile picture of the author Charles Harper
            Originally Posted by DubDubDubDot View Post

            "Fake it until you make it."

            It's a lot more difficult to fake it here in 2012. You can try, but few will bat an eye at you. That wasn't the case several years ago when it was assumed by far more people that the "gurus" had really been places.

            ShoeMoney obviously isn't a Mark Zuckerberg or something, but there are at least some publicly verifiable accomplishments. Then you look at one fake guru in particular, who had to throw up a dog training site because people started to question if he was a doer or just a talker. Then this rumor goes around that the site had generated millions for him (gee, who started that rumor?). And to this day, based entirely on that rumor, his fans (who still don't "get it") build dog training sites thinking that you can make a ton of money with them.

            That type of BS is in stark contrast to people who've actually done something and you can go out and look at it and see that the success is actually there.
            I'm not sure I fully agree. I don't think he is a "fake guru", but nobody head of Michael Ellsburg, before he wrote the book, "The Education of Millionaires". Scarcely, not too many people on the Forum have read him, but he is very popular in business blogging circles. In his book, he is explaining Internet Marketing (all stuff you know backwards and fowards) and Direct Response copy writing.

            Read through Tim Ferris' first book and see if you learn anything new. Nope, you'll probably see that he is teaching people the stuff we talk about in this forum every day. How to Make Money Online basically. I could go on..."The $100 Startup". blah blah blah. All very popular, and by rights they may have been "fake gurus" because they didn't have huge success before they wrote these books.

            It is still very possible to tell people how to make money and then get yourself an audience. Again, though, as I have suggested, it may NOT always be with SEO Traffic, Social Media, etc. Write about something that people care about, get published and let people in media know about it.

            The Education of Millionaires: It's Not What You...The Education of Millionaires: It's Not What You...
            The $100 Startup: Reinvent the Way You Make a...The $100 Startup: Reinvent the Way You Make a...
            Amazon.com: The 4-Hour Workweek: Escape 9-5, Live...Amazon.com: The 4-Hour Workweek: Escape 9-5, Live...

            (Tim Ferris is milking the 4 Hour Thing to death, lol)
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            • Profile picture of the author DubDubDubDot
              Originally Posted by Charles Harper View Post

              I don't think he is a "fake guru", but nobody head of Michael Ellsburg, before he wrote the book, "The Education of Millionaires".
              When I use the term fake guru I'm directing it towards the guys that haven't attained any level of success using the very methods they teach, or their courses are so massively incomplete that nobody reaches the implied income potential.

              I'm not familiar with Micahel Ellsburg, but scanning over his website he appears to publish pieces on success and business theory. He's likely an academic with little to no business experience outside of his book operation. However, there's a key difference between the academic and the pretender as outlined above.

              I don't have a problem with academic theorists because they aren't the ones pitching step by step internet riches plans. The theorists are there to stimulate your brain at best, entertain you at worst. Their material isn't even actionable in a step A to B to C sense, so no expectations in that regard.

              The business theorist who tells a good story is timeless. They can come along at any time and get a nice following. The new blogger with an online business history that viewers can see never goes out of style either. The fake guru blog that's new to the scene has virtually no chance of success in the current environment.
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  • Profile picture of the author shonny
    They started their websites a long time ago when only a few websites existed. It was much easier to get backlinks and a high page rank by that time. Google also give priority to older sites.
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  • Profile picture of the author thedanbrown
    Blogging is still an effective medium to reach your target audience. Like ShoeMoney said all he did was talk about his life and story, and where he was going in his business. People began to relate and identify with him so they followed along with the help of his blog. He got them engaged and that's why his traffic grew and is still growing (also because of his branding).

    Like he said, his blog is not a big money maker but if you want to build a list in a given niche you basically need a blog. You need somewhere to put fresh content and bring people into your sales funnel.

    Just my opinion
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  • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
    Podcast: How Did Jeremy “Shoemoney” Schoemaker Get To Where He Is Today?
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    BS free SEO services, training and advice - SEO Point

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  • Profile picture of the author Paul Gram
    It's important to note that some people are judging success my the # of blog comments someone receives as a form of social proof. While blog comments and lots of blog readers are never a bad thing, it's also not a true indicator of success.

    There are people out there with multi million dollar businesses who blog and get little or no comments. Blog comments and social media don't pay the bills unless blogging is the ONLY thing you do, which wouldn't be smart.
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  • Profile picture of the author fin
    Haters gonna hate.

    Everyone else gonna find out what Chow had for lunch.
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  • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
    What ever helps you sleep at night. Stay on topic or don't post at all.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Hill
      Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

      What ever helps you sleep at night. Stay on topic or don't post at all.
      YOU were the one taking the topic off course and who are you to say to anyone about being able to post or not? Is this YOUR forum? NO

      And I'm guessing you don't have permission to use Kevin O'leary's pic either.
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      • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
        Originally Posted by Mike Hill View Post

        YOU were the one taking the topic off course and who are you to say to anyone about being able to post or not? Is this YOUR forum? NO

        And I'm guessing you don't have permission to use Kevin O'leary's pic either.
        His last post had nothing to do with the topic. If he's upset about being wrong he can pm me or write me a letter about it. The topic is about shoemoney and john chows traffic. Can you read the thread title?

        Oh and maybe you should go run along and tell Kevil O'leary that someone on a forum is using his picture.
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        • Profile picture of the author Mike Hill
          Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

          His last post had nothing to do with the topic. If he's upset about being wrong he can pm me or write me a letter about it. The topic is about shoemoney and john chows traffic. Can you read the thread title?

          Oh and maybe you should go run along and tell Kevil O'leary that someone on a forum is using his picture.
          About the picture... that's just plain stealing.

          Also, you talk about the fact anyone can fake twitter followers etc... then you ramble on about Compete stats and whatever else. But you know as well as anyone that those stats can be easily faked as well.

          Seems like you are the one who HATES being wrong.
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          • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
            Originally Posted by Mike Hill View Post

            About the picture... that's just plain stealing.

            Also, you talk about the fact anyone can fake twitter followers etc... then you ramble on about Compete stats and whatever else. But you know as well as anyone that those stats can be easily faked as well.

            Seems like you are the one who HATES being wrong.
            I'm stealing his picture? Interesting. I guess I'm in good company because I ain't the only one around here using somebody else's picture. I guess I could just print out his picture and then take a picture of that picture to use. Would that make you happy?

            Oh and about your little theory there. Yes almost any stats can be faked, but there's a problem with your idea...

            My argument is about a website losing traffic... Now if someone is going to fake compete or alexa stats, why would they want their traffic stats to be on a downward trend? Wouldn't it make sense to fake your compete or alexa stats on an upward trend?

            Soooo it doesn't look like the stats were faked (unless they want to fake stats showing that their site is LOSING traffic). Meaning your idea is totally bonkers.
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            • Profile picture of the author Mike Hill
              Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

              I'm stealing his picture? Interesting.
              What else would you call it?

              I guess I'm in good company because I ain't the only one around here using somebody else's picture. I guess I could just print out his picture and then take a picture of that picture to use. Would that make you happy?

              Oh and about your little theory there. Yes almost any stats can be faked, but there's a problem with your idea...

              My argument is about a website losing traffic... Now if someone is going to fake compete or alexa stats, why would they want their traffic stats to be on a downward trend? Wouldn't it make sense to fake your compete or alexa stats on an upward trend?

              Soooo it doesn't look like the stats were faked (unless they want to fake stats showing that their site is LOSING traffic). Meaning your idea is totally bonkers.
              You completely missed my point... keep reading!

              I'm rebutting the fact you easily dismissed the upwards trend of his Twitter followers because like YOU said they can be easily faked. But when I mentioned about web stats being faked (in general) you say he's not which is correct but I didn't say he was.

              My point is why is everyone elses opinion wrong except yours?

              You easily dismiss everyone's opinion then with total reckless abandon you decide to inject false statements and conclusions were you clearly do not have all the information but rather just a sliver.

              And as for the picture you cannot use it to represent yourself in any form no matter if you drew the dam thing. But you're probably one of those dam hippies who thinks everything online should be free!
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              • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
                Originally Posted by Mike Hill View Post

                What else would you call it?

                You completely missed my point... keep reading!

                I'm rebutting the fact you easily dismissed the upwards trend of his Twitter followers because like YOU said they can be easily faked. But when I mentioned about web stats being faked (in general) you say he's not which is correct but I didn't say he was.

                My point is why is everyone elses opinion wrong except yours?

                And as for the picture you cannot use it to represent yourself in any form no matter if you drew the dam thing.
                So why would you bring up the point of web stats being faked if you knew he wasn't faking his stats? Just to make a general statement that web stats can be faked too? What are you going to tell me next? the sky is blue???

                My point is why is everyone elses opinion wrong except yours?

                That's a weird way of getting your point across if this is what you've been trying to tell me this whole time...

                My opinion is just what it is. An opinion. If you don't like it then counter with a logical argument. If someone is going to come in here and say "LOL UR SO WRONG. I AM SO SMART." That's not a logical argument. If someone wants to counter and prove my opinion wrong I'd be happy to listen and discuss it...


                Originally Posted by Mike Hill View Post

                And as for the picture you cannot use it to represent yourself in any form no matter if you drew the dam thing.

                Are you sure about that? If i drew it, I would be the owner of the picture, no matter who was in it.
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                • Profile picture of the author Mike Hill
                  Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

                  So why would you bring up the point of web stats being faked if you knew he wasn't faking his stats? Just to make a general statement that web stats can be faked too? What are you going to tell me next? the sky is blue???
                  You're an idiot... I brought up the point about that because YOU mentioned about his twitter followers can be faked when someone else mentioned they were on the upwards trend. GET IT???

                  Clearly you have an agenda to stomp through here and say everyone else is wrong except you. But when you go off half-cocked it really is ridiculous...

                  PS. As for the pic it is 100% illegal for you to use it.
                  1. Right of Publicity: One is a celebrity's right of publicity -- the right to control the use of one's name or likeness (or any person's right of privacy);

                  2. Copyright: The other is the copyright protection of a particular photo in which a celebrity or other individual appears.

                  C. Public Figures are not Public Property: Many people assume that public figures are public property, but this is not the case.

                  1. Advertising; Commercial Use - not okay: You absolutely cannot use anyone's image, celebrity or not, for any advertisement or endorsement without permission.

                  D. Use of Exact Image: The image doesn't even have to be a celebrity's exact likeness to be considered an infringement.

                  1. Vanna White; Samsung Robot: Last January, Vanna White was awarded $403,000 in damages from Samsung Electronics, because Samsung ran an ad featuring a blonde robot in a game show setting that resembled "Wheel of Fortune".

                  E. Dead Celebrities: In addition, the celebrity doesn't even have to be alive. The image of Elvis Presley is one of the most carefully protected, and Tennessee, where Presley lived, has the most far-reaching rights of privacy, and publicity laws in the country.

                  F. For editorial purposes: you are less likely to get in trouble when using a celebrity's image for editorial purposes under the First Amendment, as with newsletters, newspapers, or magazines. As long as the image is used to appropriately illustrate news reporting or some form of commentary or criticism, it is most likely protected fair use.

                  G. Photo of Celebrity: Separate Copyright: While a celebrity is a public figure, it is important to remember that a particular photo of that celebrity is subject to the same copyright protections as any other original work, and must be licensed.
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                  • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
                    Originally Posted by Mike Hill View Post

                    You're an idiot... I brought up the point about that because YOU mentioned about his twitter followers can be faked when someone else mentioned they were on the upwards trend. GET IT???
                    So what is your point in all of this???

                    I said they can be faked, I didn't say they were. That isn't the main problem with using twitter followers as a traffic estimator. I didn't bother going into detail because it should of been pretty obvious to anyone with a brain that trying to use twitter as a judge of how much traffic someone gets is dumb.

                    But you jump in and say my argument is wrong, because stats can be faked on compete as well, even though you AGREED that the stats weren't faked (because obviously nobody fakes a downward trend). So basically your whole argument was I shouldn't base my facts on a site like compete or alexa when the stats can be easily faked just like twitter? Please clarify because I hope what I just said isn't your argument.
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                    • Profile picture of the author Mike Hill
                      Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

                      So what is your point in all of this???

                      I said they can be faked, I didn't say they were. That isn't the main problem with using twitter followers as a traffic estimator. I didn't bother going into detail because it should of been pretty obvious to anyone with a brain that trying to use twitter as a judge of how much traffic someone gets is dumb.

                      But you jump in and say my argument is wrong, because stats can be faked on compete as well, even though you AGREED that the stats weren't faked (because obviously nobody fakes a downward trend). So basically your whole argument was I shouldn't base my facts on a site like compete or alexa when the stats can be easily faked just like twitter? Please clarify because I hope what I just said isn't your argument.

                      What I'm saying is you're jumping to a whole bunch of conclusions about Shoemoney's website based on what you see at Compete.com.

                      You have no idea other than that one piece of info which can clearly be wrong at times.

                      So what I have gathered about you is:

                      1. You like to jump to conclusions
                      2. You like to say others are wrong when you yourself have no idea
                      3. You're a thief
                      4. You have a soap box
                      5. You like to have the last word
                      6. You call yourself Merchant of Truth :confused:
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                      • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
                        Originally Posted by Mike Hill View Post

                        What I'm saying is you're jumping to a whole bunch of conclusions about Shoemoney's website based on what you see at Compete.com.
                        It's not what I just see at Compete.com. It's what I've seen over 7 years.

                        Originally Posted by Mike Hill View Post

                        You have no idea other than that one piece of info which can clearly be wrong at times.
                        More than one piece of info. And they all say the same thing, but what I say isn't fact. I'm simply stating my opinion and I have sources that backup what my opinion is.

                        Originally Posted by Mike Hill View Post

                        So what I have gathered about you is:

                        1. You like to jump to conclusions
                        2. You like to say others are wrong when you yourself have no idea
                        3. You're a thief
                        4. You have a soap box
                        5. You like to have the last word
                        6. You call yourself Merchant of Truth :confused:
                        Whats wrong buddy? I thought we were having a nice conversation and now you're jumping to conclusions, telling people they are wrong when you yourself have no idea, while on your soap box, trying to get in the last word in a conversation you've yet to add value too. :confused:
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                        • Profile picture of the author Mike Hill
                          Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

                          Whats wrong buddy? I thought we were having a nice conversation and now you're jumping to conclusions, telling people they are wrong when you yourself have no idea, while on your soap box, trying to get in the last word in a conversation you've yet to add value too. :confused:
                          Whatever... and as for value I've added far more value in this forum than you so shut it slick. You're whole purpose here is to talk down to others with your tail chasing answers and weak assumptions. I don't like that. That's the only reason I chimed in here but after reading your other posts I can see you're a little rough around the edges and are clearly an a_ _ hole.

                          But that's okay, you have your right to be one I guess.
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                          • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
                            Originally Posted by Mike Hill View Post

                            Whatever... and as for value I've added far more value in this forum than you so shut it slick. You're whole purpose here is to talk down to others with your tail chasing answers and weak assumptions. I don't like that. That's the only reason I chimed in here but after reading your other posts I can see you're a little rough around the edges and are clearly an a_ _ hole.

                            But that's okay, you have your right to be one I guess.

                            PS. You better take down your Thumb pic of my face in it... YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED



                            THE END....


                            LOL I knew you'd like that. I didn't think you were going to notice it. It's off now. You can go to bed now old timer. Try not to be so grumpy and maybe we can be friends.
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                • Profile picture of the author Mike Hill
                  Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

                  Are you sure about that? If i drew it, I would be the owner of the picture, no matter who was in it.
                  Yes I'm entirely sure, look it up or better yet look to my last post for the answer. Kevin is a celebrity so even if you draw it you cannot use it.
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                  • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
                    Originally Posted by Mike Hill View Post

                    Yes I'm entirely sure, look it up or better yet look to my last post for the answer. Kevin is a celebrity so even if you draw it you cannot use it.
                    Fine. I changed up the image and used the smudge tool on his face so now he doesn't even remotely look like a human being and I even added a sombrero. Now are you happy?
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      • Profile picture of the author TerranceCharles
        1st, they picked the RIGHT niche. "How to Make Money Blogging" something millions of people want to learn. 2nd, they create good content that solves that problem. 3 million new blogs come online every month, that's a market! 3rd, they utilized the right social media networks to make their content viral and get noticed.

        4th, they've built solid branding through these social media networks and blog sharing platforms. 5th, they've built their blog readership in the 1000's so that whenever they have a new blog post, they hit their subscribers 1st to create leverage and bring them back to the site, to do one thing - share the content again.

        6th, They've created their own blogging courses and made recommendations to their list keeping the money and sharing coming in, creating leverage. 7th, They utilized guest posting on other blogs to consistantly get noticed and bring in new readers, and also attend popular social media conferences to increase their brand.

        8th - Rinse and repeat and at this time, your audience know who you are, love your content and are conditioned to share them whenever a new post is created. It's hard work, and does take a while, I am a blogger myself and it's not overnight, but these are the same steps they've used. BIGGEST assett, (Email List.)
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    • Profile picture of the author shane_k
      @TheSalesBooster

      You started out good

      Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

      They pretty much started during the IM boom years ago and they were one of the few IM blogs around. Back then nearly everyone was a newbie and blogging for money was a big thing.
      Then you veered into your own lala land

      Slowly both blogs kind of died off over the years

      Shoemoney's blog use to be interesting back in the day,

      Who knows, but the site hasn't been very relevant for awhile now.

      Can't say much about johnchow I know he's still around promoting his "internet celebrity" status. I don't think hes been relevant for awhile either.
      So where in the OP's original question did he ask people to insert their opinions of whether or not it's appropriate to setup a blogging site?

      And where in the OP's origninal question did he ask people to insert their personal opinions on what they think of John Chow or Shoemoney?

      Hint; He didn't

      Originally Posted by TheSalesBooster View Post

      What ever helps you sleep at night. Stay on topic or don't post at all.
      So BEFORE you tell someone "who is a respected member of this forum" to stay on topic or don't post at all, it might be a good idea to follow your own advice first.
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      • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
        Originally Posted by BarberShop View Post

        Such as?

        What would the JohnChow and ShoeMoney of today be doing? What's the equivalent today of blogging for money in 2005?
        Originally Posted by BarberShop View Post

        ^^ I appreciate the candor. Its a nice wake up call. I was planning there for a second to start a blog.
        Originally Posted by BarberShop View Post

        What do you recommend doing for earning big bucks?


        --------------------------------------------------



        Originally Posted by shane_k View Post

        @TheSalesBooster

        You started out good



        Then you veered into your own lala land



        So where in the OP's original question did he ask people to insert their opinions of whether or not it's appropriate to setup a blogging site?

        And where in the OP's origninal question did he ask people to insert their personal opinions on what they think of John Chow or Shoemoney?

        Hint; He didn't



        So BEFORE you tell someone "who is a respected member of this forum" to stay on topic or don't post at all, it might be a good idea to follow your own advice first.

        Looks like he was interested with what I had to say and I'd say it was on topic.
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      • Profile picture of the author DubDubDubDot
        Originally Posted by shane_k View Post

        where in the OP's origninal question did he ask people to insert their personal opinions on what they think of John Chow or Shoemoney?

        Hint; He didn't
        Sorry for the thread not complying to the requirements of your OCD. In the future we will try to make sure all replies are exactly related to the thread title.
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  • Profile picture of the author mikelmraz
    A few months ago, John Chow had 78k Twitter followers. Now he has 98k. I highly doubt his traffic is dropping. I regularly check what he has for lunch.
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    • Profile picture of the author TheSalesBooster
      Originally Posted by mikelmraz View Post

      A few months ago, John Chow had 78k Twitter followers. Now he has 98k. I highly doubt his traffic is dropping. I regularly check what he has for lunch.
      Never read john chow much, but there's a problem with your example... Using twitter users as an example of how much traffic someone gets is flawed. How do you know those twitter followers came from his blog traffic? How do you even know those twitter followers are real? It's so easy to fake twitter followers that almost everyone does it. It's a poor example to use.
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  • Profile picture of the author celente
    these guys have been around for years and years...since day one and have good quality content, that gets linked to and fro. That alone can overload your servers with traffic. QUALITY is KING as they say.
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  • Profile picture of the author himanuzo
    Both JohnChow & ShoeMoney are massive traffic in "internet marketing" niche and they are in top 100,000 Alexa.com. You can get traffic from them through guest blogging.

    Although this time "internet marketing" niche is not booming era, you still can start a blog that related to "internet marketing" niche then get into the top 100,000 Alexa.com.
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  • Profile picture of the author webmaster1742
    I love shoemoney check photo!
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  • Profile picture of the author BarberShop
    I'm glad we had this conversation guys.
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    Make Money Online Fast (With No Money)
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  • Profile picture of the author brettb
    Be the first person in a new niche and you can easily replicate their success.
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    ÖŽ FindABlog: Find blogs to comment on, guest posting opportunities and more ÖŽ
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    • Profile picture of the author ShoeMoney
      Originally Posted by brettb View Post

      Be the first person in a new niche and you can easily replicate their success.
      I somewhat agree with this. However in my case I tripped over a rock and fell into it.

      I never thought my blog would make a dollar.

      The value to my blog is MUCH bigger in leveraging it for my other stuff.
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  • Profile picture of the author BarberShop
    ^^ that's actually the exact answer I was looking for, originally. Thx
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  • Profile picture of the author Fazal Mayar
    They started back when Im was booming but I like John, he is a good man and blogger. He has a lot of passion and now he is lauching products that work, John knows his stuff
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  • Profile picture of the author Adie
    Successful bloggers like Shoemoney, Chow, Darren Rowse, and even the owner of gone-with-the-wind blog dosh-dosh did not and does not spend time in forums like us, that's why they are successful... and that's why they are not well known here for most members.

    There are other successful bloggers that have really useful content and are seldom mentioned here. Dailyblogtips, myseoblog.net, kikolani - to name a few. Doshdosh was famous before until it disappeared and the reason was unclear. it had a very good content and I enjoyed reading them...
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    Moderator's Note: You're only allowed to put your own products or sites in your signature.

    Signature edited.
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