Domain Flipping BS...

11 years ago

Domain flipping isn't worth it these days, and hasn't been for quite some time. It's been over a decade since the dot-com bubble. The profit margins are paper thin for buying and selling PR domains.

Anyway, if you think it is BS why are you promoting a domain flipping site in your sig?

Originally Posted by alexsbusiness

quickflipformula(dot)com (i am NOT affiliated with this)

Are you sure you're not affiliated with this site?

Seems closely related to the site in your sig.

P.S. Have you read any books on guerilla marketing lately?

Thanks
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alexsbusiness

11 years ago

Hey @Craig B it took me while to realize that my passion is biz dev... I really like domains and great business ideas... and here is why?

did you know that just this week "MarketLeader Buyer Of RealEstate.com For $8.25M Gets Buyout From Trulia For $355 Million"

I am just starting but that BLOWS MY MIND! WTF! (Now that's domain flipping)

...and YES in my sig is my new website that I just created so I can post my domains for sale and maybe helping some people to CASH IN ON THEIR IDEAS as well... why not right! (it needs work and a differential... let me know your feedback)

...and NO... I am not affiliated with that dude. However, I am interested in the ebook but I think it could be shit... I don't know.

thanks for taking the time

Originally Posted by Craig B

Domain flipping isn't worth it these days, and hasn't been for quite some time. It's been over a decade since the dot-com bubble. The profit margins are paper thin for buying and selling PR domains.

Anyway, if you think it is BS why are you promoting a domain flipping site in your sig?

Are you sure you're not affiliated with this site?

Seems closely related to the site in your sig.

P.S. Have you read any books on guerilla marketing lately?

Thanks

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Gene Pimentel

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Craig B

Domain flipping isn't worth it these days, and hasn't been for quite some time. It's been over a decade since the dot-com bubble. The profit margins are paper thin for buying and selling PR domains.

Craig, I couldn't disagree with you more. The dot-com bubble of years ago has nothing to do with today's fluid market for domains. Margins paper thin? I routinely flip $10 domains for many hundreds and thousands. Like any worthwhile business, you have to study and learn the current market to be successful.

Have a look at the weekly sales reports at http://dnjournal.com/domainsales.htm, and tell me again that it's "not worth it". :-)

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Craig B

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Gene Pimentel

Craig, I couldn't disagree with you more. The dot-com bubble of years ago has nothing to do with today's fluid market for domains.

Good luck buying one word domain names even close to the prices they were going for back then. It's nothing like it use to be.

Originally Posted by Gene Pimentel

Margins paper thin?

Yes, margins are paper thin for buying and selling PR domains.

The only exception is if you've been holding onto high PR domains before the market became saturated. Even then, you have to hold your breath during a PR update and hope that the high PR backlinks aren't dropped.

Originally Posted by Gene Pimentel

I routinely flip $10 domains for many hundreds and thousands. Like any worthwhile business, you have to study and learn the current market to be successful.

Yes, there are still domain flippers who make a lot of money, and the majority of them, to no surprise, have thousands of domains that they've held onto for years waiting for the right buyer. A lot of the domains are from the bubble or even before.

Talk about an industry that's not newbie friendly

How old are most of the domains that you buy for $10 and sell for many hundreds and thousands? What percentage of the $10 domains you buy don't sell or haven't sold yet? Do you hold onto thousands of domains waiting for the right buyer?

I'm not looking for exact answers. It's just always nice to get a good idea of the big picture. I've seen way too many domains on GoDaddy Auctions and Sedo being sold that never get a single bid.

Originally Posted by Gene Pimentel

Have a look at the weekly sales reports at Trio of Six-Figure Sales Including the Year's Biggest ccTLD Deal Fueled Another Strong Week for the Domain Aftermarket, and tell me again that it's "not worth it". :-)

All that tells me is what the domains are being sold for. I have no idea what the profit margins are or how long the seller held onto the domain before it being sold.

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Gene Pimentel

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Craig B

Good luck buying one word domain names even close to the prices they were going for back then. It's nothing like it use to be.

Don't need luck, and don't need one-word domains. You are correct in saying it's nothing like it used to be. So what? Different market, different strategies.

Originally Posted by Craig B

Yes, margins are paper thin for buying and selling PR domains.

False. All the domains I sell and have sold over the last 9 years as a full time domainer have zero PR. Zero traffic. Zero backlinks. Raw domains. Profit margins are huge.

Originally Posted by Craig B

Yes, there are still domain flippers who make a lot of money, and the majority of them, to no surprise, have thousands of domains that they've held onto for years waiting for the right buyer. A lot of the domains are from the bubble or even before.

True. But that has nothing to do with me or anyone else who hand register every domain they sell.

Originally Posted by Craig B

Talk about an industry that's not newbie friendly

What's not "newbie friendly" about it? It doesn't get any simpler. Register a domain name based on current markets, and sell for a profit.

Originally Posted by Craig B

How old are most of the domains that you buy for $10 and sell for many hundreds and thousands? What percentage of the $10 domains you buy don't sell or haven't sold yet? Do you hold onto thousands of domains waiting for the right buyer?

All domains I sell are hand-registered by me, every day, new. I always have an inventory of around 2,000. Some I keep for very long term, some I sell immediately, some I sell in months, most I let drop or park if there is no action.

Originally Posted by Craig B

I'm not looking for exact answers. It's just always nice to get a good idea of the big picture. I've seen way too many domains on GoDaddy Auctions and Sedo being sold that never get a single bid.

True. Most domains listed on auction sites will never sell. That's because people take a shotgun approach and list hundreds of domains that they want to unload, because they have no idea about the right way to register domain names that have a hungry market.

Domaining is a simple business, but not an "easy" business. Most people who enter domaining end up losing money because they're in it for quick riches. They don't take the time to learn the market, and don't take the time to research each market BEFORE registering EACH domain name. They don't research the potential prospect pool for each domain before registering it. They register hundreds of domains that "sound good" and then try to find buyers. That's backwards, and a guaranteed road to failure.

Do the proper research FIRST, and you'll register only domains that have a hungry market with lots of potential buyers.

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Craig B

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Gene Pimentel

False. All the domains I sell and have sold over the last 9 years as a full time domainer have zero PR. Zero traffic. Zero backlinks. Raw domains.

I was referring to those who flip domains purely for their PR value. It's a whole different market.

I realize that you are not a PR domain flipper. The reason why I mentioned it in my first post is because there are some PR domain flippers out there and there is a demand for them, but from my experience the profit margins are often very thin.

Originally Posted by Gene Pimentel

What's not "newbie friendly" about it? It doesn't get any simpler. Register a domain name based on current markets, and sell for a profit.

Building up and maintaining a 1,000+ inventory is not exactly cheap. A lot of money can be lost in the process. It's nowhere near as easy or profitable as it was 10+ years ago.

Originally Posted by Gene Pimentel

Domaining is a simple business, but not an "easy" business. Most people who enter domaining end up losing money because they're in it for quick riches. They don't take the time to learn the market, and don't take the time to research each market BEFORE registering EACH domain name. They don't research the potential prospect pool for each domain before registering it. They register hundreds of domains that "sound good" and then try to find buyers. That's backwards, and a guaranteed road to failure.

Do the proper research FIRST, and you'll register only domains that have a hungry market with lots of potential buyers.

I agree with your approach here and what you said about being in it for the quick riches. That can be applied to businesses in general.

Sure, lots of money is being made by seasoned veterans who have been in the market before it became saturated. However, I still don't believe it is worth it these days for someone new to domain flipping for the reasons I mentioned.

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Gene Pimentel

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Craig B

Building up and maintaining a 1,000+ inventory is not exactly cheap.

It's not cheap at all. That's why someone entering the business needs to start with registering just a few, and over time build an inventory ONLY as profits allow.

Originally Posted by Craig B

A lot of money can be lost in the process.

If you're stupid about it, yes. One should never spend more money in any business that they can't afford to lose.

Originally Posted by Craig B

It's nowhere near as easy or profitable as it was 10+ years ago.

False. It was easier 10+ years ago to find killer domains, but because it's harder today, there is much more profit. Supply and demand at work.

Originally Posted by Craig B

Sure, lots of money is being made by seasoned veterans who have been in the market before it became saturated.

There is no such thing as saturation. Quality domain names and buyers are in wide abundance.

Originally Posted by Craig B

However, I still don't believe it is worth it these days for someone new to domain flipping for the reasons I mentioned.

And that's why you won't be the one to realize the profits, and that's perfectly fine. Domaining is NOT for everyone. It takes a lot of work and dedication to get to the point where is becomes second nature. That is the very beautiful thing about any worthwhile business. The easier it is, the less profitable it is because everyone is doing it. Diamonds are hard to find. Gold takes enormous effort to uncover. The most profitable businesses take serious effort.

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Craig B

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Gene Pimentel

False. It was easier 10+ years ago to find killer domains, but because it's harder today, there is much more profit. Supply and demand at work.

Actually, more weight was placed on domains before and during the bubble. A mediocre idea along with a good domain name could be sold for millions or even billions back then. Just take a look at broadcast.com for example.

These days it's more about branding, even more so after the Google EMD update.

Also, those killer domains that are going for thousands of dollars these days were bought cheap many years ago. Many sold for the same prices if not more 10+ years ago.

Originally Posted by Gene Pimentel

And that's why you won't be the one to realize the profits, and that's perfectly fine. Domaining is NOT for everyone. It takes a lot of work and dedication to get to the point where is becomes second nature. That is the very beautiful thing about any worthwhile business. The easier it is, the less profitable it is because everyone is doing it. Diamonds are hard to find. Gold takes enormous effort to uncover. The most profitable businesses take serious effort.

All I'm getting at is that domaining is much more difficult to get into than it was 10+ years ago, or even 5 years ago for that matter. I see that you've been domaining since at least '05 yourself (I'm guessing even before then).

It's not something I would recommend for a newbie these days.

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eric w 11 years ago

I just got into domain flipping. Sold all of my first few domains for a profit. I used "an angle" in selecting the domains. Just so you know, I had absolutely no experience with domain flipping.

I treated it like ebay. Most people don't have a clue about making money from ebay, especially since they have raised their fees, but I continue to generate thousands of dollars from ebay on a monthly basis.

So, I read what people said about domain flipping and how it's difficult to make money with it. I did my research and hit the ground running. It's not a big investment....I never pay over $5.00 for a domain..(well, rarely, maybe 1 out of 10 times)..and even then, i'm paying only $7.

I've learned alot about domain flipping. By the way, all the domains I've sold were pr0.
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Gene Pimentel 11 years ago

Originally Posted by Craig B

These days it's more about branding, even more so after the Google EMD update.

Not from a seller's perspective. EMDs are MUCH easier to sell than brandable domains. Brandable domains are hard to find buyers for. EMDs are dead simple to find many buyers for.

A brandable domain is recommended for a business who is looking for a primary domain to promote and build a reputation with. No question about that. However, EMDs are generally secondary domains that leverage keywords to point back to the main branded domain. Every business with a brandable domain as their main site should be using many secondary keyword domains to attract new leads and customers and guide them to the main "money" site.

The problem for a seller is that most brandable domains have no meaning at first, until it is heavily promoted and becomes known to the public. It's difficult to find a market for most undefined brandable domain names. That's why EMDs, product-oriented, and local domains is where it's at for domain sellers.

Originally Posted by Craig B

Also, those killer domains that are going for thousands of dollars these days were bought cheap many years ago.

Every domain I've sold for thousands were registered very recently.

Originally Posted by Craig B

All I'm getting at is that domaining is much more difficult to get into than it was 10+ years ago, or even 5 years ago for that matter.

Strongly disagree. Quality domains are easier to sell today, because it's increasingly difficult for a business to find one on their own.

Originally Posted by Craig B

It's not something I would recommend for a newbie these days.

Understandable, since you don't have the information necessary to make such a recommendation. And I don't mean that in a disparaging or condescending way. It's just that many of your comments are based on assumptions that are not correct.
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- Craig B 11 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Gene Pimentel
  
  Understandable, since you don't have the information necessary to make such a recommendation. And I don't mean that in a disparaging or condescending way.
  
  Well Gene, I'm sure you have much more experience at flipping domains. The only time I've flipped domains is when I've ran across domains that I couldn't pass up (really good deals), but had no other use for them than to sale. And it's even been a few years since I've found a deal like this.
  
  However, I do have quite a bit of experience searching for and buying domains at auctions for my own use. It's hard not to notice the vast amount of domains that are listed at ridiculous prices and never receive a single offer or bid.
  
  Also, these days it seems I have to spend more and more time searching through the domains to find anything worth buying. Then again, I'm buying for personal use and not for flipping.
  
  It just seems much more difficult to get into domain flipping than it use to be. I think that someone new to IM would be better off flipping websites than flipping domains.
  
  But I'm sure we'll agree to disagree...
  
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  Gene Pimentel 11 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Craig B
  
  But I'm sure we'll agree to disagree...
  
  And we can shake hands on that ;-)
  
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stoltingmediagroup

11 years ago

Originally Posted by alexsbusiness

I see a lot of ebooks/courses on domain flipping
promising that you can START MAKE MONEY within HOURS.. HOW?

The keywords are "could" and "start".

His line is: "Now, what if I were to tell you that in less than an hour from now you could start generating cash online and start pulling in hundreds of dollars a day by flipping $10 domain names?"

Secondly, you could accept funds for a domain within 60 days of purchase,
just not change registrars. Maybe sell the domain and let the purchaser know that you'll only be transferring the dns to the new owners server for now, and then change registration etc after 60 days.

In some cases you can transfer ownership of the domain to another account holder if they are within the same registrar where you registered it, (if your registrar offers that option.)

Or so I heard...

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alexsbusiness

11 years ago

i did not know that you could do any transfer before the 60days.

Thanks a bunch!

Originally Posted by stoltingmediagroup

The keywords are "could" and "start".

His line is: "Now, what if I were to tell you that in less than an hour from now you could start generating cash online and start pulling in hundreds of dollars a day by flipping $10 domain names?"

Secondly, you could accept funds for a domain within 60 days of purchase,
just not change registrars. Maybe sell the domain and let the purchaser know that you'll only be transferring the dns to the new owners server for now, and then change registration etc after 60 days.

In some cases you can transfer ownership of the domain to another account holder if they are within the same registrar where you registered it, (if your registrar offers that option.)

Or so I heard...

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Richard Tunnah

11 years ago

Of course you can sell a domain before 60 days. You just get the buyer to register free with the same registrar and transfer it to them within the registrar.
Yes you can (still!) make a living domain flipping but it's a business and you need to know what doamins to buy, where and who to sell them too.
Gene Pimental is your domain guy. He has a very good course on domain flipping you can buy from WSO section

http://www.warriorforum.com/warrior-...g-results.html

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Gene Pimentel

11 years ago

The 60-day rule is universal among all registrars, but it makes absolutely no difference in selling domain names. I sell a lot of domain names. In almost every case, I simply create a new account at the registrar where the domain currently lives. I move the domain from my account to this new account. Once I've collected the money, I simply give the buyer the username and password to the new account. They will then change the password and other information to their own, and they are now in full ownership of the domain.

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sbucciarel

Banned 11 years ago

Originally Posted by alexsbusiness

How can you buy and sell domains without having to way the 60 days ICANN waiting period?

What are you thoughts on this?

What 60 day waiting period are you talking about? There is no waiting period for selling a domain. The only waiting period is 60 days to move it out of the registrar that you registered it in. That is easily worked around by simply pushing the domain to the new owner in the same registrar where it is registered.

But people who buy a bunch of crap domains and expect to flip them quickly and make a bunch of money are deluding themselves. You have to research before buying domains and you have to find likely prospects to market them to. It is not instant or passive income by any means.

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Isaiah Coe

11 years ago

If your trying to get into domain flipping, your be gambling all the time. Best thing to do is get into website flipping. Think of a type of site that can get lots of traffic, and find a good template for it. I recommend trying out arcade sites (invest in my arcade plugin). You can find aged and high pr domains on godaddy auction for your site. After you get the site setup get traffic to it and maybe make some money. You can easily flip it for high profits on flippa.

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A S M

11 years ago

I remember reading about this 5 years ago . There was a big boom with domain flipping maybe 10 years ago (or more) if i remember correctly. People in that business made a heck load of money . I even read about sites selling 4-10 million dollars!

Its probably not the best thing to do online(for me at least) but if you know what domain names you need to buy and know who too sell them to and fully understand the business and have the mindset/devotion for it , I don't see how you can go wrong

Best of luck bro

Thanks

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donnied79

11 years ago

Domain flipping can be very profitable but it's a very complex market that to be successful requires you to work a lot, each and every day. Forget the autopilot or earning money while sleeping like it can happen with IM (that was true for domain market many years ago when type-in traffic was still huge).

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im0001

11 years ago

@Gene

What methods do you mostly use to sell your domains? Do you send away emails to likely buyers using whois data or do you use another method?

Thanks

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alexsbusiness

11 years ago

I want to thank you all for the awesome answers!

I have another questions that will help a lot of people buying aged domains... http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...ml#post8072517

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judsonsolomon

10 years ago

To Gene Pimentel:
Appreciate and respect.

That's is called, "thinking outside the box" and "doing outside the box".

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biggerk9

10 years ago

It is not as easy as people says it is. You would need to do research and predict which domains would likely pick up. You would want to choose certain keywords when purchasing. Check the stock market for company names and try to go with that for starters.

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Domain Flipping BS...

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