Affiliate Marketing - A Flawed Business Model?

by art72
20 replies
This subject has been gnawing at my brain since last week when I started researching and reading the history of affiliate marketing. Specifically, online or internet marketing.

There are several points I'd like to mention that are relative to every warrior here, and I found no better comfort then seeking your opinions to this thread, and in exposing some sensitive realities concerning affiliate marketing.

First off, I am not implying anything about ethics or even your integrity as an affiliate marketer, or hammering on anyone new to the game. Obviously, I am an affiliate marketer too.

O.k., so I am looking at the enormous potential and opportunity the internet offers to anyone with an ounce of salt and is willing to put forth a sincere effort to earn a living online. Naturally, affiliate marketing is one of the easiest platforms from which one can get started in, and capitalize on the potential return for their sincere efforts, right?

Being most product owners or vendors supply our advertising (i.e. creatives, text ads, landing pages, email scripts, etc...) and offer a plenty of legit opportunities to earn revenue from their products, services, or what not's... we should maintain a certain level of respect, and preserve the future of these opportunities, no?

However, I must question the sincerity of 'publishers' (*myself included) who put themselves in the way of consumers, and strategically embody ourselves around these promotions.

Speaking for myself, I perform my due diligence before buying anything, and these days it's critical in receiving value in exchange for the release of my hard earned money.

So, on behalf of those who do optin or make purchases through my sincerest efforts, I lose very little sleep at night, knowing; I've done my best to ensure those customers (and in essence, my customers) receive value for their hardened dollars.

This morning, around 3: 45 in the morning, as I once again became engrossed in my business and sacrificed sleep for knowledge... I had this burning revelation that this business model, affiliate marketing in itself; is severely flawed.

How so?

Simple. Out of the 10', 100's, or even 1000's of products at our disposal we can earn commissions from, such as; eBooks, training, software, templates, to plugins, and everything in between in relation to niches such as weight loss, acne, and even kindle amazon or amazon stores...

Who of us really knows what is in the inner-wrappings of the items we're pushing?

Sure of the 100+ products I promote and embodying into my own personal campaigns, I have purchased maybe a handful of these items and can speak from true experience, and stand firm in knowing; they definitely over-deliver, or in the least, deliver dollar for dollar true value.

However, the other 97 is solely based on performing tons of research, before I can even think about promoting an offer. Some better than others perhaps.

But... as I look deeper into my own promotions, and all the hours I am currently spending researching products, writing quality content to compliment these products, I really cannot say; "This is the absolute solution that a prospective buyer is seeking" - or - "Guarantee the product isn't just a giant turd!" - it's a numbers game, of course.

While, I understand people are going to buy espresso machines, or a book on amazon and I need not concern myself or in reading into it too deeply, this thread derives more from all this crap I am sifting through trying to find decent, not great, just decent products... like along the lines of eBooks for various niches. Many of these rehashed PLR piles of crap ain't worth the digital pixels used to display them, let alone what's under the hood, so to speak.

I am tired of competing with garbage and yet should probably welcome and embrace it, for in the long run, it'll make me better for it, and likely sustain a more suitable audience as I remain keen on providing value, sure.

My point is this:

With no real rules governing over 'us' publishers in promoting umpteen amounts of products that we ourselves have never used, read, or likely will ever purchase... does it make any sense whatsoever to create such fallacies in our marketing?

As an example, I watched a popular marketers free videos when I started, Chris F's to be exact, and it taught me 'how-to' upload my files via FTP, and install my first ever WP site.

I was forever grateful, naturally... it was free, and I got a ton of value, let alone the excitement of having my 1st website up .

However, I immediately started promoting one of his $97 per month training courses based on reviews compiled from research, not by way of actual experiencing what was inside the members area, and did get a trickle of sales. *This was when I was a newbie.

Now we see people shooting flaming arrows at the WSO threads, and all the hyped up push button junk plastered all over the internet that either doesn't deliver any real value to anyone, less the guru's or marketers whose lazy customers do not demand a refund, or demand they get what they paid for... This, is a major problem for product owners and publishers alike, as their are great WSO's and great training & software that can aid us all to market more efficiently.

We see CB tightening up, and we see (2) things happening; those who remain vendors are offering better products, delivering better value to a degree in many cases, or the junk product creators bail and jump on the next platform that flat out doesn't give a @#$% what they sell, as long as they get their cut.

So, we seek a product review...

99% are fake reviews written by publishers who never intend to buy the product, but rather make money off the unsuspecting visitors who haven't a clue how this all works. Being we have the inside scoop so to speak, doesn't it make sense we preserve the industry, uphold some integrity in what we do, what we sell, and ultimately, provide value to customers?

Look, I get it. I see the entire matrix, how it works, why it works, the leverage aspect, down to the upsells and big monthly memberships that can earn affiliates some serious recurring cash.

But even those whom I believe are sincere, and offer value such as Chris F mentioned prior, odds are 95% of those who do stumble upon a real product, with real training, and purchase it; will likely never put forth the any real effort to actually apply or implement the knowledge...

Partly due to their own making, and I believe; largely impart perhaps to having been misled so many times, they don't know right from wrong techniques. Others suffer from shiny object syndrome, naturally.

At times affiliate marketing reminds me of those carney's who sold hair tonic regrowth formula's that were promising to solve someone's balding problem, and they built great esteem and compelled balding sufferers to jump on the chance it could work with marketing strategies... only to leave buyers beaten down, - not only out of their hard earned money, but more importantly, the fact their search to cure their buyers balding head was not providing value as the sufferer expected!

Gals... Guys, I will openly admit, I am 40 years old, weigh a whooping 150lbs soaking wet with a ripped stomach, and I promote weight loss products, among several other niches, and I really have little use for these products personally.

I understand the game, no doubt.

All I am saying is in order to preserve our markets. In order to expand the affiliate business model itself before new laws and regulations hammer us to dust, which I believe can and will happen (and might need to happen to clear the chaff from the wheat)... in the very least - research your affiliate products. Give a moment to see beyond the ease in which we can sling sh#t, and ask yourself; am I preserving the future business model for the next? -or- am I just f#@king it up for everyone including myself?

This is a business. Treat it as such.

Lastly, while I openly admit to focusing my efforts on highly searched keywords, LSI keywords, and use what I have learned here to generate 'some' income,( and intend to get better at it)... I cannot help but look deeper at to where these affiliate marketing opportunities can take those who put forth a sincere effort to provide quality, value, and a resolve to potential buyers problems. -In that regard, the potential is truly unlimited!!!

After reading a press release about a new product, and clearly being able to see through the BS this person wrote about a specific product, it was so dry, so bland, so full of holes, it was obvious; they didn't buy the product. They didn't use the product. They probably didn't even watch the sales video. Hell, I'm not even sure they did much more than find a high gravity CB product, look at the commission, and go "NEXT!" - and in doing so waste internet real estate doing so!

Btw, this is a person respected for her advice, her powerful writing, an in direct affiliation to major news feeds around the globe. Yet, she's using this 'flawed' model like a chump!

The title was a rhetorical question, as "You're damn right this is a seriously flawed business model in several ways, that doesn't mean we shouldn't make every effort to correct upon it!"

Sorry for the rant, 2 hours sleep, a ton of brainstorming, and the result... this thread.

All the Best,

Art

PS- I am not implying that I am not guilty by association, neither that I've truly honed in on my eventual business plans online. It's more over a request to "in the least' add value, do proper research, and if nothing less, try to deliver value to that balding dude who's entire life centers around succeeding at finding a resolve.

It really does matter, both for the future of this business model, and the ability to build trust and long term success with your list, and buyers. There too, it's respectful to those who present the opportunity 'for us' to publish and earn from their hard work and efforts.

Please comment, and share what you believe can preserve the future of the affiliate marketing business model, both for your business, and especially, the next who sees this grand vision.
#affiliate #business #flawed #marketing #model
  • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
    Banned
    Hi Art

    Originally Posted by art72 View Post

    Who of us really knows what is in the inner-wrappings of the items we're pushing?
    The more serious, successful, pro-affiliates tend to. They already know quite a bit about the niche -otherwise they wouldn't be interested in promoting the product, clearly - and never promote anything without examining it carefully and contacting the vendor. (That still excludes most affiliates, I grant you).

    I'm thinking mostly of "information products" here. Not people with websites offering a comparative review of 12 different makes of wide-screen TV. Nobody expects those affiliates to have every product (unless they're pretending to be a "consumer reviews magazine" or something, in which case they're deceiving their customers).

    Originally Posted by art72 View Post

    this thread derives more from all this crap I am sifting through trying to find decent, not great, just decent products... like along the lines of eBooks for various niches.
    Ok, we're on the same page.

    Yes, this is very time-consuming, but it affects your long-term income hugely. Because in affiliate marketing, most of the long-term income comes from repeat sales to the same customers, so you have to be as sure as you can that they're not going to be disappointed. It's all about credibility and trust, isn't it? Otherwise you're not really building a business at all, as much as trying to do a series of "rinse and repeats". That isn't a business.

    Originally Posted by art72 View Post

    Many of these rehashed PLR piles of crap ain't worth the digital pixels used to display them, let alone what's under the hood, so to speak.
    Agreed.

    Over the last 4 and a half years, I've probably spent over 700 hours looking at different ClickBank products and assessing what I can and should promote. I couldn't make a living without having done that. (I happen to make about 80% of my monthly income from ClickBank).

    Originally Posted by art72 View Post

    So, we seek a product review...
    They don't help me at all. They're written by affiliates. I need to see the product itself before I can recommend it to my mother, and if I can't recommend it to my mother (imagining that she's interested in the general subject area to start with, of course), I can't recommend it to anyone on my list. For me, it's about as simple as that.

    Originally Posted by art72 View Post

    doesn't it make sense we preserve the industry, uphold some integrity in what we do, what we sell, and ultimately, provide value to customers?
    Yes.

    Originally Posted by art72 View Post

    But even those whom I believe are sincere, and offer value such as Chris F mentioned prior, odds are 95% of those who do stumble upon a real product, with real training, will never put forth the effort to actually apply the knowledge...
    I agree.

    That's among the (several) reasons why I wouldn't promote that, myself.

    (No offense to Chris F, at all, I hasten to add!).

    Originally Posted by art72 View Post

    At times affiliate marketing reminds me of those carney's who sold hair tonic regrowth formula's that were promising to solve someone's problem, and built great esteem and compelled balding sufferers to jump on the chance it could work... only to leave buyers beaten down, - not only out of their hard earned money, but more importantly, the fact their search to cure their balding head was not as expected!
    I agree.

    There are other, better ways of doing it, though.

    They take up more time, but it's worth it in the long run (is how I look at it).

    Originally Posted by art72 View Post

    .. in the very least research your affiliate products.
    I agree.

    Very good post.

    For me, a lot of it comes down to whether you're trying to build a real business based on personal relationships with people who trust and respect you - the kind of business which is (apart from the monthly income it produces for you) an appreciating asset in its own right.

    Originally Posted by art72 View Post

    Please comment, and share what you believe can preserve the future of the affiliate marketing business model, both for your business, and especially, the next who sees this grand vision.
    Can't comment much further, or add much. I agree with almost everything you said.
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  • Profile picture of the author drewfioravanti
    It's marketing and advertising. You study the market, find its pain points, and frame your offer in a way that it solves that pain.

    If you look at any magazine or on TV, at just about any ad, I highly doubt the actors, writers, directors, etc. felt compelled to buy the product first out of some sort of imposed sense of integrity. Their job is to sell the product. So that's what they do.
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  • Profile picture of the author jgant
    A simple solution to your concern about affiliates not fully understanding the inner workings of a product is for affiliates to buy and use the products they promote. I buy about 95% of the products I promote costing me thousands of dollars over the last few years. The remaining 5% of the time I research it extensively. The only reason I don't buy a particular product is if I already have that product in the product line or have access to it and it's expensive.

    Every ebook I promote in every niche, I buy or am provided a review copy. I actually try the techniques as well. I promote the winners.

    In my local affiliate marketing, I actually hired the local business I promote to the tune of more than $1,500 to see how they would perform.

    Another example is I bought a course and am deploying the techniques in my business. It's cost me $1,500 to deploy and I'm at the 3 month mark extensively using it (fortunately the course techniques are working very well; I've already earned my investment back), but I took a risk. I won't mention this course until I know it works.

    Another solution to your concern (a concern I share with you) if you wish to promote several products in a niche but don't want to buy all of them (especially if they cost thousands of dollars) is travel to the various merchants' place of business and try the stuff out. I'm actually seriously considering this in one niche. The trip may cost a few grand, but the information I'll gather will be invaluable.

    Alternatively, go to a retail store and try the stuff.

    My point is there are simple solutions to your concerns. I totally agree with you about the potentially flawed nature of affiliate marketing that you suggest exists, but there are simple solutions.

    The affiliates that invest in products they promote and provide real value in the form of information stand out and will earn profits while actually helping people.

    I've learned it's far more profitable to promote a few high quality products I use and like and can demonstrate the benefits to readers than promoting tons of stuff I've never used.

    Look at affiliate marketing in a different light

    Have you ever bought anything based on a recommendation? It may have been a recommendation from an affiliate, a friend etc. Now sometimes the recommendation is bad, but many times it's good. I've found real gems and have bought all kinds of stuff I love, use and am super grateful for on the basis of a recommendation.

    If an affiliate does their job and takes the job seriously and is building a real business, value is provided. It's a real service that helps people solve problems.

    Does this mean that just because I love a product and recommend it that a referral won't have the same positive experience I do? Sure, some people will buy based on my good faith recommendation and not have a good experience, but most products offer a refund/have a guarantee. We all buy stuff we don't need/don't like.

    Great post and I'm sure it will inspire a great discussion.
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  • Profile picture of the author Stuart Walker
    In theory before promoting a product any affiliate should buy it and make sure it's legit but often that's not done especially if you know the vendor has a reputation for good quality and you're willing to take the risk that their new product will be the same or often it just isn't practical (say you're an affiliate for luxury holidays or diamond watches for example).

    Originally Posted by Alexa

    (I happen to make about 80% of my monthly income from ClickBank).
    Does that not worry you that such a high amount of your income comes from solely affiliate marketing and even more so worrying from one, single, network? All it takes is Clickbank to close, change the rules, you to get banned, the products you promote to no longer be selling and you could lose a huge chunk of your income.

    I like to keep things diverse so affiliate marketing, own products, services etc. Would worry me too much to rely on one method.
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      Does that not worry you that such a high amount of your income comes from solely affiliate marketing and even more so worrying from one, single, network?
      It worries me that so high a percentage is from one network; yes. (It was 90% a year ago, and 80% feels a lot better!).

      I'm always trying to find and build additional, non-ClickBank sources of income.

      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      All it takes is Clickbank to close, change the rules, you to get banned, the products you promote to no longer be selling and you could lose a huge chunk of your income.
      Very few of these are realistic problems, I hope.

      Getting banned would be (I hope I'm one of the very least likely ever to incur that fate - few people have a lower refund percentage or cause fewer problems than I do!).

      Products no longer selling isn't much of a worry because I promote 30, and one of the great advantages of an affiliate marketing business is that you're not dependent on the continuing success of any individual product but can always replace it with another. And my CB income is spread across 8 unrelated niches, too, with nothing "legally/ethically high-risk" at all.

      ClickBank closing seems very unlikely (they've been there longer than Google and are increasingly regulation-compliant all the time) and if they did, those vendors would all put their products on sale elsewhere as quickly as they could, wouldn't they? They wouldn't want to lose all their affiliate sales ...

      But it's quite true that from week to week my income is heavily ClickBank-dependent, and I'd be more comfortable if it were "spread out" more, yes. I'm building up other things, too. You do make a good point here about income security, of course.
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      • Profile picture of the author Stuart Walker
        Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

        It worries me that so high a percentage is from one network; yes. (It was 90% a year ago, and 80% feels a lot better!).

        I'm always trying to find and build additional, non-ClickBank sources of income.



        Very few of these are realistic problems, I hope.

        Getting banned would be (I hope I'm one of the very least likely ever to incur that fate - few people have a lower refund percentage or cause fewer problems than I do!).

        Products no longer selling isn't much of a worry because I promote 30, and one of the great advantages of an affiliate marketing business is that you're not dependent on the continuing success of any individual product but can always replace it with another. And my CB income is spread across 8 unrelated niches, too, with nothing "legally/ethically high-risk" at all.

        ClickBank closing seems very unlikely (they've been there longer than Google and are increasingly regulation-compliant all the time) and if they did, those vendors would all put their products on sale elsewhere as quickly as they could, wouldn't they? They wouldn't want to lose all their affiliate sales ...

        But it's quite true that from week to week my income is heavily ClickBank-dependent, and I'd be more comfortable if it were "spread out" more, yes. I'm building up other things, too. You do make a good point here about income security, of course.
        Have you ever tried creating your own products? You know which ones sell well after years of promoting them so nothing to stop you making something similar and taking all the money for yourself when you make a sale.
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        • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
          Banned
          Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

          Have you ever tried creating your own products?
          Noooooo ... I prefer being an affiliate, and avoiding all the potential problems and risks of being a vendor. At least for now.

          The only "niche" in which I've felt tempted to write my own product is forex (it's the "niche" I know best), and that would be a marketing non-starter, because what people buy in that niche is the promise of dramatic, fast incomes: customers don't want to buy the boring reality. :p

          I'm writing fiction, though. Just "very slowly".
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          • Profile picture of the author Stuart Walker
            Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

            Noooooo ... I prefer being an affiliate, and avoiding all the potential problems and risks of being a vendor. At least for now.

            The only "niche" in which I've felt tempted to write my own product is forex (it's the "niche" I know best), and that would be a marketing non-starter, because what people buy in that niche is the promise of dramatic, fast incomes: customers don't want to buy the boring reality. :p

            I'm writing fiction, though. Just "very slowly".
            Having looked at the list of 'potential problems' most of them are non-problems that don't really exist IME. There's a lot of risks involved with being an affiliate too and you have much less control over things when you're just a third party promoting other people's stuff than when promoting your own.
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            • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
              Banned
              Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

              Having looked at the list of 'potential problems' most of them are non-problems that don't really exist IME.
              Well, they're nearly all things that vendors have mentioned to me: I have no experience of being a vendor.

              Which ones do you think "don't really exist"? Product research and development? Employing a copywriter and producing a sales page? Needing some legal advice? Handling the refunds? Giving some customer support? They don't seem to be entirely confabulated issues to me? :confused:

              Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

              There's a lot of risks involved with being an affiliate too and you have much less control over things when you're just a third party promoting other people's stuff than when promoting your own.
              Yes, I take this point. But one compensates for that by "spreading the risk", I think. The 30 different CB products I currently promote across 8 niches are hardly all going to hit the rocks at the same time, are they? (Unless ClickBank disappears, but in that case their vendors are going to sell them elsewhere, as discussed above).
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  • Profile picture of the author Nathan Bumstead
    Hey do you have a link for the guy selling the balding cream?

    ....just joking.

    (........no but seriously?) J

    I enjoyed your thread Art. Thanks for posting. The very first product I ever tried to create I never even tried to market because it ended up being a POS. I put a lot of time into it, ignored my family for almost a month. It took up every spare minute I had after work and on weekends. But when all was said and done, I didn't like it at all and never did anything with it. It was not a failure though. It was my first product attempt and I learned a lot!

    Now that project folder sits on my storage drive haunting me. I see the folder and think, website is done, sales copy is done, product is done........ Ahhh NO! It's a crappy product though!
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  • Profile picture of the author Stuart Walker
    I just think it's difficult to build up any sort of authority in a niche when you're not creating your own products and relying solely on promoting others.

    Handling refunds is hardly a major issue assuming your product isn't garbage. Customer support can be outsourced cheaply. If you are well versed in your niche you don't need much research you already know most things and can create products with ease.
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    • Profile picture of the author Nathan Bumstead
      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      I just think it's difficult to build up any sort of authority in a niche when you're not creating your own products and relying solely on promoting others.
      I've thought about creating simple products in multiple niches to increase my "authority"... But then leave the heavy hitting stuff to good, value adding, affiliate products.

      Do you go deep into your niches or do you spread your efforts across a lot of niches? I have heard valid points for both.
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    • Profile picture of the author Magic Mike IM
      Wow... excellent post; wonderful discussion...

      Much of what was addressed is why potential customers have become so skeptical... it is becoming obvious that reviews are "made up", or worse yet, purchased on Fiverr, etc.

      Affiliate marketing certainly has a lot of potential flaws, but so does selling cars or boats or anything else for that matter. Over time, if done right, the cream rises to the top. Quality affiliate marketers who create real reviews and TRY to only offer quality products to their list become obvious.

      I both create products and am an affiliate for products. MOST (not all) of the products I recommend I have first used and tested myself. I NEVER would recommend a product to my current customers without testing it... BUT many people do... and worse yet, many of the top affiliate marketers with the biggest lists do it all the time !!!

      I do a good number of product launches (as a "launch jacker"). It is common practice for people to "blindly reciprocate" promoting each others launches. It happens on a regular basis... super affiliates/product creators just continually (and blindly) promoting each others products...

      I have not (yet) used affiliates to market my products. I'm sure I could be increasing my profits enormously if I did... but I just don't want to get in that game of blindly promoting someone's product simply because they did a good job promoting one of mine. I probably at some point will, but will refuse to get pulled into that "product launch game".

      There are a few people here that I have noticed seem to have a great mix of both integrity and sales savvy... WillR is a good example of one... he promotes, but does not "over-do it"... he creates great products himself and is a genuinely helpful guy. There are others, but he comes to mind (although I don't know him personally at all).

      The "good news" is that it is easy to stand out from the crowd when most of the crowd is doing the wrong thing.
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    • Profile picture of the author Lucian Lada
      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      I just think it's difficult to build up any sort of authority in a niche when you're not creating your own products and relying solely on promoting others.
      Actually, there are niches where it's natural to sell physical products, such as fishing, for example, and you don't create those yourself - you're an affiliate for them. Sure, there are (or could be, I don't know) info products, but think about all the actual gear used to fish that you can recommend as an affiliate. Same with camping.

      And to be honest, I believe it might be easier to build an authority site promoting other people's info products, because you can work on the content you put on your site in the time needed to develop a product. Also, I think (though that's just my suspicion), that people will think you're a little (or more) biased when you recommend your own products.
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  • Profile picture of the author art72
    Everyone's feedback has been much appreciated.

    @Alexa - 700 hours researching is exactly what I am trying to avoid, lol.

    @drewaflioravanti -your reference to tv and magazine ads rings true. As does most major marketing platforms, as they justify ads being only as valuable as the results (i.e. conversions, sales, etc.) as would be so with "G", FB, YT, Bing, etc..

    So from this perspective, your right on.

    @ jgant - absolutely, I agree, if the ability to access (or purchase the product) is possible, by all means affiliates should learn from this example.

    In my case, as with so with many other aff's, the reality of building a large niche network for example, would be clearly impossible to afford to purchase each item. Naturally, I am much more passionate in promoting the items I do use, and have purchased.

    I personally do a great deal of research, which is what spawned my frustration, as clearly both product creators and aff's alike often do not!

    @ Nathan Bumstead - this is exactly where I am at right now, I am so prone to wanting my business to be founded on quality, value, and integrity. While performing so much research (as an affiliate) and in trying to 'partially' keep watch over potential buyers interests, I've grown a bit frustrated weeding through the trash looking for gems as Alexa mentions. As such, I am leaning toward product development myself... at least in providing decent eBooks with useful info, as opposed to these 17 pages of white space, large fonts, and unfounded facts for $27 with a 75% aff commission.

    It almost appears, many product creators (not all of course) look at the bottom line. A $27 product, is say $6.25 after a $20.75 payout to an affiliate, and really the creator's know this, and are seemingly (intentionally)only offering a product worth about $5 to the end user! Many of which are grammatically, factually, and blatant misrepresentations of no good to anyone.

    Again, leading back to the necessity of conducting proper research. Of course, there are other payment processing fees, vendor fees, these creators incur, etc... which I didn't need mention.

    @RockingLastsForever - Confirmation to my point. Alexa of anyone has provided ample enough amounts of great information here on these forums alone (*did I mention free), that by far exceed what paid products are offering. I mean, I too would encourage her to write a book on syndication, as she, along with several other notable mentions (i.e. John, Paul, Mike, Bill, and others) who widely share more here than several do in a paid memberships or product creations.

    Understanding, that we ourselves must pick and/or choose the direction, nurturing, and growth of our businesses, and could easily just promote known items such as amazon, or travel, watches, etc... sure, and there's no fine line there, as there is in what many (Including myself are trying to walk) and abide by in say, micro niche marketing.

    Either way, it's inspiring to see the different perceptions applied, as it already has broadened my perhaps 'narrowed vision' this morning when I wrote this thread.

    Thanks!


    Art
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  • Profile picture of the author cimsols
    This is definitely a thread every affiliate marketer should read. Thanks to everyone who has contributed. Some really great information here.
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  • Profile picture of the author Stuart Walker
    @Alexa - 700 hours researching is exactly what I am trying to avoid, lol.
    If you are knowledgeable about your niche (which to be fair you should be IMO) then there's no need for 700 hours of research because you know what peoples problems are and how to solve them already. Being involved in a niche means you know exactly what issues your visitors / customers have already. In most of my niches I could have a new the basis of product ready in a couple of hours because I already know everything inside out.

    Alexa of anyone has provided ample enough amounts of great information here on these forums alone (*did I mention free), that by far exceed what paid products are offering. I mean, I too would encourage her to write a book on syndication, as she, along with several other notable mentions (i.e. John, Paul, Mike, Bill, and others) who widely share more here than several do in a paid memberships or product creations.
    Indeed she could easily knock out a WSO on article syndication just by combining a few of her posts...she'd have a product in less than an hour. See how easy it is when you know what you're talking about.

    I've thought about creating simple products in multiple niches to increase my "authority"... But then leave the heavy hitting stuff to good, value adding, affiliate products.

    Do you go deep into your niches or do you spread your efforts across a lot of niches? I have heard valid points for both.
    The way I see it YOU should be one of the heavy hitters otherwise why are you offering advice to others in the niche?

    I'm involved in multiple niches but I go deep into most of them. I'm in most of my niches because I know a good bit about them though so it's not difficult to know them inside out.

    Actually, there are niches where it's natural to sell physical products, such as fishing, for example, and you don't create those yourself - you're an affiliate for them. Sure, there are (or could be, I don't know) info products, but think about all the actual gear used to fish that you can recommend as an affiliate. Same with camping.

    And to be honest, I believe it might be easier to build an authority site promoting other people's info products, because you can work on the content you put on your site in the time needed to develop a product. Also, I think (though that's just my suspicion), that people will think you're a little (or more) biased when you recommend your own products.
    I actually said something similar earlier in the topic. You can't ALWAYS buy every product you promote because if you're promoting luxury holidays or diamond watches then it just isn't practical. Fishing gear is along the same lines but probably easier if you are actually into fishing.

    We moved onto talking about info products on Clickbank etc though and if you're in a niche where it's all based around promoting info products then I do believe you should think about creating your own because if you're not it makes me think you're not that much of an authority on it when you need to rely on recommending other peoples products. People don't get suspect when you recommend your own stuff if you've built up a following, brand and authority because they WAN'T to buy your stuff. In some cases biting your hand off to do it.
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      If you are knowledgeable about your niche (which to be fair you should be IMO) then there's no need for 700 hours of research
      A lot of that 700 hours was spent on selecting niches (according to the products available in them), and on examining products - not just on reading sales pages, you know?

      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      you know what peoples problems are and how to solve them already. Being involved in a niche means you know exactly what issues your visitors / customers have already.
      Yes, I agree with all that. I've still had to spend 700 hours spread over 4+ years in finding the 30 CB products I want to promote out of the 15,000+ available (and I have a "short-list of perhaps 30 more for my own possible future use). And I attribute my growing income, and the almost complete lack of "product-changing" problems I've had, to having spent that time.

      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      Indeed she could easily knock out a WSO on article syndication just by combining a few of her posts...
      That's a different matter. I have other, personal reasons for choosing not to do that at the moment.

      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      she'd have a product in less than an hour.
      I really wouldn't. It's an academic and slightly sterile discussion, but it would actually take me quite a lot of time, because I'd also want to include plenty of material that isn't already on the board. (On the other hand, it would admittedly save me a lot of time currently spent in replying to p.m.'s explaining why there isn't one!).

      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      I'm involved in multiple niches but I go deep into most of them. I'm in most of my niches because I know a good bit about them though so it's not difficult to know them inside out.
      Yes, I agree that you need to know plenty about the niches in which you're involved, of course.

      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      You can't ALWAYS buy every product you promote because if you're promoting luxury holidays or diamond watches then it just isn't practical.
      Sure ... but to be fair Art and I did both specify "information products" and were obviously talking, in that context, about "ClickBank-style products". People who promote private jet chartering/sharing and month-long African safari vacations aren't so much expected to be users of the service themselves, I think?

      Originally Posted by RockingLastsForever View Post

      I do believe you should think about creating your own because if you're not it makes me think you're not that much of an authority on it when you need to rely on recommending other peoples products.
      An interesting perspective, and not a point I remember seeing discussed here before. I'll give it some thought, but my initial reaction is that it depends what you mean by "rely on"? Being an affiliate marketer is a business-type of its own, after all. If you ask a CB product vendor who provides suggestions for his affiliates to promote the product concerned by PPC why he doesn't just do that himself instead of paying the affiliates 60%/70% and letting them do it, he's going to say something along the lines of "I'm not a marketer - that's your job; mine is to create products", isn't he? Product creation is a "business-type", after all. I admit it's never occurred to me, seeing an affiliate site/autoresponder series, to think that "this person can't be much of an expert if he hasn't produced his own product". But it's an interesting point, I'll grant you.
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  • Profile picture of the author Stuart Walker
    If you are truly an authority or expert in your niche it would be no problem to create your own info products and your visitors would rather buy YOUR products (because they have trust in you and see you as someone who knows what they are talking about) than someone else. It just makes sense to create them IMO.

    Obviously it's possible to be incredibly knowledgeable and an authority in your niche without having your own products but the logical step is to start creating your own at some point IME. I just don't see why you wouldn't because you'll be able to create some great products that people need, want and love.
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    • Profile picture of the author GlenH
      I just wanted to make some general comments about marketing affiliate products in 2013

      "Are You Frustrated and Struggling to Find High, Quality Products That You'll Be Proud, To Promote To Your List?....

      ......Products That WON'T Make You Look Like Just Another Greedy 'Money-Hungry' Affiliate Who's Only Interest Is Ripping As Much Money Out Of Your Subscribers Wallets As You Can"

      Sounds like the start of a sales letter doesn't it?

      But it's not...

      However, those two statements should really hit a nerve with every affiliate marketer.

      Right now, you probably have a customer list that you've most likely spent years building up

      You've nurtured that list and you've built a solid reputation with each person on that list over the years.

      The only problem is that it's hard as hell (and getting harder all the time) for you to find quality products that are actually worth promoting.

      But at the same time, YOU, as an affiliate, still have to make money to put food on the table, clothes on your back, and provide shelter for your family.

      And the only way you can do that is by bringing in money promoting products to your list.

      You know only too well that affiliate marketing is getting tougher by the day.

      There's more competition than ever before, and the number of competitors you have is growing at an incredible rate every day.

      Add to that the fact there are so many internet marketing products being released on the market every day, that it's almost impossible to tell up front what is a quality product and what is just a load of garbage..

      Maybe you've experienced this.....

      You come across a product that's been released, and you decide to get onboard as an affiliate.

      You see some of the 'usual suspects' promoting this product - You're getting bombarded be emails from every man and his dog promoting this thing, so you think to yourself...... 'it must be a quality product'.

      So you get onboard as an affiliate too.

      Then you do a quick email blast to your list proudly telling everyone how fantastic the product is, and based on your recommendation, your customers jump in and buy, and you make a truck load of cash from your list.

      Fantastic!

      Then the (s _ _ t) hits the fan!

      Complaints and reviews of the product start to hit all the forums.

      Refund percentages go into the stratosphere, and the word spreads..... the product is a total..... DUD.

      Next, you start getting the customers on your list bombarding YOU with complaints about the product YOU promoted to them.

      It's then you suddenly realize you've made a very expensive and potentially disastrous mistake.

      What do you think will happen next?

      All those valuable subscribers and customers on your list that you've taken years to build, and who like and trust you, will eventually start blaming YOU.

      - They'll blame YOU for sending them a junk offer.

      - They'll blame YOU for not properly screening the products you promote.

      - They'll blame YOU for bombarding them with stuff they can't use.

      - They'll blame YOU for being money-hungry & not having their best interests at heart.

      - They'll blame YOU for not being the same person who used to provide them with beneficial information and products that improved their online business.

      - Then they'll just......opt out of your list, never to return again.


      If you're guilty and doing what I've just described, my guess is that you may already be seeing long-time subscribers dropping off of your list left and right, which affects your overall profits' hard.

      So here are a couple of questions YOU really need to ask yourself before you even think of promoting any product.....

      1. Are You Prepared To Risk Losing Ever Ounce Of Respect and Credibility You've Fought Long and Hard To Build Up.....if the product turns out to be the biggest of 'duds' ?

      2. Are you Willing See The Customers You've Taken Years to Build Up Desert You ...... all because you wanted to make a quick-buck from them?

      So, if you're a smart affiliate marketer, you'll take the time to do all the due diligence you can before you ever consider marketing any product as an affiliate

      There's just too much to lose if you get it wrong.
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