Go Back   WarriorForum - Internet Marketing Forums > The Warrior Forum > Main Internet Marketing Discussion Forum
Register Blogs FAQ Social Groups CalendarHelp Desk

Reply
 
Share
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 02-17-2013, 03:11 PM   #51
Tunnel Vision
War Room Member
 
thedanbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Montreal
Posts: 1,385
Thanks: 8
Thanked 219 Times in 183 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's YouTube Profile
Contact Info
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Extremely short-sighted! He most likely won't be getting any design work in the near future unless he creates an alias.

thedanbrown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2013, 03:14 PM   #52
Most Interesting Man - WF
 
PerformanceMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 2,340
Thanks: 153
Thanked 532 Times in 392 Posts
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by thedanbrown View Post
Extremely short-sighted! He most likely won't be getting any design work in the near future unless he creates an alias.
That's what I think too. Plus his name is associated with this mess when people search.

He started out blasting them but he's getting hit with the backlash too.
PerformanceMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2013, 06:37 PM   #53
Senior Warrior Member
War Room Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: , , USA.
Posts: 11,607
Thanks: 5,767
Thanked 2,136 Times in 1,805 Posts
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Most people ******DON'T****** pay until the work is done. Don't you see the hypocrisy? People here complain that they get substandard work after paying, and members tell them to NEVER pay in advance and then YOU say to NEVER work without getting paid in advance.

We may never know the TRUTH. did the customer do something wrong, or force it out of scope? Is the web designer simply a jerk that failed? WHO KNOWS?

But you CAN'T do this. So the "web designer" is in the wrong.

Steve
seasoned is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2013, 06:40 PM   #54
Senior Warrior Member
War Room Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: , , USA.
Posts: 11,607
Thanks: 5,767
Thanked 2,136 Times in 1,805 Posts
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raydal View Post
Web hosting companies do the same thing all the time.
Except that their replacement websites may have a kinder
message.

-Ray Edwards
They DO have a kinder message AND, if you pay the bill, EVERYTHING is BACK!
seasoned is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 05:00 PM   #55
I'm Batman
War Room Member
 
ronrule's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 990
Thanks: 244
Thanked 923 Times in 497 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's Twitter Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by alksense View Post
I get wanting to get paid and getting more and more frustrated with no replies but I think there are better ways of going about it if your goal is really to get the money that you are owed... many of which have already been mentioned here.

By hurting their business he's only lessening his chances of getting paid...

I checked yesterday morning and their Yelp page ranked them 4.5 stars, now it's down to 2.5 and I'm sure it will keep going down:

Fitness SF - SoMa - San Francisco, CA
That right there is the biggest problem when people do stuff like this... all of the bandwagon jumpers who want to throw their 2 cents into the mix who had no familiarity with either company before this went viral.

They'll probably sue him, and they'll probably win, but reputation damage that has nothing to do with their product will be a lot more costly to repair.

ronrule is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 05:24 PM   #56
SEO Specialist
War Room Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 287
Thanks: 55
Thanked 59 Times in 40 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's Twitter Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diice View Post
I think this is a childish move.

The agency were stupid enough to do the work without receiving the payment first. Some people are just stupid. Do the work they have paid you for, not the work they 'might' pay you for.

The agency is simply bitter for a mistake which it has made, both parties are in the wrong.
You're obviously not a web designer
The norm in web design is to take a deposit and then the remainder upon completion, it's certainly not the norm to get paid up front, so the fact he didn't get paid 100% up front, isn't a mistake on his part. 50% up front & 50% on completion is the most common structure.
Plus, he's not an "agency" he's a freelance designer.
The other thing people are not taking into consideration is that this guy is in Germany - in Germany bad debt is much more rare than it is in most countries, people just up when they say they will, and when German firms work with companies in other countries where the norm is to try to hold off paying until absolutely necessary, it's understandable that they would react differently.

I don't think anyone can really judge though because we don't know all the facts - and there are two sides to every story.

KevL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 05:31 PM   #57
I'm Batman
War Room Member
 
ronrule's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 990
Thanks: 244
Thanked 923 Times in 497 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's Twitter Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevL View Post
You're obviously not a web designer
The norm in web design is to take a deposit and then the remainder upon completion, it's certainly not the norm to get paid up front, so the fact he didn't get paid 100% up front, isn't a mistake on his part. 50% up front & 50% on completion is the most common structure.
Dude 50/50 is a terrible deal for a web designer. If you're still billing clients this way, you're doing a lot more work than you should be.

Here's what happens every time with this arrangement:

Client: I want it to look like X
Designer: Ok, that will be 50% up front
(designer does the work, exactly to the client's spec)
Designer: Ok, I'm done, I'll take my other 50% now.
Client: Oooh... yeah, I want to change this and this and this and this and this and this and this and I'm not paying you the other 50% until you do those things.

You should be billing in milestones... break the design process up into each of the critical components (wireframe, graphical mockup, HTML, optimization). Bill the client FOR each stage prior to starting it (in this case, 25% of the total quoted price), and require them to approve it before you start the next phase. And in your contract, if you ever have to roll back and change anything that was previously agreed, it's a separate hourly charge. That way you're billing for your work in advance, and if they bail at any point in the process, turn over what they paid for thus far - they aren't entitled to a refund, you delivered as agreed for each milestone. And if they are slow to pay, you are slow to start working.

ronrule is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 05:36 PM   #58
SEO Specialist
War Room Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 287
Thanks: 55
Thanked 59 Times in 40 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's Twitter Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by seasoned View Post
Most people ******DON'T****** pay until the work is done. Don't you see the hypocrisy? People here complain that they get substandard work after paying, and members tell them to NEVER pay in advance and then YOU say to NEVER work without getting paid in advance.

We may never know the TRUTH. did the customer do something wrong, or force it out of scope? Is the web designer simply a jerk that failed? WHO KNOWS?

But you CAN'T do this. So the "web designer" is in the wrong.

Steve
The client claim that they paid him a portion up front, and he'd not kept up with his obligations so they took someone else on, and he wasn't happy about that and hijacked the site to blackmail them to pay him in full.
He claims that they simply didn't pay up.
So who knows - I said in my last post that there are two sides to every story, I forgot an old saying, that there are three sides to every story and, one side, the other side, and then the truth

I am in web design, so I can certainly sympathize with this guy - although I am very lucky to work with brilliant clients most of the time, who do pay - and I can only think of one client who didn't pay, and no I didn't post a nasty message on their site...

I don't think it's fair to judge because none of us are in possession of the full facts, but I disagree that you "can't do this" - obviously you can, as he did... whether you SHOULD is a different matter, but again we just don't know the facts. In my opinion, what he has done has won favour with lots of other freelance designers - but other freelance designers are not his potential clients...I think he's done something very risky in terms of the media publicity this has given him, because it's not the kind of thing that is likely to impress a potential client!

KevL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 05:41 PM   #59
I'm Batman
War Room Member
 
ronrule's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 990
Thanks: 244
Thanked 923 Times in 497 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's Twitter Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Best thing this guy could do right now is shift professions... use the publicity he's garnered to start a website that outs non-paying companies. He'll have the press talking about it, and the designers who support him posting clients to it. Monetize it by allowing the clients to pay to remove themselves.

You know, like those Mugshot sites. Or the Better Business Bureau.

At least that's what I would do if it was my 15 minutes in this situation, because I sure as hell wouldn't be working as a web designer again. :P

ronrule is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 05:43 PM   #60
HyperActive Warrior
 
sparkah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 139
Thanks: 8
Thanked 24 Times in 21 Posts
Social Networking View Member's YouTube Profile
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

#1. WOW. Frank is really good at typography!

#2. You never have to go that far: I ALWAYS START every client relationship with a glowing positive review about them on my blog.

You might wonder what that has to do with the price of...

a. they love the review so much they treat me well
b. the implied threat that I can change that review at any time looms </evil>

I'm a writer for Forbes and Fast Company.
Also, I did this: 25 Google SEO Secrets You've Never Heard of --- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbZcykUNUg8
sparkah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 05:48 PM   #61
HyperActive Warrior
War Room Member
 
nasuryono's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: City of Warriors (Literal Translation of a City)
Posts: 497
Thanks: 4
Thanked 127 Times in 63 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's Twitter Profile 
Contact Info
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

It's essential to be clear up front about payment terms, etc.

I do this with all my offline clients. I deliver on time and I expect them to pay on time.

That's the deal.

nasuryono is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 05:51 PM   #62
SEO Specialist
War Room Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 287
Thanks: 55
Thanked 59 Times in 40 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's Twitter Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronrule View Post
Dude 50/50 is a terrible deal for a web designer. If you're still billing clients this way, you're doing a lot more work than you should be.

Here's what happens every time with this arrangement:

Client: I want it to look like X
Designer: Ok, that will be 50% up front
(designer does the work, exactly to the client's spec)
Designer: Ok, I'm done, I'll take my other 50% now.
Client: Oooh... yeah, I want to change this and this and this and this and this and this and this and I'm not paying you the other 50% until you do those things.

You should be billing in milestones... break the design process up into each of the critical components (wireframe, graphical mockup, HTML, optimization). Bill the client 25% of the job prior to each stage, and require them to approve it before you start the next phase. And in your contract, if you ever have to roll back and change anything that was previously agreed, it's a separate hourly charge. That way you're billing for your work in advance... if they are slow to pay, you are slow to start working.
I have been in web design for several years, and the scenario you have said above, i have never experienced....

here's how it usually goes for me:

The client pays 50%
The process starts with the mockup, any amends required, continues through to the coding stage - any more amends requested & processed - fully developed and goes live.
The client pays the final 50%

In your description you seem to be missing out some crucial elements, for instance the client being able to request amends because they simply don't like any elements of the mockup. We can't just tell the client that it's to their specs so they have to like it. I know I wouldn't accept that as the client.

What does sometimes happen is that the client takes time to get stuff to me, which slows things down and is a bit of a pain, this is more often to happen with schools, and large companies, than with small to medium businesses, but luckily I don't experience what you're describing, so I must be lucky with my clients!

If you're in web design and you work this way - then you must love faffing about with invoices and contracts I don't...

In your description though you seem to be missing out the amends stage - are you saying that you expect a client to pay because the designer says that it has been done "to the clients specs"? The client is the only one who knows whether the site is how they want it to be, and at this stage amends can be requested.

KevL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 05:53 PM   #63
SEO Specialist
War Room Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 287
Thanks: 55
Thanked 59 Times in 40 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's Twitter Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronrule View Post
Best thing this guy could do right now is shift professions... use the publicity he's garnered to start a website that outs non-paying companies. He'll have the press talking about it, and the designers who support him posting clients to it. Monetize it by allowing the clients to pay to remove themselves.

You know, like those Mugshot sites. Or the Better Business Bureau.

At least that's what I would do if it was my 15 minutes in this situation, because I sure as hell wouldn't be working as a web designer again. :P
Agree with this! Great idea!!

KevL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 06:01 PM   #64
I'm Batman
War Room Member
 
ronrule's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 990
Thanks: 244
Thanked 923 Times in 497 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's Twitter Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevL View Post
I have been in web design for several years, and the scenario you have said above, i have never experienced....

here's how it usually goes for me:

The client pays 50%
The process starts with the mockup, any amends required, continues through to the coding stage - any more amends requested & processed - fully developed and goes live.
The client pays the final 50%

In your description you seem to be missing out some crucial elements, for instance the client being able to request amends because they simply don't like any elements of the mockup. We can't just tell the client that it's to their specs so they have to like it. I know I wouldn't accept that as the client.
No, of course not, what I'm saying is by using milestones you get that stuff dialed in within each stage after you've been paid, not at the end while you're waiting for payment. On an $8k website (that's the minimum) I'm sure as heck not going to have my guys do all of the work and wait around to get paid. I still have to pay them whether the client pays or not. This method guarantees we aren't doing any work we aren't being paid for, and gets all of the little nitpicky changes worked out early on when it's easy to correct them. No surprises at the end.

Wireframe is always first, so how elements are going to be laid out on the page are clear up front. That's working directly with the customer to design them... no graphical mockups begin until the site wireframe and navigation are completed. Then they pay for the mockups, and we deliver 3 that we feel are close to what they're looking for. Usually one of them is pretty close to the mark, and we tweak from there - all still working in photoshop, no code, until it's to the client's liking. Once that's approved they pay for the build out phase (at which point they've had plenty of time to get their content written and have a feel for how it's going to flow on the site). Then their content is optimized and they're done.

Quote:
What does sometimes happen is that the client takes time to get stuff to me, which slows things down and is a bit of a pain, this is more often to happen with schools, and large companies, than with small to medium businesses, but luckily I don't experience what you're describing, so I must be lucky with my clients!
That's what is great about this method - it actually frees the team up so we can handle more projects at a time than we could using the 50/50 method. If a user has delayed getting something required to move into the next step - like content (or payment) - we've already been paid for all of the work that's been done thus far so we aren't obligated to do anything else for them yet. That keeps us free to work on other projects.

Quote:
If you're in web design and you work this way - then you must love faffing about with invoices and contracts I don't...
It's just basic protection... keeps everyone focused and on the same page. It's a lot better to find out we completely missed the point in the wireframe or photoshop phase, than after we've coded something out and imported content. By using this methodology, there is never any arguing - the client is a part of each step of the process, and is paying as they go. We never have to bug them to pay up for work we've done, and they never come back at the end and say they want to change something (unless they're willing to pay for that change, because they already agreed to how it was done the first time).

I've also never had to give a refund. Sometimes clients financial situations change and they can't continue with a site we're in the middle of. So at that point, we would turn over the wireframe or photoshop PSD and let them know we're available to continue if they're ever ready. But they OWN that material as they pay for it, if they wanted to hire another firm to pick up the ball later that's fine, we still got paid for everything we did.

You should try it man, it's a great system. I did the 50/50 thing for years... got burned too many times by the last minute nitpickers.

ronrule is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 09:10 PM   #65
Mind Warrior
War Room Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 2,151
Thanks: 218
Thanked 324 Times in 284 Posts
Social Networking View Member's Twitter Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

This designer showed neurotic behavior, after making the mistake of not getting paid before working. Two mistakes, one after another, but there are people who believe that he was ‘defending a cause’.







clever7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 09:12 PM   #66
I'm Batman
War Room Member
 
ronrule's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 990
Thanks: 244
Thanked 923 Times in 497 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's Twitter Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Yeah, he was defending a cause... his constitutionally-protected freedom of jackassery. :P

ronrule is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 10:46 PM   #67
Warrior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 23
Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

I don't have anything to remark about the story, because I haven't finished reading the article yet. I just want to point out that I go to a Fitness SF gym and they're mighty fine.

The "Fitness SF" chain actually used to be Gold's Gym franchises, but they got tired of the franchise fee and split. I think they publicly said they split off because of Gold's Gym's stance on gay rights issues, but that's very questionable.

Get More Customers - Promote Your Website, Business, or Product (website under construction)
GetMoreCustomers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 11:06 PM   #68
Advanced Warrior
War Room Member
 
preets's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: India
Posts: 679
Thanks: 73
Thanked 121 Times in 38 Posts
Social Networking View Member's Twitter Profile 
Contact Info
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

I don't think this is the right way to take out your frustration. Firstly it is our mistake that we did not asked to advance payment. Though this does not mean that such person can be spared. Recently, I have also came across such situation, I did the work I got from a Warrior Member and did not asked for upfront payment. After I completed his work, I send the Invoice but he did not pay my invoice and also changed his Username and Password for his hosting and wordpress I contacted him several times through skype, email, facebook but he did not responded. I was very annoyed and wanted to name him publicly but my ethics did not allow me to do so. If someone wants to know his name, he/she can PM me and I will disclose his name for the sake of avoiding another fraud.

Can anybody tell me where I can report.

Thanks

Preeti

BUY HIGH QUALITY BACKLINKS | Visit My Blog For Free Traffic Tips | <--WARRIOR NEED YOUR HELP-->
Wordpress Developer | Sales Page Designing | Affiliate Site Development | HTML Website
|
preets is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2013, 11:13 PM   #69
WarriorWill.com
War Room Member
 
WillR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Australia
Posts: 11,573
Thanks: 2,228
Thanked 7,828 Times in 3,896 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

None of us here know the full story so it's very easy for us to pick a side but without knowing who was actually in the wrong, it's very hard to make an educated comment.

If the business was not paying what they were supposed to and had not removed his work from their site, good on him. Too many people let customers walk all over them nowadays. Nice to see someone taking a stand.

But again, we don't know the full story. Ofcourse the gym is going to come out with a statement saying it was his fault. Any business with half a brain would do that. But I find it very odd that someone who had been paid properly would go to these lengths. That's why I am not believing the gyms comeback.

As for the people saying this will ruin his reputation... are you kidding? This will all be forgotten about in a few days time. I bet you if I asked you this guys name in 3 weeks time you'd draw a blank face at me. You know you would. This will not make one bit of difference to his reputation apart from the new clients he gets as a result of him taking a stand.

On the other side of the coin, this could all just be a well organized publicity stunt. It's been done before.

WillR is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 04:58 AM   #70
SEO Specialist
War Room Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 287
Thanks: 55
Thanked 59 Times in 40 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's Twitter Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronrule View Post
No, of course not, what I'm saying is by using milestones you get that stuff dialed in within each stage after you've been paid, not at the end while you're waiting for payment. On an $8k website (that's the minimum) I'm sure as heck not going to have my guys do all of the work and wait around to get paid. I still have to pay them whether the client pays or not. This method guarantees we aren't doing any work we aren't being paid for, and gets all of the little nitpicky changes worked out early on when it's easy to correct them. No surprises at the end.

Wireframe is always first, so how elements are going to be laid out on the page are clear up front. That's working directly with the customer to design them... no graphical mockups begin until the site wireframe and navigation are completed. Then they pay for the mockups, and we deliver 3 that we feel are close to what they're looking for. Usually one of them is pretty close to the mark, and we tweak from there - all still working in photoshop, no code, until it's to the client's liking. Once that's approved they pay for the build out phase (at which point they've had plenty of time to get their content written and have a feel for how it's going to flow on the site). Then their content is optimized and they're done.



That's what is great about this method - it actually frees the team up so we can handle more projects at a time than we could using the 50/50 method. If a user has delayed getting something required to move into the next step - like content (or payment) - we've already been paid for all of the work that's been done thus far so we aren't obligated to do anything else for them yet. That keeps us free to work on other projects.



It's just basic protection... keeps everyone focused and on the same page. It's a lot better to find out we completely missed the point in the wireframe or photoshop phase, than after we've coded something out and imported content. By using this methodology, there is never any arguing - the client is a part of each step of the process, and is paying as they go. We never have to bug them to pay up for work we've done, and they never come back at the end and say they want to change something (unless they're willing to pay for that change, because they already agreed to how it was done the first time).

I've also never had to give a refund. Sometimes clients financial situations change and they can't continue with a site we're in the middle of. So at that point, we would turn over the wireframe or photoshop PSD and let them know we're available to continue if they're ever ready. But they OWN that material as they pay for it, if they wanted to hire another firm to pick up the ball later that's fine, we still got paid for everything we did.

You should try it man, it's a great system. I did the 50/50 thing for years... got burned too many times by the last minute nitpickers.
Cheers - but this seems far to complex for my liking, and my clients liking... and I simply haven't been burned by nitpickers, so the 50/50 method works fine for me.

KevL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 04:24 PM   #71
Happy Hooker
War Room Member
 
JohnMcCabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: North of the Peace River, Florida, USA.
Posts: 11,429
Thanks: 4,542
Thanked 8,712 Times in 4,428 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's Twitter Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by WillR View Post
As for the people saying this will ruin his reputation... are you kidding? This will all be forgotten about in a few days time. I bet you if I asked you this guys name in 3 weeks time you'd draw a blank face at me. You know you would. This will not make one bit of difference to his reputation apart from the new clients he gets as a result of him taking a stand.
Whether I remember his name or not isn't important. I don't have to.

Even if I wanted to hire him, all I would have to do is search on his name, and this little hissy fit would come up front and center. At which point I would think more than twice befor hiring him.

New clients as a result of taking a stand? I think potential clients would worry about whether he has an encore in him, and that they would be the latest "stand".

Quote:
Originally Posted by WillR View Post
On the other side of the coin, this could all just be a well organized publicity stunt. It's been done before.
And it will be done again.

What are Verified Buyers saying? (Click to get the scoop)

"MUST HAVE for anyone wanting to learn...how to handle it."
"Overall, this product will teach how to be successful with email marketing..."

Email Marketing: How to Turn Strangers Into Buyers and Buyers Into Raving Fans [Kindle]
JohnMcCabe is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 07:48 PM   #72
WarriorWill.com
War Room Member
 
WillR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Australia
Posts: 11,573
Thanks: 2,228
Thanked 7,828 Times in 3,896 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post
Whether I remember his name or not isn't important. I don't have to.

Even if I wanted to hire him, all I would have to do is search on his name, and this little hissy fit would come up front and center. At which point I would think more than twice befor hiring him.
I doubt most of his clients come from searching his name on Google. Even when people found this web design agency, do you really think the average person would go and Google the owners name? I don't think so.

As others rightfully commented below the article, the only people who would have a problem hiring someone like this are those who don't want to pay him. If you pay him then there shouldn't be any problems.

I wouldn't hesitate hiring this guy. At least he sticks up for his rights and isn't just a yes man like far too many developers and vendors on the Internet. We need more people like this guy.

I find it odd the number of people who are against what this guy did and are product vendors or service providers themselves. You don't like people standing up for what is rightfully theirs? Why on earth would this guy waste his time doing all of this if he had been paid on time.

I say good on him. Why let clients walk all over you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post
New clients as a result of taking a stand? I think potential clients would worry about whether he has an encore in him, and that they would be the latest "stand".
I very much doubt it. I can almost guarantee you as a result of this exposure this guy would have gained a lot more clients than he has lost. Anyone who saw the story and didn't like his stance would just never use him, but they never knew about him before. The people who read it and did like his stance now know about him and can hire him.

WillR is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 07:55 PM   #73
Expert Coach
War Room Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,018
Thanks: 21
Thanked 229 Times in 174 Posts
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

As a businessman and also as a client, that is a stupid, stupid move. I would never ever do that. It is so unprofessional and childish. If you really had a legitimate beef, then a plain "This site is temporarily unavailable." message would have gotten the message across loud and clear.

IMSince2003 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 08:26 PM   #74
Senior Warrior Member
War Room Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: , , USA.
Posts: 11,607
Thanks: 5,767
Thanked 2,136 Times in 1,805 Posts
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevL View Post
I disagree that you "can't do this" - obviously you can, as he did... whether you SHOULD is a different matter, but again we just don't know the facts. In my opinion, what he has done has won favour with lots of other freelance designers - but other freelance designers are not his potential clients...I think he's done something very risky in terms of the media publicity this has given him, because it's not the kind of thing that is likely to impress a potential client!
I meant legally you can't. He could be in a lot of trouble. hey, I had a company conspire to steal my code. They had the AUDACITY to ask me if they had the right to transfer my code to another. They did, KEYWORD???? ******DID****** they THEN went bankrupt, could not pay the bills, and sued me under an obscure rule in the bankruptcy code making me, retroactively a SLAVE! ALSO, that was a BREACH of the contract that said they code transfer my code.

I have had others take credit for my code. Recently, I had a run in with a company that lied about several things and my code will likely be used THERE.

So I can sympathize ALSO!

Steve
seasoned is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2013, 05:29 PM   #75
Happy Hooker
War Room Member
 
JohnMcCabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: North of the Peace River, Florida, USA.
Posts: 11,429
Thanks: 4,542
Thanked 8,712 Times in 4,428 Posts
Social Networking View Member's FaceBook Profile  View Member's Twitter Profile 
Default Re: So you're mad at a client who didn't pay promptly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by WillR View Post
I doubt most of his clients come from searching his name on Google. Even when people found this web design agency, do you really think the average person would go and Google the owners name? I don't think so.
In a day and age when people run background checks before hiring a dishwasher, you don't believe people would run a simple name search before signing a four or five-figure contract? Really?

As for the people who see this as some kind of heroic stand, where only the cheats need to fear, they can have him. Whether he's in the right or not, it's a demonstration of irrational, compulsive behavior. Something I would worry about, lest some other perceived slight or disrespect set him off.

You would eagerly hire this hero. I wouldn't hire this psycho. Let's agree to disagree, eh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WillR View Post
I very much doubt it. I can almost guarantee you as a result of this exposure this guy would have gained a lot more clients than he has lost. Anyone who saw the story and didn't like his stance would just never use him, but they never knew about him before. The people who read it and did like his stance now know about him and can hire him.
Only time will tell on this one. I have a hunch, though, that the people who like his stance might still fear his behavior.

What are Verified Buyers saying? (Click to get the scoop)

"MUST HAVE for anyone wanting to learn...how to handle it."
"Overall, this product will teach how to be successful with email marketing..."

Email Marketing: How to Turn Strangers Into Buyers and Buyers Into Raving Fans [Kindle]
JohnMcCabe is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

  WarriorForum - Internet Marketing Forums > The Warrior Forum > Main Internet Marketing Discussion Forum

Bookmarks

Tags
client, mad, pay, promptly

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:58 AM.