Paypal freezing accounts? due to Upsell/OTO? How to prevent this? and avoid Via Funnels

23 replies
Paypal suspend and freeze accounts, which they have done to many warriors.

How can we be careful using upsells, and one time offers, in our funnels (using paypal only),

so that they don't freeze our account?

what are the rules (dos and don'ts),
so that paypal are safe and fine using upsells/ one time offers? / forced upsells, etc

Eg, dont do this,
eg- Dont force an upsell 'before' the buyer has paid, but only After they have paid, on the download page?
#accounts #careful #due #freezing #paypal #prevent #this or #upsell or otos
  • Not much you can do about it.

    PayPal (like Clickbank and many others) are cutting down their risk levels by moving away from some specific niches (make money online, trading, gambling, etc), thus randomly banning accounts that are active in those niches.

    Now a days, it's simply not a good idea to rely on PayPal if you're processing any decent amount of transactions in these "high risk" niches. Sooner or later, PayPal could drop the hammer on your account.
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    • Profile picture of the author debtreliefadvice
      Has anyone had trouble with their debit card?
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    • Profile picture of the author Networking_now
      Originally Posted by Anonymous Affiliate View Post

      Not much you can do about it.

      PayPal (like Clickbank and many others) are cutting down their risk levels by moving away from some specific niches (make money online, trading, gambling, etc), thus randomly banning accounts that are active in those niches.

      Now a days, it's simply not a good idea to rely on PayPal if you're processing any decent amount of transactions in these "high risk" niches. Sooner or later, PayPal could drop the hammer on your account.
      There aint going to be a heavey load of sales, as am not heavily promoting it.

      I am just asking, how do use upsells and OTOs in a way, that paypal 'prefer;' and like,

      VS which will shut your account down ?
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  • Profile picture of the author tpw
    If you prevent a consumer from being able to access their initial purchase, before they take another action, then that is grounds for paypal closing your account.

    In other words, make the "No Thanks" link easy to locate and select.
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    • Profile picture of the author Coby
      Originally Posted by tpw View Post

      In other words, make the "No Thanks" link easy to locate and select.
      This is what I was going to suggest...

      What I do is put an optin form up with a link under it that says "No thanks I don't want to register my purchase"...

      This has kept PayPal happy for over 3 years now as the customer isn't "forced" to opt-in and they can also access their purchase again if they re-visit the page at a later date.

      Even though most of the customers will go ahead and join your customer list you should also place another opt-in form on your download page just to cover all your bases.

      Hope this helps.

      Cheers,
      Coby
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    • Profile picture of the author Daniel Evans
      Originally Posted by Bill_Z View Post

      What makes you think they have a problem with upsells?
      I'm curious of the answer to this question too...
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    • Profile picture of the author Networking_now
      Originally Posted by Bill_Z View Post

      What makes you think they have a problem with upsells?
      Originally Posted by Daniel Evans View Post

      I'm curious of the answer to this question too...
      I read WillRs post to this following thread here, and he gives good advice.

      http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...-about-wf.html

      (His post on post 12)
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      • Profile picture of the author Bill_Z
        Originally Posted by Networking_now View Post

        I read WillRs post to this following thread here, and he gives good advice.

        http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...-about-wf.html

        (His post on post 12)
        Unless Paypal specifically told anyone it's because of the upsells then it's just speculation. I have had my Paypal account limited a few days after a launch. The reason they gave me was just because of the huge amount of sales, not because of the funnel or upsells or anything like that. I explained to them what my product is and why the number of sales increased dramatically this month and they released their limitation.

        He told me to give them a heads up next time a few weeks before a launch and there should be no problems with their fraud protection flagging my account.

        Every marketer I've ever read or spoken with that had a problem with their account had a similar problem. No one has ever told me nor have I ever read anyone saying that a Paypal rep. specifically told them that it's because they have upsells. Upsells is marketing, and if you think they are limited to just WSO's you are very mistaken. Just about any smart product creator in any niche anywhere on the internet has upsells.
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        • Profile picture of the author Daniel Evans
          I'm not convinced that there is any direct correlation between OTO's and PayPal freezing accounts.

          When users here complain of OTO's people jump into exclaim that upselling is just a part of effective business and it's rife - which is true. Therefore PayPal should be no exception of being aware of this factor.

          The OTO's are just adding to the quantity of overall sales in the influx, with the influx itself being the clincher.
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          • Profile picture of the author Coby
            Originally Posted by Daniel Evans View Post

            I'm not convinced that there is any direct correlation between OTO's and PayPal freezing accounts.

            When users here complain of OTO's people jump into exclaim that upselling is just a part of effective business and it's rife - which is true. Therefore PayPal should be no exception of being aware of this factor.

            The OTO's are just adding to the quantity of overall sales in the influx, with the influx itself being the clincher.
            It's not the people complaining about the UPSELL, but the customer complaining to PayPal about not being able to ACCESS the purchase...

            The correlation is that an OTO prevents them from getting "immediate access" to their purchase...

            What happens is people get lost in the funnel and flip out and start claiming "I never got my product"... That's when PayPal takes a look and that's when you realize what's happened

            Cheers,
            Coby
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      • Profile picture of the author WillR
        Originally Posted by Networking_now View Post

        I read WillRs post to this following thread here, and he gives good advice.)
        That thread was nearly a year ago and things have changed since then.

        I've spoken with their risk department a couple of times and they have no issues with it. Back then everything was on the swords edge because most people were using split payments which was not a great way of doing things. Having the payments for each product going to a load of different people just did not make sense.

        Now that most platforms use adaptive payments I've not had any troubles.

        Don't believe everything you read on this forum, especially not if it is from a year ago. Things change way too quickly in this industry so you should always be looking to get the most up to date information and not basing decisions on posts or threads that are a year old... even a week old.

        In short, you shouldn't have any dramas with upsells or OTO's provided you do then properly and give customers an easy way to decline them and access their original purchase if they so wish.
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  • Profile picture of the author seobro
    I prefer to sell an e-book on amazon. Like this is far more safe and secure. Basically "no pay" pal is a night mare. They have a million reason. Yeah, to freeze your money. I must have move to the polar ice cap. All they can do is FREEZE us.
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    • Profile picture of the author Networking_now
      Originally Posted by tpw View Post

      If you prevent a consumer from being able to access their initial purchase, before they take another action, then that is grounds for paypal closing your account.

      In other words, make the "No Thanks" link easy to locate and select.
      How do paypal track this?

      How do paypal track upsell and downsell webpages

      eg
      Upsell 1 html page has a No thanks button

      Upsell 2 htmp page doesn't have a No thanks button.


      John buys product 1, and Upsell 1 (Which has a clear No thanks button)

      Mary buys product 1, and Upsell 2 (Which doesn't have No thanks button)


      John would have used his paypal account for 2 transactions (Product 1, and US1)
      Mary would have used his paypal account for 2 transactions (Product 1, and US2)

      How can paypal track the HTML pages, quickly to state US2 has no, 'no thanks' button, and ban that paypal account?

      I know paypal are smart, but how do they do that ?
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      • Profile picture of the author Coby
        Originally Posted by Networking_now View Post

        How can paypal track the HTML pages, quickly to state US2 has no, 'no thanks' button, and ban that paypal account?

        I know paypal are smart, but how do they do that ?
        They don't track them and they WON'T know unless one of your customer's complain...

        That's when it gets nasty

        Cheers,
        Coby
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  • Profile picture of the author tac88
    So how do are money back from pay pal?
    They just cant keep it ,that would be stealing where I come from?
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  • Profile picture of the author twister85
    I'am using PayPal For five years now and Haven't got any problem yet.

    Maybe you should Be good with them and They will do the same. Just sell securely and Don't dare to have lots of refunds.

    Its so simple. Stay cool with PayPal they will take you to everest.
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    • Originally Posted by twister85 View Post

      I'am using PayPal For five years now and Haven't got any problem yet.

      Maybe you should Be good with them and They will do the same. Just sell securely and Don't dare to have lots of refunds.

      Its so simple. Stay cool with PayPal they will take you to everest.
      You're potentially up for a world of pain whenever they freeze your account out of the blue for no particular reason (no refund, no complain, nothing dodgy going on) right in the middle of a launch.

      Be wise: dont rely exclusively on PayPal if you're in the Make Money Online, Forex, Betting, etc niches.
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  • Profile picture of the author rmolina88
    I've had this problem before and all you need to do is talk to paypal to clear it up.

    Haven't had problem since and I have tons of OTOs on my squeeze pages.
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  • Profile picture of the author fpdeziner
    If you want to prevent this from happening with you, you must keep in mind few things:

    If you are expecting to receive a large sum of money, then you should call Paypal ahead of time so they expect to see the extra funds. In other words, if you are planning a large product launch, make sure you let them know ahead of time.

    When you first signup for Paypal Website Payments Pro, there’s a survey that you have to take. Make sure that you check off higher numbers in terms of how much money you anticipate making every month.

    Make sure your name or the name of your business is on your Paypal account and that it exactly matches your bank account and credit cards.

    Use the exact same addresses and phone numbers that match your bank account and credit cards.
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    • Profile picture of the author WillR
      Originally Posted by fpdeziner View Post

      If you are expecting to receive a large sum of money, then you should call Paypal ahead of time so they expect to see the extra funds. In other words, if you are planning a large product launch, make sure you let them know ahead of time.
      Why? If I was going to run a scam through Paypal tomorrow I could call and warn them just as easily as you could, right? Therefor this prevents absolutely nothing. Any irregular activity is still going to be reviewed manually whether you have pre-warned them or not. Do you think Paypal would still be in business if they just took the word of every person who rang up and warned them? Me don't think so.
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  • Profile picture of the author Kim Standerline
    I often wonder if Paypal in Europe is more lenient than in the US, I got scammed last Nov to the tune of a couple of thousand dollars (All my own fault I hasten to add as I didn't do my due diligence) with credit card fraud and had to refund lots of people a lot of money. Only realized what was happening when the chargebacks came rolling in.

    To say I had a major panic attack is an understatement, I've had my PP account since 2002 and would have been devastated if it had shut down.

    I refunded everyone who had bought through the particular affiliates I identified and once I'd done that, I rang Paypal and explained what had happened. PP could see I'd taken positive action to resolve the problem and the girl told me that she would check my account in a few days and if it did get red flagged would sort it for me and keep my account open

    I was on tenterhooks for weeks afterwards. the really weird thing was all the chargebacks I got afterwards PP disputed for me and I won them. (Don't forget it costs $20 for every chargeback you accept!!)

    Point I'm making is I've always found that with PP you should do your own risk management, making your account as secure as you possibly can. And if stuff happens, grit your teeth and get it sorted before they do it for you.

    As for the other subject in this thread about forced optin for stuff customers bought? that's been a hairy chestnut for years, It pisses many of your customers off and I can't understand why so many vendors still do it. Why build a list of pissed off people who are probably gonna flag you as spam anyway when you mail them the latest piece of whatever you're flogging.

    BTW as a side note to my scam story above, a few weeks after it happened, a flood of refund money was paid into my PP account from one of the scammers, I'd love to have been a fly on the wall when he realized what had happened...

    Kim
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  • Profile picture of the author Joan Altz
    I wouldn't worry about it too much since adaptive payments has pretty much quelled PayPal's lethal axe. As long as you aren't scamming people, no worries.
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