Why This Is A Damp Squib

[Steven Wagenheim]

Originally Posted by Martin Luxton

Steven,

He's not worth it.

Martin

No, he's not, and I was trying to let this die...twice...but he refused to
let it.

So now I am simply telling him what an arrogant SOB he is.

And if he was standing here in my home right in front of me, I'd say it to his
face.

[Fabian Tan]

Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim

Yes, which has nothing to do with this particular thread. You essentially
called me a liar, which as far as I'm concerned does make this personal.

I am simply telling you the person who I think you are.

Sometimes looking in the mirror can be a real nasty wakeup call.

First of all, you don't even know me.

Secondly, I have seen many threads where you blow it all out of proportion and make a big drama out of it.

I think this is one of them...

Fabian

[Steven Wagenheim]

Originally Posted by Fabian Tan

First of all, you don't even know me.

Secondly, I have seen many threads where you blow it all out of proportion and make a big drama out of it.

I think this is one of them...

Fabian

Fabian, I don't want to know you. If you were the last marketer on this
planet, I wouldn't want to know you.

You say I'm making a big deal out of nothing?

I think being called a liar is not nothing.

No go on and please have the last word because as Martin said...

You just ain't worth it.

I'm going to do something productive.

[majidmaskat]

Originally Posted by Dmitry

Of course it's a great tool - so long as you use it for what it was meant to be.

Spamming will definitely not get you the results you want! Bashing about it neither.

i hate spamming however evertime i use twitter i see many "internet marketers", who send out their links literlayy every 1 minute literally, but i don't know what to say to them, obvisouly they do not have a very clear idea?

[Dmitry]

Originally Posted by majidmaskat

i hate spamming however evertime i use twitter i see many "internet marketers", who send out their links literlayy every 1 minute literally, but i don't know what to say to them, obvisouly they do not have a very clear idea?

These are no marketers - these are spammers. The same who send you email spam. Only there's the CAN SPAM ACT so it keeps most of these "marketers" away from email spam (yes, most of them are MAN enough to bash out on forums as we see here but when it comes to real world action they are p***ies).

[JasonParker]

Wowsa... I have an opinion on this subject but I'm staying out of this heated debate.

Friends with Fabian, Wagenheim, Riley, Peterson... so I'm not touching this with a 10 foot pole.

But what I will say is I believe there's truth to both sides and I don't think this subject should be discussed in absolutes.

[Jill Carpenter]

Well, I have to disagree with Fabian.

Honestly I don't see where Fabian has real proof to back up his statement - so until then I don't know that his demands for others to prove what it is doing for them apply.

Fabian, if you can honestly say you've tested a few accounts with a few niches and have built a good following and followed the advice of a few twitter guides and still don't see it working then maybe you'll be able to back up your point a bit better.

I do see one mistake you are making on your twitter account.

7 out of 20 tweets I just saw when visiting your page were links going to offers. This is not the "winning formula." But again, this is one of those things you learn when buying the "the shovel" information.

As for the comment about the "spamming of links to ones blog posts" - I don't know about you but I have some blogs that are positioned to automatically tweet themselves when I make a new post. Not sure what is wrong with that. There are not offers on all those posts - many of them are just my regular ramblings.

Anyway, that is just my take on it. If it is not working for you then by all means direct your efforts elsewhere that is more productive.

I personally use Twitter for more than just handing out links - and have been successful in building my Facebook into hundreds of friends - the bulk who came from Twitter. That is just one way I've used it - and without it I would not have nearly the number of contacts that I do. Others have gone onto lists, others have visited my blogs and helped traffic, and was able to actually make some really good connections and get help FAST when I needed it.

Not all the value you get out of the free resource comes back to you in the form of instant income - and sometimes that is even more important/valuable.

[bhopkins]

Well outside from the insults, lets get back to the subject. Twitter can be a great tool, its just most people abuse it. Call them spammers or what ever, but personally I think its the mindset.

A lot of people are so desperate for a little cash that they think the only way tyo get it is to post as many affiliate links in an as many places as possible in a short amount of time. Now this does work to a degree or people would not still be spamming like they do.

Personally, I try to take a longer term approach to business activities. I would rather give up one sale today for 10 next week, but that is just me.

Whether its twitter or forum marketing or whatever in this business a long term approach will earn you more money and that money will be much more stable and consistent in the end.

After all isn't that what we are all working towards a business model which lets you not work and still earn money. You can't get that by spammer twitter ever ten minutes, whether its automated or not, you still have to add messages to the automation software.

my 2 cents
Bruce

[Martin Luxton]

Originally Posted by Fabian Tan

First of all, you don't even know me.

Secondly, I have seen many threads where you blow it all out of proportion and make a big drama out of it.

I think this is one of them...

Fabian

Fabian,

I have just given you an infraction.

Maybe you could start another thread

"How To Drive Traffic To Your Twitter Page Through Controversy And Libelling People!"

Martin

P.S. Steven has blown things up in the past (and I have called him on that) but in this thread he is blameless.

[JayXtreme]

WOW.. looks like I missed all the funzeee.. here

I'm pro-twitter.. it's increased my list, and still does regularly. I have pen name accounts that I feed RSS and my EzineArticles into which all increase my traffic...

My personal Twitter account has been a great source of traffic, income and connections for me. I've met some of the most fantastic people ever, some of which I connect with on Skype, over the phone and via e-mail... profitable relationships for all parties there.

Also.. I've had access to John Taylor via DM regularly.. what more could I want

I don't care much for what occurred in this thread.. but Twitter is good for my business.

Peace

Jay

p.s. And no.. I don't have a Twitter for profit product to push here, so no bias. (Although my own product does contain a chunk of Twitter info)

p.p.s. Some of the Tweeple in this thread should chill a little, grab a beer.. I'm going to.. the footie's on soon .. w00t!

[Asher]

Arguments on the main internet marketing discussion forum
sure livens things up~

Like many others - I'm pro-Twitter.

Asher

[TheAngelGuy]

Sometimes, too, people look for a strategy to be either a "yes" or a "no" instead of a "where does it fit", and for some people, myself included, it's not yet obvious enough where it fits and how to use it.

That being said, if it's not too OT, could anyone recommend some good resources (even WSO's) on using Twitter most profitably? (If OT, then I'll start another post.)

Thanks, all, and have a good day,

- Paul

[Thomas Belknap]

Email marketing doesn't work either. There I said it.


Now sign up for my email list!

[Steven Wagenheim]

Originally Posted by TheAngelGuy

Sometimes, too, people look for a strategy to be either a "yes" or a "no" instead of a "where does it fit", and for some people, myself included, it's not yet obvious enough where it fits and how to use it.

That being said, if it's not too OT, could anyone recommend some good resources (even WSO's) on using Twitter most profitably? (If OT, then I'll start another post.)

Thanks, all, and have a good day,

- Paul

Paul, get Dana W's book on it. It's excellent.

[Kay King]

I see people in the JV forum saying they have 4.6 million subscribers with no proof whatsoever.

Talk about lies in this industry.

Contrary to those who give infractions when they don't like what someone says - and to those who post again and again until they escalate threads into "personal attacks".....I don't believe that comment above made any reference to Steven W. I didn't think so when I first read it - but I guess if you are looking for a problem you can always find one.

Andy is right that text can be posted in a way that is "my opinion" - but it doesn't always get done. Is that an excuse to always assume the worst interpretation of what is posted? Is that helpful...or self serving?

Not everyone loves Twitter - I think it's boring. However, I know others who love it and that's fine if it is working for them. It doesn't make them right or me wrong - just two different viewpoints.

If you post exact results to "prove" the OP is wrong - you don't have to provide proof. BUT....It would be useful to know how long you've done twitter, how many people you follow, how many follow you, how often you tweet per day - and how much actual time per day you spend at Twitter. Were there other marketing tactics that might have contributed?

Fabian could have stated his case in a more "my viewpoint" way - but the "I'm right and the OP is wrong" attitude that results in threads highjacked and escalated into personal arguments is getting old and tired.

I'm sure we'll see a thread yet today about "people who post opinions as fact" - wouldn't be the first time.

kay

[Thomas Belknap]

Originally Posted by Kay King

Fabian could have stated his case in a more "my viewpoint" way - but the "I'm right and the OP is wrong" attitude that results in threads highjacked and escalated into personal arguments is getting old and tired.


kay

You are wrong Kay. I find the "OP is wrong" attitude both new and exciting.

[Dana_W]

Originally Posted by Fabian Tan

You are spamming your own Twitter account with links to your blog.

Fundamentally, you are considered a spammer as you described.

Fabian

You think that tweeting links to your blog is automatically spam? Because I do it on Twitter quite frequently and get no complaints. I write a post on my blog with a title like "Here's why your press release got rejected" - I tweet a link to it - people retweet it - and I get a few hundred visitors in a day from it.

At this point - I literally make my living from Twitter, because I get all of my press release clients from there. Yes, I do sell an ebook showing how to use Twitter for marketing - but if that stopped selling today I'd STILL be making my living from Twitter. The vast majority of my money comes from writing for clients I find from Twitter.

As for proof - how exactly would anyone prove that they make a living from Twitter? I could show you my Paypal account. I could show you my Google Analytics stats showing how much traffic I get from Twitter - I could swear on a stack of bibles - but that can all be faked.

[Dana_W]

Originally Posted by majidmaskat

i hate spamming however evertime i use twitter i see many "internet marketers", who send out their links literlayy every 1 minute literally, but i don't know what to say to them, obvisouly they do not have a very clear idea?

Unfollow them. That's what I do.

[Neil Morgan]

Spam is an interesting word to use when talking about a 100% permission-based system such as Twitter, when the only way you can receive tweets is to remain as a follower.

The content of some of the tweets might leave a little to be desired, but that doesn't make it spam.

One click and you're outta there, so where's the problem?

Cheers,

Neil

[Dana_W]

By the way, never thought I'd see the day where Steve Wags and I are on the same page - but seriously! For someone who's barely tried Twitter to claim that there's no way to make money using Twitter is just ignorant. You won't know unless you try it.

I am not saying that if you go on Twitter and blast out sales links you will make money - because you won't. I am saying that Twitter is like a giant online chamber of commerce that offers endless networking opportunities, with minimal effort.

[TheMagicShow]

Steven you are an amazing marketer, don't take things so personal pal. I think that it is wrong to insult fellow warriors and this thread has turned into one of those.

This place is all about building relationships and not burning bridges...Peace to all!

[ShayRockhold]

I have 2 main Twitter accounts.

One is "me." It is the account I use for my day-to-day stuff and has gotten my new clients, more business, etc. There are about 1200+ followers on that account.

I also have a just-for-fun account. It is a Star Trek role-playing account. Totally geeky and never gets a business tweet sent from it.

Interestingly enough, I have gotten business from that one, too. People ask me for my "real" account and follow that one, then order from me.

[debra]

Originally Posted by Fabian Tan

Erm, pal, you can't go around making claims (with stats) in a debate without backing it up.

Owe me something? Again, you are taking this too personally.

Fabian

Fabian...you started this thread whether for self promotion or not, we're still waiting to see your stats to back up your claims.

So...are your stats obtainable or is it just your word(opinion) on it?

[Bill Farnham]

Twitter-1 ... Fabian-Ziltch

Well, this has been an interesting thread to say the least

Being mostly, OK, completely a Twidiot, it's interesting to see how some folks have used it with success.

I went to Kelly's page, but the vid didn't load , so now I'm back to square one

Onward and upward...

KJ

[Kay King]

Debra -

Di you read any of this thread? Fabian made no claims and promoted nothing. Had you read the thread you would have known the stats were posted by others. So what do you want "proven"?

Dana comments about being "ignorant" referencing a statement I can't find? Another person fusses about the "spam" comment but ignored the rude post it was answering.

I don't know Fabian and don't agree with everything he posted here - but
THIS comment by the OP is all this thread was about - so where's the big problem?

That's why I want to play devil's advocate.

We can go on and on about getting more joint ventures, learning new stuff, getting rankings, maintaining relationships...all those are the benefits of Twitter and I have benefited from them too. I didn't say I haven't.

But the benefits don't size up to the amount of hype and attention it gets. If you admit that this will probably be a fad, then that just proves my point.

Which is, focus on evergreen tactics and try not to be too obsessed with Twitter when you could be doing something a lot more productive.

Kevin said 10 minutes per day, I would say that's about right.

kay

[debra]

Originally Posted by Kay King

Debra -

Di you read any of this thread? Fabian made no claims and promoted nothing. Had you read the thread you would have known the stats were posted by others. So what do you want "proven"?

Dana comments about being "ignorant" referencing a statement I can't find? Another person fusses about the "spam" comment but ignored the rude post it was answering.

I don't know Fabian and don't agree with everything he posted here - but
THIS comment by the OP is all this thread was about - so where's the big problem?



kay

Well...first, just to be clear I'm for neither side...pro or con. I do have a twitter account though. Not to say I have the thing figured out either, anymore than most ppl. I would like to though.

Fabian made a comment to Steven about backing up his claims with stats. And basically the same comment by someone else was made of Fabian.

My comment is made from an educational point. I really want to know why it works for Steven but not Fabian. Both parties are very good marketers.

So, to me, it would be interesting to know "why" it works for some and not others and why.

That's all I was after, I'm not looking to participate in the school yard brawl over it.

Problem? I didn't see a problem. These threads sure have been getting heated lately.

[Steven Wagenheim]

Dana

I will be the first to admit that I have acted like a total ass in the past and
you were on the receiving end of it. No excuses. I'm just trying to start
acting like a responsible forum member, though some people do make that
very difficult.

For what it's worth, your book got me into Twitter and even though I was
skeptical as hell (I really hate these social sites usually) I can honestly say
that used correctly it can be very profitable.

Debra

To answer your question of why Twitter works for me and not for Fabian,
I can't answer that other than to say, I follow what Dana says, especially
about how to act on Twitter. I provide lots of free content to try to help
people. Even put up a special Twitter blog just for my followers.

I did this totally skeptical and not believing for a second that it would
amount to anything.

I was so wrong. If I put my effort into it than I do (I only spend about
10 to 15 minutes a day) I'd probably do even better, but for what little
time I spend, I am getting a decent following.

Kay

I have no problem with Fabian making his comment about Twitter being a
waste of time. If that's how he feels, fine. I'm not here to change anybody's
mind about it.

What I had a problem with was when I reported the results that I have
personally gotten using it and when he demanded that I show him proof
(even though I tactfully at first told him there was no need for me to have
to do that) he then insinuated that I was liar.

That is when I blew up at him.

I could care less that he doesn't think Twitter is worth his time, but
nobody calls me a liar and expects me to just roll over and take it.

That is the reason for my taking his head off.

And if you look at other posts in this thread, you will see that others
agree that he was out of line.

[steveweber]

Fabian,

I can't speak for anyone else, but from my perspective you are wrong about twitter. It's been extremely good for my business.

[sbucciarel]

It's not uncommon for people who use a tool incorrectly or just don't know how to use it at all to say that it doesn't work. The fact is that it does work for some who know how to use it. Constantly spamming links is not how to use it.

[D Ambrose]

Come on guys, its clear that Twitter works for some and not for others. It all depends on how you approach it.

EVERY traffic stream has potential... you just can't use the same tactics you use on Facebook for myspace or Twitter (or other social network sites). Each site has there uniquness, so driving traffic from there requires a unique approach.

Daniel

[Michael Chris]

To Everyone:

Okay, Twitter is hot, IF you can apply it to your business model... you should... definitely. If you can't (or feel you can't) or feel you are wasting your time... don't. It's a personal choice... results will vary from person to person.

Now, that being said...

It is reminiscent of FFA. (free for all links)

It's time is now.... how long will it last? Who knows, but the prospect for it to morph into a major search player (rivaling google and youtube) is there... so there is long term potential.

If you use MyNicheUsername instead of making it personal and do a lot of promotion... you may be subject to a mass purge at some point.

Okay, that's all I have on twitter for now.

Also, people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. (Notice I don't mention any names... if you feel this is directed at you... then I guess it is.)

I think probably some just need to get out the mats and blankies... take a nap and then have a snack.

Cheers,
Michael

[ryanbessling]

Twitter is a great place to connect and find JV partners.

[DeanJames]

I think Fabian was making an observation that Twitter may, in the grand scheme of things turn out to be a fad, relative to evergreen methods such as 'article marketing'. Time will tell. I do happen to agree with some of the points Fabian has made though. I know Jonathan Leger did a test from scratch the other day and generated some sales of his products via Twitter. I think people are fascinated with it right now both as a marketing platform and a place to connect with like minded individuals.

- Dean